The inevitable end result of our last 56 years

[Benjamin Cole]

17 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Mathew,

      Surely, you jest.  Did you not watch the Congressional impeachment hearing testimony of Trump's own staff in the Ukraine-gate case-- Ambassador Sondland and NSC Russia expert, Dr. Fiona Hill?

     Trump directly violated U.S. State Department policy in Ukraine by threatening to withhold U.S. military aid to Ukraine if President Zelensky declined to make up a false story about Joe Biden allegedly being under "investigation" in Ukraine!

     It was a blatant case of Trump trying to extort a sleazy, personal political favor from a foreign President in exchange for U.S. military support in Ukraine's border war with Russia!  Zelensky declined Trump's request for "a little favor."

    This is the problem with living in the Faux/Daily Caller MAGA bubble, as you and Ben do.

    You guys are literally clueless about historical events.

    It's the same problem that we have all observed here with you and Ben refusing to watch the Congressional J6 hearings.  You were both unaware of the damning facts, while endlessly promoting "alternate facts" from Fox-- "patriot purge," Ray Epps, etc.

   As for Rand Paul, he's a compromised Russian asset.  Putin has him by the short hairs.

"As for Rand Paul, he's a compromised Russian asset.  Putin has him by the short hairs." - W

Have you a cite on this? 

 

[Benjamin Cole]

Interesting. Sam BF beyond the law? He was based in the Bahamas. 

The Justice Department may, or may not, decide to prosecute. 

---30---

"The shock over FTX’s sudden collapse is turning to anger as it becomes clear that CEO Sam Bankman-Fried used customer funds from the exchange to plug losses in his failing crypto empire. The question now is what the consequences will be for the one-time icon known to everyone as SBF.

While there will be civil lawsuits as customers and investors try to recover what’s left of FTX’s assets, the Justice Department is also reported to be investigating, raising questions of whether the agency will file criminal charges, and whether SBF could see the inside of a prison cell.

Even if the facts seem may seem damning on the surface, lawyers contacted by Fortune cited two potential obstacles to any criminal conviction—though ones prosecutors could likely overcome.

The first is jurisdiction. Since FTX is an offshore business with headquarters in the Bahamas, and did not cater to Americans, defense lawyers could argue the actions of its executives are beyond the reach of U.S. law enforcement.

The Justice Department, however, is good at finding a “nexus” linking overseas defendants to American shores, according to Randall Eliason, a former prosecutor who now teaches law at George Washington University."

---30---

Well, we will see. 

[Matt Allison]

1 hour ago, Douglas Caddy said:

Even if DeSantis beats Trump half of the GOP will hate him: George Conway - Raw Story - Celebrating 18 Years of Independent Journalism

Yes.

The GOP is screwed.

The GOP is screwed, and they know it.

The GOP is screwed, they know it, and they've known it for a long time. It's why you saw them desperately go along with Trump's coup attempt; power is the only thing that matters to them, and that was the only way they saw to keeping it.

Age demographics have finally caught up with them. Their base of racist middle-aged/old white men is dying off.

Gen Z hates them with a passion and went to the polls last week to demonstrate that.

The MAGA GOP is done, and now we just get to enjoy watching them eat each other to their demise.

[Matthew Koch]

2 hours ago, David G. Healy said:

LIFE toots, just life (for the moment)... 

 

Well David, you seem like you are itching for a fight with someone. You have attempted to fight with me, Michael and Chris this last week. You seem to be triggered by something and have a chip on your shoulder. If you want to fight with me, that is fine but please either start a discussion topic or be coherent about what subject you would like to fight over because I can't follow. 

[W. Niederhut]

1 hour ago, Benjamin Cole said:

"As for Rand Paul, he's a compromised Russian asset.  Putin has him by the short hairs." - W

Have you a cite on this? 

 

Ben,

     I can't reveal my confidential KGB sources, but, surely, you know that Rand Paul has served as Trump's personal courier to Putin, in addition to strongly opposing U.S. aid for Ukraine and publicly promoting Kremlin talking points in recent years. 

    If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck... 🤥

    A former staffer of Rand Paul was also busted for funneling Russian money to the Trump campaign, and was later pardoned by Trump for this crime against the United States.

    This Salon article by Jon Skolnik summarizes Rand Paul's history as a Putin gofer.

    https://www.salon.com/2022/04/26/rand-paul-goes-to-bat-for-putin-the-countries-theyve-attacked-were-part-of-russia/

[Matthew Koch]

1 hour ago, W. Niederhut said:

Mathew,

      Surely, you jest.  Did you not watch the Congressional impeachment hearing testimony of Trump's own staff in the Ukraine-gate case-- Ambassador Sondland and NSC Russia expert, Dr. Fiona Hill?

     Trump directly violated U.S. State Department policy in Ukraine by threatening to withhold U.S. military aid to Ukraine if President Zelensky declined to make up a false story about Joe Biden allegedly being under "investigation" in Ukraine!

     It was a blatant case of Trump trying to extort a sleazy, personal political favor from a foreign President in exchange for U.S. military support in Ukraine's border war with Russia!  Zelensky declined Trump's request for "a little favor."

    This is the problem with living in the Faux/Daily Caller MAGA bubble, as you and Ben do.

    You guys are literally clueless about historical events.

    It's the same problem that we have all observed here with you and Ben refusing to watch the Congressional J6 hearings.  You were both unaware of the damning facts, while endlessly promoting "alternate facts" from Fox-- "patriot purge," Ray Epps, etc.

   As for Rand Paul, he's a compromised Russian asset.  Putin has him by the short hairs.

Rand Paul named the "Whistle Blower" by name it's Eric Caramella and if you type his name into social media the post will self destruct like in mission impossible. Try it sometime. I bet you can't cite a source on that Rand Paul allegation.. 

 

[W. Niederhut]

1 hour ago, W. Niederhut said:

Mathew,

      Surely, you jest.  Did you not watch the Congressional impeachment hearing testimony of Trump's own staff in the Ukraine-gate case-- Ambassador Sondland and NSC Russia expert, Dr. Fiona Hill?

     Trump directly violated U.S. State Department policy in Ukraine by threatening to withhold U.S. military aid to Ukraine if President Zelensky declined to make up a false story about Joe Biden allegedly being under "investigation" in Ukraine!

     It was a blatant case of Trump trying to extort a sleazy, personal political favor from a foreign President in exchange for U.S. military support in Ukraine's border war with Russia!  Zelensky declined Trump's request for "a little favor."

    This is the problem with living in the Faux/Daily Caller MAGA bubble, as you and Ben do.

    You guys are literally clueless about historical events.

    It's the same problem that we have all observed here with you and Ben refusing to watch the Congressional J6 hearings.  You were both unaware of the damning facts, while endlessly promoting "alternate facts" from Fox-- "patriot purge," Ray Epps, etc.

   As for Rand Paul, he's a compromised Russian asset.  Putin has him by the short hairs.

Mathew,

     Take a break from your MAGA propaganda and study the House impeachment hearing testimony of Ambassador Sondland and Dr. Fiona Hill.  They worked for Trump, and they certainly "blew the whistle" on Trump's Zelensky extortion scam.

     You need to focus on reality here.

[Matthew Koch]

34 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Mathew,

     Take a break from your MAGA propaganda and study the House impeachment hearing testimony of Ambassador Sondland and Dr. Fiona Hill.  They worked for Trump, and they certainly "blew the whistle" on Trump's Zelensky extortion scam.

     You need to focus on reality here.

AND..

the reality is that it has to do with Hunter Biden and Burisma. Remember this clip William? 

 

[W. Niederhut]

Mathew,

     You don't get it.  Trump was impeached for trying to extort Ukrainian President Zelensky to make a false public statement about "investigating" Joe Biden.  It was a cheap, dishonest public relations stunt in which Trump was violating U.S. State Department policy and undermining diplomatic and military support for a U.S. ally for his own political benefit.

     The "whistle blowers" were Trump's own ambassador to the Ukraine, (Sondland-- appointed after Trump inappropriately fired Yovanovitch) and his NSC advisors, Dr. Fiona Hill and Lt. Col. Vindman.

     This is my final post to you on the topic.  I don't want to waste time on your deflective MAGA propaganda.

[Matthew Koch]

17 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Mathew,

     You don't get it.  Trump was impeached for trying to extort Ukrainian President Zelensky to make a false public statement about "investigating" Joe Biden.  It was a cheap, dishonest public relations stunt in which Trump was violating U.S. State Department policy and undermining diplomatic and military support for a U.S. ally for his own political benefit.

     The "whistle blowers" were Trump's own ambassador to the Ukraine, (Sondland-- appointed after Trump inappropriately fired Yovanovitch) and his NSC advisors, Dr. Fiona Hill and Lt. Col. Vindman.

     This is my final post to you on the topic.  I don't want to waste time on your deflective MAGA propaganda.

You don't get it.. he declassified the conversation and we know what was said. Cite it, quit being lazy. Willam. I literally showed you Rand Fing Paul on the Senate floor naming the whistle blower and your telling me not to believe my lying eyes. That Trump got impeached by a CIA whistle blower over trying to investigate actual corruption. 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Matthew Koch

[W. Niederhut]

Mathew,

     You're, obviously, completely clueless about the actual events that led to Trump's first impeachment.  In fact, you don't even understand the full implications of your own references on the subject-- including the CNN clip above.

     You need to educate yourself about Trump's notorious July 25, 2019 extortion phone call to Zelensky, and the back story-- including the fact that Trump had put a disturbing hold on U.S. funds supporting Ukraine's precarious defenses against Russian forces in the Donbas before he made his high-pressured sales pitch to Zelensky to smear Joe Biden.

    There is no better account of Trump's chicanery than the detailed history written by Lt. Col. Alexander Vindman, who witnessed the phone call, and the strange activities of Trump and Giuliani preceding the extortion call.

    Study Vindman's complete history of Trump's Zelensky extortion scam, then get back to us if you have any questions about what really happened.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2021/08/trump-ukraine-call-impeachment-vindman/619617/

Edited November 14, 2022 by W. Niederhut

[Matthew Koch]

18 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Mathew,

     You're, obviously, completely clueless about the actual events that led to Trump's first impeachment.  In fact, you don't even understand the full implications of your own references on the subject-- including the CNN clip above.

     You need to educate yourself about Trump's notorious July 25, 2019 extortion phone call to Zelensky, and the back story-- including the fact that Trump had put a disturbing hold on U.S. funds supporting Ukraine's precarious defenses against Russian forces in the Donbas before he made his high-pressured sales pitch to Zelensky to smear Joe Biden.

    There is no better account of Trump's chicanery than the detailed history written by Lt. Col. Alexander Vindman, who witnessed the phone call, and the strange activities of Trump and Giuliani preceding the extortion call.

    Study Vindman's complete history of Trump's Zelensky extortion scam, then get back to us if you have any questions about what really happened.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2021/08/trump-ukraine-call-impeachment-vindman/619617/

The CIA whistle blower being Eric Caramello and Rand Paul saying his name on the senate floor is a #FACT, William.

This isn't debatable if you live in reality. The transcript was declassified I just re read it maybe you should to instead of going off your memory. 

 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Matthew Koch

[Kirk Gallaway]

5 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

I am shocked---shocked!---to be informed there is political hypocrisy. 

In both parties? 

I thought it was only the GOP that was hypocritical--oh, wait, or was it the other way around? 

I will sadly inform my friend that there is political hypocrisy going on. 

 

?

So bottom line, who did your friend vote for Pennsylvania Senator?

So you're telling me, your friend is a Pennsylvania lifelong Democrat with a Dad whose a steelworker and he voted for TV snake oil salesman Mehmet Oz? You obviously had a conversation about who he was going  to vote for. II he did, he's a fool. The Democrats had a good candidate for him, who I'm sure talked about his family on the campaign many times. 

The only real problem with Fetterman is he had a stroke 7 months ago. I'm not sure I would have let him debate Oz. But I think it does say something for the Pennsylvania electorate that they had some compassion for him and realized he was one of them. Oz moved to his mother's house to get a residency in Pennsylvania. He really lives in New Jersey.

 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Kirk Gallaway

[Mark Knight]

On 11/12/2022 at 7:51 PM, Chris Barnard said:

I think they should, because digital is manipulable. I’ll say it again, and this applies to every election; the question isn’t whether there were fraudulent votes, it’s a question of to what extent? 

Now, I have no idea how elections are handled where you live. Here in southern Indiana, USA, before we go to the polls, we must have a valid government-issued ID, with signature, in order to register to vote. We must leave a copy of our signature on file to be compared with our signature on Election Day. And our bipartisan poll workers not only keep an eye on one another, but they hand the voter a PAPER ballot. The voter goes to a booth, makes his/her selection on the paper ballot, and then enters the paper ballot into a machine which reads the selections made on the ballot and tallies them [the tally is not displayed at the voting site], 

For absentee ballots, once again they are paper ballots just like the ones used at the polling site. The envelope in which the ballot is returned to the county clerk's office is initialed by poll workers before it is sent to the voter. Any ballot envelopes without the required initials are considered suspect and are not "automatically" counted. Also, the voter must sign the envelope before it is returned, and that signature is compared with the signature on file for that voter BEFORE the ballot is fed into the machine that tallies the votes by a certified poll worker. THIS is why it takes so long to process absentee ballots, as each is manually checked Again, the bipartisan, trained, and certified poll workers don't do this alone. They keep an eye on one another to ensure that no shenanigans occur by members of either party.

And early voting is handled exactly like an absentee ballot...which, for all intents and purposes, it is.

So I hardly see how electronic manipulation can occur, since these voting machines that tally the local ballots are NOT connected to the internet, and they are tested by the bipartisan county election commission prior to any voting to ensure that the votes are properly tallied. Perhaps in other jurisdictions, the election commissions are not bipartisan, though I see no reason for that to occur and EVERY reason for that NOT to occur. Perhaps in other jurisdictions, their voting is completely electronic, but without a paper ballot there can be no paper trail in the event a recount is necessary.

To you, perhaps our methods of voting here are "quaint." But there is adequate security, there are bipartisan election commissions and trained, certified, and bipartisan poll workers to ensure that no irregularities occur. If there is an extremely close race, one party or the other may request either a recanvass, in which the paper ballots are recounted by the machines, or a recount, in which a bipartisan election commission, with witnesses from both candidates, perform a hand recount. [I was a designated witness at a hand recount for a county office a few years back.] 

If a voter shows up at the wrong polling place for their voting precinct on election day, they are directed to the proper polling place. If they insist on voting at the wrong polling place, they cast what is called a "provisional" ballot, which is not tallied until and unless it is confirmed that the voter didn't also vote at another polling place. And those provisional ballots are secured by the bipartisan election officials at the polling sites until they are taken in locked boxes to the county clerk's office to be verified before being tallied.

The system here, while slightly cumbersome, has worked for years, and continues to work. If all localities in the US used a similar system [which I suspect they do], the chances for voter fraud become quite miniscule.

[Matt Allison]

I don't think Chris is old enough to vote, but his wealthy father might have some right winger "insight" for us.