Steve Roe Consulting

[James DiEugenio]

Easy; he would not have changed the names unless she threatened to sue.

[Vince Palamara]

30 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

Easy; he would not have changed the names unless she threatened to sue.

Jim, please see my brand new post Wallace Milam (and Mark Oakes) mine gold regarding CE399 and the interesting connections of O.P. Wright

[Bill Brown]

1 hour ago, W. Tracy Parnell said:

Exactly. Also, we have two versions of the story now. Stone tells Schnaph that the Paines threatened to sue which implies communication with them. But he tells DiEugenio that they wouldn't talk to him and says nothing about a lawsuit.

Bingo.

[Vince Palamara]

2 minutes ago, Bill Brown said:

Bingo.

For the 1993 made-for-tv movie FATAL DECEPTION: MRS. LEE HARVEY OSWALD, the Paines were once again known as the Williams!

 

Gee, I wonder why...

Fatal Deception: Mrs. Lee Harvey Oswald (TV Movie 1993) - IMDb

[Bill Brown]

53 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

Easy; he would not have changed the names unless she threatened to sue.

And you believe that is the only possible conclusion to be reached?

 

I could just as easily say that he changed the name for fear of being sued since he never bothered to contact her.

 

The difference is I am not claiming either version to be factual. 

 

 

[James DiEugenio]

Bill,  I know Oliver. Do you?

Look at at the precedent of Helms with Nixon.

And do you know the people he talked to in Dallas?  Do you know the research team of 12 people who worked for a year in advance interviewing witnesses, calling people on the phone, Oliver actually in some people's living rooms.

DId you know all that?  Did you know he offered people money if they were reluctant to talk?  That is how bad he wanted everyone on paper.

No, you did not know that did you? That is why he changed their names.

 

Edited July 13, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[Bill Brown]

1 hour ago, James DiEugenio said:

Bill,  I know Oliver. Do you?

Look at at the precedent of Helms with Nixon.

And do you know the people he talked to in Dallas?  Do you know the research team of 12 people who worked for a year in advance interviewing witnesses, calling people on the phone, Oliver actually in some people's living rooms.

DId you know all that?  Did you know he offered people money if they were reluctant to talk?  That is how bad he wanted everyone on paper.

No, you did not know that did you.  That is why he changed their names.

 

I know Ruth personally.  Do you?

 

You know Oliver.  Is that supposed to mean anything related to what we're discussing here?

 

I was aware of some of the things you mention above but I don't see how even one bit of that is somehow supposed to automatically mean he tried to contact Ruth. 

 

As for Oliver's film crew, I have concerns about their credibility. I can elaborate if you'd like. 

Edited July 13, 2022 by Bill Brown

[Pat Speer]

1 hour ago, Bill Brown said:

Bingo.

You're playing (and I don't mean Bingo).

Both statements can be true. 

1. The Paines wouldn't talk (as in having a long talk) to Oliver.

2. They communicated in some way (whether in a short conversation or perhaps even in writing) that they would sue.

See how easy things can be when one uses a little common sense?

I mean, honestly. Oliver Stone was scared to talk to Ruth Paine? Are you kidding? To paraphrase Corleone, if history has shown us anything it's that Oliver Stone is not afraid to talk to anyone!

 

 

Edited July 13, 2022 by Pat Speer

[Bill Brown]

1 minute ago, Pat Speer said:

You're playing (and I don't mean Bingo).

Both statements can be true. 

1. The Paines wouldn't talk to Oliver.

2. They communicated in some way (presumably in writing) that they would sue.

See how easy things can be when one uses a little common sense?

I mean, honestly. Oliver Stone was scared to talk to Ruth Paine? Are you kidding? To paraphrase Corleone, if history has shown us anything it's that Oliver Stone is not afraid to talk to anyone!

 

 

Straw man. I don't think anyone has said that Oliver was scared to talk to Ruth.

Edited July 13, 2022 by Bill Brown

[Pat Speer]

8 minutes ago, Bill Brown said:

Straw man. I don't think anyone has said that Oliver was scared to talk to Ruth.

Here is Larry's post from a few pages back:

"BTW- Ruth Paine was either "misremembering" or dissembling when she denied that she had spoken to Oliver Stone in Max Goode's movie. In 2013, I asked Oliver at the Wecht 50th anniversary program why he had changed the names of the Paines to Williams but did not change the names of any other important characters. He said it was because the Paines threatened to sue him and his production company.

Too bad Max did not know this when he interviewed her.  She made it sound like Oliver was either afraid to contact her or ignored her because she would contradict his thesis. Even if it was the Paines' lawyer who contacted Stone, her statement was inaccurate. And she did that laugh when she said that which is her "tell" when she is being evasive.

I wish Max had also grilled her on the phone message from the employment office. She was evasive with Liebler who was not interested in getting a straight answer."  

 

I assumed you were defending her position (or what Larry interpreted as her position.)

Will you acknowledge then that Oliver Stone, whatever his failings, was almost certainly not afraid to contact Ruth Paine?  

[Bill Brown]

8 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

Here is Larry's post from a few pages back:

 

"BTW- Ruth Paine was either "misremembering" or dissembling when she denied that she had spoken to Oliver Stone in Max Goode's movie. In 2013, I asked Oliver at the Wecht 50th anniversary program why he had changed the names of the Paines to Williams but did not change the names of any other important characters. He said it was because the Paines threatened to sue him and his production company.

Too bad Max did not know this when he interviewed her.  She made it sound like Oliver was either afraid to contact her or ignored her because she would contradict his thesis. Even if it was the Paines' lawyer who contacted Stone, her statement was inaccurate. And she did that laugh when she said that which is her "tell" when she is being evasive.

I wish Max had also grilled her on the phone message from the employment office. She was evasive with Liebler who was not interested in getting a straight answer."  

 

I assumed you were defending her position (or what Larry interpreted as her position.)

Will you acknowledge then that Oliver Stone, whatever his failings, was almost certainly not afraid to contact Ruth Paine?  

No, I do not believe that Oliver Stone was afraid to contact Ruth Paine. That is not to say that he attempted to contact her, however.