Looking for information on "Failure Analysis Associates" and a 1992 "do-ever" of Edgewood Arsenals Ballistics tests.

[Tommy Tomlinson]

I've just been talking to someone about CE399, and he has been rattling on about this company who apparently ran "proper" tests on the Carcano ammunition and human wrists. Using lower levels of powder charge to simulate lower velocities in order to dispute the deformation identified by EA's tests for the WC.

They are called "Failure Analysis Associates" or FAA for short.

I've never heard of this... I managed to find a link to something that looked like an old Word document talking about them doing a "computer model" in the 1990's, but little more.  

Can anyone help me out here, and give me some background?

 

Cheers in advance.

[Guest]

Here is something :

 http://www.assassinationweb.com/mcc.htm

 

[Guest]

From Sp.Ed. : "Posner crowns his theory with the certainty of science by using one side of the computer-enhanced studies by Failure Analysis Associates of Menlo Park that his text implies he commissioned. The firm, however, lambastes his use as a distortion of the technology that it had developed for the American Bar Association's mock trial of Oswald where both sides used it"

[Guest]

And of course in Chapter 12 by Pat it is mentioned (a couple of times) 

Now, I don't know of a full study is somewhere out there (well it actually could be 4 or 5 segments I think), I have seen excerpts (mostly by Posner).  There are some old links to parts of the study, but they don't go where they should anymore.

But if you search Google for "Jeffrey Lotz" and "zapruder" you can find a lot of books referring to the study 

Posner only refers to interviews and the "trial" statements (as far as I can tell)

AND there is this :

 

Edited February 15, 2023 by Jean Paul Ceulemans

[Guest]

And the last one (Weisberg Collection) :

http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg Subject Index Files/P Disk/Posner Gerald Failure Analysis Oswald Mock Trial/Item 01.pdf

[Lawrence Schnapf]

Failure Analysis served as the expert for both sides of the 1992 ABA Mock trial. Different teams were established. I know the former CEO of the firm who worked for the defense. I also have some CDs from the trial.  I know that Failure Analysis did a test showing that a frangible bullet would not have transited the other side of the skull- thus rebutting the claim that a shot from the GK would have hit Jackie.

I believe that Posner only used the portions of the Failure Analysis work that was developed for the prosecution.  

[Matthew Koch]

Failure Analysis did the first digital recreation computer model of the shooting. During this, their computer found the lapel flap that hadn't been noticed before because it's in only one frame. Court Tv used Failure Analysis in their single bullet analysis episode in the 90's. 

[Chris Bristow]

1 hour ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

Failure Analysis served as the expert for both sides of the 1992 ABA Mock trial. Different teams were established. I know the former CEO of the firm who worked for the defense. I also have some CDs from the trial.  I know that Failure Analysis did a test showing that a frangible bullet would not have transited the other side of the skull- thus rebutting the claim that a shot from the GK would have hit Jackie.

I believe that Posner only used the portions of the Failure Analysis work that was developed for the prosecution.  

The first I heard of the theory that a knoll shot would have hit Jackie was in the documentary "Inside The Target Car" with Gary Mack.
  It was a complete fabrication. Mack positioned JFK's head firmly  up against the actresses left shoulder to put Jackie in the GK line of sight. We know from Z frame 312 that JFK's head did not align with her left shoulder and we know from the Muchmore film that their heads were at least 6" apart at the head shot.
 The theorized knoll shooter position at 15 ft west of the fence corner lines up above the 6" gap between their heads in the Muchmore film. That means Marie Muchmore, the gap between the heads, and the knoll shooter position are all on the same line of sight. They are at opposite ends of the LOS so they would both see almost the same gap at the head shot. A shot from the knoll would not have hit Jackie.
 Z frame 312 alone proves the shot would not hit Jackie. Taking into account the LOS from the knoll and Jackie's head being forward of JFK's the shot would have not hit her. The Failure analysis people must have plotted the knoll LOS so it is surprising they did not realize Jackie was out of the way.

[Lawrence Schnapf]

yep- this test by Roger McCarthy using frangible bullet and a gallon jug of water proved that even if she was in the line of fire, a frangible bullet would have exhausted its energy upon impact. this also accounts for the tiny metal fragments at the front of the skull. Small particles do not have the energy to travel far from the impact site.  

[Pat Speer]

18 hours ago, Tommy Tomlinson said:

I've just been talking to someone about CE399, and he has been rattling on about this company who apparently ran "proper" tests on the Carcano ammunition and human wrists. Using lower levels of powder charge to simulate lower velocities in order to dispute the deformation identified by EA's tests for the WC.

They are called "Failure Analysis Associates" or FAA for short.

I've never heard of this... I managed to find a link to something that looked like an old Word document talking about them doing a "computer model" in the 1990's, but little more.  

Can anyone help me out here, and give me some background?

 

Cheers in advance.

FAA performed no tests of this kind. Dr. Martin Fackler, however, was brought in to testify about the nature of the wrist wound, and if a reduced velocity bullet could create that wound without suffering more damage than CE 399. He said that he had performed some tests and that in his estimation an M/C bullet traveling through JFK's neck and striking Connally's rib would exit Connally's chest traveling 900 fps, and that a bullet striking JBC's wrist at that velocity would not suffer much damage, and would be consistent with the appearance of CE 399.

There was a problem with this, however. HSCA wounds ballistics expert Larry Sturdivan would later assert such a bullet would be traveling about half that velocity. (500 fps--give or take 100).

And there's a reason for this.

To be clear, the bullet striking the thigh was almost spent. And the wrist wound was minor when compared to the wound on the wrists of the cadavers shot by Olivier. So the bullet striking the wrist must have been traveling at a greatly reduced velocity. So Sturdivan proposed it was traveling much slower than as proposed by Fackler. Olivier's tests proved that the bullet would not have lost much velocity within the chest. His tests also showed that the bullet would lose little velocity while traveling through JFK's neck assuming it didn't strike bone. Well, this meant the bullet was traveling at nearly full velocity when it struck JBC. 

Only, yikes, a bullet traveling at such a velocity would become grossly deformed upon striking the rib.

Well, this led Sturdivan, in a book designed to answer all the questions, to propose something so ludicrous it boggles the mind. He proposed that the bullet lost far more velocity within an inch or so of Connally's back before hitting the rib than it did in four inches or so of JFK's neck. It was pure smoke. 

In essence, then, the tests performed by Olivier and Fackler on down suggest that a bullet creating JFK's and JBC's wounds as reported would be traveling at much lower velocity than that claimed for a fully charged M/C bullet. Such a bullet would almost certainly have been subsonic. A silenced shot.

This is discussed in great detail in chapter 11 of patspeer.com

 

 

Edited February 16, 2023 by Pat Speer

[Benjamin Cole]

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

FAA performed no tests of this kind. Dr. Martin Fackler, however, was brought in to testify about the nature of the wrist wound, and if a reduced velocity bullet could create that wound without suffering more damage than CE 399. He said that he had performed some tests and that in his estimation an M/C bullet traveling through JFK's neck and striking Connally's rib would exit Connally's chest traveling 900 fps, and that a bullet striking JBC's wrist at that velocity would not suffer much damage, and would be consistent with the appearance of CE 399.

There was a problem with this, however. HSCA wounds ballistics expert Larry Sturdivan would later assert such a bullet would be traveling about half that velocity. (500 fps--give or take 100).

And there's a reason for this.

To be clear, the bullet striking the thigh was almost spent. And the wrist wound was minor when compared to the wound on the wrists of the cadavers shot by Olivier. So the bullet striking the wrist must have been traveling at a greatly reduced velocity. So Sturdivan proposed it was traveling much slower than as proposed by Fackler. Olivier's tests proved that the bullet would not have lost much velocity within the chest. His tests also showed that the bullet would lose little velocity while traveling through JFK's neck assuming it didn't strike bone. Well, this meant the bullet was traveling at nearly full velocity when it struck JBC. 

Only, yikes, a bullet traveling at such a velocity would become grossly deformed upon striking the rib.

Well, this led Sturdivan, in a book designed to answer all the questions, to propose something so ludicrous it boggles the mind. He proposed that the bullet lost far more velocity within an inch or so of Connally's back before hitting the rib than it did in four inches or so of JFK's neck. It was pure smoke. 

In essence, then, the tests performed by Oliver and Fackler on down suggest that a bullet creating JFK's and JBC's wounds as reported would be traveling at much lower velocity than that claimed for a fully charged M/C bullet. Such a bullet would almost certainly have been subsonic. A silenced shot.

This is discussed in great detail in chapter 11 of patspeer.com

 

 

The idea of shots fired with use of silencer, or pneumatic rifle, is under-explored. 

For example, Gov. Connally described bullets striking the cab of the limo as if fired by an "automatic" rifle. Not only to the WC, but he then repeated he expression in a  news conference, saying, "I told the Warren Commission I thought shots were be fired by an automatic rifle."

One of the Secret Service agents in the limo described a "flurry" of bullets striking the limo. 

The Lewis & Clark Expedition carried a Girandoni rifle that fired at about 1000 fps---about half the speed of a Mannlicher Carcano, but plenty lethal at under 100 yards. 

In addition, shots may have been fired simultaneously, or heard simultaneously. If someone 1087 away from you fires a shot, and then some else, 543 feet from you, fires a shot a half second later, you will hear one shot. 

Given the distances in the Dealey Plaza, shots fired on signal, only fractions of a second apart, might be heard as one shot by most witnesses. 

 

[Tommy Tomlinson]

6 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

The idea of shots fired with use of silencer, or pneumatic rifle, is under-explored. 

For example, Gov. Connally described bullets striking the cab of the limo as if fired by an "automatic" rifle. Not only to the WC, but he then repeated he expression in a  news conference, saying, "I told the Warren Commission I thought shots were be fired by an automatic rifle."

One of the Secret Service agents in the limo described a "flurry" of bullets striking the limo. 

The Lewis & Clark Expedition carried a Girandoni rifle that fired at about 1000 fps---about half the speed of a Mannlicher Carcano, but plenty lethal at under 100 yards. 

In addition, shots may have been fired simultaneously, or heard simultaneously. If someone 1087 away from you fires a shot, and then some else, 543 feet from you, fires a shot a half second later, you will hear one shot. 

Given the distances in the Dealey Plaza, shots fired on signal, only fractions of a second apart, might be heard as one shot by most witnesses. 

 

A number of the earliest reports transcribed over the phone from the press corps (attributed to either British PA or Reuters) referred to what sounded like "three bursts of automatic gunfire..."

I believe that there were three guns, and the first "shot" was actually a volley. As you say Ben, the distance distortion of the sound could make one person hear one shot, another person may hear two, while a third person may hear all three, depending on their relative distance to the guns.

Then on the second and third "shots" there could have been a total of three further actual shots fired. The time differential described between two and three potentially discounts any more, unless one or more were fired from a semi automatic carbine like the ones Oswald trained with in the Marines... of course if suppression were used on one or two of the guns, then those shots would have potentially sounded more like echoes of the other shots.

[Pat Speer]

On 2/16/2023 at 7:44 AM, Tommy Tomlinson said:

A number of the earliest reports transcribed over the phone from the press corps (attributed to either British PA or Reuters) referred to what sounded like "three bursts of automatic gunfire..."

I believe that there were three guns, and the first "shot" was actually a volley. As you say Ben, the distance distortion of the sound could make one person hear one shot, another person may hear two, while a third person may hear all three, depending on their relative distance to the guns.

Then on the second and third "shots" there could have been a total of three further actual shots fired. The time differential described between two and three potentially discounts any more, unless one or more were fired from a semi automatic carbine like the ones Oswald trained with in the Marines... of course if suppression were used on one or two of the guns, then those shots would have potentially sounded more like echoes of the other shots.

From chapter 1 at patspeer.com:

Shots on the Motorcade

Forget everything you think you know about the Kennedy assassination. Your mind is clear and open to new impressions. It is 11-22-63. You are sitting at home, listening to the radio, when suddenly a newsman interrupts your favorite show.

He reads from a 12:34 P.M. UPI news bulletin: “Three shots were fired at President Kennedy’s motorcade in downtown Dallas.”

These are the words of Merriman Smith, a reporter for United Press International. Smith was sitting in the middle of the front seat of the presidential press pool car—a car riding but five cars back of the Presidential limousine in the motorcade--that was equipped with a phone. Upon hearing these shots, Smith grabbed ahold of this phone, called in this report, and refused to yield the phone to his fellow reporters.

Now, to most humans, Smith’s behavior would be inappropriate, if not downright disgusting. Someone has shot at the President of the United States, and a veteran newsman has responded to this not by sharing the lone phone available to the press traveling with the President but by fighting off his fellow newsmen in order to hold onto a scoop.

Of course, in journalism circles, this is the stuff of legend.

According to this legend, Smith smothered the phone like a fumbled football in order to keep it from his chief competitor, Jack Bell of the Associated Press, as a now-diminished motorcade (a half a dozen motorcycle escorts, a lead car containing the Dallas Chief of Police and Dallas Sheriff, the President’s limousine, a Secret Service back-up car, the Vice-President’s car, a second Secret Service car, the Mayor’s car, and, finally, the press pool car) raced to Parkland Hospital.

Here, moreover, is footage of the pool car taken a few seconds after the first shot was fired. The car is turning onto Elm Street from Houston Street, heading straight towards the Texas School Book Depository, the building from which the shots were fired. (At least according to the legend... Remember, we're like Sgt. Schultz on the 1960's TV show Hogan's Heroes. We know nothing.)

 

This footage was created by NBC News cameraman Dave Wiegman, who was traveling in the convertible just behind the pool car. He turned his camera on at the sound of the first shot, and began filming, hoping to catch something, anything, of importance. He then leapt from his car and ran around for 40 seconds or so before climbing back into the vehicle. While the footage of this mad race is priceless, it may have cost Wiegman something even more valuable. As a result of his mad dash around Dealey Plaza—a grassy park in Dallas, Texas, the scene of the crime--the car in which he was riding fell behind the section of the motorcade racing to the hospital. And that part of history—the arrival of the motorcade at Parkland Hospital, and the transport of the President and Governor Connally into the hospital—went unrecorded.

In any event, upon arrival at the hospital, Smith grabbed another phone and updated his story. This 12:39 flash reads: “Kennedy seriously wounded—perhaps seriously—perhaps fatally—by assassin’s bullet.”

A few minutes later, a more substantive bulletin followed. It reads: “President Kennedy and Gov. John B. Connally of Texas were cut down by an assassin’s bullets as they toured downtown Dallas in an open automobile today. The President, his limp body cradled in the arms of his wife, was rushed to Parkland Hospital. The Governor also was taken to Parkland. Clint Hill, a Secret Service agent assigned to Mrs. Kennedy, said, “He’s dead,” as the President was lifted from the rear of a white house touring car…”

A 12:45 follow-up adds: "Reporters about five car lengths behind the Chief Executive heard what sounded like three bursts of gunfire…There were three loud bursts. Dallas motorcycle officers escorting the President quickly leaped from their bikes and raced up a grassy knoll."

And then, at 12:54: “Some of the Secret Service agents thought the gunfire was from an automatic weapon fired to the right rear of the president's car, probably from a grassy knoll to which police rushed."

Note that I have highlighted certain words in Smith’s last report. These words are at odds with what, first, the FBI, and later, The President’s Commission on the Assassination of President Kennedy (aka the Warren Commission), would come to conclude. These investigations held that the shots were fired seconds apart by a bolt-action rifle, and not by an automatic weapon. They also held that all three shots were fired from the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository, a red brick building sitting at the right rear of the President when the shots were fired—and that none of them were fired from the grassy knoll in front of Kennedy, and to his right.

Still, one might assume Smith’s reporting an anomaly, and that other reporters within the motorcade heard three well-spaced shots, and immediately suspected these shots came from a building in back of Kennedy.

But one would be wrong.

Take a gander at the bulletins sent out by the Associated Press within the first half-hour or so of the President’s arrival at Parkland. The first bulletin was provided by James Altgens--an Associated Press photographer who witnessed the assassination from the curb on Elm Street, and then ran to find a phone. Here is this first bulletin:

“President Kennedy was shot as his motorcade left downtown Dallas. Mrs. Kennedy jumped up and grabbed him. She cried “Oh, no!” The motorcade sped on. Photographer James Altgens said he saw blood on the President's head. Altgens said he heard two shots but thought someone was shooting fireworks until he saw blood on the President. Altgens said he saw no one with a gun…”

Now, the rest of these bulletins come from Jack Bell, the Associated Press reporter riding in the pool car with Smith, who tried in vain to get access to its phone, but had to settle on calling in his reports from Parkland Hospital, along with everyone else. (Note: I have corrected some spelling errors and slightly edited both these AP bulletins and the previously cited UPI bulletins.)

“AP reporter Jack Bell… said Kennedy was transferred to an ambulance… Bell reported three shots were fired as the motorcade entered the triple underpass which leads to the Stemmons Freeway to Parkland Hospital. Pandemonium broke loose around the scene. The Secret Service waved the motorcade on at top speed to the hospital. Even at high speed it took nearly five minutes to get the car to the ambulance entrance of the hospital. Bell said a man and a woman were scrambling on the upper level of a walkway overlooking the underpass…Mrs. Kennedy was weeping and trying to hold up her husband’s head when reporters reached the car…Kennedy apparently was shot in the head. He fell face down in the back seat of his car. Blood was on his head. Mrs. Kennedy cried ‘Oh, no!’ and tried to hold up his head… Gov. John B Connally of Texas also was cut down by bullets. The President was slumped over in the backseat of the car face down. Connally lay on the floor of the rear seat. It was impossible to tell at once where Kennedy was hit but bullet wounds in Connally’s chest were plainly visible indicating the gunfire might possibly have come from an automatic weapon… It was difficult to determine immediately whether the First Lady and Mrs. Connally were injured. Vice President Johnson was in a car behind the President’s. There was no immediate sign that he was hurt--in fact there was no evidence at all at what might have happened to Johnson since only the President’s car and its Secret Service follow-up car went to the hospital.”

Now, some of the surprising comments contained within these bulletins—Kennedy’s being transferred to an ambulance, Connally’s lying on the floor of the rear seat—were almost certainly the consequence of Bell’s making his report over the phone to a third party who typed it into a teletype—in other words, communication errors. But the bit about Johnson not going to the hospital? That’s either a cover story designed to protect Johnson, or sloppy, sloppy reporting. And the bit about automatic weapons? This was within minutes of Smith’s reporting that the Secret Service thought automatic weapons were fired on the President, probably from a grassy knoll. This would be quite the coincidence…if it was a coincidence.

Now note that Bell’s initial reporting made repeated references to the underpass--which had been in front of the president at the time of the shooting--and did not mention the buildings behind the president at the time of the shooting.

Now consider that an AP article published in the Christchurch Star, shortly after the shooting, declared: “Three bursts of gunfire, apparently from automatic weapons, were heard.”

Well, it’s clear then. Prior to the reporting of the roughly 1:00 P.M. discovery of a bolt-action rifle in the school book depository behind Kennedy at the time of the shooting, the suspicion among the nation’s top newswire reporters--Smith and Bell, who’d been traveling just five cars behind Kennedy in the motorcade—was that an automatic weapon had been fired at the President…from a location in front and to the right of Kennedy.

 

Edited December 3, 2023 by Pat Speer

[Tommy Tomlinson]

Pat, or anyone... are there any subsequent interviews with the likes of Bell and Smith that you could point me at? 

I would pay good money for a book on the collected thoughts and opinions of the press representatives running round Dealey and Parkland that day.

Not so much on their further investigations and such, but just the events of the day and the way the various agencies managed it.

[Pat Speer]

1 hour ago, Tommy Tomlinson said:

Pat, or anyone... are there any subsequent interviews with the likes of Bell and Smith that you could point me at? 

I would pay good money for a book on the collected thoughts and opinions of the press representatives running round Dealey and Parkland that day.

Not so much on their further investigations and such, but just the events of the day and the way the various agencies managed it.

I have chapters on my website devoted to the recollections of hundreds of witnesses. The recollections of the reporters in the motorcade are included in Chapter 6: Pieces on the Road.

Here's the section on Smith, Bell, and the other pool car reporters.. 

Merriman Smith, a reporter for UPI, sat next to the driver of the blue Impala. After the shots rang out, he picked up the car phone and called the Dallas UPI bureau. As a result his first reports were on the wire before the president's limo even reached the hospital. (11-22-63, 12:34, earliest UPI teletype) "Three shots were fired at President Kennedy's motorcade in downtown Dallas." (11-22-63, 12:39 UPI teletype) “Kennedy seriously wounded, perhaps seriously, perhaps fatally, by assassin's bullet." (11-22-63, 12:45 UPI teletype) "Reporters about five car lengths behind the Chief Executive heard what sounded like three bursts of gunfire. Secret Service agents in a follow-up car quickly unlimbered their automatic rifles. The bubble top of the President's car was down. They drew their pistols, but the damage was done. The President was slumped over in the backseat of the car face down. Connally lay on the floor of the rear seat. It was impossible to tell at once where Kennedy was hit, but bullet wounds in Connally's chest were plainly visible, indicating the gunfire might possibly have come from an automatic weapon. There were three loud bursts. Dallas motorcycle officers escorting the President quickly leaped from their bikes and raced up a grassy knoll." (11-22-63, 12:46 UPI teletype) “It was impossible to tell at once where Kennedy was hit, but bullet wounds in Connally’s chest were plainly visible, indicating the gunfire might possibly have come from an automatic weapon. There were three loud bursts. Dallas motorcycle officers escorting the President quickly leaped from their bikes and raced up a grassy hill.” (11-22-63, a 12:54 Smith dispatch to UPI) “Some of the Secret Service agents thought the gunfire was from an automatic weapon fired to the right rear of the president's car, probably from a grassy knoll to which police rushed." (11-22-63 statement regarding the number of shots while on the flight back from Dallas, as recalled by reporter Charles Roberts in The Truth About the Assassination, 1967) "Smith had heard three." (Smith’s 11-23-63 Pulitzer-prize winning eyewitness account, published in hundreds of papers) “The procession cleared the center of the business district and turned into a handsome highway that wound through what appeared to be a park. I was riding in the so-called White House press “pool” car, a telephone company vehicle equipped with a mobile radio-telephone. I was in the front seat between a driver from the Telephone Company and Malcolm Kilduff, acting White House press secretary for the President’s Texas tour. Three other pool reporters were wedged in the back seat. Suddenly we heard three loud, almost painfully loud cracks. The first sounded as if it might have been a large firecracker. But the second and third blasts were unmistakable. Gunfire. The President’s car, possibly as much as 150 or 200 yards ahead, seemed to falter briefly. We saw a flurry of activity in the Secret Service follow-up car behind the Chief Executive’s bubble-top limousine…Our car stood still for probably only a few seconds, but it seemed like a lifetime.” (Smith’s Pulitzer-prize winning eyewitness account, as edited and published in the Los Angeles Times, 11-24-63) “It was a balmy, sunny noon as we followed President Kennedy's car through downtown Dallas. Then, suddenly, we heard three almost painfully loud cracks. The first sounded as if it might have been a large firecracker. But the second and third blasts were unmistakably gunfire. I was riding in the White House press “pool” car, equipped with a radio-telephone. I was in the front seat between a telephone company driver and Malcolm Kilduff, acting White House press secretary. Three other pool reporters were wedged in the back seat. As we heard the shots the president’s car, possibly as much as 150 or 200 yards ahead, seemed to falter. There was a flurry of activity in the Secret Service car behind the President's open limousine. Our car stopped for probably only a few seconds, but it seemed like a lifetime.”(4-14-64 interview with William Manchester, as represented in The Death of a President, 1967) "Smith was not as astute a reporter as he seemed. Despite extensive experience with weapons he had thought the sounds in the plaza were three shots from an automatic weapon, and in a subsequent message he identified them as 'bursts.'" (11-14-66 UPI article found in the Sarasota Herald-Tribune. This version of the article was published in the 11-20-66 Washington Post as well.) “I was only a few hundred feet from John F. Kennedy when he was shot in Dallas. I would swear there were three shots and only three shots fired at his motorcade. The car In which I rode as a press association reporter was not far from the presidential vehicle Itself, and in clear view of it. We were at the point of coming out of an underpass when the first shot was fired. The sound was not entirely crisp and it seemed for a split second like a firecracker, a big one. As we cleared the underpass, then came the second and third shots. The shots were fired smoothly and evenly. There was not the slightest doubt on the front seat of our car that the shots came from a rifle to our rear (and the Book Depository at this point was directly to our rear). We remarked about rifle fire before we knew what had happened to Kennedy, although we had seen him slide from view in the rear of the open White House car...Clint Hill, the Secret Service agent who raced from the follow-up car to the presidential vehicle to shield the fallen leader and his shocked wife, Jacqueline, heard only three shots.” (11-14-66 UPI article found in the Bucks County Courier Times, with the references to the underpass removed from the more prevalent version above. Presumably, an alert editor at this paper caught Smith's mistake.) "I was only a few hundred feet from John F. Kennedy when he was shot in Dallas. I would swear there were three shots and only three fired at his motorcade. The car In which I rode as a press association reporter was not far from the presidential vehicle Itself, and in clear view of it when the first shot was fired. The sound was not entirely crisp and it seemed for a split second like a firecracker, a big one. Then came the second and third shots. The shots were fired smoothly and evenly. There was not the slightest doubt on the front seat of our car that the shots came from a rifle to our rear (and the Book Depository at this point was directly to our rear). We remarked about rifle fire before we knew what had happened to Kennedy, although we had seen him slide from view in the rear of the open White House car." Analysis: Smith’s reporting of bursts and automatic weapon fire, and his subsequent representation of the last two shots together, indicates he probably heard the last two shots together. His dispatch stating that Connally’s chest wounds indicated the use of an automatic weapon suggests, moreover, that he at least briefly suspected that shots had come from the grassy knoll. Intriguingly, given Smith's subsequent suicide, his 1966 article shows that either he’d “corrected” his impressions to match the official version, or was beginning to lose his mind. There was, of course, no underpass to “clear” which might account for the different sound of the first shot. Clint Hill, of course, had consistently claimed he'd heard but two shots, not three. The Texas School Book Depository “directly" to Smith's rear during the last two shots was, for that matter, in front of him or to his right as late as frame 265, the beginning of the Wiegman film. Smith's recollection that the depository was to his rear when the second and third shots were fired can therefore be taken as an indication that the second shot he heard was seconds after frame 265, and quite possibly the head shot. Probable first shot hit 190-224. Last two shots probably bunched together.

Assistant Press Secretary Malcolm Kilduff sat on the right side of the front seat of the “pool” car. (11-22-63 1:30 P.M. press conference in which Kilduff announced Kennedy's death) (When asked how many shots he'd heard) "I was in the pool car. We heard three." (When asked if he knew where they came from) "They came from the right side." (December 1963 audio recording found in the National Archives as Dialogue on Dallas, Group W, as presented in President Kennedy Has Been Shot, 2003) "We saw a flash of pink-which of course was Mrs. Kennedy. We realized she was doing something. I saw the Secret Service agent in the follow-up car raise the rifle. At that point we realized these were shots." (5-2-64 and 5-19-65 interviews with William Manchester, as represented in The Death of a President, 1967) (On the first shot) "Kilduff, in the pool car directly under the gun, asked 'What was that?'" (11-13-66 AP article by Merriman Smith) “Malcolm Kilduff of the White House press staff who was seated beside me in the front seat of the pool car heard only three shots.” (11-22-66 AP article found in the Cedar Rapids Gazette) "Kilduff says he does disagree with the Commission's finding that the first bullet that struck Kennedy and passed through his neck was the one that wounded Texas Gov. Connally. A second shot in the head killed Kennedy. "In my mind," Kilduff said, "there were three shots fired. I have verified that with other people who were riding in the same car. I have verified it with Secret Service Agents."... Kilduff said he had talked to Connally who agrees he was hit by a separate bullet, that the governor said he heard the first shot and was turning to look back when he was hit." (11-24-66 newspaper column by Crosby S. Noyes in the Washington Star) "After the first shot he recalls that Merriman Smith of the United Press International asked, "What was that?" and that he replied, "It sounded to me like a firecracker." The second shot, according to Kilduff, came at least five seconds after the first. The third, which killed Kennedy, followed after a shorter interval." (Late 1966 interview with Lawrence Schiller recounted in The Scavengers And Critics of the Warren Report, published 1967) (On how many shots were fired) "Malcolm Kilduff heard three." (Schiller interview as presented on the Capitol Records release The Controversy, 1967) "The first time I heard a shot was just after having said to Merriman Smith, after looking at a sign, 'What in the world is the Texas Book Depository.' My first impression was it was a firecracker. But the second shot, for some reason, we instinctively felt it was a rifle shot. Then when the third shot came, which was nearer to the second shot than the second was to the first, we couldn't tell whether the shots were coming toward the motorcade or away from the motorcade. We could tell it was coming from the right. I would have to go 'bang (waits 2 seconds) bang (waits 1 second) bang.' About 5 seconds between the--5 1/2 to 6 seconds--between the first and second shot and about 2 1/2 seconds between the second and third shot, about half the time, in other words." (3-15-76 oral history with the JFK Library) (On the moment of the first shot) "Merriman Smith, if I recall--and I was sitting next to him in the car--had just finished mentioning that, you know, 'You guys have really pulled off a real coup here,' when suddenly we heard what we thought was the backfire of a car or a firecracker." (On the shooting) "we were directly under the window in the Texas School Book Depository...when the first--what turned out to be a shot--was fired. Merriman Smith said, 'What was that?" And I recall very clearly saying, 'It sounded to me like a firecracker," 'cause it was my first thought that it was a firecracker. Because it was around the holiday season, and in Texas they sell fireworks. And I remember that--why I remember it, but I do remember it--as going through my mind that's exactly what it was. And it was not until the second shot was fired--and there was enough time in there for me to say, "What was that?" --rather, Merriman Smith saying, "What was that?" and my saying, "It sounded to me like a firecracker." And that takes up about four seconds--we've timed it since then--before we realized it was a gunshot because we saw the secret service agents all look up and to the right and to the rear which would have been directly above my right shoulder. Now, I'll be very frank with you, Bill. I cannot say in all truthfulness and honesty that I realized there was a shot coming right over my own head, because there was a slight bowl there at that underpass at Dealey Plaza, and the reverberations of the echoes just... I looked to my right, instinctively I looked to my right, but I did not know where to look, and I did not look up to that window. I'll be frank with you. I did not, because I could not place where that noise was coming from, but I knew it was off to my right. And, of course, we now know that it was right directly in my right ear." (When asked if he heard two shots) "No,no. I heard the first one. There was a longer pause between the first and the second than there was between the second and the third...I know I heard three shots. Nobody's going to tell me I didn't hear three shots. I mean I know that there was a long pause because there was that little interchange of conversation between Merriman Smith and me between the first and the second shot. Then the third shot got off very quickly." (When asked to describe Kennedy's wounds as he observed them upon the removal of Kennedy from the limousine outside Parkland hospital) "The left side of his head was a bloody mass (sic, he means mess) is all you can say. The only thing I did look for was some sign of life, and I could tell from under his shirt around his waist he was breathing. But his head was such a mess that I could not tell what the extent of his injuries were."

(10-26-77 article by Scott Payton for the Knight-Ridder news service and found in the Michigan City News-Dispatch) "'The shots came over my right shoulder. There's absolutely no question they came from the Depository. I was riding in the right front seat--that put the depository directly over my right shoulder. My first thought was that someone had thrown a firecracker. We immediately sped off. We couldn't tell what was happening. I think the last thing in the world anybody thought of was that the President had been shot.' After the race to Parkland Hospital (during which two reporters for the AP and UPI fought furiously over the single phone in Kilduff's car) he saw what had happened. 'His head was just a mass of blood,' Kilduff says. 'It looked like hamburger meat.'" (12-22-78 AP article by Bill Bergstrom on Kilduff found in the Kentucky New Era) "The press pool car in which I was riding on Nov. 22 1963 was directly under the window of the Texas School Book Depository when the shots were fired. I have never had any question in my mind from which direction the shots came or the number of shots fired. There were three shots and they came from above my right shoulder. From my vantage point I was looking directly at the now famous 'grassy knoll.' No one on the knoll was firing a gun." (11-11-83 AP article found in the Bowling Green Daily News) "'I was the person in the motorcade closest to the School Book Depository. I was right under it in the pool car,' Kilduff recalled. Sitting by the open car window, he heard the shots clearly. 'My first thought was 'this is Thanksgiving week and they sell firecrackers in Texas' and somebody had thrown a firecracker. Then I saw that some of the Secret Service men had turned around, and a couple of them had pulled their guns," he said. 'There has never been any question in my mind that the shots came from that window,' Kilduff said. 'My reaction was to turn around and look upward over my right shoulder. If they had come from the so-called grassy knoll they would have been from off to my left.'"

(11-21-88 AP article by Steve Robrahn found in the Lewiston Daily Sun) "'Someone in the car said 'What was that?,' Kilduff recalled. 'I thought, this is the week before Thanksgiving and they sold firecrackers. I said, 'It sounded to me like a firecracker.' Another shot was fired and they realized it wasn't firecrackers.'" (4-17-91 interview with Harrison Livingstone published in High Treason 2, 1992) “I do not accept the so-called 'Magic Bullet' theory… It was a very short period of time between the second and third shot.” (11-22-91 interview with Bob Hensley for WTVQ television, found on youtube) "I was sitting in the right front seat of the pool car just as it turned by the school book depository. So I was directly under the window of the school book depository when we heard the first noise. When we heard the first noise, someone in the car, and I think it was Merriman Smith, said "what was that?" I can remember my thought process, and thinking here we are on top of Thanksgiving. And they sell fireworks. And I said "It sounded to me like a firecracker." And I go into a little detail there, Bob, because there was that much time for me to think and talk between the first and the second shot, despite what you hear now that they came in rapid succession. They did not. The first shot was fired, and I thought it was a firecracker, and then the second shot. By that time, I'd noticed that up ahead of me one of the Secret Service agents, which later turned out to be Clint Hill, had jumped off the running board of the Secret Service follow-up car, and had run toward and was climbing aboard the President's car, and jumping onto the car, which the Zapruder film shows. It shows Mrs. Kennedy reaching out to pull Clint Hill, who it turned out to be was her Secret Service agent, into the President's car. And then the third shot...By that time, I had turned around and was looking at my rear right and up...I was looking at the window, without realizing it, of the school book depository." (5-21-92 letter from William Neichter to Harold Weisberg found in the Weisberg Archives) "Mac Kilduff now lives in Kentucky. Recently he was on WHAS 840 AM with Jim Moore, Jim Marrs, and Judge Burt Griffin. It was amazing that Kilduff agrees with the Warren Commission, except that he says that he thinks 'there were three bullets, three hits.' That is a pretty big except!" (11-1-93 AP article found in the Williamson Daily News) "I was looking directly at the guy on the 'grassy knoll' and he was no more carrying a gun than I was,' Kilduff said, referring to reports that someone on a slight mound in front of the motorcade had fired. 'The shots came from my right shoulder and above me,' he said. 'What am I looking at? The window of the sixth floor of the depository, which is precisely what I've been saying for 30 years. Except that I haven't written a book.'" (4-16-93 oral history for The Sixth Floor Museum) “'I heard this first noise and Merriman Smith said, 'What the hell was that?' And I said, 'Well, it sounded to me like a firecracker.' And then, the second shot, by that time, I had noticed that Clint Hill… had jumped off the Secret Service follow-up car and was running towards the president's car. But then I looked up to where the second shot came from and I was looking, of course, at the sixth—looking up at this building. Now I cannot say I was looking at the exact location it was coming from. I knew it was coming from above and over my right shoulder. It was not coming from the grassy knoll over there (looks right). It came from above and from my rear.' (When asked if at this time two shots had been fired) 'That’s right. There was a longer space between the first and second than between the second and third shots.'” (11-23-99 article in the Dallas Morning News on an interview performed prior to Kilduff's appearance at the Sixth Floor Museum) "When the shots were fired, Mr. Kilduff said, the car he was riding in was directly under the sixth-floor window where Lee Harvey Oswald had been. 'I immediately turned and looked up,' he said. 'There is no doubt in my mind that’s where all the shots came from.' Mr. Kilduff admitted, though, that at the time of the shooting he didn’t believe the president had been wounded. Only when the president’s traveling party arrived at Parkland Memorial Hospital and Mr. Kilduff 'saw his condition' did he realize the seriousness of the situation." (11-23-99 article in the Ft. Worth Star-Telegram on Kilduff's appearance at the Sixth Floor Museum) "Former White House press aide Malcolm Kilduff remembers hearing the first bullet that hit President John F. Kennedy as he rode in a motorcade down Elm Street on Nov. 22, 1963. Kilduff, who was riding two cars behind Kennedy, said he thought someone had set off a firecracker. Six seconds later, he heard another shot and turned and looked above to 'that window' on the sixth floor of the old Texas School Book Depository." Analysis: by stating that Clint Hill (who is still on the back-up car at frame 255) began running for the limousine after the first shot, and by stating that the last two shots were closer together than the first two, Kilduff was describing a first shot hit, followed by two closely-bunched shots. Beyond that, he's full of crap. At first he said he looked to his right out of instinct, and did not look at the window. But he later switched it to his looking up at the window. First shot hit 190-224. Last two shots bunched together.

 

Jack Bell, a reporter for the Associated Press, was in the back seat. (11-22-63 AP Bulletin, marked as 12:41 PCS) "Bell reported three shots were fired as the motorcade entered the triple underpass, which leads to the Stemmons Freeway route to Parkland Hospital." (11-22-63 news bulletin on WBAP, moments later) "Bell of the Associated Press says that three shots were fired as the motorcade entered the triple underpass which leads to the Stemmons Freeway route to Parkland Hospital." (11-22-63 news bulletin on WBAP, around 1:00) "Associated Press reporter Jack Bell says the President and Connally were shot as the motorcade entered a triple underpass that leads to the Stemmons Freeway. Bell said a man and a woman were scrambling on an upper level of a walkway that leads to the underpass." (11-22-63 news bulletin on NBC, read by Chet Huntley around 1:00) "Kennedy was taken to Parkland Hospital, near the Dallas Trade Mart where he was to have made a speech. The AP reporter said Kennedy was transferred to an ambulance. He lay on a seat of the car, blood streaming. Bell reported three shots were fired as the motorcade entered the triple underpass which leads to the Stemmons Freeway route to Parkland Hospital...Reporters saw the president lying flat on his face in the car...Mrs Kennedy was weaping and trying to hold up her husband's head when reporters reached the car." (11-23-63 AP article in the Christchurch Star. Christchurch is in New Zealand, 18 hours ahead of Dallas. This was an afternoon paper. As a consequence, this article must have been written within a few hours of the shooting.) “The assassination took place near a three-highway intersection close to the business area of the city. Within seconds of the shooting, Mr. Kennedy slumped over in the back seat of the car, face down. Mr. Connally lay on the floor of the rear seat. Three bursts of gunfire, apparently from automatic weapons, were heard. Secret service men immediately unslung their automatic weapons and pistols. Mrs. Kennedy and the Governor’s wife, who was also in the car, both crouched over the inert forms of their husbands as the car sped towards the hospital.” (11-22-63 eyewitness account written for the Associated Press, found in the 11-22-63 Spokane Spokesman-Review and the 11-23-63 New York Times) "There was a loud bang as though a giant firecracker had exploded in the caverns between the tall buildings we were just leaving behind us. In quick succession there were two other loud reports...The reports sounded like rifle shots. The man in front of me shouted 'My God, they're shooting at the president!' Our driver braked the car sharply and we swung the doors open to leap out. Suddenly the procession, which had halted, shot forward again...As my eye swept the buildings to the right, where the shots--if they really were shots, and it seemed unbelievable--might have come, I saw no significant sign of activity." (Upon arrival at Parkland) "By the time I had covered the distance to the presidential car, Secret Service Men were helping Mrs. Kennedy away. Hospital attendants were aiding Mr. and Mrs. Connally. For an instant I stopped and stared into the back seat. There, face, down, stretched out at full length, lay the President, motionless. His natty business suit seemed hardly rumpled. But there was blood on the floor." (11-22-64 AP article found in the Ada Oklahoma Evening News) "As the motorcade made a right turn off the packed street, suddenly there were only a few waving spectators. Ahead, we rode toward a left turn into a street which led to an underpass. Nearby was a building with a sign which read: 'Texas School Book Depository.' The President's auto, four cars ahead, already had made the turn toward the underpass and we had just completed it when there was a loud report. My first thought was: Those Texans, now they're shooting off giant firecrackers. Then came two more reports, paced possibly five seconds apart. They had the ominous sound of rifle crack. The President's car had stopped. We reporters riding 'pool' scrambled to get out to run ahead. But at almost that instant, a Secret Service man, riding in the front seat of the presidential limousine stood up, phone in hand, and waved the preceding police cruiser on. In that numb moment we all sensed that something horrible might have happened." (4-19-66 Oral History interview performed for the Kennedy Library) "We turned a corner, and there was the Texas Book Depository. Then we turned another corner heading toward an underpass. I thought somebody had set off a cherry bomb. I thought to myself, 'My God, these Texans don't ever know when to quit. They've given the man everything they could. Here they are shooting off firecrackers and cherry bombs.' About three seconds later there was another report, and then there was a third one. By that time everybody thought this was a rifle shooting. So we started to jump out of the car...We started to get out. There was an assistant White House press secretary in there, too. He yelled out as we were just getting out, 'My God, they’re shooting at the President!' We all thought this was probably true, but we didn’t know. There was no way of finding out at this point what was happening because Kennedy’s car was four cars ahead, and we couldn’t see it clearly. And then the motorcade began to move, so we all jumped back in the car. It moved very fast." (11-23-66 AP article found in the Oil City Pennsylvania Derrick) "Three years ago in a sunny midday in Dallas I heard from the fourth car in a motorcade the sound of three rifle shots that killed a president and wounded a governor. There was the sound of three cadenced shots—no more, no fewer. As our car bearing four newsmen, a presidential press aide and a driver turned left in front of the Texas School Book Depository, the first of these rang out. The sound came from above and to our right. It echoed down the canyon-like block of moderately tall buildings behind us. I remember thinking that some over-enthusiastic Dallasite must have exploded a cherry bomb. Then there was a second crack, unmistakably that of a rifle. It was followed in about five seconds by a third. Then there was a moment of awful silence, broken by shrill cries and screams. People scurried toward whatever protection they could find. As we scrambled back into our car, the motorcade, which had halted, was moving again. Up ahead I saw a man, looking fearfully back over his shoulder and the book depository building, push a woman down on the grassy knoll that led to an overpass and throw his body protectively over hers. The sounds of the three shots had come from above and to the right of us. To one who had been familiar with shooting ranges they sounded like the cadenced quick fire of an experienced rifleman squeezing off a shot, re-loading by bolt action, firing again and a third time..." Analysis: if the Christchurch article was written by Bell, his statement that the shots were apparently from automatic weapons is consistent with his early account of the shots being in quick succession, and sounding like firecrackers, and destroys the credibility of his later assertion that the three shots were "cadenced." Even if he didn't write that, however, his story is still at odds with the LPM scenario. For, even in his later writings, his assertion that the car in which he was riding had made its turn onto Elm when the first shot rang out places this shot well after frame 160. First shot hit 190-224. Last two shots probably bunched together.

Robert Baskin, a reporter for the Dallas Morning News, was also in the back seat. (11-23-63 article in the Dallas Morning News, reportedly written by Bill Rives under Baskin's byline) "Then came the approach to the triple underpass, with the leading cars picking up speed as the crowd thinned out. Over to our right loomed the gaunt structure labeled the Texas School Book Depository. It was 12:30 p.m. The sharp crack of a rifle rang out. But at that moment we couldn't believe it was just that. "What the hell was that?" someone in our car asked. Then there were two more shots, measured carefully. We saw people along the street diving for the ground. Several persons shielded children. Then we knew that the presidential party was under fire. The motorcade ground to a halt. There was a good bit of activity around the President’s car, with Secret Service men running about. Before we could get out of our car, however, police sirens began wailing loudly. The President’s car started up and quickly was going at breakneck speed." (11-23-63 article in the Dallas Morning News--an alternate version of the story re-written for a later edition. Note that this version has Baskin claiming the shot came from up high and to the right--something he failed to claim in his later accounts.) "As the presidential motorcade approached the triple underpass, at the height of the paved hill at Elm and Houston, I was in the 'pool' car three cars back of the President. The President's car had just passed the Texas State Book Depository building when we heard a shot, off to the right. It seemed to come from rather high up. Then we heard two more shots, carefully measured, as though a calm, determined sharp shooter were at work. The Presidential caravan ground to a halt, and suddenly there was a great deal of activity around the President's car. But the impact of the awful act didn't register until we saw people falling down on the streets and frantically trying to find cover. Then we realized it was actual gunfire we had heard." (March-May 1964 account of Bill Rives, the assistant managing editor of the Dallas Morning News on 11-22-63, as published on the Dallas Morning News' website, DallasNews.com) "Earlier, I had talked to Bob Baskin, Washington bureau chief who had been in the press pool car near the President's. We talked on one of our car radios, which had been taken to the Parkland scene by a photographer. Baskin dictated some notes to one of our staffers via this 2-way radio set-up. I took the notes and began writing a first-person story, under Baskin's byline, for the first edition...No reporter had been closer to the assassination than he, and he saw the dead President's body before it was removed at the hospital from car in which Mr. Kennedy rode. He saw the wounded Governor Connally, the stricken wives, the shaken members of the President's staff, and the ashen-faced couple who would become the First Family: Vice-President and Mrs. Johnson. The impact of all this was too much for even a seasoned reporter like Baskin. When he came into the office at my request, he was white-faced and trembling. Someone gave him a drink of whiskey, hoping it would quiet his racing nerves. We got him a cup of coffee, too, and his hand shook so much that he splashed coffee into the saucer as he raised the cup to his mouth. At that time, I had begun writing his first-person account, under his byline. I told him what I was doing and I said "Bob, ordinarily, I'd ask you to go ahead and write this story yourself. But I suggest I finish it for the first edition and you can write your own sub for it later." He readily agreed, admitting that he was in no shape to write anything at that time." (5-15-64 interview with William Manchester, as represented in The Death of a President, 1967) (On the first shot) "Bob Baskin, in his seat behind Kilduff, knew what it was; he was an infantry veteran of the 85th Division, and he looked around wildly for cover." (7-23-64 account written for the Dallas Morning News published in the 2013 book JFK Assassination: The Reporters' Notes) "We turned off Main Street and onto Houston for the last leg of the motorcade route to the Trade Mart at almost 12:30. We saw the President's car make the turn onto Elm in front of the Texas School Book Depository, gaining a bit of speed. The press car was halfway down the block before the left turn when the first shots rang out. "What the hell was that?" one of us asked. The motorcade kept moving and we had just turned the corner for the approach to the triple underpass some four seconds later when a second and then a third shot were heard. We came to a halt. Ahead we could see considerable movement around the President's car but couldn't make out what it was all about." (3-16-74 interview with the Johnson Library) "We heard the first shot ring out and...I instinctively thought it was a rifle shot. Then the other shots followed and I was convinced it was rifle fire. But then this commotion started around the President's car and people were falling to the ground over there. And our press car came to a halt and we were throwing open the back doors to get out, and all of a sudden the thing began to move, and we moved down fast to Parkland." Analysis: while Baskin's "measured carefully" might lead some to put him in the LPM category, he also said the limo was past the book depository when the first shot rang out. He confuses things further by stating that the press car was only halfway down the block before the turn when the first "shots" rang out. This suggests a first shot seconds before frame 160. He then wrote that they'd made the turn onto Elm "some four seconds later". Well, this suggests they were far more than halfway to Elm when the first shot rang out. As Baskin grouped the last two shots together, moreover, and didn't notice a commotion until after the last two shots were fired, it's highly doubtful he heard the last two shots five seconds apart, as in the LPM scenario. Probable first shot hit 190-224. Last two shots possibly bunched together.

Bob Clark, a reporter for ABC News, was in the back seat as well. (11-22-63 phoned-in report on ABC) “Three shots were fired at the President’s motorcade as it passed out of the downtown area of Dallas...The shots rang out as the motorcade had entered an open area just beyond the main downtown business district. It was impossible to determine where the shots had come from.” (11-22-63 news report on ABC Radio, around 1:40 PM) "Bob Clark said he had seen blood on the President's head." (11-22-63, phoned-in recap, broadcast around 2:10 PM) "We had just rounded the corner at the fringe of the business district when three shots suddenly rang out. They sounded at this stage like an automobile backfiring. They were extremely loud...We heard the shots very clearly but it was almost inconceivable at this stage that this was an assassination. Then three or four seconds elapsed before the car that the president was traveling in--this car came to an immediate stop. The Secret Service follow-up car--some of the agents piled out then almost immediately leaped back in." (6-3-96 interview on C-Span) "When Oswald fired the shots, I was in the pool car, about the sixth car back from the President, about maybe 250 or 300 feet behind the President. But our car was just making the turn underneath the window where Oswald was firing. So in our car the sounds of the shots were very loud and very clear, and what was to become more significant historically, equally loud and clear. So we all felt after the first one, the first was just a loud noise--it might have been a firecracker or something. But with the next two shots we all knew they were shots and we all knew they came from very close to us, up above and again almost directly overhead." (3-4-03 Interview conducted for President Kennedy Has Been Shot, 2003) “When (Merriman Smith) said those were gunshots, I think we all in the car just accepted they were gunshots. They were loud and clear and more significant—for the historical record—they were equally loud and equally clear and were clearly fired from almost over our head.” (11-20-03 article on Gwhatchet.com reporting on a meeting of the National Press Club) "'Right as we turned in front of the Texas School Book Depository I heard three extremely loud and clear shots,' said Clark, referring to the building from which suspected assassin Lee Harvey Oswald reportedly fired three shots. Clark told the audience of 100 that he and other journalists were unaware of exactly what happened because they could not see the presidential limousine." (Chapter by Clark in November 22, 1963, by Dean Owen, published 2013) "I was directly under the window where Oswald was shooting from when the shots rang out. The shots were loud and clear, though we had no idea Kennedy had been hit. Merriman Smith of UPI, who was the senior wire service reporter, was in the car. He was a gun fancier and said "Those are shots." Analysis: it’s interesting that Clark says all the shots sounded the same but that the only reason he knew they were shots was because Smith, who’d said the first shot sounded different than the others, told him so. It's also interesting that he says that they were turning as they heard the shots. As people claiming they heard something at a given time are most commonly implying that they heard the beginning of a sound or series of sounds at that time, and not the end of a sound or series of sounds at that time, this suggests the first shot heard by Clark was fired long after frame 160, when he was still three cars from the corner. First shot hit 190-224.