David Josephs

For the entire month of Nov the FBI looked for any sign of Oswald. (see composite of reports at bottom of post)

And when a list of FBI reports is compiled... these PECK & CRAWFORD reports are not listed...

Seems to me the FBI is deferring to the CIA transcripts as the only evidence of Oswald's trip... while hiding the facts as they learned them.

So why perform this CI activity the same weekend Oswald is with Cubans in Dallas, is seen by Odio and is at a shooting range also in Dallas?
Leaves Hoover very little room to wiggle if Ozzie is acting the informant/agent, getting paid and traveling with Cubans...  

Libeler: The Commission had information to the effect that sometime during November 1963, you saw a gentleman at the rifle range whom you subsequently came to believe was LEE HARVEY OSWALD?
Price: That's right. The first time I saw this person was in September, the last week, the last Saturday of September, and that was the afternoon they opened the rifle range.
Libeler: On the last Saturday of September? That would be Saturday, September 28, 1963?
Price: Yes.

What a spectacularly rich thread we have here...  and I do not wish to derail it....  I simply would like to add that placing our Oswald in Mexico is akin to placing him in the Sniper's Nest....
Makes for a good legend and conviction, but is simply not the fact.

Thank you all for voicing yourselves on both sides of the discussion.  While I choose not to comment on the details of the mole-hunt or any other operation not specific to connecting Oswald to Cuba/Russia...  there are a few key points along the way which convince me Oswald was nowhere near Mexico...  Hoover himself wrote it in a note:

As you may know, I've tried to stay away from this area since so many are doing such great work following the leads.
I've concentrated on the constructed trips to and from... and the mountains of FBI evidence trying to convince you he took the trip and was actually there... 
when there simply is no evidence beyond the transcripts, the listened to tape, and the physical evidence created by an FBI asset at the GOBERNACION.

In the discussions above I see little about Phillip's arrival on the 8th of Oct after having spent time at JMWAVE.
Quite a lot happens between Oct 8 and the 15th....  with Phillips and Goodpasture in the middle of it.

Here is the Oct 8th Summary report for LIENVOY.  I added some parts of the report which explain what they did with LIENVOY info and did you mention LEVISTER?
I'd have to go back and look again....   Those dates for LEVISTER - CIA HQ officer is at the Mexico City CIA station at the perfect time to discuss the writing of a report "as an example".

The numerous calls on the 27th and 28th of Sept are nowhere to be found.

The calls of Sept 27 and 28 are not reported on any summary of activity report from Mexico city
The October Summary reports of surveillance do not mention Oswald despite previous months mentioning Americans specifically.
The Oct/Nov summary reports on the taps on Russian consulate officer's homes turns up not one conversation about this mysterious AMERICAN visitor 
 trying to get into a compound closed on Saturdays.
The Nov reports do not come out until January 64

The Houston evidence is TWIFORD and the Houston bus terminal ticket salesman... the problem here, like at every stop along the way... instead of buying the cheaper 2-3- or 4-part ticket to Mexico and Back... a ticket is supposedly purchased at every single stop... without record.

The initial FBI investigation turns up only 2 buses from New Orleans to Mexico City and neither gets him to the destination when he needs to...
So the go back to Continental and find a bus to HOUSTON which can get him there for the TWIFORD 10pm call ....  cause it's the only one... not cause Oswald was found to be on it.

Then there is the entire episode in Austin and the handful of witnesses who claim Oswald was there...

"To avoid corroborating her story we find the FBI once again trying to discredit witnesses.  While they all give Mrs. Dannelly (and Jesse Skrivanek) the benefit of the doubt, they determine that two more people could not be right.  One of these witnesses, a waitress who claims to have served Oswald stated she has Wednesdays off.  Sept 25^th was a Wednesday and the day Mrs. Dannelly sees Oswald, so by process of elimination Mrs. Norman could not have seen Oswald.    When shown a photo of HARVEY, both Ronnie Dugger and Mrs. Stella Norman claim the person they met was “identical with Oswald”.   "   https://kennedysandking.com/john-f-kennedy-articles/the-evidence-is-the-conspiracy-index   

(There are a number of chapters...  and initially I felt LEE may have come down from Dallas on his way to Mexico... but I do not find that the case.  In fact, it is possible that no Oswald existed in this story at all...  consider those who claim to have SEEN him and their validity...  MANN at State was in bed with and pushing the CASTRO angle from the start with Phillips and the CIA.... whereas the I&NS/FBI were not so easily convinced.

All I am getting at here is that the time has come to stop even pretending that the man Ruby killed went to Mexico in Sept/Oct

Case in point....  When the alphabetized FM-11 is provided by our FBI man OCHOA...  Mr. H.O. LEE is mysteriously set under "O" and not "L"
(We can also prove Oswald was not at the Mexican Consulate with GAUDET on Sept 17)

I will continue to read with great interest as y'all unravel what was happening down there...  I spent a few years and wandered thru thousands of docs seeing the same thing... the FBI/CIA finding virtually every single person via the records available... and many of them tell easily proven falsehoods about the trip and meeting this man.... yet not Oswald.

For a second take Oswald completely out of the picture... other than in the knowledge of David Atlee Phillips... (Teresa Proenza even claims that Oswald bumps into her and talks to her before anyone!)  Making a phone call appear it is coming from one place when it comes from another... intelligence agency capability you think?

What if the calls where all faked from JMWAVE... I don't believe DURAN ever listened to her voice on those tapes... right?
LITAMIL-9 and -7 both support there not being any Oswald in Mexico - at ANY time....

And then of course.... where was E H Hunt at the time? and what do you supposed he was doing?

8 hours ago, Robert Wheeler said:

Oswald visited Sarasota, Florida. If true, is there a link to the source?

Robert,

I am aware via the H&L work of Armstrong that LEE was in Florida while Harvey was in Russia....

The link below the excerpt is to the FBI report.... 

Google maps shows Sarasota and Stock Island appear to be 150-200 miles by water...  
Sarasota is not mentioned in H&L... only Key West.

DJ

21 hours ago, John Butler said:

Harvey Lee Oswald, PFC at Santa Ana at 31 July 1959 

By July 1959, Lee Harvey had been and was released from El Toro in March.

There are most certainly 2 diff signatures on the Helsinki hotels .

From what I remember Lee hated to be called Harvey...

And then figuring who it was in London....

12 hours ago, John Butler said:

Didn't Dino say 8 shots?  I was sort thrown off by that. 

Thought he said 6-8 from 3 diff directions

23 minutes ago, John Butler said:

Jean Hill's 4 to 6 shots.

And Dino’s at NPIC Sat night as well...

On 5/9/2020 at 8:42 AM, John Butler said:

I ran across this recently and haven't seen it before.

Had seen it but without the caption....  here is a partial list of men in San Diego... tells us where the men are from as well...

I don't see any Evansville, Indiana....  This shows "DAVIS, ELAM, OSWALD & SCOTT" were recruited from Dallas TX.... 

And the WRONG Felde (not Robert A Felde but Alex R Felde) coming from Wisconsin...

Thanks James... only looked at the front slits in the image
Standard button is 12mm or .47”....  ya think there are 10 buttons from top of collar to hole in back?

That photo makes what Ford did even more obvious... no bullet hole in shirt or jacket at the Ford spot...

Take care.. DJ

Not sure what the problem is here...  In the Marines we are shown he has no WISDOM TEETH... only 2 molars per side (missing 1/16/17/32), upper and lower with
tooth #30 missing from extraction

Why does the exhumed dental record, and the photo show 3 MOLARS per side, upper and lower?

Good idea John...  I'll get on that

58 minutes ago, John Butler said:

So, is it worth putting into your timeline?  I believe it is.

13 hours ago, Chris Bristow said:

Does anyone know what the initials are(Looks like VS) on the towel under JFK's head on the blue part of the towel? Also was the gallery on a second floor looking down on the scene as other galleries?
And for anyone who wants to strain their eyes you can see some of the room reflected in the chrome head brace in the photo that shows the phone in the background. Looks like you can make out a bowl and maybe cabinets.

 

Says US

2 minutes ago, Jonathan Cohen said:

No "supporting data" will ever satisfy H&L adherents that they're actually talking about the same person - not two distinct individuals who magically look exactly alike. All the supporting data anyone would ever need comes from the exhumation, which proves there was one and only one Lee Harvey Oswald. Was Oswald impersonated at various points throughout the assassination? I believe he was, in an attempt to strengthen the eventual case against him. But that certainly does not require subscribing to the preposterous and throughly debunked notion that he was part of a CIA doppelganger project.

You don't seem to understand Jon that YOU are being asked to back YOUR claims... not question ours... yet.

You want to read and cherry pick from a few dis-tractors, have at it....  but don't post like you know anything about the subject... they call that PARROTING

Which of all this debunking evidence do you like THE BEST for countering what ELY & Jenner wrote below?

btw, If you're not aware, El Toro and Santa Ana are two separate and distinct locations

... 

1 hour ago, Jim Hargrove said:

DJ,

Thank you for bringing together all these USMC documents!  Ever since I read H&L all those years ago, I thought the Marine Corps records were among the very best evidence of two Oswalds.  It's just all over the place in those docs, which is remarkable since there was surely a serious effort to conceal them.

Always my pleasure Jim....   

So many people are aware of each of these men, separately,  and yet the Military offers enough excuses and/or in many cases simply ignores the evidence...

Then there's this nonsense... Official LEE military photo shows a man with an enormous head...  yet these are the same person?

And then there is the body mechanics... shoulder slopes and sheeer size...  5'8" 135 versus 5'11" 160...  people do not shrink from age 18 to 24....

Everything based on lined up left eye...

  yet his training was AIRCRAFT MECHANICS...  what up?

On 5/6/2020 at 11:56 AM, Jonathan Cohen said:

There is no "Harvey." Paperwork anomalies notwithstanding, every single photo being discussed here is of the same person - the one and only historical Lee Harvey Oswald.

Hit and run Jon?  Do all your opinions get this much supporting data...

Cheers Jon... to each their own.
 

As serious as Gorsky and March 1959....  

Brady, I believe, was simply a HSCA staffer...

The story of Harvey's crossing on a ship is also kind of interesting... I've written about it here so do a search...

Take care... DJ

2 diff signatures... where have we seen that?

15 minutes ago, Jonathan Cohen said:

There is no "Harvey." Paperwork anomalies notwithstanding, every single photo being discussed here is of the same person - the one and only historical Lee Harvey Oswald.

Anything to offer beyond your word Jon?  You know what they say about opinions...  but a well documented argument is hard to ignore...
Whatcha got?

This Asst PROVO MARSHALL talks of the Lee Oswald he knows

The biographer John Ely finds some interesting things as well

And then there is this drawing from 1668.. if those railings were there, that tile step in the Stare image can’t be the gallery.  I also seem to remember they did not use the metal support but a wooden block support seem in one of the their photos.

Edit..  although the bottom of those rails may match that little step... if the rails were not there in 63.

https://images.app.goo.gl/zRNve1Sr2KVCryQJA

Found this recently - RYBERG drawing of Bethesda Morgue....

Can anyone please explain how this photo (which has to be about where BOSWELL is in the Ryberg drawing) is taken in that room.. or in the room drawn by O'Connor down below. 
To his left would be the GALLERY,and neither of those 2 objects are gallery related...

1 hour ago, Steve Thomas said:

David,

I wonder who Leo Oswald was.

 

Steve Thomas

This seems to have been typed by someone after the fact looking at the signature which you just cut off...

I think a real problem - as I see it - is his using that DOD ID with HARVEY's picture, yet the passport has Lee..

Do you think that DoD card had a similar photo to the Passport, and was changed later... or simply not used as ID and the typing was well after the fact and a cya...

(Here's a mock-up of what the card SHOULD have looked like...  if he shows the bottom one and gives them or takes a photo for the passport... what up??

... or ???  As we both know, he should not have had that card at the time of the 1959 passport application....

13 hours ago, Pete Mellor said:

I have never discovered any statement from DPD or Sheriff officers who discovered the Carcano (or Mauser) stating that they sniffed the barrel to prove that their discovery had been fired.

Strange that!

The test could have only shown the rifle was not fired in some time... as he says, a single bullet cleans the barrel, but if no bullet was fired it would reveal the rust still in the barrel...  FBI expert doesn’t even test to see if rifle had been fired... par for the course...
 

Mr. McCLOY - When you examined the rifle the first time, you said that it showed signs of some corrosion and wear? 
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir. 
Mr. McCLOY - Was it what you would call pitted, were the lands in good shape? 
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; the lands and the grooves were worn, the corners were worn, and the interior of the surface was roughened from corrosion or wear. 
Mr. McCLOY - Was there metal fouling in the barrel? 
Mr. FRAZIER - I did not examine it for that. 
Mr. McCLOY - Could you say roughly how many rounds you think had been fired since it left the factory, with the condition of the barrel as you found it? 
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I could not, because the number of rounds is not an indication of the condition of the barrel, since if a barrel is allowed to rust, one round will remove that rust and wear the barrel to the same extent as 10 or 15 or 50 rounds just fired through a clean barrel. 
Mr. McCLOY - Thank you. 

13 hours ago, Pamela Brown said:

What a good question.  Why don't we put together a map of the streetcar routes and locations? Judyth may even have one in her book; I can check...

From what I could piece together her apartment was 1032 Marengo couple blocks off Magazine..

Ferrie's location is not pointed out on this map....  but you can't be at 2 places at once...

And why was the prodigy working at a coffee shop first?
When she calls Oswald in the middle of the night when she is kicked from her first apartment... Ozzie is living at Lillian's...
Where does she go as Ozzie had yet to get the Reilly job...

This call supposedly occurs May 4th...  yet he's at Lillian's all week....  Nothing I have found offers where she would have been or how she gets into her Marengo Apartment...

May 1: Robert Baker arrived; he wished to get married immediately, because he had to
leave before midnight May 3rd to go to a summer job in the Gulf Coast area.
May 2: Because of a 2-day waiting period in Louisiana, Baker and Judyth eloped to
Mobile, Alabama, where they were married. [28]
May 3: evening: Robert Baker left for his summer employment
May 3-4 Midnight: Judyth was evicted from her rented room due to a police raid and
found herself on the streets. [Times-Picayune articles for May 4-5 describe these raids]
May 4: By afternoon, Lee helped Judyth move into an apartment at 1032 Marengo,
within walking distance from an apartment he said he was going to take for himself soon
thereafter.
Prior to May 9: Judyth worked at a fast food restaurant, Royal Castle

I've also wondered why Oswald was in such a rush to get Marina out to Magazine if he was in a torrid love affair...
He could take time to get set up, delay ever longer if he wanted...but within 1 week of the eviction he is sending for her
 (why in the world would she be some place from where she could be evicted?
and what kind of place has police raids at Friday night at midnight...to just throw people from their homes? 

And this was how BAKER leaves his new wife - btw, is there a photo of Mr Baker?)

Funny too how little she says of George Smathers, a JFK groomsman and her benefactor thru her late teens and early 20's...

And then there's the infamous W-2 Copy B...  Anna Lewis... Clinton...  so many insinuated inclusions in the activities that never involved her...

I've asked this of most JVB supporters... but get no reply:  they hate it when her story is challenged

If she's taking a bus to and from work with Oswald and spending time with him at Reilly...
when is she working at the Ochsner clinic with Mary Sherman in her lab? ... or with Ferrie in his?  and how does she get there and back?

Eddy.... are you thinking Oswald brings this rifle before Friday morning?  If so... How?  If not... my article rests my case...

Dougherty here does a good job refuting Wesley. (see testimony excerpt below) and there's Danny-boy here...

This is a sister protecting her brother/family....

Mrs. RANDLE. He was carrying a package in a sort of a heavy brown bag, heavier than a grocery bag it looked to me. It was about, if I might measure, about this long, I suppose, and he carried it in his right hand, had the top sort of folded down and had a grip like this, and the bottom, he carried it this way, you know, and it almost touched the ground as he carried it.

And Wesley's mother shows her kids to be protecting each other...    FBI uses neither WESLEY of FRAZIER and then uses the RANDLE address...

Think they were trying to hide this?  she was not called of course...

How many times does Ball have to ask and re-ask the same questions?

Mr. BALL - "I started to work today, 11-22-63, at about 7 a.m. o'clock".
Did you tell them that?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes.
Mr. BALL - The statement says, "I recall vaguely having seen Lee Oswald, when he came to work at about 8 a.m. today."
Mr. DOUGHERTY - That's right.
Mr. BALL - Now, is that a very definite impression that you saw him that morning when he came to work?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Well, oh--it's like this--I'll try to explain it to you this way--- you see, I was sitting on the wrapping table and when he came in the door, I just caught him out of the corner of my eye---that's the reason why I said it that way.
Mr. BALL - Did he come in with anybody?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - No.
Mr. BALL - He was alone?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes; he was alone.
Mr. BALL - Do you recall him having anything in his hand?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Well, I didn't see anything, if he did.
Mr. BALL - Did you pay enough attention to him, you think, that you would remember whether he did or didn't?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Well, I believe I can---yes, sir---I'll put it this way; I didn't see anything in his hands at the time.
Mr. BALL - In other words, your memory is definite on that is it?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - In other words, you would say positively he had nothing in his hands?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - I would say that---yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Or, are you guessing?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - I don't think so.
Mr. BALL - You saw him come in the door?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes.
Mr. BALL - The back door on the first floor?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - It was in the back door.
Mr. BALL - Now, that back door is the door that opens onto what? That back door would be the first floor?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes.
Mr. BALL - And it opens where?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - On the back deck--on the back dock side over there.

8 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

David I'm not much on linking pictures but I saw one recently elsewhere that relates I think.  Sorry I can't remember where, somewhere on here most likely.  It's of Shelly being escorted from the TSBD to a police car for an affidavit and/or questioning by a shotgun toting DPD cop.  The Shelly in that picture looked a whole lot like the one in the picture of the guy behind Oswald in the leafleting picture.  If someone who knows how could post them side by side that would be neat.  Or it might make me look like a alone nut.  Sequestered In Place.

I think this is what you're talking about...

And the people at prayer-man.com decided I was right and ran with it...  the circled image above comes from a larger image of them walking to this police car

http://www.prayer-man.com/tsbd/bill-shelley/

2 hours ago, Eddy Bainbridge said:

'could Oswald have willingly smuggled in a rifle for someone else to make use of'

It happened that way Eddy...

You've read the story of Ralph Leon Yates?  The FBI institutionalized him days after his Jan 1964 polygraph at age 27...
He died 12 years later, still institutionalized, at 39.

Yates also claimed that the man showed him 1 of the Backyard photos... with Yates recognizing it was the man in the car with him...

Yates drops him off at Elm/Houston with his package...  so in a real sense "an" Oswald does what you claim... just not the guy Ruby killed.