Shanet Clark

You have such a rosy view of government! You want to insure that no one blames the agency, even if their agents acted on this. If the illegal, immoral and violent CIA programs and covert ops of the late 1950's and early 1960's set the stage for deniable, off the books operations, well, then the CIA still gets a free pass ... "it" didn't do it because the DI McCone didn't write the order down and send you a signed copy of the plans ...... If the mindset of CIA MK ULTRA mind control, cancer-to-kill research, induced madness and political murder around the world set the stage and gave skills and training to the killers of Kennedy, do you still say the CIA had no responsibility? If John Gotti and Vincent the Chin order "Fats" Chicolino to kill Judge Parker, (under your theory) ... the "Mafia" didn't do anything, just a few "rogues" ... The system of running unstable and violent individuals, in illegal and poorly designed covert ops, the whole CIA joint agency DOMESTIC operations of the period...that is the backdrop we are working in front of in order to solve this crime, and place responsibility .... Your patriotic denial and willingness to forgive and indulge a classified secret agency until THEY relaease undeniable evidence AGAINST THEMSELVES is misplaced.... I see it more like third century Rome, where the palace guard, Centurians and generals of the Legions decided who was to be Ceasar. Blood was shed and no one reading history is surprised. But Dallas ? Get real............Power is as Power does, and the victor cleans up after....

A recent private email from a member asked me what I thought the agencies might have used against JFK in the security process, if they removed his clearance and removed him from power via an executive sanction: I wrote back: Hey XXXXXX, Yes, of course. The "problems" are the same ones that are exposed in his biographies. These are stressed by his opponents and downplayed by his supporters... Mary Meyer's friends knew very well that she shared her LSD-25 with JFK, and this relationship with her (the wife of CIA honcho Cord Meyer) I believe was pivotal, both in its extramarital and pharmacological aspects. Meyer's mysterious murder and CIA interest in her diary point to this being a well observed tryst (and trip). After the MK ULTRA program, it is hard to believe a top executive could indulge in social LSD without some agency interest. This didn't occur in a vacuum, agency and military concern for Kennedy's "softness" on Communism and hostility to the CIA, etc., was the setting for the specific pretext of incapacity. The Addison's adrenal deficiency and subsequent injections of amphetamine were part of his file...the use of opiates for pain, and alleged marijuana use (no source-LA hearsay, sorry) were contributing. His "questionableness" probably goes back to FBI and ONI files concerning Inga Arvad (Inga BInga) during WWII. His array of sexual partners was a matter of interest, and of course Ellen Romesch, apparently an East German spy, could have been the last straw. The agencies (ONI, JCS security, NSA, CIA, DI, Treasury & FBI) may have had evidence from medical records of syphilis (rumored) which has neurological aspects. Your note hints at the charged partisan aspect of this theory. JFK lovers will shy away from the theory, suspecting that I am playing to his enemies in the manner of Seymour Hersh (Dark Camelot)...they think it might be true, but don't want to talk about it, because it does reflect back on John.... Those on the right see the theory as a way to "slag" him, and probe for real dirt, and real security lapses. They hope to prove the incapacity charge as a final coffin-nail on JFK. Since the 25th hadn't been passed yet, there was no legal way to sanction the President, if he was a security risk, except possibly through impeachment. The 25th allows for a very streamlined "impeachment" by cabinet level executives---and it appears, to me, to normalize the sanction of November 1963... Shanet

I googled ZAPRUDER FRAME (no pun intended) and got several good discussions. The big edit, the jump from no limo to limo in the kill zone, is supposedly Zapruder turning off the camera, then turning it back on. However, this would have produced strong overexposure of the First frame of the "restart" because the Bell and Howell always overexposed the first frame after a complete stop. So someone edited out the missing portion and made a spliceless splice, which means a false master print --- read the various opinions, they range from TOTAL FAKE to INNOCENT HOME MOVIE. I am concerned about the letters on the margin, this is evidence of tampering that is not visible when the movie is screened, only when the full frames are inspected.

I see you have been working on it. Priceless resource, we appreciate it...

Frame One through Frame 39 does have an anomaly in the upper right quadrant. It is persistent, it looks like a MATTE overlay and it resembles, indeed, the retaining wall and bushes in Nix and Moorman.... It essentially airbrushes the windows of the building to the right of the three upright narro windows (county records?) View it in its "original" form here: http://www.assassinationresearch.com/zfilm/z1.jpg Shanet ALSO: The animation above (Lees post of the horizontal shadow man) might be best interpreted as light and shadow falling on the Screen during a cineplex transfer. If one were filming a dub or "doctored" copy from a screen (or mirror) and someone opened a door, and light fell on the screen briefly, this is what you would see. This to me is the "watermark" that shows film transfer and duplication in what is supposedly an original. It didn't happen in the darkroom, because the light would be a dark spoilage, this is a light shining onto the image that is being filmed. ALSO: what are the strange letters on the left margin in 34-38, some are letters against the tree, some are against a solid background, glimpse of margin of composite element ...? (these #s return around 160...169 "M" in left margin... ?) The shadow overlay looks most human and like the Badgeman or gunman in Frame 170, against the follow up cars black hood --- check it out: http://www.assassinationresearch.com/zfilm/z170.jpg Here is another anomaly, visible to the naked eye. Click on frame 183 -- what is the secondary source of the building? It is shown in the lower left hand corner and isolated in the upper bracket fragment ... this looks like the triple overpass or a brick building ! http://www.assassinationresearch.com/zfilm/z183.jpg ALSO coming and going at random are letters in the left hand margin M, I, K, D, C, R etc. Sometimes they are there and sometimes not.... ?????????????????????????????????????????????? Duncan's theory comes into play here. If someone from a nearly identical Point of View as Zapruder were to pan across the parade route, a few yards before the limo, but with no limo in the frame, then this stock footage could have been used to superimpose the limo in the bottom of the released zapruder film -- and all the witnesses like Jean Hill and Mary Moorman would still be in the movie.... That retouching of the first forty frames or so in the upper right hand that Lee Forman points out ... that is the "smoking gun" for forgery, this is more compelling than the pincushion effect problems or speed and braking issues. Some one asked what was the one "flag" for fraud, and here it is, along with the super fast blood dispersal 313-314.

Intersting. The most interesting part for me is AL HAIG, blowing his own horn, yet again. Anyone who has considered my theory of a joint agency executive sanction of Kennedy should read Alexander Haig's words carefully. He tends to puff himself up and say more than he means to....given his role in the JCS spy ring involving Admiral Moorer and Yeoman Radford, his role as chief transisiton officer in the Nixon Ford event, his hawkish self aggrandisement under natrional security, I think this is a fateful statement. Was he the Military CHief of the CIA WH Caribbean AM and ZR programs? Certainly looks like it, and if he is claiming to be THE MAN over MONGOOSE, INTERPEN and TILT for the Armed Forces, then I think his role in 11/22/63 needs to be seriously re-apprised. Does anyone else see what I am saying : Is he claiming to be military honcho on the Joint agency WH plans for 11/63? Looks like he is ..... AL HAIG stands expossed by his own unwise statements, again.

Thanks David Healey, That really helped me get up to speed. I will check out the sites. Does anyone sell a 8mm of the Dealey films? I would like to watch them screened AS FILM. Anyone else have anything on the "MASTER FILM ?" Scottish television showed it ?

Right on Robert Charles Dunne well put. Stan was just stating plainly what we all think of this herring... TIM GRATZ has sources he is defending as firm, sacrosanct, infallible. What sources are these, that are unimpeachable and central to his theory? "Attorney Joseph Califano, Dean Michael Kurtz, General Alexander Haig and Joseph Trento " Unquote. Trento based his narrative on CIA sources including DESMOND FITZGERALD and JAMES JESUS ANGLETON. This obviously is ca-ca, or scheidt, or foul offal, or septic human sewage, barnyard droppings, scat, nitrate soil, night soil, manure, waste, Stan knows it, Greg knows it and everybody else knows it, ( I guess Tim doesn't know it yet )......

dgh01: Covered pretty much in Jim Fetzer's HOAX... RDellaRosa comments in HOAX about the "other film" he, as well as others have seen. Including one person [from Europe] that has posted to this forum in the past. His post were under another topic. /do you think Fetxer is right on this, is this credible?/ Having a background in special effects compositing and matting techniques in both film and electroinc media, its pretty easy to speculate how alteration to the Z-film could of happened. It's not a question of; was it possible -- was the know how, manpower, technology available? Of course it was -- it available years prior to the assassination. The black art of optical film printing [and all it entails] became a known commodity during WW2... Washington turned to Hollywood for ALL the talents resident there in support of the WAR effort [which all of us Americans, amongst others,should be thankful for] /howard hughes? cd jackson? or joint agency psy ops propaganda commnd?/ Those photo researchers that have seriously broached the film alteration subject - find one area of question that needs more clarification: was the time avaialble to perform alteration? Coupled with that simple question, I've couched another: when did Shanneyfelt of the FBI give the actual Z-film frame, numbers? /splices? half-trees? missing frames? nix and muchmore start after 313/ Another perplexing question has risen in the past few years: no one can attest too, or verify, that the sitting members [not aides or staff] of the Warren Commission ever saw the camera original Z-film... /they didn't want to see it...deniability, elitists distanced from gory reality/ Ask your self this: following the assassination, the Secret Service and the FBI conducted their investigations in Dealey Plaza, why, during those investigations did they [sS, FBI] conclude the notorious headshot [Z-313] happend further down Elm St., approximately the concrete stairs ascending the Grassy Knoll (the area where we see Z-358 - today) ... /big difference since nix and muchmore cut in here and braking headpins in Z here/ Confusing investigation details, coupled with the FINAL WC report lead to big, BIG questions... then we can get to; WHY was it deemed necessary to alter the film, in the first place! /no doubt/ Welcome to the can of worms, Shanet. I wish you well! /thanks dgh#1/David Healy <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Duncan McRae has made a very serious claim, one I have heard before. Can anyone vouch for this? Has anyone seen this Dealey "Master Film" ? Also, I would like anyone else to weigh in on the original question I asked of Duncan... QUOTE(Shanet Clark @ Feb 20 2005, 06:47 AM) Duncan From your experince with handling the dubs and various prints, what do you think the NIX, the MUCHMORE and the dreaded ZAPRUDER films looked like before ANY handling whatsoever? What do you think may have been edited, or guided the final product? How degraded are NIX and MUchmore, and why are they so short and cut to the same part, and what was edited from Zapruder... Any ideas on how to approach this field...? "Hi Shanet..That's quite a question you ask,and a good one.The answer is one i can only guess at just like anyone else.The "other film" as it is known was first brought to my attention on Rich Della Rossa's Forum back around 2001 www.jfkresearch.com which Miller is banned from for reasons which i will leave to him to explain if he so desires.The "other film apparently shows the limo coming to a complete stop,and 2 head shots striking the president,and much more brain matter being ejected as is seen in the Zapruder movie.I stand to be corrected by anyone who has seen the other film if this short description is wrong.Now this intrigued me very much,as when i regained an interest in the assassination after many years,i showed my brother the Zapruder movie,and he was surprised that it did not show a limo stop or as much brain matter as we both recalled seeing in the early 70's when a film was shown on Scottish television.My brother remembered a limo stop,and i had not even mentioned that others on the Della Rossa forum had claimed to have seen this too.Personally i do not remember a limo stop,only much more brain matter,but he is adamant that it stopped.The purpose of the "other film" i do not know,but from what information i have gathered,it seems to have been used for military purposes.The logic of this is beyond my understanding.Why they had to keep the "other film" and not destroy it (maybe it has been destroyed now) is also beyond my understanding,but to answer your question,i can only guess that the Nix,Muchmore,and Zapruder films were possibly altered (i am open minded on the topic of alteration) to confirm the lone gunman theory.I can't think of any other logical reason that would make sense.As you probably know,the original Nix film is missing...lost...it's disgraceful,so degragated copies of this film are all we have to work with.My suspicions about this film are mainly in the seemingly blacked out background between the wall and the fence which probably contains lots of clearer information and answers about..BDM,Arnold,Badgeman,Classic gunman etc etc etc. Muchmore was also spliced at the exact frame of the commonly seen headshot apparently by accident..Now the "other film" as far as i am aware,shows 2 almost similtaneous headshots.Could this splice be significant?...who knows?.I would like to see the technical aspects of the Muchmore and Nix camera mechanics explored in as much detail as the Zapruder film has been scrutinised.Perhaps Costella or someone of that caliber could undertake such a project at some point." DUNCAN MACRAE Can anyone support this or shed light on this? Theory and Speculation is welcome... Thanks, Shanet [Rather than call it the generic "other" film, easily confused with NIX or MUCHMORE I call it the "Master Film"]

http://jfkresearch.freehomepage.com/c2766.html

Hear Hear ! Top drawer, fine post, Al. Hit the nail on the head. Thanks for posting. ALBERT SPAGGIARI PHOTO POST #2 Shanet.

PHOTO POST #2 ???

[ SPAGGIARI, ALBERT NICE FRANCE 1977

The relationship of those two makes the whole Oswald theory go up in smoke. DeMorenschildt was a double if not a triple agent. He was apparently more interested in Marina, the KGB family russian immigrant, at first, but then the suave international white russian became a handler for Lee as well... That guy was dirty, he was murdered before he could testify to COngress or talk to his biographer, The Baron is really the puzzle.... fascist and they called him Lee...

....I heard it was colonel mustard in the library with a candlestick ...

Duncan From your experince with handling the dubs and various prints, what do you think the NIX, the MUCHMORE and the dreaded ZAPRUDER films looked like before ANY handling whatsoever? What do you think may have been edited, or guided the final product? How degraded are NIX and MUchmore, and why are they so short and cut to the same part, and what was edited from Zapruder... Any ideas on how to approach this field...?

Clarence Dougla$$ Dillon NEVER gave John Fitzgerald Kennedy the Protection a President needed and was understood to have in the modern period. He stripped security when Jack was inaugurated in 1961.... this is a silly dialogue, because the lack of running boards tight motorcycle formations, hard tops and advance work in OTHER cities is evidence AGAINST the 1963 Secret Service under CD DILLON.... And that is a provable , manifest fact ...

Mike: I agree so much - esp. about the power of Gerald Ford to dictate to Nixon in 1974. Once Nigel Turner and Barr McClellan spoke out on the nature of the Johnson alliances, I have sought further evidence. John Simkins ( a British man, by the way, not even an American), seemed to have the most complete and up to date consensus gathered. But the focus on Johnson left other principles out of the loop and off the hook...Maxwell Taylor, Edgar Hoover and C.D. Dillon seemed to me to be involved in some sort of executive action sanction that involved all the federal agencies and also seemed to be approved at the highest levels EXCEPT for John and Robert Kenneddy, The P. and A.G....now when I read the account of Cord Meyer and James Angleton and Mary Meyers murder, I thought that is it, incapacity, sanction, removal of the executive by the other executives --- and this is shown to be the fact by the 25th amendment and the succession in August 1974.... The Warren Commission Report and the 25th Amendment are contemporary documents ! Thanks for posting \ Shanet

I am unfamiliar with it. I will say that in general, conspiracy theories tend to point away from real issues in order to scapegoat bugaboos. Totalitarian states promote conspiracy theories all the time. Nazism is rooted in conspiracy theory. The John Birch and hysterical New World Order conspiracy theories tend to revolve around issues of race and class hatred. The complexity of events in the modern world must be addressed in all its complexity and not be reduced to simplistic scare campaigns. While I too am concerned with the actions of the classified agencies, the Military Industrial Complex, the Skull and Bones and the interlocking corporate directorships, I believe the way to approach these is through thorough and moderate analysis, not by invoking a demonized "other" , i.e., Wall street bankers, Rockefellers or Texas oilmen....but that is not to say ssome of these characters, as well as every other group, never conspire for power! I am very concerned about the concentration of power in the executive branch, which ironically, is what killed JFK, because it doesnt really devolve (presidential power) upon an individual, it devolves on a group of individuals with executive capacities across the military industrial complex. These powers can be used to kill individuals, and ancient Rome is probably a better historical approach than any nonsense about patriotic George Washington crap. Dick Cheney and Don Rumsfeld are Ford men all the way, and carry these PROGRAMS out to this day.... What is the theme of Epperson's work?

Members interested in Twentieth Century fascist trends, monopolistic wealth, dynastic families, corporate hegemony and Krupps style armament profiteering should know about Jerry Colby's book: DUPONT DYNASTY: BEHIND THE NYLON CURTAIN This is a very legitimate, well researched and readable history book. The DuPonts, aristocratic exiles from the French Revolution, came to America with gunpowder formulas and started the first and most important "trust" when they bought out all the other explosives companies in the US around 1900. By the 1930s the Dupont DeNemours company was thoroughly blended with the German chemical cartel of IG FARBEN (Hoescht, AGFA, BASF and BAYER)... After WWII they attempted to gain a monopoly on atomic weapons and energy. Today they are the largest chemical polluter in the U.S. and their family sits in financial control of General Motors and the American chemical industry. If anyone wants to investigate these disturbing events, by all means they should purchase and read DUPONT DYNASTY: BEYOND THE NYLON CURTAIN by GERALD COLBY (Lyle Stuart publishers)

If I had done all the things David Ferrie did, I would probably have a stroke, too!

It is pretty obvious that once a majority of Americans rejected the warren commission conclusions on Oswald acting alone, the authorities in Washington threw the suspicion onto the Mafia. Blakey and Anderson orchestrated this via the HSAC committee and the press. Ovid Demaris, the author, was a big part of this. From my point of view, this was a secondary, limited, hang-out and disinformation campaign to protect TACTICAL agents like Desmond Fitzgerald and David Attlee Phillips and STRATEGIC agents MAXWELL TAYLOR, CD DILLON, J EDGAR HOOVER and LYNDON BAINES JOHNSON from exposure...