Dawn Meredith

Thanks Myra. Colleen Cason's words made my day! How has she avoided being mockingbirded I wonder? (Then again tomorrow she may not have a job). Dawn

Seal was a friend of mine. I used to work for Radio KEPS Eagle Pass Texas, I know the Murchinsions. I am from Dallas. Peter Brewton (The Mafia CIA and George Bush; 1992; pgs 91-93-95) interviewed me many times as to some the above information. I flew C-130's all around Iron Mountain, Eagle Pass, Lajitas MX (referenced and documented; Tri-State Drug Task Force) during the Iran/Contra resupply network. I worked an undercover federal interdiction program. Some of the information above is perhaps correct and some is not correct. I would be very careful as to background research and where it came from on some of this information. I smell something funny here. Seal was in no way associated with Dallas and the assassination of JFK... I have gone over this years ago and produced documentation to that fact... I was called names because I would not go along with the story. I was in Mexico many times with Seal and have pictures and documentation to support that. I testified in the Seal case and I know some of the players. If you would like to talk about this with me, then Email me privately. If I do not hear from you then I know a con is in the works. Simkin has my email. and I'll be happy to talk with Mr. WorthingtonII and you in reference to this subject matter. However, I am sure some will advise you not to do that. AND that TOO, will tell me something about the credibility of this story. http://toshplumlee.info/pdf/DEAfiles.pdf Referenced documentation and file locator numbers: 1-99-J DH 39711 (RUC) 1989 1-99-J R- 39711-7 ITE-0653 1-99-R-DN-39711-3 10-17-89 Report of: Feb. 9, 1990 Classified Secret SA Wayne Schmidt DEA SA Hector Berrellez DEA SA Susan Baldwin DEA ...also reference found as to the investigations of the murder of KiKi Camarena and his pilot Alverz. ... ... References as to Richmont Aviation Mena Ark. reference; C-130 N- 0699 P pilot W. Plumlee; C-123 pilot B Seal fuel forms; Setco aviation Costa Rico. ref; Plumlee aircraft, (Big Toad); B A Seal, aircraft (Fat Lady 1) Operation "Iron Butterfly" It appears that with Mr. Plumlee the forum may have another Ashton Gray on its hands. We all remember him, don’t we? I have never met or corresponded with Mr. Plumlee. Yet, like Mr. Gray, Mr. Plumlee appears all too willing to engage in character assassination, implying that I am engaged in some sort of con, which is dictionary defined as a “swindle.” I have been an attorney for 38 years and this is the first time that someone, in this case a complete stranger, has used that term in connection with my professional reputation. I got involved in the forum primarily because John Simkin started a thread on me, which can be found at http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=4727 Another reason I got involved in the forum was because Alfred Baldwin was willingly answering members’ questions about Watergate. Then Mr. Gray emerged from nowhere and engaged unceasingly in character assassination against Mr. Baldwin and myself for our roles in the scandal. Mr. Baldwin, apparently taking the understandable attitude of “who needs this crap?”, withdrew from the forum and with him an invaluable source of new information into Watergate dried up, thanks to Mr. Gray. I decided to stick with the forum and not reply to Mr. Gray’s numerous verbal assaults, expecting that his rude and insulting behavior would expand to include other members and that such activity would eventually lead to his withdrawal from the forum, which indeed is what occurred. I do not hold myself out as an expert on the assassination of JFK. (For that matter neither does Jack Worthington II.) My strategy has always been as I uncover promising lines for research that these should be posted on the forum in the event that real experts, such as John Simkin, Pat Speer, J. Raymond Carroll and other forum members, might find a clue therein worth further pursuit. Mr. Worthington’s contention as to his JFK parentage has already produced one great embarrassment for two eminent scholars. Robert Caro and J. Robert Dallek, who are acknowledged as the foremost biographers of LBJ, are quoted in the April 2008 Vanity Fair article, “A Claim to Camelot”, as stating on page 238 that “they’ve never come across a reference to Johnson residing with” Maverick County Judge Robert Bibb. Yet the Toronto Globe and Mail of February 18, 2008, in its article on the Bibbs’ relationship to Jack Worthington II, reported from Maverick County that “Lyndon Johnson spent the night at our house and my father spent the night in the White House,” said Gravis Bibb, the judge’s son. “My father was a very, very good friend of LBJ. They were buddies going way back.” So here is a promising line of inquiry into the life and times of LBJ, heretofore not known, that serendipitously has been opened up as a result of the effort by Jack Worthington II to establish his parentage. Mr. Plumlee appears above to object to the contents of the emails of Jack Worthington II that can be viewed on Vanity Fair’s blog. Vanity Fair saw fit to post these, so it is safe to assume that the magazine believed they are worthy of public attention. Mr. Plumlee, like Mr. Gray, must learn one of life’s most basic lessons: employing common courtesy and good manners usually cause strangers to respond reciprocally, thus achieving one’s goal, whereas insults and boorishness get one nowhere. So, Tosh asks a couple of questions, tries to set some records straight and gets called Ashton Gray. In Mr Caddy's opinion the only "true experts" on the jfk murder here on this forum are John Simkin, Pat Ppeer and Ray Carroll. Hmmm...I concur that these folks are experts but Attorney Carroll has also posted on this very subject on the original thread. See below. Dawn CODE Jack, in Caddy’s view, was the real deal. When Simoneaux and Caddy met him, the attorney said, “it was almost electricity as he strode toward us. He has that charisma. And he looks like … like his father.” Doug: It seems you were right after all. This man really DOES look like his father: CODE Then yearbook photos of Jack senior emerged from a library in Texas. Jack II bore an uncanny resemblance to the man in the basketball uniform and in a college-yearbook headshot from 1960—the student named Jack Worthington. Both father and son had similar jaws, noses, eyes. Both had receding hairlines. Both were awash in freckles. This post has been edited by J. Raymond Carroll: Mar 1 2008 ---------------------------------------- Post #14 Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 983 Joined: 10-March 05 Member No.: 2672 QUOTE(Wim Dankbaar @ Mar 2 2008, 11:19 AM) He could be exposed as a con, if he's a fraud. If you read the Vanity Fair Article, you will see that he HAS been exposed as a con, by no less an authority than his own mother. (Ray Carroll's post) QUOTE Without DNA from Worthington’s parents, however, and without a reconciliation between mother and son, all Jack II’s tale amounted to, really, was one man’s cold call to a magazine. ------------------------------------------- Post #14 Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 983 Joined: 10-March 05 Member No.: 2672 QUOTE(Wim Dankbaar @ Mar 2 2008, 11:19 AM) He could be exposed as a con, if he's a fraud. If you read the Vanity Fair Article, you will see that he HAS been exposed as a con, by no less an authority than his own mother. QUOTE Without DNA from Worthington’s parents, however, and without a reconciliation between mother and son, all Jack II’s tale amounted to, really, was one man’s cold call to a magazine. ------------------------------------ QUOTE(Douglas Caddy @ Mar 1 2008, 07:22 AM) “Doug Caddy was not my lawyer,” Mr. Worthington said yesterday. ... Doug: Is this man telling lies about you? This post has been edited by J. Raymond Carroll: Mar 2 2008, 08:25 PM -------------------------------------------------- QUOTE(Douglas Caddy @ Mar 2 2008, 08:53 PM) Jack Worthington is scheduled to be interviewed on ABC's 20/20 on Friday night, March 7. ABC is calling the show: THE MAN WHO WOULD SELL HIS OWN MOTHER AND DISOWN HIS OWN FATHER (to guarantee his 15 minutes of fame) This post has been edited by J. Raymond Carroll: Mar 3 2008, 01:08 AM ------------------------------------------------ #34 Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 983 Joined: 10-March 05 Member No.: 2672 QUOTE(Douglas Caddy @ Mar 7 2008, 08:24 PM) 'JFK Love Child': Now I Don't Want To Know ABC NEWS But Worthington's own response is that he is telling the truth and that he will "proceed with criminal charges against her [HIS OWN MOTHER] for willfully and maliciously misleading me regarding my paternity." Doug, since you are Worthington's lawyer, will you be assisting him in the "criminal charges" he is threatening against his elderly mother? Will Mrs. Worthington's trial on the charge of "misleading her son" be televised live around the world on CNN? What is the maximum sentance a court can award for the crime of "Misleading Jack Worthington" ? ---------------------------------------------- So I take it Attorney Caddy approves of Attorney Carroll's expertise in this matter, but not Tosh's. Please excuse my confusion. Dawn

Seal was a friend of mine. I used to work for Radio KEPS Eagle Pass Texas, I know the Murchinsions. I am from Dallas. Peter Brewton (The Mafia CIA and George Bush; 1992; pgs 91-93-95) interviewed me many times as to some the above information. I flew C-130's all around Iron Mountain, Eagle Pass, Lajitas MX (referenced and documented; Tri-State Drug Task Force) during the Iran/Contra resupply network. I worked an undercover federal interdiction program. Some of the information above is perhaps correct and some is not correct. I would be very careful as to background research and where it came from on some of this information. I smell something funny here. Seal was in no way associated with Dallas and the assassination of JFK... I have gone over this years ago and produced documentation to that fact... I was called names because I would not go along with the story. I was in Mexico many times with Seal and have pictures and documentation to support that. I testified in the Seal case and I know some of the players. If you would like to talk about this with me, then Email me privately. If I do not hear from you then I know a con is in the works. Simkin has my email. and I'll be happy to talk with Mr. WorthingtonII and you in reference to this subject matter. However, I am sure some will advise you not to do that. AND that TOO, will tell me something about the credibility of this story. http://toshplumlee.info/pdf/DEAfiles.pdf Referenced documentation and file locator numbers: 1-99-J DH 39711 (RUC) 1989 1-99-J R- 39711-7 ITE-0653 1-99-R-DN-39711-3 10-17-89 Report of: Feb. 9, 1990 Classified Secret SA Wayne Schmidt DEA SA Hector Berrellez DEA SA Susan Baldwin DEA ...also reference found as to the investigations of the murder of KiKi Camarena and his pilot Alverz. ... ... References as to Richmont Aviation Mena Ark. reference; C-130 N- 0699 P pilot W. Plumlee; C-123 pilot B Seal fuel forms; Setco aviation Costa Rico. ref; Plumlee aircraft, (Big Toad); B A Seal, aircraft (Fat Lady 1) Operation "Iron Butterfly" It appears that with Mr. Plumlee the forum may have another Ashton Gray on its hands. We all remember him, don’t we? I have never met or corresponded with Mr. Plumlee. Yet, like Mr. Gray, Mr. Plumlee appears all too willing to engage in character assassination, implying that I am engaged in some sort of con, which is dictionary defined as a “swindle.” I have been an attorney for 38 years and this is the first time that someone, in this case a complete stranger, has used that term in connection with my professional reputation. I got involved in the forum primarily because John Simkin started a thread on me, which can be found at http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=4727 Another reason I got involved in the forum was because Alfred Baldwin was willingly answering members’ questions about Watergate. Then Mr. Gray emerged from nowhere and engaged unceasingly in character assassination against Mr. Baldwin and myself for our roles in the scandal. Mr. Baldwin, apparently taking the understandable attitude of “who needs this crap?”, withdrew from the forum and with him an invaluable source of new information into Watergate dried up, thanks to Mr. Gray. I decided to stick with the forum and not reply to Mr. Gray’s numerous verbal assaults, expecting that his rude and insulting behavior would expand to include other members and that such activity would eventually lead to his withdrawal from the forum, which indeed is what occurred. I do not hold myself out as an expert on the assassination of JFK. (For that matter neither does Jack Worthington II.) My strategy has always been as I uncover promising lines for research that these should be posted on the forum in the event that real experts, such as John Simkin, Pat Speer, J. Raymond Carroll and other forum members, might find a clue therein worth further pursuit. Mr. Worthington’s contention as to his JFK parentage has already produced one great embarrassment for two eminent scholars. Robert Caro and J. Robert Dallek, who are acknowledged as the foremost biographers of LBJ, are quoted in the April 2008 Vanity Fair article, “A Claim to Camelot”, as stating on page 238 that “they’ve never come across a reference to Johnson residing with” Maverick County Judge Robert Bibb. Yet the Toronto Globe and Mail of February 18, 2008, in its article on the Bibbs’ relationship to Jack Worthington II, reported from Maverick County that “Lyndon Johnson spent the night at our house and my father spent the night in the White House,” said Gravis Bibb, the judge’s son. “My father was a very, very good friend of LBJ. They were buddies going way back.” So here is a promising line of inquiry into the life and times of LBJ, heretofore not known, that serendipitously has been opened up as a result of the effort by Jack Worthington II to establish his parentage. Mr. Plumlee appears above to object to the contents of the emails of Jack Worthington II that can be viewed on Vanity Fair’s blog. Vanity Fair saw fit to post these, so it is safe to assume that the magazine believed they are worthy of public attention. Mr. Plumlee, like Mr. Gray, must learn one of life’s most basic lessons: employing common courtesy and good manners usually cause strangers to respond reciprocally, thus achieving one’s goal, whereas insults and boorishness get one nowhere. So, Tosh asks a couple of questions, tries to set some records straight and gets called Ashton Gray. In Mr Caddy's opinion the only "true experts" on the jfk murder here on this forum are John Simkin, Pat Ppeer and Ray Carroll. Hmmm...I concur that these folks are experts but Attorney Carroll has also posted on this very subject on the original thread. See below. Dawn

Tosh, While I share some of your upset and frustration and agree, in part, abandoning the ship only depletes its resources. Your not the first to make this decision. I'll not go into all the reasons I think what you sense or suspect is so. A little of value does still go on here. Not as much as it should; and, yes, there are persons here who only want to disrupt and upset - you know the routine. I find the Forum goes through waves of general quality....depending on who is paying attention and posting and who not. I've long noted that many of the best posters and thinkers have left, apparently out of distaste, disgust or their thoughts that they could better spend their time working alone or elsewhere. I've had my moments of doubt too. Yet, I have learned much and there are still very good people here...along with some flotsam and a handful of provacateurs. I think even you'd have to admit to learning or being able to straighten-out a few things here. Yes, the same could likely be done by private emails, but there is value to post this for the public to see, I think. Anyway, whatever. I'd like you to stay - or check in now and then, but I know how to reach you outside the Forum. Many of us are frustrated at a lot of things - the Forum, being only one. The slow pace of rising awareness in America; the closing of the door on democracy; freedoms and information; the lack of real official investigations on many things; the continued deciet and war and theft at the top; Etc. Whatever, take care and thanks for your contributions here. I think some appreciate them more than you know. I know you've also gotten back-chanell negative feedback and even threats for posting and a few on the Forum. Ever was thus. Ignore the fools and the troublemakers. Keep the blue side up! Tosh: I agree with Peter. I know you get frustrated when you ask pertinant questions and get no response, Or put out valuable information that is also ignored. But I have also seen some very good sharing between you and others. Gee I sure wish Al Carrier would come back. You and Harry Dean. James, Frencesca (sp) who we have both noted is an excellent researcher. (Just wish I would write her name down properly to refer to before I murder it in a post), Bernice, up in Canada, and more, Greg, BK, Thomas...... Sometimes people don't answer your questions because no one here knows the answers. But that is not avoiding you, that is simply not knowing. Personally I really miss the great posts of Charles Drago. And also Ashton, to whom you were unfavorably compared by Douglas Caddy. While I loved Ashton's writing, knowledge, his true search for the truth and fine mind, I did NOT approve of his treatment of Doug Caddy. And was not surprosed by Mr. Caddy's refusal to respond to Ashton Gray's questions. The style WAS rude and undignified. And people here know Ashton was (is) my friend. But this is not a courtroom where aggressive crossexamination is properly employed. The forum is a place to exchange ifnormation with the goal of advancing the case and leaving a record for the next generation. So I reiterate what I said the other day: Get your d*** book done but drop in and check on us. Once in awhile. Hey cold turkey is also pretty hard dude ). Whatever you do I know we'll continue to be in touch. I thank John Simkin for having this place that allows people for whom this is so very important, from all over the world to meet, exchange ideas, argue, and try to come up with a where -do- we- go- from here gameplan. Yes there are infiltrators, that is to be expected on a forum devoted understanding, and solving the murder of JFK. And a forum that also seeks to prevent the next political assassination. So of course the really bad guys moniter the crap out of this place. The net is the last bastion of free speech and we need to employ that here and everywhere else we can, while we can. PUT ASIDE OUR PETTY ARGUMENTS AND DIFFERENCES. WE ARE HERE FOR ONE REASON: TO ASSIST IN THE SOLVING OF THESE CRIMES. A RECORD OUR TRUE HISTORY IS IMPORTANT. And that is what John has been trying to do. Dawn

I didn't expect that response from you Dawn. As someone I've always liked and respected, I'm really surprised you could react so harshly towards a fellow member merely for holding a differant opinion than yourself. IMO, anyone not looking at the case thru rose colored spectacles can see that there's a lot more going on than "using too many paperclips" but that's only my opinion and I may well be proved wrong. Whats more importaint, at least to me, is your attitude towards me for expressing it. Its a real eye opener Dawn. I dont mind admitting I'm genuenly disappointed. So be it, and so much for free speech, which you and other members are forever advocating here. Guess that only appliers if that free speech mirrors your own. Denis...or as you seem to address me now, Pointing. From your comment about him being guilty it appeared as if you have been followong this trial? No? Yes? So, if you have and you say that he guilty, then I agree with Peter, I'd sure not want you on my jury. That's my view. But I am getting reports ON the trial from a fellow researcher In Lancaster (Jerry Policoff) so I see how absurd, vandictive and downright frightening this is. I did not mean to be harsh to you. Also it's hard to truly judge the evidence without being there. That said the articles I have read have all been bs. THis prosecution is politically motivated and they are trying to destroy the life of a great man. If you can't (won't ) see that then .....you're right to your opinion, just as I am right to mine. They are arguing over pennies here. Dawn

Seal was a friend of mine. I used to work for Radio KEPS Eagle Pass Texas, I know the Murchinsions. I am from Dallas. Peter Brewton (The Mafia CIA and George Bush; 1992; pgs 91-93-95) interviewed me many times as to some the above information. I flew C-130's all around Iron Mountain, Eagle Pass, Lajitas MX (referenced and documented; Tri-State Drug Task Force) during the Iran/Contra resupply network. I worked an undercover federal interdiction program. Some of the information above is perhaps correct and some is not correct. I would be very careful as to background research and where it came from on some of this information. I smell something funny here. Seal was in no way associated with Dallas and the assassination of JFK... I have gone over this years ago and produced documentation to that fact... I was called names because I would not go along with the story. I was in Mexico many times with Seal and have pictures and documentation to support that. I testified in the Seal case and I know some of the players. If you would like to talk about this with me, then Email me privately. If I do not hear from you then I know a con is in the works. Simkin has my email. and I'll be happy to talk with Mr. WorthingtonII and you in reference to this subject matter. However, I am sure some will advise you not to do that. AND that TOO, will tell me something about the credibility of this story. http://toshplumlee.info/pdf/DEAfiles.pdf Referenced documentation and file locator numbers: 1-99-J DH 39711 (RUC) 1989 1-99-J R- 39711-7 ITE-0653 1-99-R-DN-39711-3 10-17-89 Report of: Feb. 9, 1990 Classified Secret SA Wayne Schmidt DEA SA Hector Berrellez DEA SA Susan Baldwin DEA ...also reference found as to the investigations of the murder of KiKi Camarena and his pilot Alverz. ... ... References as to Richmont Aviation Mena Ark. reference; C-130 N- 0699 P pilot W. Plumlee; C-123 pilot B Seal fuel forms; Setco aviation Costa Rico. ref; Plumlee aircraft, (Big Toad); B A Seal, aircraft (Fat Lady 1) Operation "Iron Butterfly" It appears that with Mr. Plumlee the forum may have another Ashton Gray on its hands. We all remember him, don’t we? I have never met or corresponded with Mr. Plumlee. Yet, like Mr. Gray, Mr. Plumlee appears all too willing to engage in character assassination, implying that I am engaged in some sort of con, which is dictionary defined as a “swindle.” I have been an attorney for 38 years and this is the first time that someone, in this case a complete stranger, has used that term in connection with my professional reputation. I got involved in the forum primarily because John Simkin started a thread on me, which can be found at http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=4727 Another reason I got involved in the forum was because Alfred Baldwin was willingly answering members’ questions about Watergate. Then Mr. Gray emerged from nowhere and engaged unceasingly in character assassination against Mr. Baldwin and myself for our roles in the scandal. Mr. Baldwin, apparently taking the understandable attitude of “who needs this crap?”, withdrew from the forum and with him an invaluable source of new information into Watergate dried up, thanks to Mr. Gray. I decided to stick with the forum and not reply to Mr. Gray’s numerous verbal assaults, expecting that his rude and insulting behavior would expand to include other members and that such activity would eventually lead to his withdrawal from the forum, which indeed is what occurred. I do not hold myself out as an expert on the assassination of JFK. (For that matter neither does Jack Worthington II.) My strategy has always been as I uncover promising lines for research that these should be posted on the forum in the event that real experts, such as John Simkin, Pat Speer, J. Raymond Carroll and other forum members, might find a clue therein worth further pursuit. Mr. Worthington’s contention as to his JFK parentage has already produced one great embarrassment for two eminent scholars. Robert Caro and J. Robert Dallek, who are acknowledged as the foremost biographers of LBJ, are quoted in the April 2008 Vanity Fair article, “A Claim to Camelot”, as stating on page 238 that “they’ve never come across a reference to Johnson residing with” Maverick County Judge Robert Bibb. Yet the Toronto Globe and Mail of February 18, 2008, in its article on the Bibbs’ relationship to Jack Worthington II, reported from Maverick County that “Lyndon Johnson spent the night at our house and my father spent the night in the White House,” said Gravis Bibb, the judge’s son. “My father was a very, very good friend of LBJ. They were buddies going way back.” So here is a promising line of inquiry into the life and times of LBJ, heretofore not known, that serendipitously has been opened up as a result of the effort by Jack Worthington II to establish his parentage. Mr. Plumlee appears above to object to the contents of the emails of Jack Worthington II that can be viewed on Vanity Fair’s blog. Vanity Fair saw fit to post these, so it is safe to assume that the magazine believed they are worthy of public attention. Mr. Plumlee, like Mr. Gray, must learn one of life’s most basic lessons: employing common courtesy and good manners usually cause strangers to respond reciprocally, thus achieving one’s goal, whereas insults and boorishness get one nowhere. This is really FUNNY. NOONE here would confuse Tosh with Ashton. Tosh, trust me, no matter how nicely you ask you won't get any answers from this man. We all smell a con with the Worthington story. No one accused attorney Caddy of being a con. A bit defensive? You- Tosh- merely invited a dialogue, something this forum is supposed to be. It just devolves more and more each day. Name calling's the norm. Seem's there's way more plants here than people who care about who killed Kennedy. Wothington has ZERO to do with the murder of JFK. Dawn

Pointing, just one more person to ignore here. Ya, guilty as hell for using too many paperclips. Let's give him the needle. Dawn

Not the way I would have done it. I think he needed to testify. This could easily backfire. Jurors think people who don't take the stand are hiding something. Sure they SAY they can be fair and understand the defendant's right not to testify, but this is crap. THey all WANT to hear from the accused. So I think it was a risky call on their parts. His atty. had better do one heck of a closing.! Dawn ____________ Wecht defense rests case, calls no witnesses Closing arguments set for Monday in fraud trial against former coroner Wednesday, March 12, 2008 By Jonathan D. Silver, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette The biggest question of Dr. Cyril H. Wecht's federal fraud trial -- whether the verbose and volatile former Allegheny County coroner would take the stand in his own defense -- was answered yesterday in surprising and brief fashion. After the prosecution announced it had rested its case following 44 witnesses, hundreds of exhibits and 22 days of testimony, lead defense attorney Jerry McDevitt quietly stood up and said he was resting as well. No defense witnesses (there were 84 on the list). No more testimony. And no climactic showdown between Dr. Wecht and the prosecutors who have spent two years stitching together the case against him. "I thought it was a very smart move," said Stanton Levenson, a Pittsburgh criminal defense lawyer for 41 years. "I think that puts them in the position to argue that the case the government presented was very weak and required no response on the part of the defense, that Dr. Wecht entered a plea of not guilty, and that's sufficient." Carl Tobias, a University of Richmond law professor, echoed that sentiment, but said there was a flip side. "It also happens sometimes when you're afraid to put the defendant on the stand," Mr. Tobias said. "I think it's a fairly bold move because you're trusting that you made the right call and you've properly read the jury and they're leaning in your favor." Mr. McDevitt and his partner, Mark Rush, declined comment on their announcement, as did Dr. Wecht. "I look forward to closing," was all Mr. McDevitt would say as he left the courtroom. Those closing arguments are scheduled for Monday morning. U.S. District Court Judge Arthur J. Schwab has given each side 90 minutes to make their final pitch to jurors. It is not unheard of in criminal cases for defendants not to take the stand or even for defense attorneys to not call any witnesses, though such moves might raise the eyebrows of some jurors. More witnesses means more chances for prosecutors to cross-examine. And whether to put the defendant on is a double-edged sword. "The jury could say, 'If he really didn't do this, why didn't he get on the witness stand and tell us that,'" said Mr. Levenson, who makes a practice of trying to keep his clients from testifying. But, he added, that's better than putting the defendant on and having the jury say, "I didn't like him or I didn't believe him." And with a defendant like Dr. Wecht -- intelligent but sarcastic, genial to some but caustic to others -- some might think the smartest move would be to keep him from going toe-to-toe with prosecutors. Throughout the trial, Judge Schwab has instructed witnesses to give "teaspoon" answers to "teaspoon" questions, meaning witnesses should not go off on tangents but should stick narrowly to the question. Dr. Wecht is known for giving gallon-sized answers. Dr. Wecht is charged with 41 offenses involving wire fraud, mail fraud, and theft from an organization receiving federal funds, namely Allegheny County. Prosecutors allege that while Dr. Wecht was the coroner, he used county resources -- including his staff, fax machines, phone lines, vehicles and even unclaimed bodies -- to benefit his private multimillion-dollar autopsy and consultation business, Cyril H. Wecht and Pathology Associates. They also claim he schemed to defraud his private clients by inflating airfares for which he was reimbursed, fabricated invoices for limousine rides he never took and billed clients for mileage expenses while he used a county car and never passed the money on to county coffers. Prosecutors allege that Dr. Wecht carried out several of those schemes by using fax transmissions or sending invoices through the U.S. mail. Should the Wecht defense team have called witnesses to try to address every alleged instance of a crime? Not necessarily. "There's not much point in trying to rebut every individual instance if you're arguing to the jury that what the prosecution has shown has not demonstrated an overall pattern of abuse," said Duquesne University law professor Bruce Ledewitz, a friend of Dr. Wecht's for 24 years. "They're not going to convict on a federal charge because the guy took home paper clips."

Tosh: Normally I'd say PLEASE don't leave the forum BUT you have important deadlines to meet. I know just how much time you put into this forum and how little time that leaves you to write your book, so ......perhaps a compromise. Work on your book for several days in a row and NO FORUM , then come back for check ins....and posts....I was away for several days due to heavy work constraints, but then when I come back I find all sorts of interesting stuff....plus we're all kinda family here. So, get your book done and also drop in and say hi. When you can. Ignore your detractors, some of whom were your supporters when it suited their needs and the person to whom I am referring here knows who he is. But since you don't back his big theory he disses you now. So be it. So buddy get your work done, then get your butt to Tx to see Leslie and me for that bbq she promised. We'll all toast to Jay. Hey, we'll get Terry "the terror" out here for the occasion! Dawn

I will of course be keeping a close watch on this story. Police spokesmen yesterday were very keen to point out that his sucide had nothing to do with his police work. How can they know that? John: You know too much about real history to ask a question like that. "They" always "know". Dawn

I was about to say "amen" to David Gyatt's brilliant post til I read this. Just one more reason to not let McCain get this. Though the Dems seem determined to implode. Yes Ray I too am greatly enjoying your analysis and agree. Hillary and now Jerry; the "race" is indeed on. They will stop at nothing. I am ashamed to be a woman. After Hillary's little "McCain is better fit to be commander in chief" comment her true colors became clear to me- at last. She just gave him the election. And he'll give us 100 more years in Iraq, and the Gus Russo's of the world will receive classified docs while true searchers of the TRUTH will be told to get lost. Dawn

BK: In what capacity was she mentioned? I realize that a message was left saying "we'll be dead" but that does not prove he did it. It merely proves that there will be no investigation into their deaths. Pretty convenient. Odd that someone would kiill and commit suicide over a class A misdemeanor. Even if it reverted back to a felony (forgery) she could have gotten two years deferred adjudication, repaid any restitution, and after compliance with probation rules the case would be dismissed. Hardly something one dies over. Dawn Dawn, Latest news I found: 12:50 PM CDT on Tuesday, March 11, 2008 By BRAD WATSON / WFAA-TV Video Brad Watson reports March 12, 2008 STORY: Police seek motive in Shaw murder-suicide View larger E-mail Clip More Video DALLAS — Rufus Shaw left a phone message with a friend before he killed his wife and then himself Monday evening. State Sen. Royce West has been close to Shaw since they met in junior high school. The call he received on his voice mail around 6 p.m. may have been one of the final messages from Shaw or his wife, Lynn Flint Shaw, prior to their deaths. A grieving Sen. West described Shaw's tone of voice on the message as one of a man who didn't sound self assured, as he usually was. "He basically said that by the time I got the message, he'd be dead — they'd be dead," Sen. West said. He said Shaw left instructions for West to assist his college-age son and to take care of the affairs of the family. Sen. West said Shaw also left a cryptic clue about what happened: "His enemies would make sure that they were dead before the end of the day," Sen. West said, adding that he did not know who these "enemies" might be. Sen. West said he learned of the deaths about 12:30 a.m. Tuesday, then remembered that Shaw had called earlier. Only then did he retrieve the message. The senator declined to speculate about what may have prompted the tragic shootings; he said he is baffled just like everyone else. Sen. West said he doesn't know whetehr Lynn Flint Shaw's recent legal problems could have been a factor. Sen. West said he provided a copy of the voice mail message to police. With deep regret, West said he should have returned Shaw's call immediately. [/color]"His enemies would make sure that they were dead before the end of the day". Yup, sounds just like a murder suicide to me. Dawn

BK: In what capacity was she mentioned? I realize that a message was left saying "we'll be dead" but that does not prove he did it. It merely proves that there will be no investigation into their deaths. Pretty convenient. Odd that someone would kiill and commit suicide over a class A misdemeanor. Even if it reverted back to a felony (forgery) she could have gotten two years deferred adjudication, repaid any restitution, and after compliance with probation rules the case would be dismissed. Hardly something one dies over. Dawn I just went back and looked at the Da's transcript. Most interesting. The relevent portion is below: Q30: In the interests of transparency, are you going to file a felony case against Lynn Flint Shaw? CW: Hey, we're talking about Kennedy right now, we're not talking about that. Q31: …real time? CW: Yea, well that conversation is best left for another day. I'm here talking about the Kennedy assassination, not Lynn Flint Shaw.

BK: In what capacity was she mentioned? I realize that a message was left saying "we'll be dead" but that does not prove he did it. It merely proves that there will be no investigation into their deaths. Pretty convenient. Odd that someone would kiill and commit suicide over a class A misdemeanor. Even if it reverted back to a felony (forgery) she could have gotten two years deferred adjudication, repaid any restitution, and after compliance with probation rules the case would be dismissed. Hardly something one dies over. Dawn

Tosh: The forgery error is easily correctable, or rather was. Probably just a typo. Hell I still put "07" on things. It would not get the case thrown out. Now why they were murdered and what they were involved in with this DA is the real issue here. Is it the racial stuff? That is what the Dallas papers will say, but the timing is ....just one more odd coincidence. In a case where the "coincidences" are simply overwhelming. The press may even just say "ramdom murder". No way. This couple was too tied in with the DA. (And other things yet to be posted). Too d*** strange. Dawn Thanks Dawn: (information before the fact, if speculations prove correct) Points and summation" 1. I made contact with the DA shortly after the information concerning the JFK releases. 2. Shortly after a series of conversations with the DA's Staff; in reference to the DPD's "Vault" and the DA's " Safe", and my statements of what I (speculated) was in the boxes..., all contact was broken by the DA's office. 3. I was contacted by Rufus publishing (Rufus Shaw) in reference to various documents I had attempted to discussed with the DA. 4. I forward information and some of the limited documentation to the address I was given by the publisher. 5. Within ten days, he and his wife are Dead. 6. Case ruled Susicide by Dallas cornor Is there a connection to the documents and the information submitted to the DA? I do not know. However, I find it strange that the timing is such. Perhaps your right Dawn; its nothing more than a strange coincident. Perhaps just one more of many. However, if its not.... then this information is before the fact.... and not after. IMO, The DPD's "Vault" should be investigated as to what may be in there and too, perhaps what has been removed and hidden from the Dallas DA. Desktop Radar ANOTHER SUICIDE: Two found fatally shot at former DART chairwoman's home http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dw...w.41fcc700.html IRWIN THOMPSON/DMN A Dallas police officer stands guard outside the home of political analyst Rufus Shaw Jr. and former DART chairwoman Lynn Flint Shaw early Tuesday morning. 8:24 AM CT Political analyst Rufus Shaw Jr. died from a self-inflicted gunshot wound at his Red Bird-area home where the body of a woman was also found, Dallas police said Tuesday. Mr. Shaw lived at the home with his wife Lynn Flint Shaw, who resigned from the DART board in January. Video: Police investigate deaths CASE CLOSED: Nothing to see here. Ya sure! Just one more murder suicide. That tells me a LOT. Just a hunch but I call this a warning. Tooooo damn coincidental. I am surprised there is not more activity on this thread. Oh well I guess arguments over the authencity of the Zapruder film are way more important. Dawn

Tosh: The forgery error is easily correctable, or rather was. Probably just a typo. Hell I still put "07" on things. It would not get the case thrown out. Now why they were murdered and what they were involved in with this DA is the real issue here. Is it the racial stuff? That is what the Dallas papers will say, but the timing is ....just one more odd coincidence. In a case where the "coincidences" are simply overwhelming. The press may even just say "ramdom murder". No way. This couple was too tied in with the DA. (And other things yet to be posted). Too d*** strange. Dawn

We shall see. Mostly, I think, we shall see where the "JFK Grand Jury" folks are (NOT) during Watkins' term. This is our best hope, in fact our only one, so....there must be a plan. A very carefull one. Jim's piece was great. Hope he sent it to the DA. (And it goes without saying I agree with Tosh). Dawn

So the Clinton crowd does not have the moral high ground in this round. Yet what was the net result? Power, a talented journalist and thinker who gives a damn about genocides (certainly more so than Bill Clinton did during the Rwanda nightmare), was forced off Obama's campaign. [Read: Obama was a schmuck to fire her.] ____________________________ I totally agree Ray, but if he were to ask her back he'd be called a flip flopper. This is turning into a total mess. The Dems can't seem to do anything right. I was of the opinion that HRC and Obama would make a dream ticket and win, but now ....the level of anger is too great. And the Michigan and Florida mess is just one more indication that the Dems seem destined to fail. Hate radio did drive this. (I read a lot of the comments on the blogs posted here). Rush does have power and his ditto heads listen to him. They don't think, he tells them not to. It's a sad and sorry state of affairs. I liked and voted for Obama but can't believe he actually fired Power. He does look like a wimp now. Dawn

Leslie, I am not sure if this will fully address your question but if you just click on Tosh's name, you will get to his profile, then on the left hand side under the word "options" that is in a box you will get a drop-down. There you can click on all his posts (33 pages) and all the topics he has started. Are you having that other problem too that Tosh was having? Where you have to click on the lines at the bottom to read the posts? (We just hung up and he thought you were, as he was). I have this happen at times too and you fix it by going, on the forum itself, to "options" on the upper right hand corner, drop down, then click on "standard", which will bring the forum back to it's normal state. Dawn

A friend of mine is now reading the forum (and will at some point hopefully join) so I wanted to bump this most important thread back to the top specifically for his benefit. Gene, ignore our resident Castro- did -it nut, Tim Gratz, whose ( on purpose) lack of comprehension here bogs down this thread. I think you will find many answers here to some of the points you raised in your email. (Mine is down again at the moment- technology- drives me nuts when I can't fix things). Dawn ps Tim's on moderation now so rarely posts.

Dad, we must have crossed in the mail and postings. WOW! The first link does not work anymore! That quick! This is wierd. Google Washington Independent Streak...in search engine put washington post cia lawyers. Is anyone out there seeing this happen? Here is the box shown when we go into the first one. "The page you are looking for does not exist You could have mistyped the URL, or the page could have moved or been deleted. Go back to where you came from" Here is a link I copied: http://www.washingtonindependent.com/view/...deral-court-cia Will see if this works. round and round we go..where we stop nobody knows. Sheesh! Yup, these articles are disappearing fast. I was able to read one earlier this morning, but now all that is left is one paragraph. One of the two Tosh posted, the other and Leslie's link gives you a "does not exist" message. Operation Mockingbird is working overtime. Did anyone manage to copy and paste any of this to save it here? These boys just may be running scared. Dawn

Well, I'll bet they do produce some[thing], but somehow [cynical me!] just don't expect they will produce all. They'll be a shreddin'; moving them out of their file system or just plain don't give a damn about being in contempt of court or the Nation nor anyone in it. This is one of their most tightly held secrets on this matter. One wonders why. Just from Joannides position I'd expect thousands. [Has any of the legal action to date produced a number of files they claim to have, but not be producing?] Anyone want to make a gentleman's bet it is less than fifty that are produced, if that many. Maybe his golf or tennis scores during the period. Lunch tabs or other routine matters. The 'good' stuff they seem to have indicated are not to be released, by hook or crook. It will be interesting, but I'm not optimistic. Less so, with the current administration and attorney general to whom the law is just a 'four letter word'. The other varient would be somehow convincing the Court they must not be released due to 'National Security'. We won't see CIA Director in jail for less than full compliance! Somehow, they will do a 'Rosemary Woods', I fear. [.....they'll likely move most of them to the 'there is no file file' in the CIA file 'annex' [wherever that may be - like Gitmo or Diego Garcia - or some bunker for atomic war in PA or WV]. ------------------------------------------------------------------- By the way the pdf file Tosh posted with the Court's decision makes very interesting reading. The Judges seemed fair on the application of the laws, BUT seemed to 'miss' the ways the CIA has in the past and will in future use the various 'exemptions' to not disclose things they don't want to disclose - as only they get to 'look at' and 'judge' if it contains 'things that fall within the exemptions'. The 'by executive order' is also an overly broad one...as there might well be secret executive orders to do so willynilly - especially under this Administration! Tosh: Thanks so much for posting the actual opinion. It was quite an interesting read. I do agree with Peter's assessment of what may occur, i.e. junk and/or documents that "no longer exist" explanations. These thugs are not going to comply with a court order. The judges exercised some sound reasoning in some areas but in the area of Exemptions there is a lot of wiggle room. I was impressed by their basic knowledge of the importance of this case. I also was happy to see my friend Carl Oglesby's lawsuit -(also brought by Jim Lesar)- referred to so often, as precedent. (Carl ultimately prevailed). And, like Peter, seeing the term "Executive Order" so broadly employed leaves me more than worried. Keep in mind we are dealing with a President who has alrerady said that the Consititution is "just a G**D*** piece of paper". Kudos to Jeff Morley for his persistance and especially to the tireless efforts of Attorney Jim Lesar. He gives lawyers a good name. April 30th will be an interesting day. Too bad our media doesn't see fit to cover these important developments. Dawn

You may have "proof " that Bobby Baker said something but you have no proof that JFK ever said such to Baker. The DNA test is referred to in the article here on the forum. That Douglas posted. DId you not read it? The "crackpot" to whom I am referreing is Files. And no I am not smoking or hallucinating. Your comments on Marilyn Bobby and JFK are not worthy of comment. (Lucky for you you can't defame the dead). End of discussion for me. Dawn

Because you appear to believe every crackpot that comes down the pike. The DNA from his family proved that the husband was his darn father. The yearbook pics of young Worthington (father) look like the son. On and on and on. And why the ugly "JFK quote" about a "piece of XXX"? Like Bobby Baker would REALLY have this conversation with JFK? Wim what the heck are you smoking? Don't get me wrong: I would LOVE to believe this guy. It would be wonderful to have another Kennedy. But thus far I have seen nothing that convinces me that this guy is any more than a con. And we've had more than enough cons in this case. Dawn

Hey Tosh Whats' the indication here, I mean the rifle casing in the photo? TOG = The Older Guy Harry Hey TOG; TOD here..... Just a little tongue and cheek. I'm sure if I said "I wonder if that shell casing had any teeth marks" it would be taken wrong, and some wouldn't appreciate my humor.... no offence to anyone out there... Arrowhead in bone found on the Old Butterfield stage route near Massacre Peak, in southern NM on a field trip last year. 1880 vintage..... just having a little fun with myself. Hey, I got it. (Nice to finally see this Tosh) We can use a little levity around here. Dawn