Ed LeDoux
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Posts posted by Ed LeDoux
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15 hours ago, Steve Thomas said:
Please forgive me if this is half-baked. I'm still trying to work this out in my mind. I haven't thought it all the way through yet.
That itty bitty piece of paper. Who woulda thunk it?
That itty bitty piece of paper could be the key that unravels the case of the JFK murder mystery.
Notice that I said, "unravels" and not solves, but it definitely shoots a hole in the official story we've been given.
Will Fritz told the Warren Commission that before he went in to talk to Oswald following Oswald's arrest, an officer told him out in the hall that Oswald lived on Beckley. How would that officer have known that?
Arthur C. Johnson, the husband of the owner of the rooming house on Beckley told the Warren Commission (10H303)
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/johnso_a.htm
Mr. JOHNSON. Well, they just came down there looking for--uh--Oswald.
Mr. BELIN. Did they say what his full name was?
Mr. JOHNSON. Yes, I believe they did.
Mr. BELIN. Lee Harvey Oswald?
Mr. JOHNSON. I believe they did.
Mr. BELIN. Did they say how they happened to come there?
Mr. JOHNSON. "Well, uh--after he was--uh--apprehended out there, they searched him and found my address in his pocket.
Mr. BELIN. Your address of 1026 North Beckley?
Mr. JOHNSON. That's right.Gladys Johnson told the Warren Commission that;
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/johnso_g.htm
Mr. BALL. Did you ever know his true name was Lee Harvey Oswald?
Mrs. JOHNSON. No; not until we saw his picture flash on the television as the officers were out. Those particulars was found in his pocket after he killed Tippit, after his arrest.Since the register sheet with O.H. Lee's name on it was in the Johnson's possession, that couldn't been one of the "particulars" Mrs. Johnson was talking about.
Mick Purdy wrote in the ROKC Forum 12/08/2019
https://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t1180p125-did-oswald-deny-living-at-1026-n-beckley
Washington Post reporter and Editor and General Manager of the Texas Observer, Ronnie Duggar
Duggar interviews Johnson perhaps in the 1966-67 time frame?
Bart Kamp posted this in the ROKC Forum 02/08/2020 concerning a 1977 interview Gladys Johnson had with the HSCA:
https://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t1180p125-did-oswald-deny-living-at-1026-n-beckley
1) Either that little piece of paper existed;, or,
2) It didn’t
1) If the piece of paper with the Beckley St. address on it did exist, evidence of its existence was supressed. It wasn’t mentioned by
a) any policeman who drove Oswald from the Theater to police headquarters,
b) any policeman who searched Oswald while he was at police headquarters,
c) any policeman, David Johnston, or Bill Alexander, who arrived at the Beckley St. residence on the 22nd,.
d) any inventory sheet of the property seized at Beckley.
If the sheet of paper did exist and evidence of it was suppressed, it could mean that the police knew about Oswald and his whereabouts and that either,
a) he was under surveillance; or,
b) he was not under surveillance, but the police had to manufacture a reason for how they came about going to Beckley; or,
c) he was framed
2) If the paper did not exist, it would mean either;
a) the Johnsons lied; or,
b) the Johnson’s really were told by the police that such a piece of paper existed.
What would be the motive for the Johnsons to lie? If the Johnsons were lying, it’s a lie that Gladys Johnson maintained for more than 14 years.
I think the Johnsons really were told that such a piece of paper existed, and that the police lied to the Johnsons to justify how they came to be at Beckley.
Some element of the Dallas Police Department, but not the Criminal Intelligence Section of the Special Service Bureau, knew about Oswald prior to the assassination.
Someone with ties to military intelligence perhaps?
Steve Thomas
Beautiful sight when laid out.
Seemed the cops were DESPERATE to tie Oswald to Beckley.
The frame and its players, the particulars and details.
I still want to see Saturdays search warrant, wherever they hid it.
Cheers,
Ed
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Mrs. PAINE - He did give her, I think, $10, just prior, or some time close to the time of the assassination, because she planned to buy some shoes.
Mr. JENNER - Shoes for herself, or her children?
Mrs. PAINE - For herself, flat s. But when he gave that to her I am not certain. I do know that we definitely planned to go out on Friday afternoon, the 22d of November, to buy those shoes. We did not go.
Mr. JENNER - That is you girls planned to do that?
Mrs. PAINE - She and I did; yes.Where would they go shopping isnt asked.
Cheers, Ed
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Fay listens in on the extension?
Well how often did they listen in on roomers calls. I doubt this was a one off.
Jim several Beckley witnesses had to have the caveat 'spanish or russian' spoken during the calls.
I do not see these confused for one another in Texas,.. so more likely the calls were in spanish and they were for Mr Herbert Leon Lee.
They added Russian as that is what the, police, and television news told them he spoke.
Hall was told to not talk about Mr Lee
"..her mother told the children to not talk about any of this with anyone."
and
"Hall turned her 1026 N. Beckley Ave. home into a museum, which by appointment can be toured. She kept the effort low key and sought help to partner with the Sixth Floor Museum at Dealey Plaza, which did not happen.
Hall said it was because she wouldn’t back the Warren Commission conclusions. “There’s too many questions,”
Was it really about money as she's doing a fine job propping up the Commission's Ommissions and fairytales.
She knew Mr Lee. not Oswald.
Why does she claim the register is destroyed or pages are torn out... how does she know??? Seems a good thing to keep prying eyes away.
Financial marketing strategy.
Cheers, Ed
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Question, what is between the Texas Theater and Beckley where that bus stops.
Would it be a SHOE STORE Andrej?
It is.
And of course why would Lee peer into the lobby, ...
Do you have a wife and kids Andrej?
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Here is Will Fritz's statement:
"I talked to Oswald about his leaving the building, and he told me he left by bus and rode to a stop near home and walked on to his house. At the time of Oswald's arrest he had a bus transfer in his pocket. He admitted this was given to him by the bus driver when he rode the bus after leaving the building."
Here is Hosty and Bookouts statement:
"Oswald stated he then went home by bus and changed his clothes and went to a move."
Bookhout solo report:
"Following his departure from the Texas School Book Depository, he boarded a city bus to his residence and obtained transfer upon departure from the bus. He stated that officers at the time of arresting him took his transfer out of his pocket."
And finally Thomas Kelley, Secret Service:
"In response to questions put by Captain Fritz, Oswald said that immediately after having left the building where he worked, he went by bus to the theater where he was arrested; that when he got on the bus he secured a transfer and thereafter transferred to other buses to get to his destination."
Seems a lot of wiggle room in Oswald's statements or poetic license was used in some cases.
I dealt conclusively with the transfer in the "Dallas Transit Transfer" essay.
Lee went to the theater from work on a bus, and the Beckley bus gets closer than the Marsalis by a half mile. It was directly behind the Marsalis bus and stopped at the corner of Elm and Houston as a regular stop.
Why does Andrej
" find this scenario improbable and logically inconsistent "Though its what was reported in interrogations....
Cheers, Ed
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On 2/26/2020 at 3:12 PM, Andrej Stancak said:
John:
some of the authors I quoted spoke to Mrs. or Mr. Johnson. They were conspiracy researchers and sensitive to any false information fitting the official version. These people were not gullible or poorly informed. It is therefore useful to know their views. Actually, it is part of good research to familiarise with the views of first or second generation researchers.
Appeal to authority Andrej.
That they accepted without question that Oswald lived under an alias is on them.
It's not a shining moment for any of them.
Their lack of questioning faults them not me Andrej
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On 2/26/2020 at 1:39 PM, Andrej Stancak said:
Ed:
thanks for taking time to respond. However, I find your responses as again diverging away from the simple question I asked. Your last post is enough for me to see that you do not have any positive evidence about alternative address of Lee Oswald in October and November 1963. How many people had to lie to make your story possible? Ten, twenty? How many people would have to lie under oath and risk ending in jail and loss any self-respect for the rest of their lives? People usually do not lie, only if their existence or existence of their loved ones is in grave danger. However, this was not the case of witnesses in 1026 North Beckley.
I can now retire from this thread. Actually, I may come back if Mrs Pat Hall would respond to my request for information regarding the keys rules in North Beckley rooming house. The lack of keys in Lee Oswald's possession during his arrest puzzles me and I would like to understand this point.
Why does Not Living at an address need alternatives.
That is a false equivalency.
Being framed for a cop killing isnt enough?
This is a tactic. ...you go first.
How many people had to lie to convict 20 + innocent people?
A rough estimate will do.
TIA.
Cheers, Ed
PS,
RE-READ THE ESSAY
I explicitly replied to this
And now a second time special for Andrej
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On 2/27/2020 at 5:38 PM, Steve Roe said:
No Ed, don’t get all melodramatic again. 2 brands of shells found at the Tippit Murder scene, same 2 brands of 0.38’s found on Oswald.
I already know your answer, everyone in Dallas County framed Oswald.
How many conspirators are you up to now Ed, with this pistol plant fantasy? Got to be at least 50. Did they hold a Pre-Assassination meeting at the Dallas Memorial Auditorium to discuss who was going to plant the gun, plant the holster, get Fritz to invent the North Beckley story, get the Johnsons to go along with Fritz and frame Oswald....Seriously, is this some kind of joke?
How many innocent people had their convictions overturned in Dallas Steven?
20+
Those real humans had alibis.
They were with family and friends or far from the scene of the crime.
Didn't matter did it Steve? Well till DNA kept but not shared by the DA's office proved their innocence.
Do or did these things happen in a vacuum. To Steve they must.
Are you saying that in each case the detectives and Will Fritz were not framing them? How did they obtain the conviction without proper police work?
Are you in a historical fantasy world?
When's the Jamboree Steve???
Is that where you are going to joke about the travesties in Dallas as a one man stage performance...
I'd buy a ticket and a tomato.
Cheers, Ed
PS
Got that Holster - Revolver match yet
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On 2/27/2020 at 2:31 PM, David Josephs said:
Seems to me Ed, without the modern buildings there, the view from the backyard balcony/top of the steps in the BYPs to the corner of Elsbeth was very possible...
That's not what the ladies say.
They said hanging laundry
There was no view to the back yard.
So again its Hugh's anonymous entities claiming that, and no real evidence that was how he found Neely.
It is another question Aynesworth will need to answer.
Do any photos exist of any view From Neely backyard to Elsbeth... why not?
Cheers,
Ed
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Aye aye aye,
Steve where is the gun that killed Tippit?
Isnt more likely the killer ditched it.
Is the revolver in question thee murder weapon?
How did you reach that conclusion?
Cheers, Ed
Oh btw does it fit the holster supposedly found at Beckley? TIA
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Yes revolvers were planted by cops
Are you disputing know fact again?
Or is Oswald immune from these devices as they framed him for a cop killing?
Which excuse does Roe pick this time....
Ed
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David,
You do know 214 Neely and 602/4 Elsbeth are on different blocks?
Reason I ask is that I just spoke with Jane the owner of Elsbeth and she never recalls seeing Neely from any apartment at Elsbeth...
She seemed to recall being able to see "NEELY STREET" up at the intersection but houses, trees, fences, and bushes were in the way of seeing through all that to the Neely back yard...mid block.
Interestingly Jane did point out that Marina hung out clothes to dry at Elsbeth. Hmmm
Was this subterfuge by Hugh Aynesworth?
Did he get the Neely addy elsewhere or did two lil old ladies have better than 20/20 vision with their xray glasses on?
Who were these human telescopes?
They seemed to know Marina and her movements yet remain anonymous... nah. Hugh Aynesworth was blowing smoke up our backsides and calling us a chimney.
Cheers, Ed
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32 minutes ago, Bart Kamp said:
The pistol as a dropped item; I know that is a thing now, not sure it was in 1963 but more importantly, are all of the remarks from Oswald about owning and taking a pistol to the theater also false (again, totally lost).
Thanks for highlighting this Bart.
Let me address it this way.
The drop piece is a historical fact.
Not a modern invention.
The Gun
In late 1977, after the grand jury hearings, Mary Sinderson asked Lupe Salinas to close out the Randy Webster case. The investigation seemed to be going nowhere, and the U.S. attorney’s office was involved with other time-consuming matters. But Salinas asked Sinderson and U.S. Attorney Tony Canales for more time. He told Canales he wanted to trace the gun that had been found next to Randy Webster’s body. Canales gave him the go-ahead, but urged him to do it quickly.
When the Houston Police Department investigated the death of Randy Webster, its information about the origin of the gun came from a report by the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms, which said the pistol had been manufactured by a company in Connecticut and sold to Oshman’s, a wholesaler in Houston. Oshman’s, the report said, had shipped the gun to a Globe discount store in Southwest Houston, and from there it had gone, in 1964, to another Globe store on West 34th Street in Northwest Houston.
In 1974, when Salinas moved back to Houston from San Antonio, he had lived three blocks from the Northwest Houston Globe store, and he remembered that the store had opened about the time he had moved into the neighborhood. In other words, the federal agency had reported that the gun was shipped to a store ten years before that store existed. That meant the report was wrong.
Salinas asked Robert Ontiveros, a young man doing a criminal justice internship in the U.S. attorney’s office, to go down to the Southwest Houston Globe store and check its gun-sale records. Ontiveros asked to see the records for 1964, and he was given a big, dusty box of index cards. He went through them, checking serial numbers against the serial number found on the gun next to Randy Webster’s body. After he had been through more than eight hundred, he finally found a match. The gun had been bought from Globe in 1964 by a man named Roy Hooven.
There was no Roy Hooven listed in the Houston telephone book, but there was a William R. Hooven, Jr. Salinas called the number, and a Mrs. Hooven answered. She told him William R. Hooven, Jr., was the son of Roy Hooven, and that Roy Hooven had committed suicide in 1964 with a gun he had bought at a Globe discount store in Southwest Houston.
“What happened to the gun?” Salinas asked Mrs. Hooven. She replied that the police department had taken it when the family said they didn’t want it.
Salinas and Ontiveros were closing in. They went to police headquarters to find the suicide report on Roy Hooven and spent days searching through old records in two warehouses before they found it. The report said that a .22-caliber pistol with the same serial number and description as the one found next to Randy Webster had been tagged and placed in the police property room in 1964, after Roy Hooven’s death.
Salinas remembers feeling excited, nervous, and queasy as he looked at the report. The gun that Randy Webster had allegedly pointed at Officer Mays was the property of the Houston Police Department.
https://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/the-throwdown/
Cheers, Ed
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1 hour ago, Larry Hancock said:
then you literally have no data at all.
Yet we do find new data when we review it and are more aware.
Second Floor Lunchroom Encounter was disputed for several reasons early on, timing etc. but the huge pieces we have thanks to Bart and Malcolm are invaluable and only a fresh eye caught this recently. The wait was worth defending the position.
There is evidence that we can verify, rather than loose rubble we are told is solid footings at present.
Its messy but necessary if we really are holding the evidence accountable
All good work takes some skill and dedication.
The available mass of data was ignored before by all the academics. They did not care to scrutinize it as they saw it as a logical construct. Lee stops gets an oversized jacket and a murder weapon then goes looking to kill a cop...?
The study of the case makes it illogical.
Perhaps too many have been overtly concerned with 'where to' rather than deciding merits of that presented by the witnesses as they themselves show us "there's no there there."
Its tough to find data where nothing happened. Right Larry?
That Beckley Bus hole is wide, deep and zero data Larry, I have been looking/ looked.
Any cries before about its absence of evidence by anyone? Nah, I feel I'm a one man justice league on the bogus bus bandwagon.1 hour ago, Larry Hancock said:Or does Oswald just go the Oak Cliff and the Eight Street area because of the Texas School Book Depository and nothing else? Or possibly none of that is relevant at all and he went directly to the Theater.
He did have the possibility of meeting Ruth and Marina for a shoe shopping expedition they were planning to do that afternoon. (postponed due to Kennedy death)
Recall Lee did ask Marina to buy shoes for Junie.
The shoe store sighting has always said to me Lee checked the store but since his wife wasn't there he went to the theater to waste time... or simply saw what kids shoes they had in the display...?
Then timing and stories told by Brewer are two fold and make little sense. I covered his actions in the Texas Theater Theatrics thread.
Why Oakcliff? Cheap rents and plenty of apartments/rooms/rentals... just look at the Davis sisters. They each had an apartment in the same house on Tenth.
Though its not "close" to work at TSBD.
It would be "close" to Trinity Flooring. Walking distance, and in Oak Cliff, that's close. TSBD was a couple miles, not a leisurely walk at 7:30am across the Trinity River bridge, so bus was the means,,, if he lived at Beckley.
Sans driver for DAILY trips is very odd. Why no interest in that driver. Its beyond odd.
1 hour ago, Larry Hancock said:Perhaps so if he was never at Becklay at all...but if not where did he pick up the pistol...or did he have it with him at the TSBD..
That's Gladys claim since she searched rooms for liquor. She and Earlene said there was no commie literature, no dishonorable discharge paperwork, no russian works, ... nothing With Lee Harvey Oswald on it. Yet we are shown a floor full of it at DPD (on Nov 23rd not Nov 22!!)
The Tippit murder pistol was a dropped item,... Ex. police carry drop pieces that are untraceable.
Were the police framing Oswald for murder. Yes. There is no other answer to seek here. History proves this is the MO
I say he went to Beckley did not like what he saw and went to Bledsoe's.
For what its worth she lacks credibility. Her "books" are a laugh, not worth a plug nickle, yet Porter sells this calendar page.
Again the evidence submitted after that calendar page is brought to the bureaus attention is telling... the fbi take a photocopy ... a copy of the notation To Oswald and From Oswald.
What did Bledsoe give Oswald... mmmmm a KEY?
What did she get back from Lee..... hmmmmm a KEY!
What was they key found on Oswald?2 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:I'm be more than interested to hear thoughts for alternatives to Oswald at Beckley and in Oak Cliff beyond being in the Texas Theater.
I've covered in excruciating detail why there is no evidence for Oswald or anyone firing any shots from the TSBD.
So no escape necessary. See No Shots Fired From The TSDB
I've covered the Public Transportation Getaway
I've covered the Beckley Bunch
I've covered the Texas Theater Theatrics.
The jacket has been done, in Oswalds Technicolor Jacket.
Between Tenth and Patton and the TT is a long walk when your wanted, Jefferson blvd. would be certain death.
The alley's? No way in hell Oswald goes through alley way to TT. Cops had the block. Then the next down to Brewer's store, not past it, no cop cars tear up Jefferson as they had the area contained and yet they commission just want you Larry to accept a unfathomable trip to the theater.
I'd ask for my money back if I had paid for the Warren Report.
Its not properly labeled as fiction.
Appreciate your works Larry and questions. (And my Signed copy of SWHT)
Cheers, Ed
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Agreed.
Lets stick to the evidence or its lack and examine the record.
Truths are self evident and do not need pomp and circumstance, nor pride nor populism.
I shared the stories (plural) and then facts as presented. The disinformation and gaping holes in the narrative by Warren Commission and the Dallas Police department.
Im not in safe waters fishing for compliment. The essay is a shift in how things are viewed. The reasonable doubt exists exponentially about the official account, this is including Beckley.
I expect pushback from posting a thesis so profound. So be it.
There is nothing to refute its presence.
The Beckley tales go in the same bin as the other wrongful attributions to Oswald that could not withstand scrutiny. Rifle ranges, gun stores, auto dealerships, or mobbed up restaurants with every shadowy suspect in the Kennedy case converging ... or clubs where all these people meet and everyone is either going to kill Castro or Kennedy ... its quite ridiculous.
ANNA LEWIS comes to mind
Gee how'd that turn out?
Not well. Not well at all.
In my humble opinion many in the limelight are equally dubious and cashing in on their snake oil.
Pat Hall is behind a register alright.... one taking cash, not one with evidence in it.
I look at where we were and what has been learned along the way. Heck from the Lancer forums ideas to Bart's paradigm shift with rokc solid support has been about 20 years. (Hosty notes etc.)
Give this thesis time. Seems a bums rush to not look at Beckley from a devoted few. As expected. Egos and attitudes will be apparent.
I said it before things need a starting point.
This was the giant leap. Carry on. Thanks for listening.
Ed
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How many people had to lie to make your story possible?
Andrej, The appropriate question is how many were mistaken, and proved to be such?
All.
How many testimonies have been shown to be utter fabrications yet met with no such
"risk ending in jail and loss any self-respect for the rest of their lives?"
None of the lawyers faced any risk either, though they were called on suborning perjury. I point you to VINCENT SALANDRIA.
The commission lawyers did face disrespect by many. This was a white wash and the testimonies were full of falsehoods and half truths.
Again the Niagara of Naivety is flowing on the EdForum, bless your heart.
Many went along with the largest pressure applied, to lie for the commission lawyers.
I suggest you re-examine the testimonies from those at Beckley.
Ed
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Steve,
They are on topic as they are exactly the same type of frame up by police.
That goes to motive, opportunity and more.
Might I suggest you stop trying to control the topic or this thread.
The mods and myself will. Thanx.
The bus and routes involved in this are parts of the same case, the Beckley Bunch relates directly to both the Theater Theatrics and Bus Bungling.
So please continue David, but dont push your luck by trying to convince a ROKC Hater with a mountain of facts and evidence no matter how apropos.
Some's skills at evidence discrimination are not that advanced, primordial and somewhat naive is more appropriate of a description.
Now can we continue without constant 'intervention.' ... oy vey.
Cheers, Ed
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The bus escape was disproven by the Commission itself... yet its been used as a getaway for fifty plus years.
Since it was the bus driver Cecil McWatters and passenger, Milton Jones, who made the public transportation a non-starter why did the commission use it?
They were made aware of Milton and Cecil's recantation
So instead of interviewing or getting a simple statement from the other most likely bus driver they do nothing.
No name or otherwise of the Dallas Transit company bus drivers are introduced or investigated.
No one is questioning the bus trips each morning. CRICKETS. Why.
Do we really accept that no investigation at all was attempted for Beckley, or its bus
The problem with the Marsalis bus was the transfer said by one of Dallas's finest to have been found in Oswalds shirt pocket ( change of shirt would require taking the transfer from the old shirt and place it in a newly donned shirt..)
& That is where the frame up encountered a conundrum.
There is nothing to this "transfer business" unless the booklet from which the supposed transfers were issued is entered into evidence. Not only is the booklet deep sixed the questions about it are scuttled.
Strikingly similar to the Beckley Rooming house register fiasco
Amazing coincidental omissions?
Nah Andrej.
Cheers, Ed
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David,
Neches is right where Watson moves.
Keep questioning the narrative.
Its shat.
Cheers, Ed
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Andrej that would be your own deficit if you can not accept evidence as evidence. This is not cryptic writing.
The 'facts 'are that nothing Steve, yourself or the authorities put forth is convincing, let alone verified.
Quite the contrary, no matter the "style" presented the fact is no evidence showed Oswald stayed at Beckley.
Phone numbers in books do not suffice.
Why do you feel the need to appeal to authority when these authorities have been discredited is the question I have for you Andrej.
If you, Andrej are on a bus from work to a theater then obviously you did not change clothing mid stream.
The wild rides to get Oswald to Beckley have too been dismantled.
They never happened.
So why is the continuation of the Warren Commission's route for Oswald any more sacred?
It is no longer possible that these murders were feats of Oswald's. The police were framing Oswald just like many others. We know Will Fritz's true history and how he worked.
To say any of the essay or these facts are disputed is disingenuous.
They merely upset you and your apple cart, guess you should watch the road rather than polls or popular notions.
Better buckle up Andrej, more curves ahead.
Cheers, Ed
PS If you need a translation of the above come to ROKC and It will be apparent.
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Seemed Steve's only salvo came in the form of Oswald's notebook and the rooming house numbers. As I stated in the essay I thought Ruth gave Lee the numbers to check out. Alas there was never any call to the rooming house from Oswald to inquire about or reserve a room...
then what was the point of having the numbers...
as stated they were given to Lee and he went there but they only had a tiny room so he checked the other. At about the same time Herbert Lee does rent a room.
Oswald instead found Bledsoe's suitable enough and rented it for the week. (under his own name) After the week stay it may not have been a good fit for the Oswalds. A seperate apartment where a washing machine could be installed for Marina's benefit was preferred.
The Beckley witnesses are the best we could hope for and their statements are golden..., and prove 'their Oswald' was other roomers and COULD NOT BE OSWALD.
No one who actually knew Oswald saw him at Beckley.
The only story comes via Ruth about calling and some story about Lee calling back after hearing the call,or after finding out during his nightly calls., I say Ruth did call to inquire about rentals, and Ruth covered her tracks like a good Quaker. She knew she might get caught with her call/s to Beckley and the alias ruse helped her immensely.
& why always two stories... tell me,...always 2 tales to pick from,,, be it Earlene, or Johnson's or Ruth, its always two stories about Beckley.
This cannot be good for Roe or the case against Oswald.
Should be a natural evidentiary path, but not in Roe'm.
Here at Beckley we have a half dozen Oswald tales and no Oz. Its a ghost story. The whole thing smells on ice. The register is deep sixed, a scrap piece of paper from the "maid" is considered proof... but wait Roe can only at best offer up a photocopy, worthless for evidentiary purposes. Yet Roe tries to claim its Oswald's signature... He is sunk there. The Titanic stayed afloat longer.
Then... His third hand story was rather convenient and bunkum. Then came a spate of needless ifs and what ifs.
There is only one IF...
Stephen Roe row that Titanic lifeboat...
Thee IF is If Oswald denied living at Beckley.
There's nothing to show he lived in the tiny room. If he claimed to live there and the Johnson's denied it yet a search turns up his belongings then great suspicion would be cast on the Johnson's for little benefit other than to avoid association with a murderer. If he said he did live there and the Johnson's agreed he did then no harm, unless the dates were not the same as given by Oswald... But a late arriving slip of paper confirms everything complete with the killers sig. Oy vey.
Erasure by Gladys must have been overlooked by Steven. Oh my.
Likewise if Lee said he lived there 'once' and the Johnson's only agree that he is living there when they see him in custody on TV.
Why?
The favors the DPD has done for Gladys are being called in. She only plays along for the possibility of money, as she herself stated, and some future help by the DPD.
The cops did need Oswald in a Dallas rooming house with evidence to tie him to Tippit (Holster, Zip up Eisenhower jacket) and JFK (changed pants and shirt)... They cant have him on a bus from Elm to Jefferson!!!
.... Where would he get the jacket and pistol to kill Tipppit, yeah... let alone change his clothes TO those of Prayerman.
The FBI cut up the clothes for residues, and oddly do not test Holster for anything at all..., not even if the holster fit the pistol.
Roe, et al are playing the excuse game for all its worth. But their excuses are made of cheap tin, the kind they make badges outta.
Cheers, Ed
BTW the "Key" to the rooming house is Lee had none.
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.."extraordinary theory"...?
Or simpler.
An ordinary theory hinted at and hidden in plain sight all along.
The Emperor had disrobed long ago. These gents though when told the emperor is naked turn against those seeing no clothes. They excuse it as being some flesh colored garb or just bad lighting upon his robes.
Perfectly acceptable excuses, if it were the case. Alas it's never the nudists fault, but those whom point out the nudity on display.
Welcome to Roe'm where lack of evidence is King, and opinion its joker.
Cheers, Ed
PS
Truths are not based on consensus that ebbs and sways. They stand like statues. The birds and their droppings come and go.
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Yes and nothing but excuses from the peanut gallery.
Best not venture out of your comfort zone.
There is hoping non-existent evidence appears and gives a counterpoint. But I wouldn't count on it.
So far opposition has been scarce, I consider that the minority opinion.
Cheers, Ed
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Yes we should re-examine it in a new light.
Any questions
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:Well, shall we now consider the fallacy of 1026 North Beckley as Oswald's address after his return to Dallas in October as a proven fact? Shall we quote this thread as an ultimate proof of 57 years of false belief pertaining Lee Oswald's rooming house?
THE EVIDENCE SAYS THERE WAS NOTHING TO SUPPORT THE NOTIONS, AND PLENTY TO DISMISS IT.
What is the one killer fact, the ultimate proof, that would convince all researchers, LNs or CTs, that Lee Oswald did not stay in that rooming house after his return to Dallas?
No physical evidence or witnesses.
That is beyond enough if it was the other way around.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:Is there any other address which was pointed out by more than one reliable witness to be Lee Oswald's site of residence?
Again I do not have to prove anything other than Beckley is a false address.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:Is there any other supporting fact (e.g., any document of relevance bearing the name of Lee Oswald and another Dallas address in October-November, 1963) converging independently on some other address than 1026 North Beckley?
What address was the washing machine for?
Which addresses did Ruth help Oswald locate.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:Was Lee's positive statements he told the interrogators about living in 1026 North Beckley false?
Given the evidence in this thread, Yes.
He did not give positive statements.
It was the DPD giving false information.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:How could he invent that address?
Will Fritz is your inventor.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:Or, did he say he had lived somewhere else and Cpt. Fritz just changed that address to 1026 North Beckley?
See above, I think you are arguing against yourself based on testimony etc.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:Did the Police invent the fake address of 1026 North Beckley right after capturing Lee Oswald and raided his other residence to stage his belongings at 1026 North Beckley?
Why stage anything if you dont plan on photography of it, or any way to document it.
They grabbed someone's belongings at Beckley we are told.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:Or, did they have this address in their sleeves and knew they needed to stage 1026 North Beckley already before the assassination?
Will Fritz seemed aware of this area and house.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:Is absence of a photograph of Lee's room with Lee belongings in it a proof that the Police had planted his belongings to that small room in 1026 North Beckley? Or, is it rather a proof of a sloppy detective work?
Did Lee drag a Rifle to work?
Again your blindness to the obvious is breathtaking.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:There are a number of puzzling points which do raise questions about Lee Oswald's whereabouts, however, they appear to result from misunderstanding, honest errors, poor investigation, lack of proper documentation and of course, from urgency to convict Lee Oswald as a killer, and also from active framing accomplished by several people.
Why does the framing start or end with a few. It seems the guy with a 98% clearance rate on homicides is a HUGE suspect, and this incrimination did not happen in a vacuum. The foot soldiers are well aware and kept mum.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:If Lt. Jack Revill wrote 602 Elsbeth as Lee Oswald's address, it raises a red flag because this address was almost identical with the address at which Lee and Marina lived before moving to Neeley Street
Yet Fritzs says Lee denies Neely...
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:- only, how could Revill know about Elsbeth address if a different address was in Roy Truly's records and it was not 1026 North Beckley either.
It may be prudent to try to answer the questions listed on top of my post and only accept refutation of 1026 North Beckley address if these questions can be answered without a shadow of doubt.
Are you looking for absolute proofs.
Then the shoe is on the other foot.
Its been proven to a degree of reasonable doubt that Oswald did not go to Beckley for a pistol and thus leave a trail to Tippit's murder.
Its beyond reasonable to question the witnesses and evidence, and if that does not hold up to scrutiny... it must be re-examined.
This is not the end Andrej, but the start.
On 2/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, Andrej Stancak said:I would also recommend to answer points with clear and not too lengthy posts and to avoid mentioning some further hints which only distract from understanding the answer to essential questions.
There are 50 pages of answers.
The length is what it takes to answer the original question Andrej.
Did Oswald deny living at Beckley?
Cheers, Ed
Oh and btw Hosty is toasty.
The Beckley Bunch
in JFK Assassination Debate
Posted · Edited by Ed LeDoux