Jim Hargrove

Steve, Interesting, and I hadn't noticed the Canal Zone before. But someone is clearly lying here. Do we know an organization that routinely altered witness statements in this case? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODXoISgU-0M

Steve, Stringfellow my have been using the term “defected” inaccurately, but there’s credible evidence that one Oswald was in Cuba (as well as in the U.S. involved in anti-Castro activities) while the other was in Russia, and Hoover indicated he had been there several times. The U.S. Army seemed to take seriously this claim that "Lieutenant Harvey Oswald" was in Havana in 1961. FROM: SAC (New York) TO: Director FBI Enclosed for each recipient is one copy of a self-explanatory Army communication dated 12.30.63 captioned Harvey Oswald. Enclosed Army communication alleges that Oswald was in Cuba in the company of Robert Taber, former head of Fair Play for Cuba Committee (FPCC), approximately three weeks after the April 1961, Bay of Pigs invasion of Cuba.

Steve, Below is the full Hoover memo sent to all the FBI top brass on 11/22/63--the very day JFK was assassinated--in which he (Hoover) described telling AG Robert F. Kennedy that Lee Harvey Oswald "went to Cuba on several occasions but would not tell us what he went to Cuba for." I'm aware of no other hint on the record that Classic Oswald ever went to Cuba. Therefore, it must have been another "Lee Harvey Oswald" who went there. Isn't it amazing how much evidence points to two Oswalds? Apparently, it isn't easy to make an entire human being disappear without a trace. If it were easy, Hoover and the Warren Commission would have surely succeeded. The documents below are also available on the Mary Ferrell website at this address: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62251#relPageId=96&tab=page

Mr. B’s repeated talking points about “three Oswalds” in the theater are just unsuccessful attempts to mock what most likely really happened there. A second, but hardly a third, Oswald is so much a part of Kennedy assassination research that even the earliest investigators, such as Sylvia Meagher, discussed how it seemed to be a reality, at least in the weeks preceding to the assassination. Both Jack Davis and Butch Burroughs (we only know a few theater witnesses since the Dallas Police conveniently “lost” the list of theater patrons) said one Oswald arrived in the theater roughly twenty minutes before the second Oswald in the Postal/Brewer saga allegedly arrived. Mr. B. wants us to believe Davis and Burroughs were wrong about when the first Oswald arrived, and/or he wants us to believe that the Postal/Brewer timeline was incorrect about the time the second Oswald arrived. He wants us to believe that if a second Oswald was arrested in the balcony and hustled out of the theater, none of this could be seen clearly enough by Burroughs to enable him to say he saw Oswald arrested, even as the man was hustled down stairs and out the back door. Are we seriously to believe this scene necessitates THREE OSWALDS to envision? That’s the silliness Mr. B. wants us to believe. And so we are to believe that not one but two Dallas Police reports saying Oswald was arrested in the balcony were silly mistakes. This was the most famous arrest in the history of Texas! Are we to believe that the names and addresses of theater patrons collected by three different cops just disappeared because of yet another silly mistake? We are to believe that two witnesses who say they saw a man taken out the back door of the theater never saw images of “Lee Harvey Oswald” that night and therefore couldn’t tell the man they saw from George Applin? Mr. B. says this with great certainty without even knowing what George Applin looked like! Silly rabbit!

Don't worry. Someone will 'splain it.

Steve, But Hoover wrote a memo on 11/22/63 saying that Oswald "went to Cuba on several occasions but would not tell us what he went to Cuba for." I'll try to find the actual memo. There is no record that Classic Oswald ever went to Cuba. If Hoover was right, it must have been another LHO.

Here is John A's writeup from the Nov. 22 page on our website: LEE OSWALD IS ARRESTED IN THE BALCONY AND TAKEN OUT THE BACK OF THE THEATER Westbrook may not have seen HARVEY Oswald again after he was arrested, but he most likely saw LEE Oswald and may have escorted him out the back of the theater. Deputy Sheriff Bill Courson saw a young man in the balcony who looked identical to Lee Harvey Oswald. One police homicide report of Tippit's murder reads, "suspect was later arrested in the balcony of the Texas theater at 231 W. Jefferson." At least two other DPD documents reported the arrest occurred in the balcony. In his report to Captain Gannaway, Dallas Police Detective L.D. Stringfellow wrote: "On Novemberr 22, 1963, Lee Harvey Oswald was arrested in the balcony of the Texas Theater, 231 West Jefferson Blvd., and was charged with the murder of President John F. Kennedy and the murder of Officer JD Tippit." How could several experienced, career police officers and detectives report that Oswald was arrested in the balcony, when he was arrested in the lower section? After entering the Texas Theater Deputy Sheriff Bill Courson hurried up the stairs to the balcony and was "reasonably satisfied in his own mind" that he met Lee Harvey Oswald coming down the front stairs. Lt. Cunningham and Detective J.B. Toney encountered the same young man and began to question him. As Deputy Sheriff Buddy Walthers rushed up the stairs to the balcony, he saw the officers as they were questioning the young man. According to a Dallas police Homicide Report LEE Oswald was arrested in the balcony of the theater. Sgt. Jerry Hill and Det. Paul Bentley were checking fire escapes in the balcony when Hill opened the exit door to the fire escape. Sgt. Stringer, standing in the alley below, heard someone inside the theater yell "We got him." The police officer inside the theater may have thought the man on the staircase, being questioned by Lieutenant Cunningham and Toney, was under ar­rest, which caused him to shout "we got him." This young man may have been wearing a white t-shirt and dark pants, which matched the description of the suspect as reported by the police dispatcher. But an unknown person, who identified himself as the "manager on duty," said the young man had been in the theater since 12:05 PM. The unidentified "manager on duty" may have been an accomplice who provided Oswald with a much needed alibi, as theater manager John Callaghan left the theater before the police arrived (Julia Postal, Butch Burroughs, and the projectionist were the only employees left in the theater). The young man was released. Sgt. Stringer, standing below in the alley, asked Hill if the suspect had been arrested. Hill looked back into the balcony area and said, "No, we haven't got him." Something happened in the 2nd floor balcony that caused a police officer to yell, "We got him." Something caused veteran police officers to write reports that Lee Harvey Oswald was arrested in the balcony. Something happened in the 2nd floor balcony. After HARVEY Oswald was arrested and taken out the front of the theater, LEE Oswald was escorted out the back of the theater. There is no police report, no record of arrest, nor any mention of a person taken out the rear of the theater. Capt. Westbrook saw LEE Oswald shoot officer Tippit at 10th & Patton. Capt. Westbrook produced a 2nd Oswald wallet at 10th & Patton. Capt. Westbrook either planted or knew exactly where to find the suspect's jacket. Capt. Westbrook was the first police officer to arrive at the theater. Capt. Westbrook told his officers to cover (HARVEY) Oswalds face and get him out of here. Capt. Westbrook ordered police to compile a list of the names and addresses of theater patrons, a list that soon disappeared. Capt. Westbrook was the highest ranking officer at the Texas Theater, and it was likely that Capt. Westbrook escorted LEE Oswald out the rear of the theater. During author James Douglas's 2007 interview with theater concessionaire Butch Burroughs, Burroughs said that he saw two different people arrested in the Texas Theater. He saw (Harvey) Oswald's arrest and then, "three or four minutes later," watched as the Dallas police arrested "an Oswald lookalike." Burroughs added that the second man arrested "looked almost like Oswald, like he was his brother or something." Apparently, Butch Burroughs saw both Harvey and Lee at the Texas Theater. See the Dallas Police Homicide Report for J.D. Tippit and Detective L.D. Stringfellow's report, which both state that (LEE) Oswald was arrested in the balcony. Bernard Haire, owner of a hobby shop two doors east of the theater, saw the police escort a young man who he thought was LEE Oswald out the rear of the theater. Perhaps the young man in the balcony, who was identified by Deputy Sheriff Bill Courson as LEE Oswald, was this man. For the next 25 years Mr. Haire thought he had seen the arrest of Oswald. If Bernard Haire and Butch Burroughs observed "LEE" Oswald taken out the back of the theater then who, if not Captain Westbrook, was responsible for escorting him out of the back of the theater? After all, it was likely Capt. Westbrook who watched his co-conspirator, LEE Oswald, murder Tippit at 10th Patton only a half hour earlier. After he was taken out the rear of the theater, someone (perhaps Croy) then drove LEE Oswald to a red 1961 Ford Falcon that was parked nearby. Croy told the Warren Commission that after leaving 10th & Patton he drove by the Texas Theater (how convenient). On the other hand, recall that (HARVEY) Oswald, according to many reports and police statements, was arrested on the main floor of the theater. See Dallas Police reports indicating (Harvey) Oswald was arrested on the main floor and charged with the murder of President Kennedy and J.D. Tippit.

This is interesting, Steve. John A. wrote only briefly about Buchanan in H&L, and so I didn’t know about this reported event. There is a pretty good collection of documents on Buchanan and his alleged fight with “Oswald” on Baylor University’s online John Armstrong Collection. Here is the link: http://digitalcollections.baylor.edu/cdm/compoundobject/collection/po-arm/id/31079/rec/62 It’s pretty obvious that the Bureau took the Buchanan threat seriously, because it apparently went to some effort to discredit him. A cover page, at the very top, indicated that “The Miami Office does not contemplate further investigation to disprove the allegations by JIM BUCHANAN,” because, apparently, “he ran off with the wife of a Hollywood city employee,” and was then “refused employment,” and was finally hired by a Pompano Beach newspaper “in dire need of reporters.” And so on…. Buchanan apparently indicated, according to a 3/26/64 report by SAs Catlin and Boston, that Oswald was in Miami “during October 1962 and March 1963.” As far as I know, in October 1962, Classic Oswald® was in Fort Worth and then Dallas. His employment with Leslie Welding ended Oct. 8. He spent most of March and April of 1963 in Texas, infamously moving by bus for no apparent reason to New Orleans on April 23. John A. described Jerry Buchanan as “a member of Frank Fiorini Sturgis' CIA sponsored International Anti-Communist Brigade.” Buchanan’s description of “Oswald” wanting to join an anti-Castro operation on a Miami dock sounds much like the accusations made by Marita Lorenz and others. Thank you for bringing this up.

Mr. B. continues to pretend that James Douglass’s interview with Butch Burroughs provided information precluding an arrest of the Oswald lookalike in the balcony, while Mr. Douglass’s own published analysis of the interview clearly suggests otherwise. Mr. B. goes on and on and on about how Mr. Douglass was speculating, but that speculation was based on the information he received from Butch Burroughs, which, clearly in his opinion, did not preclude a balcony arrest. Again, this is not complicated, at least until Mr. B. tries to make it so.

Right, just like an Oswald decoy started the day on November 22 by showing a Texas driver’s license to Fred Moore at a Jiffy store to buy two beers at 8:30 am, when Classic Oswald® was already at work; just like a decoy in a white t-shirt was seen by Mrs. Reid immediately after the hit; just like a decoy was seen entering the Nash Rambler at just about the same time Classic Oswald got on a bus. The second Oswald/Hidell wallet, the one that magically appeared in Capt. Westbrook’s hands at 10th and Patton, was apparently owned by the Oswald decoy. Naturally! That same Oswald decoy apparently spent weeks setting up Classic Oswald before the assassination, including four different appearances at the Sports Drome Rifle Range, visits to Morgan’s Gun Shop, the Downtown Lincoln Mercury dealership, the Irving Furniture Mart, the Southland Hotel parking garage, and so on. I could start going back in time showing how that Oswald decoy appeared again and again and again, but I have to wonder if there isn’t a simpler explanation. Don’t have time for these thoughts, though. I’m meeting my own decoy for breakfast. Everyone has to have one of them decoys, especially “Lee Harvey Oswald,” eh?

That is simply not true. Here is what Douglass actually wrote (emphasis added): “By the time Burroughs witnessed the Oswald double’s arrest, he had also come down the balcony stairs on the far side of the lobby, either on his own or already accompanied by police who had been checking the balcony.” No matter how many times he tries, Mr. B. simply can't make his mischaracterization of Douglass's statement true. Douglass clearly wrote about the possibility that the Oswald “double” was arrested in the balcony and then brought down to the main floor where Burroughs then saw him. Two Dallas Police reports indicate Oswald was arrested in the balcony. This isn’t rocket science. Starting from a false premise, Mr. B. then goes on to list all sorts of silly "options" that I won’t bother discussing, except for the fact that in one of those "options" he makes the following statement: His sentence is perhaps intentionally unclear, but if Mr. B. is suggesting that Applin “is recorded as being escorted from the rear of the building,” I’d sure like to see his proof on that! On Sept 1, Mr. B posted this: “There is indeed no direct evidence (a photo or a written statement, for example) to show that Applin was escorted out by the police via one of the two rear doors, and then driven away in a police car.” Is he now changing his story? Mr. B. clearly wants us to believe that the Oswald “double” was George Applin, even though the witnesses suggest otherwise. Burroughs says he saw both men within minutes of each other and that they looked remarkably similar. According to Jim Marrs, who interviewed Bernard Haire in 1987, Haire said that the man who was taken out the theater’s alley door “appeared to be flushed as if having been in a struggle.” That does not sound like a mere witness. Images of “Lee Harvey Oswald” were visible on television and newspapers within hours of the assassination. And yet Haire thought for all those years he had seen his arrest. And Haire apparently got a good look at the second “Oswald.” In Crossfire, Marrs wrote, “Haire was opposite the rear door when police brought a young white man out.” (Crossfire, p. 354) While awaiting more misstatements from Mr. B., let’s take another look at those two Dallas Police reports indicating Oswald was arrested in the balcony.

That’s interesting, Karl. Thank you, and I agree completely about Priscilla Johnson. John A has noted how often the name “Harvey Oswald” (without the “Lee”) appears in assassination documents. Here's his own summary. The specifics appear in various places in the book. NOTE: The name "Harvey" Oswald was first used in North Dakota in the summer of 1953 and then at Beauregard Junior High in early 1954. "Harvey Oswald" is found in numerous Soviet documents and US State Department Security files from 1959-1962. In the fall of 1962 Oswald wrote "Harvey" in John Pic's address book and was used by George DeMohrenschildt in 1962-1963. In the summer of 1963 the name "Harvey Oswald" was used in New Orleans Police documents, FBI documents, CIA documents, and by Ruth Paine. Following the assassination we find the name "Harvey Oswald" used continuously by the FBI, Secret Service, CIA, military intelligence, Dallas Police, Dallas Sheriffs, and in the Warren Volumes. --from H&L, p. 599

What utter nonsense. From pp. 460-461 of JFK and the Unspeakable by James Douglass: In response to my question, “Now you didn’t see anybody else [besides Oswald] get arrested that day, did you?” he answered, “Yes, there was a lookalike—an Oswald lookalike.” In response to further questions, he described the second arrest, that of the “Oswald lookalike.” Ibid. Because Butch Burroughs saw neither Oswald nor his lookalike enter the Texas Theater, each must have gone directly up the balcony stairs on entering. Oswald crossed the balcony and came down the stairs on the far side of the lobby. There he entered the orchestra seats and began his seat-hopping, in apparent search of a contact. His lookalike sneaked into the theater at 1:45 P.M. and, like Oswald, went immediately up the balcony stairs. By the time Burroughs witnessed the Oswald double’s arrest, he had also come down the balcony stairs on the far side of the lobby, either on his own or already accompanied by police who had been checking the balcony.

John A on the FBI document above: There are literally millions and millions of documents relating to the assassination of President Kennedy in the National Archives. But there is only one document, among the millions, that suggests a possible origin for Russian speaking HARVEY Oswald. An anonymous telephone tip can hardly be considered proof of anything, but it does offer an intriguing clue as to the possible location and origin of a very young HARVEY Oswald (prior to 1947) and possible family members. It should be noted that Russian is an often-spoken second language in Hungary, and it would hardly be surprising that Hungarian immigrants could speak Russian fluently. The woman who telephoned Mrs. Tippit said she knew Oswald's father and uncle, who, she said, were Hungarians and communists. If this is true then it is probable the FBI and Director Hoover knew about these people from the early 1950s. A New York Times story of June 21, 1951 (page 16) indicated that during the previous year (1950) 21 people had been arrested in New York City and were awaiting trial for Communist related activities. One of the people arrested was Louis Weinstock, the Hungarian born leader of the Communist Party USA. Weinstock, born in 1903, was one of two names mentioned by the anonymous woman who called the Tippits of Westport, Connecticut. In December 1962, HARVEY Oswald corresponded with Weinstock, who was then general manager of The Worker. In the early 1950s the majority of active members of the American Communist Party were actually FBI agents working under cover. These people may have acted like communists, but in reality they were agents provocateur and their mission was to uncover and identify domestic communists for the FBI. It is difficult to believe that a supporter of communism would consider participating in Communist demonstrations in the heart of New York City at the height of the McCarthy era. But it is easy to believe the FBI, through their undercover informants, knew the identities of any and all persons suspected of being communists or supporting communist activities. The fact that Louis Weinstock was active in communist activities in NYC from the early 1950s through the early 1960s is a good indication that he was an FBI agent provocateur or informant. The woman who called Mrs. Tippit apparently knew that Oswald's father and uncle were communists and lived at 77th and 2nd Ave. in Yorkville. The House on Un-American Activities in New York had a file on a Marguerite Oswald in January, 1953. This file contained references to 1941, Nazis, and New Jersey, and was eventually discovered in a CIA office of Security file. The Assassination Records Review Board requested this file, but the request was denied. It is reasonable to assume the FBI should also have known about these "communists" Mrs. Tippit referenced. In 1959, after Russian-speaking HARVEY Oswald "defected" to the Soviet Union, the FBI and J. Edgar Hoover knew about Oswald. Eight months later (in June 1960) Hoover wrote a memo to the State Department stating, "Since there is a possibility that an imposter is using Oswald's birth certificate, any current information the Department of State may have concerning the subject will be appreciated." During the time HARVEY Oswald was in the Soviet Union, the FBI received numerous reports that (LEE) Oswald was in the USA (Florida, New Orleans, Dallas). After HARVEY Oswald returned to the USA with wife and child in June, 1962, the FBI monitored his activities. One month before the assassination (10/24/63) FBI SA Milton Kaack reviewed the birth records of Lee Harvey Oswald in New Orleans. By November 22, 1963 Hoover knew a great deal about the two Oswalds, and he knew that a thorough investigation into their backgrounds could expose HARVEY and LEE and the US government agency that created the "Oswald project." That afternoon (11/22/63) FBI SA James Hosty sat in on Oswald's first interrogation with the Dallas Police. Hosty was soon ordered, by an unidentified FBI counterintelligence officer, to have no further discussions with Oswald and not to investigate his background. Local FBI agents in Dallas and New Orleans would not be allowed to conduct their own, unsupervised investigations into the Oswalds or into their family backgrounds. Hoover and senior FBI officials knew perfectly well they had to manage and control their well-trained agents by telling them exactly where to go, exactly what evidence to confiscate, and specifically which people to interview and not to interview. Original FBI reports of "field" investigations and original evidence confiscated by the Dallas Police were sent to FBI headquarters in Washington, DC, where Hoover and senior FBI officials were waiting, were in complete control, and knew how to manipulate the evidence. As top FBI official William Sullivan said, "When an enormous organization like the FBI with tremendous power still can sit back and shuffle the deck of cards and pick up the card they want to show you it may be you're not going to get the entire picture. If there were documents that possibly he (Hoover) didn't want to come to the light of the public, then those documents no longer exist, and the truth will never be known." Hoover's knowledge of HARVEY and LEE was so extensive that he knew exactly where to send his agents in order to confiscate 6-8 year old employment records, elementary and junior high school records from New York City, Ft. Worth, New Orleans, and other material that could expose the two Oswalds. Oswald's possessions, collected by the Dallas Police, were sent to FBI headquarters only 14 hours after the assassination. Within 72 hours most of the documentation that could have exposed HARVEY and LEE was already in Washington, DC. Two days later, on November 24, FBI Associate Director Clyde Tolson wrote, "Shanklin said results of the investigation have been reduced to written form and consequently the information will all be available for these two supervisors. We can prepare a memorandum to the Attorney General [Robert Kennedy] to set out the evidence showing that Oswald is responsible for the shooting that killed the President. We will show that Oswald was an avowed Marxist, a former defector to the Soviet union and an active member of the FPCC, which has been financed by Castro. We will set forth the items of evidence which make it clear that Oswald is the man who killed the President." Two days after the assassination, and five days before the Warren Commission was established, FBI leadership had already decided that Oswald was the lone assassin. The remaining task was to distribute their manipulated and fabricated evidence to the Warren Commission, which supported the Bureau's two-day old investigation that concluded "Lee Harvey Oswald" had shot and killed JFK.

The following FBI document, an internal teletype from 11/30/63, was withheld from public view for three decades. URGENT 11-30-63 7-37 PM EST MB TO DIRECTOR, AND SACS DALLAS AND NEW YORK FROM SAC, NEW HAVEN /100-18158/ NEW YORK VIA WASHINGTON LEE HARVEY OSWALD, IS - R ON NOV. THIRTY INSTANT, JACK D. TIPPIT, SELF EMPLOYED CARTOONIST FOR NATIONAL MAGAZINES AND WIFE, ONE SIX FOUR NEW TOWN TURNPIKE, WESTPORT, CONN., ADVISED AS FOLLOWS. AT APPROXIMATELY ELEVEN THIRTY AM ON INSTANT DATE MRS. TIPPIT RECEIVED A TELEPHONE CALL FROM UNKNOWN WOMAN WHO ASKED IF MR. TIPPIT WAS A POLICEMAN AND IF HE WAS RELATED TO THE POLICE- MAN TIPPIT WHO WAS SHOT IN DALLAS. MRS. TIPPIT REPLIED HER HUSBAND WAS NOT A POLICEMAN, WAS DISTANTLY RELATED TO OFFICER TIPPIT AND ASKED IDENTITY OF CALLER. ON ANOTHER EXTENSION JACK TIPPIT LISTENED TO BALANCE OF PHONE CALL. THE WOMAN SAID SHE COULD NOT GIVE HER NAME AS SHE WAS AFRAID OF BEING KILLED, THAT SHE WAS FROM NEW YORK AND HAD TO COME "HERE" TO MAKE THE CALL SO THAT SHE COULD NOT BE TRACED AS SHE WAS IN FEAR OF HER END PAGE ONE PAGE TWO: LIFE. THE WOMAN REQUESTED THAT NOTHING BE SAID TO THE PRESS ABOUT A WOMAN CALLING AS THEY WOULD KNOW HER IDENTITY AND SHE WOULD BE KILLED. THE WOMAN SAID SHE KNEW OSWALD-S FATHER AND UNCLE WHO WERE HUNGARIANS AND COMMUNISTS. THE WOMAN CONTINUED THAT OSWALD-S FATHER AND UNCLE HAD LIVED AT SEVENTY SEVENTH AND SECOND AVENUE, YORKVILLE, NYC, THAT WHILE LIVING THERE BOTH WERE UNEMPLOYED, GOT THEIR MONEY FROM COMMUNISTS AND SPENT ALL THERE TIME IN COMMUNIST ACTIVITIES. THE WOMAN THEN BEGAN SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY, DISJOINTEDLY, AND NERVOUSLY. SHE STATED SHE HAD TWO NAMES TO GIVE AND MENTIONED THE NAME EMILE KARDOS AND SAID SOMETHING ABOUT A BROTHER IN LAW. WHEN MRS. TIPPIT TRIED TO FIND OUT WHOSE BROTHER IN LAW THE WOMAN KEPT REPEATING THE WORD BROTHER IN LAW. THE WOMAN STATED KARDOS IS HEAD OF THE COMMUNISTS AND THAT THIS GROUP IN NEW YORK NOW HAS CHARTS AND MAPS. THE WOMAN SAID SOMETHING ABOUT WEINSTOCK THE EDITOR OF QUOTE WOMAN-S WORLD UNQUOTE BUT DID NOT GIVE FURTHER DETAILS.. THE WOMAN SAID THE END PAGE TWO PAGE THREE: GROUP IN NEW YORK PLANS TO TAKE OVER THE GOVERNMENT, THAT OF COURSE THEY WOULD DENY THIS BUT SHE KNEW IT TO BE TRUE. SHE THEN HUNG UP ABRUPTLY. THE WOMAN NEVER GAVE ANY REASON FOR HER CALL WHICH SOUNDED LOCAL. MRS. TIPPIT THOUGHT THE WOMAN HAD AN AUSTRIAN OR GERMAN ACCENT WHILE MR. TIPPIT BELIEVED IT WAS SPANISH. BOTH FELT THE WOMAN SOUNDED LIKE A MATURE ADULT AND DID NOT HAVE A YOUTHFUL VOICE. MR. TIPPIT EXPLAINED WOMAN MAY HAVE OBTAINED HIS IDENTITY FROM AN ARTICLE ON PAGE ONE OF NORWALK, CONN. QUOTE HOUR UNQUOTE FOR NOVEMBER TWENTYFIVE LAST, WHICH STATED THAT WE MAY BE A DISTANT RELATIVE OF THE DALLAS POLICEMAN. TIPPIT SAID ARTICLE RESULTED FROM TELEPHONE CALL FROM REPORTER WHO WAS CHECKING ALL TIPPITS IN LOCAL TELEPHONE DIRECTORIES. BUREAU REQUESTED TO COORDINATE ABOVE WITH ANY OTHER INFORMATION TO DETERMINE IF PERTINENT AS NEW HAVEN HAS NO KNOWLEDGE OF THE RESIDENCE AND ASSOCIATES OF OSWALD-S FATHER AND UNCLE. END AND ACK PLS 7-45 PM OK FBI WA LLD FOR RELAY 6-47 PM CST OK FBI DL FL TU PLSDISC M CC-MR_ROSEN

Paul, You’re getting to understand the basics of this really quickly. Again, I’d like to suggest that it would have been difficult to make disappear the American born LHO because he had real family that might object... including his real mother, his real brother (Robert), his real half-brother (John Pic), and close relations such as the Murrets. Russian-speaking Harvey Oswald, on the other hand, who was probably born in Europe, had no one. Just a Russian wife who had already left him, two daughters way too young to help him, and a phony mom who, we soon learned through her testimony, knew practically nothing about him.

I think the second guy was a plain clothed cop, and we can finally understand why only a few witnesses saw him. The secret was revealed late last century by Mrs. Doris Holan, who wasn’t called to testify by any government agency but instead was tracked down by private researchers Bill Pulte and Michael Bronlow. Mrs. Holan lived on the 2nd floor at 409 E Tenth Street (see image below), directly across the street from the Tippit shooting. Tippit’s patrol car was parked directly in front of the very narrow driveway between two houses at 404 E. 10th & 410 E. 10th. Because the driveway was so narrow, and Tippit’s car blocked much of the view of it, few people were able to see what Mrs. Holan saw from her second story window (enabling her to clearly see over the top of Tippit’s car). Mrs. Holan saw a second police car not far from Tippit's but mostly hidden in the narrow driveway! (Megathanks to David Josephs for preparing this image) From the November 22 page of HarveyandLee.net: Seconds after shots were fired, Mrs. Holan saw a man (probably Capt. Westbrook) emerge from the 2nd police car and walk toward Tippit's body lying in the street, apparently to see if he (Tippit) was alive or dead. In 1990 a resident of the neighborhood was interviewed by JFK researcher Prof. Bill Pulte, on the condition of anonymity. This resident said that he heard that a man walked down the driveway and approached Tippit just after the shooting. In January, 1968, Playboy Magazine interviewed Jim Garrison. In response to the Garrison interview a reader wrote to Playboy and said, “I read Playboy's Garrison interview with perhaps more interest than most readers. I was an eyewitness to the shooting of policeman Tippit in Dallas on the afternoon President Kennedy was murdered. I saw two men, neither of them resembling the pictures I later saw of Lee Harvey Oswald, shoot Tippit and run off in opposite directions. There were at least half a dozen other people who witnessed this. My wife convinced me that I should say nothing, since there were other eyewitnesses. Her advice and my cowardice undoubtedly have prolonged my life--or at least allowed me now to tell the true story...” (Playboy, January 1968, Vol. 15, No 1, pg 11. Mrs. Acquilla Clemmons (interview August, 1964) said that after the shooting she saw the killer wave to the other man and they departed the scene in two different directions. This is a clear indication that the killer (LEE Oswald) and the occupants of the 2nd police vehicle were co-conspirators in the murder of Officer Tippit. From her 2nd floor bedroom Mrs. Holan hurried downstairs to the 1st floor and outside the house. She watched the man standing beside Tippit as he began to retrace his path up the driveway to the 2nd police car, and then backed up the car into the alley. The 2nd police vehicle quickly and quietly left before witnesses began to arrive at the scene. Sam Guinyard, who worked at the Harris Motor Company, directly south and across the alley from Virginia and Barbara Davis' home (400 E. 10th), apparently saw the 2nd police car. In 1970 Guinyard told JFK researcher Michael Brownlow that he saw a police car in the alley shortly after Tippit was shot.

Mr. B. might take time out from misrepresenting me and busily pointing to banned forum member Greg Parker’s site and at least pretend to be interested in exploring here some element of the Kennedy Assassination that extends beyond his endless outrage about the Harvey and Lee Menace®. People like Greg Parker and Mr. B. have been trying to shut me up for roughly two decades now, and the more names I'm called, the more insults they hurl at me, the more I'm convinced I'm right.

David, here’s what I believe, and I think I *mostly* speak on behalf of John A. here. The American-born LHO killed Tippit and then went to the theater, climbing up the balcony stairs, to lead the police there. (I should say that John is not convinced of this reason. Paul Joliffe believes his job may have been to somehow get the .38 pistol to the other Oswald.) The smaller, Russian-speaking LHO had already been in the theater for at least 15 minutes, where he was seated on the main floor and moved about looking for a contact he was told would be there. We believe that American-born LHO was taken out the back of the theater. Your question about that Oswald worrying about his immediate health is something John and I have talked about several times. John’s answer is that the American-born LHO had a number of immediate family members, at least some of whom had to be in on the original spy game for the “defection.” Their reactions, had he disappeared or been suddenly hit by a bus, would be unpredictable. The Russian-speaking Oswald, on the other hand, had no one at all; just a phony mom who, as the world soon learned, knew very little about her “son.” The Russian-speaking Oswald was totally expendable.

Steve, Your command of DPD documents is really helpful, but you’ll probably agree that we’re not going to find out who deep-sixed the theater patrons list in those pages. I still believe it was Westbrook, who I think was a co-conspirator in both murders that day. Westbrook, who claimed he had to walk several times that afternoon because he didn’t have access to a car, nevertheless happened to be near the Texaco station when the Eisenhower-style jacket was found and said that he “turned the jacket over to one of the officers” but couldn’t remember who; Westbrook just happened to be standing at 10th and Patton with one of the two “Oswald/Hidell” wallets in his hand; Westbrook just happened to be the first cop (or close to it) to arrive at the Texas Theater (his car was parked directly in front of the theater entrance); Westbrook just happened to be in his office when Gerald Hill brought a certain .38 pistol, and on and on. You may well be right about Cunningham, but this sort of thing just strikes me as the sort of things many cops do when they’re trying to cut corners and cover their… patooties. I’m sticking to my belief that Westbrook was all over this thing.

Steve... Ah, I misread your remark above about license plates from the TSBD parking lot. I remembered it as plates from cars by the theater. I've corrected my post that you quoted to remove reference to the plates. It's interesting about Westbrook saying he was "possibly" the senior officer there. I think his testimony is full of untruths, and I still think Westbrook was most likely the guy who "lost" the names of theater patrons. After all, he gave the order to get the names. Wouldn't he be the logical guy to receive what he ordered?

David.... about this, John A. wrote: NOTE: According to Marita, CIA agent Frank Fiorini/Sturgis knew Lee Oswald ("Ozzie") in Florida and, after the assassination, tried repeatedly to link "Lee Harvey Oswald" with Castro. Fiorini/ Sturgis was definitely one of the conspirators. Pressured by her attorney, and possibly threatened with charges of perjury, Marita Lorenz later recanted her testimony regarding the dates she saw Oswald in Florida. But what the HSCA still failed to understand was that Lee Harvey Oswald was never in Florida at any time from 1960-1963. [H&L p. 311] But American-born Lee Harvey Oswald was.

Wow, Mr. B. sure wants to scold me! He is obviously so concerned about the Harvey and Lee Menace® that he comes here to talk about nothing else but the Harvey and Lee Menace®. He thinks the list of theater patrons disappeared because... uh... because police didn’t want us to know George Applin was in the theater? Really? Mr. B. wants us to believe this balcony business is just nuts, but.... Isn’t it amazing that a day after the most famous arrest in the history of Texas Det. L.D. Stringfellow wrote a short report saying “Lee Harvey Oswald was arrested in the balcony of the Texas Theater...”? Isn’t it amazing that the official DPD Homicide Report for J.D. Tippit indicates that “Suspect was later arrested in the balcony of the Texas Theater at 231 W. Jefferson.” Mr. B. wants us to believe that these were just silly mistakes. Mr. B. wants us to believe that the list of theater patrons disappeared for no reason at all and that “Yet another piece of evidence for the 'Harvey and Lee' theory turns out to have a perfectly ordinary explanation.” He is right that I incorrectly indicated that Burroughs said he saw the arrest in the balcony. But he is dead wrong that this most likely has “a perfectly ordinary explanation.” Burroughs and Jack Davis both said one “Oswald” was inside the Texas Theater before 1:15 pm, the time the WC wants us to believe Tippit was shot. And yet Postal and Brewer and the WC told us the second Oswald didn’t enter the theater until after 1:30 pm. The “perfectly ordinary explanation” is that there were two people, with two wallets, sharing the identity of “Lee Harvey Oswald.” One "Oswald/Hidell" wallet appeared in Westbrook's hands at 10th and Patton, and the other "Oswald/Hidell" wallet was taken from "Oswald" in the police car. All this, according to Mr. B, has "a perfectly ordinary explanation." The real problem, according to Mr. B., is not with the evidence in this case, but simply with the Harvey and Lee Menace®!

Joe, Marita Lorenz was hardly the only person who saw LEE Harvey Oswald in the U.S. at the very same time Lee HARVEY Oswald was in Russia. For example, the famous Bolton Ford incident occurred during this exact period, and there is much more. See: Harvey in Russia... Lee in the USA

In a thread about Marita Lorenz, Douglas Caddy posted the following: From the lengthy Village Voice article beginning half way down the first column: “Late on Monday evening, Paul Meskill introduced Marita [Lorenz] to a couple of detectives from police intelligence, James Rothstein and Matthew Rosenthal. The four of them had some drinks at a bar on 43rd Street. Since May, Rothstein and Rosenthal had been assigned to the New York Senate Select Committee on Crime, which was conducting a massive investigation in to pornography. Marita was supposed to give the detectives information concerning child prostitution; she also told them that Frank Sturgis had threatened to kill her. They accompanied her back to 88th street and arrested Frank Sturgis when he turned up at her apartment around 11 o’clock.” https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1299&dat=19771121&id=_ABOAAAAIBAJ&sjid=94sDAAAAIBAJ&pg=6366,3812556 I think, but of course can't prove, that Sturgis was probably involved in any number of these suspicious deaths.