Jim Hargrove

Oh fer cryin' out loud. The truthiness here is absolutely Trumpian! Not only did Marina clearly not know how to hold or aim the Imperial Reflex camera---the camera wasn't even Oswald's. The camera wasn't even in the possession of the authorities until it was turned over to the FBI on February 24, 1964 by Robert Oswald, who said he got the camera from (what a surprise!) Ruth Paine. She sure was helpful!

Does anyone else here believe Marina would have really forgotten the use of that odd Imperial Reflex camera?

Hogwash! The Imperial Reflex was a view camera, meaning you had to hold it at roughly waist level and look down into the large, rectangular view finder to see the subject. Even then, the view was an inverted mirror image. Pretty unforgettable, but Marina testified she held it up to her eye. If I took a picture with that weird camera of my wife with a pistol and holding a rifle and commie literature, I’d remember the camera. And so would you in a similar situation.

Not me! And from her HSCA testimony, it is painfully obvious that Marina didn't have the slightest idea how to use the Im­perial Reflex camera that supposedly took the backyard photos.

I can’t wait to read American Values. It is next on my reading list. Thanks to Jim Di for making available on kennedysandking.com Edward Curtin’s fine review of it. I’ve been convinced for decades that the war between the Kennedy administration and the CIA resulted directly in JFK’s death. My guess is that the same formula resulted in RFK’s death. The truth has always been right in front of our faces, even as the NY Times columnist sought to minimize it.

Some people believe that, as part of his spy training, he secretly took Russian at the U.S. Army's Monterey School of languages. However, official USMC records, as well as recollections of his Marine associates, indicate he was not based near Monterey nor did he ever have time for such extensive training there. My belief is that the man killed by Jack Ruby was a native Russian speaker. See: https://harveyandlee.net/Russian.html

From De Mohrenschildt's manuscript "I Am a patsy! I am a Patsy!"

It would be nice to find the article from the June 9, 1962 Washington Post, as mentioned in the HTLINGUAL intercept description, but I don't think there is a free Wash Post archive available online. Also, concerning the U.S. National Seal watermark Mr. Pope expects to see on documents such as this, would such things be observable on b&w copies? John Armstrong reports that the overwhelming majority of "Oswald" documents he examined at College Park were b&w copies, not originals.

No problem, Michael. Thank you for focusing on this once secret memo. I've loaded up p. 19 of the doc you found to my web server, highlighted in yellow the parts I found most interesting, and have reproduced it below. I think this document shows that the CIA wanted to put 874 of its agents into U.S. military positions in FY 1967. Do you read it differently?

That's interesting, Michael, and the cross-fertilization seemed to go both ways. Note the part I've put in red from the infamous piece by Richard Starnes (it prompted the even more infamous CIA defense in the NYT by Arthur Krock): -------------------------------------------------- The Washington Daily News, Wednesday, October 2, 1963, p.3 'SPOOKS' MAKE LIFE MISERABLE FOR AMBASSADOR LODGE 'Arrogant' CIA Disobeys Orders in Viet Nam By Richard T. Starnes SAIGON, Oct.2 - The story of the Central Intelligence Agency's role in South Viet Nam is a dismal chronicle of bureaucratic arrogance, obstinate disregard of orders, and unrestrained thirst for power. Twice the CIA flatly refused to carry out instructions from Ambassador Henry Cabot Lodge, according to a high United States source here. In one of these instances the CIA frustrated a plan of action Mr. Lodge brought with him from Washington because the agency disagreed with it. This led to a dramatic confrontation between Mr. Lodge and John Richardson, chief of the huge CIA apparatus here. Mr. Lodge failed to move Mr. Richardson, and the dispute was bucked back to Washington. Secretary of State Dean Rusk and CIA Chief John A. McCone were unable to resolve the conflict, and the matter is now reported to be awaiting settlement by President Kennedy. It is one of the developments expected to be covered in Defense Secretary Robert McNamara's report to Mr. Kennedy. Others Critical, Too Other American agencies here are incredibly bitter about the CIA. "If the United States ever experiences a 'Seven Days in May' it will come from the CIA, and not from the Pentagon," one U.S. official commented caustically. ("Seven Days in May" is a fictional account of an attempted military coup to take over the U.S. Government.) CIA "spooks" (a universal term for secret agents here) have penetrated every branch of the American community in Saigon, until non-spook Americans here almost seem to be suffering a CIA psychosis. An American field officer with a distinguished combat career speaks angrily about "that man at headquarters in Saigon wearing a colonel's uniform." He means the man is a CIA agent, and he can't understand what he is doing at U.S. military headquarters here, unless it is spying on other Americans. Another American officer, talking about the CIA, acidly commented: "You'd think they'd have learned something from Cuba but apparently they didn't." Few Know CIA Strength Few people other than Mr. Richardson and his close aides know the actual CIA strength here, but a widely used figure is 600. Many are clandestine agents known only to a few of their fellow spooks. Even Mr. Richardson is a man about whom it is difficult to learn much in Saigon. He is said to be a former OSS officer, and to have served with distinction in the CIA in the Philippines. A surprising number of the spooks are known to be involved in their ghostly trade and some make no secret of it. "There are a number of spooks in the U.S. Information Service, in the U.S. Operations mission, in every aspect of American official and commercial life here, " one official - presumably a non-spook - said. "They represent a tremendous power and total unaccountability to anyone," he added. Coupled with the ubiquitous secret police of Ngo Dinh Nhu, a surfeit of spooks has given Saigon an oppressive police state atmosphere. The Nhu-Richardson relationship is a subject of lively speculation. The CIA continues to pay the special forces which conducted brutal raids on Buddhist temples last Aug. 21, altho in fairness it should be pointed out that the CIA is paying these goons for the war against communist guerillas, not Buddhist bonzes (priests). Hand Over Millions Nevertheless, on the first of every month, the CIA dutifully hands over a quarter million American dollars to pay these special forces. Whatever else it buys, it doesn't buy any solid information on what the special forces are up to. The Aug. 21 raids caught top U.S. officials here and in Washington flat-footed. Nhu ordered the special forces to crush the Buddhist priests, but the CIA wasn't let in on the secret. (Some CIA button men now say they warned their superiors what was coming up, but in any event the warning of harsh repression was never passed to top officials here or in Washington.) Consequently, Washington reacted unsurely to the crisis. Top officials here and at home were outraged at the news the CIA was paying the temple raiders, but the CIA continued the payments. It may not be a direct subsidy for a religious war against the country's Buddhist majority, but it comes close to that. And for every State Department aide here who will tell you, "Dammit, the CIA is supposed to gather information, not make policy, but policy-making is what they're doing here," there are military officers who scream over the way the spooks dabble in military operations. A Typical Example For example, highly trained trail watchers are an important part of the effort to end Viet Cong infiltration from across the Laos and Cambodia borders. But if the trailer watchers spot incoming Viet Congs, they report it to the CIA in Saigon, and in the fullness of time, the spooks may tell the military. One very high American official here, a man who has spent much of his life in the service of democracy, likened the CIA's growth to a malignancy, and added he was not sure even the White House could control it any longer. Unquestionably Mr. McNamara and Gen. Maxwell Taylor both got an earful from people who are beginning to fear the CIA is becoming a Third Force co-equal with President Diem's regime and the U.S. Government - and answerable to neither. There is naturally the highest interest here as to whether Mr. McNamara will persuade Mr. Kennedy something ought to be done about it.

Gene, Why don't you have your friend drop me a note expressing his interests and I'll forward it to John. I'll PM you with an email address I try to stay current with.

Sandy, Oops! That first line of the paragraph above should have read, “On August 21, 1952, prior to the beginning of school, Marguerite sold her house and drove with Lee in her 1948 Dodge to New York City.” John was obviously thinking of the 1948 Dodge when he typed what should have been the year 1952. Thanks for catching the typo. All these details are confusing enough!

Mark, More interesting, I think, are Ruby's ties to the CIA. The fact that he ran guns to Cuba could hardly have gone unnoticed by the CIA, and yet, unlike other runners, Ruby was never prosecuted. Even more intriguing are his potential ties to David Atlee Phillips via their mutual friend, KLIF's Gordon McLendon. Please see this post ("Who Ordered Oswald's Death?"):

Joe, See: https://harveyandlee.net/Comrade/Comrade_boy.htm

You really should try to understand the book you work so hard to debunk. I thought you had read it! From the excerpt I alreay posted, "But if Lee Oswald and his mother had remained in Fort Worth in the fall of 1952, Lee would have transferred to nearby Monnig Junior High, not Stripling," let's go on with page 96 from H&L to see how John answered your objections more than 15 year ago. On August 21, 1948, prior to the beginning of school, Marguerite sold her house and drove with Lee in her 1948 Dodge to New York City. Two months later Robert Oswald visited his mother and brother in New York, shortly after Lee entered the 7th grade.34 Robert again visited Lee and Marguerite in New York in the summer of 1953, when Lee was between the 7th and 8th grades at PS #44.35 Robert's visits to New York make it nearly impossible to believe that he could have assumed his younger brother attended Stripling in the 7th grade. After Robert was discharged from the Marines, in July 1955, he briefly resided with Lee and Marguerite at their apartment on Exchange Place in New Orleans. Lee had recently graduated from the 9th grade at Beauregard Junior High and, according to Robert, was working for an export firm. If anyone knew where Lee Harvey Oswald at­ tended all of his junior high school years, it was Robert Oswald. So why would Robert tell reporters in 1959 and 1962, and tell the Warren Commission in 1964, that his "brother" had attended Stripling? Because Robert was telling the Commission about his limited knowledge of Harvey Oswald's background. [H&L, p.96]

From Harvey and Lee: I considered the possibility that Robert assumed that his brother entered Stripling after finishing elementary school, because this was the same school he (Robert) attended in the fall of 1948. But if Lee Oswald and his mother had remained in Fort Worth in the fall of 1952, Lee would have transferred to nearby Monnig Junior High, not Stripling. [H&L, p. 94] Now please address ALL the evidence for Stripling School, not just one element at a time. How many people are lying?

Oh for crying out loud! Mr. Parnell is desperate to discredit Oswald’s attendance at Stripling School because it is obviously impossible for one Oswald to have attended there and to have the school records published by the Warren Commission. So he not only claims assistant principal Frank Kudlaty was lying about giving LHO’s records to the FBI, but that Jack White put him up to it! And Mr. Parnell ignores all the other evidence supporting Mr. Kudlaty’s claim. For example, on two occasions, once in 1959 and again in 1962, Robert Oswald told newspaper reporters that his younger brother attended Stripling School. This is from the June 8, 1962 Fort Worth Star-Telegram. Read the last paragraph. Stripling assistant principal Frank Kudlaty in 1963 met FBI agent at the school and gave them “Lee Harvey Oswald’s” Stripling records. Those records also all disappeared. Mr. Kudlaty's YouTube interview is here. In 1959 a Fort Worth newspaper also said that LHO attended Stripling. See that article here. Robert Oswald testified to the Warren Commission that his “brother” attended Stripling. Harvey Oswald’s classmate Fran Schubert said she attended Stripling with Oswald and watched him walk home from Stripling to his house at 2220 Thomas Place. See Fran's YouTube interview with John here. In the 1990s, Stripling School principal Ricardo Galindo told John that it was “common knowledge” that “Lee Harvey Oswald” attended Stripling. Not one “researcher” here has made an effort to contact Galindo to see if he is still alive and if he would repeat his claim. John also spoke to local student Bobby Pitts, who remembered that Oswald attended Stripling with his younger brother and that he (Bobby) remembered seeing (Harvey) Oswald standing on the porch at 2220 Thomas Place, directly across the street from Stripling. John also spoke with former Stripling student Doug Gann, who attended ninth grade at Stripling with Harvey and remembered that he live “across the street from the basketball courts and one or two houses to the left,” which exactly describes 2220 Thomas Place, where “Marguerite Oswald” lived at the time of the assassination of JFK. H&L critics have not one bit of interest in any of these witnesses. They just want to describe them as liars. H&L critics have no explanation why a Forth Worth Star-Telegram article from November 2017 would indicate that Oswald’s “teachers and classmates remember him at Stripling, though there is no official record.” Read the article here. The H&L critics are forced to say that all the witnesses above are lying or just wrong, because the critics know that, according to the official timeline of the Warren Commission, "Lee Harvey Oswald" could not have attended Stripling School. Either all this evidence is invented, or there were two Lee Harvey Oswalds. Really, Mr. Parnell. I can't stop you from besmirching the memory of the late Jack White for your own personal reasons, but you might have the decency to acknowledge all the other evidence for Oswald's attendance at Stripling School while you're doing so.

All the H&L deniers can do is to say people like Veciana, whose statements clearly indicate there was more than one LHO, are lying, along with witnesses such as Dr. Milton Kurian, Allen Felde, Linda Faircloth, Marita Lorenz, Frank Kudlaty, Fran Schubert, Aletha Frair, Laura Kittrell, Ralph Leon Yates, Fred Moore, half the residents of Alice, Texas and vicintiy, and many others I'm undoubtedly forgetting. These people are not making mere "mistakes;" their statements are far too detailed and elaborate. Perhaps Jack White can be blamed for all of them. There is another long list of witnesses who have to be seriously mistaken.

Here's why W. Tracy HATES Veciana.... Way back in 1977, Mr. Veciana testified that, "the person who travelled to Mexico City and visited the Cuban Embassy was not Lee Harvey Oswald, but was in fact a man disguised as Oswald. He was his double, from that time on Oswald was being framed as the Castro agent." Below are excerpts of Mr. Veciana's statements....

To Mark Lawson…. Sorry about not responding to your email. I get scores of notes (many of them spam) to that address just about every day and simply can’t read—let alone respond—to many other than those from people I know. I had hoped that putting the address in tiny type would spare me the spam, but I was clearly mistaken about that, and it takes more time than I have available to separate the wheat from the chaff. We’ve debated here for years about whether there were one, two, or even more “Lee Harvey Oswalds.” For the time begin, I’m happy to let the evidence presented on my website speak for itself. John has been asking me to put some stuff up on a FB group, and between that and H&L website updates my additional free time is pretty limited. Regardless of what anyone thinks about multiple Oswalds, there is also the issue of what CIA accountant James Wilcott called the CIA’s “Oswald project.” To my mind, “Oswald’s” intel connections were obvious from the beginning. Isn’t it amazing that a so-called troubled “loner” with no particular political connections to anyone would have a gazillion pages of documents about him declared secret for national security reasons? I’m not aware of any dead links on my website. If you have found some, I’d appreciate hearing about them. Please feel free to respond here or, if you’d prefer to communicate privately, I’ll try to watch for your name at my gmail address. Thanks again for your interest.

Jefferson's Morley's take-down of Mr. Parnell's latest effort is here: http://jfkfacts.org/two-different-views-antonio-veciana/

Hi, Mark, In my opinion, none of our opinions matter. They just don't. All that matters is the evidence! John is continuing to post documented write-ups which include the evidence. His most recent essay, just two or three days old, is here: https://harveyandlee.net/Merging_2_Lives/H&L_Merged.html

To Steve and Paul, I’m shocked, SHOCKED that we can so easily assemble such disparate evidence both for and against the existence of the 488th MI Detachment headed by Col. Crichton. After all, what element of American history is clearer more than half a century after it unfolded than the assassination of JFK? Two explanations that occur to me are: Jack Crichton felt his resume was a bit thin and invented the 488th out of whole cloth and was able to plant a few factoids in the print media. The 488th MI Detachment was instrumental in killing JFK, or in overthrowing any number of foreign governments, or something else equally unpleasant, and therefore had to be erased from American history. Is there an easier-to-believe explanation?

According to Google Books, vol 14 of Army Reserve magazine includes the following caption: LEGION OF MERIT is presented to Colonel Jack A. Crichton, CO, 488th MI Det (Strat), Dallas, Tex., by Colonel Robert D. Offer, CO, VII Corps, Houston, Tex., upon Col. Crichton’s recent retirement. See: https://books.google.com/books?id=cW3UxFbBfScC&dq="legion+of+merit"+jack+crichton&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=jack+crichton Edit: Also, indicating that it is reproducing the following article: Dallas Morning News, The (TX), December 15, 2007, Author: JOE SENNACHERIB, Page 13B; the Find A Grave entry on “John Alston ‘Jack’ Crichton” states as follows: In December 1967, he retired from the Army Reserve after serving for 30 years. He received the Legion of Merit for his service, which included organizing the 488th Military Intelligence Detachment reserve unit in 1956. See: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/116536208/john-alston-crichton

Thank you James.... Despite the detractors, to me this is the public forum most dedicated to the truth about JFK's assassination. I'd hate to be banned from it.