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Michael Clark

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    1963, Heroin, Cocaine, and the assassination

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted · Edited by Michael Clark

    Members,

    Another thread was getting off-topic, so I thought I would open this one.

    I am expecting that a research paper from another member will show up here.

    Cheers,

    Michael

    ••••edit.... I'm just dropping this off here so I don't have to bump the thread:

    ****edit.. dropping another link

    Edit**** dropping another link so I don't have to bump this thread

     

    http://www.madcowprod.com/2014/08/19/the-cia-double-dip-drugs-financial-fraud-in-st-petersburg/

    Does Lifton's Best Evidence indicate that the coverup and the crime were committed by the same people?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    4 minutes ago, Cliff Varnell said:

    Michael, would could possibly be more efficient than a smuggling operation only 90 miles from the US mainland?

     

     

    4 minutes ago, Cliff Varnell said:

    Michael, would could possibly be more efficient than a smuggling operation only 90 miles from the US mainland?

     

    Cliff, ships and planes were, and increasingly would, run amuck from then-on. That short hop was and would become increasingly less valuable and increasingly more visible and obvious. 

    And I repeat myself, our players had no interest in bringing dark, Spanish-Speaking catholic folk, 90 miles away, into the heart of the nascent new world order. They had an even far greater interest in keeping the Mafia from having control of it all, and them.

    So, no, I don't think that the fear of a nuclear war kept us from invading Cuba. I believe they had all the cards to make that happen, while possibly risking the loss of Berlin. 

    90 miles didn't mean much then when a ton of cocaine or heroin could fit in, I don't know what, but it couldn't take up that much space.

    Cheers,

    Michael

    Does Lifton's Best Evidence indicate that the coverup and the crime were committed by the same people?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Cliff Varnell said:

    His dad worked for Brown Brothers Harriman bank, with lots of Harriman money invested in Zapata.

    Here's an intrigung take on "Kingslayer" W. Averell Harriman:

    Joseph Trento, The Secret History of the CIA, pgs 334-5:

     

    <quote on, emphasis added>

     

    Who changed the coup into the murder of Diem, Nhu and a Catholic priest accompanying them? To this day, nothing has been found in government archives tying the killings to either John or Robert Kennedy. So how did the tools and talents developed by Bill Harvey for ZR/RIFLE and Operation MONGOOSE get exported to Vietnam? Kennedy immediately ordered (William R.) Corson to find out what had happened and who was responsible. The answer he came up with: “On instructions from Averell Harriman…. The orders that ended in the deaths of Diem and his brother originated with Harriman and were carried out by Henry Cabot Lodge’s own military assistant.”

     

    Having served as ambassador to Moscow and governor of New York, W. Averell Harriman was in the middle of a long public career. In 1960, President-elect Kennedy appointed him ambassador-at-large, to operate “with the full confidence of the president and an intimate knowledge of all aspects of United States policy.” By 1963, according to Corson, Harriman was running “Vietnam without consulting the president or the attorney general.”

     

    The president had begun to suspect that not everyone on his national security team was loyal. As Corson put it, “Kenny O’Donnell (JFK’s appointments secretary) was convinced that McGeorge Bundy, the national security advisor, was taking orders from Ambassador Averell Harriman and not the president. He was especially worried about Michael Forrestal, a young man on the White House staff who handled liaison on Vietnam with Harriman.”

     

    At the heart of the murders was the sudden and strange recall of Sagon Station Chief Jocko Richardson and his replacement by a no-name team barely known to history. The key member was a Special Operations Army officer, John Michael Dunn, who took his orders, not from the normal CIA hierarchy but from Harriman and Forrestal.

     

    According to Corson, “John Michael Dunn was known to be in touch with the coup plotters,” although Dunn’s role has never been made public. Corson believes that Richardson was removed so that Dunn, assigned to Ambassador Lodge for “special operations,” could act without hindrance.

     

    <quote off>

     

    Thanks again Cliff, that's as deep and dark as it gets. The General gist has not been lost on me. Also, I am very much enjoying our digression; yet it is a digression. I would be glad to follow this to another thread.

    That said, I don't think that maintaining a Cuba-vectored throughofare for drugs was important, nor desirable, to the 11-22-63 hit. Alternatives to that thoroughfare could be more transient, discreet and efficient. Alternate vectors could cut-out the Mafia. Also, a banana Republic style system of slavery would be too apparent in Cuba. So I think Cuba was sacrificed, in fifty years of darkness, to the alternatives for such interests.

    Cheers,

    Michael

    Does Lifton's Best Evidence indicate that the coverup and the crime were committed by the same people?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    Just now, Cliff Varnell said:

    Hi Michael -- Meyer Lansky developed pre-Castro Cuba as the center of international narcotics trafficking.  Under Castro it was a boutique operation -- far from a "hub.".  He forced the Sicilian/American Mafia to move their operations to the Dominican Republic and the Bahamas. 

    Only 90 miles from the American mainland, Cuba was the ideal location for drug smuggling.

    For the Skull & Bones crew it wasn't just the black money they derived from heroin -- it was social control, a holocaust by another means in American inner cities.

    Who do you define as "the winners"?

    Thanks Cliff, there's a lot to unwrap in what you have posted. I'll dig in.

    By "winners" I am referring to one of my two factions in my working theory of a Far-Right/Industrial faction double-crossing an Anti-Castro Cuban/Mob faction. The Anti-Castro Cuban/Mob faction lost; They didn't get Cuba, the Casino's or their old drug-hub back.

    Cheers,

    Michael

    Did a Far-Right/Industrial faction double-cross a Mob/Anti-Castro faction?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    On 4/5/2017 at 3:59 PM, Roger DeLaria said:

    Sounds very interesting. The Cubans and Mafia get told a fairy tale(much as I believe Oswald was also told a fairytale) ensuring their willing participation), neither knowing what would really unfold, and getting double crossed. It's not like they would have anyone to turn to. Hmmm....

    Yup, they would have been told: "whatchagonnadoaboutit?", or, "we'll get to the Cuba thing after Vietnam".

    Did a Far-Right/Industrial faction double-cross a Mob/Anti-Castro faction?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted · Edited by Michael Clark

    I'll be adding points to this thread in support of my theory.

    -My theory explains the Mexico City shenanigans.

    ----- Why go through the trouble of building an LHO trail to Mexico City and then discredit, obfuscate, abandon or not use it?

    The Mexico City caper served to bolster confidence in the Cuban conspirators that LHO would turn-up, probably dead, at Dealy Plaza as part of a pro-Castro, Communist conspiracy, that would ignite the Cuba war.

    When the evidence of MC actually turned-up, it wasn't Oswald, the pictures were of a blonde-guy. If LHO had made his way to MC at any time, and got in front of cameras, pictures of him could be used If necessary. As it turned-out, the double-cross plan got the green light, and no photos of Lee at the consulates were produced.

    Cheers,

    Mike

    Does Lifton's Best Evidence indicate that the coverup and the crime were committed by the same people?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    1 minute ago, Cliff Varnell said:

    The casinos in Havana were fronts for dope smuggling and money-laundering.

    Are you sure there was no faction of "industrialists" who didn't have keen interest in those activities?

    Hi Cliff, while searching this issue, I have seen your posts regarding the drug trade as it related to my working pet-theory. I am thinking that the Far-Right and Indurial and oil concerns were not interested in the drug trade angle at that time. I think that the Mafia got left in the cold on that.

    I assume you have a solid basis for your assertion that Castro's Cuba was a drug hub. I find that surprising. To be sure, I have not yet delved into that being a possibility. It seems to me that drug hubs can, and probably should be shifted around. My limited knowledge tells me that those hubs did, over the next decades, shift around, quite a bit (Montreal, Arkansas?). 

    So, no I think that if the drug angle did have a play in the decision making, the results would testify that the winners were glad to see a drug-hub develop somewhere other than Cuba.

    Cheers,

    Michael

    Does Lifton's Best Evidence indicate that the coverup and the crime were committed by the same people?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    10 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:


    Now that's an interesting theory. I'd love to hear of any evidence pointing to that.

    Though the Mexico City thing makes me think that the perps were interested primarily in war (with Russia) in Cuba. Not Vietnam.

     

    Yes, the anti-Castro Cubans wanted a war to free Cuba, The Far-Right and Industrialists wanted war in Vietnam. The Far-Right and Industrialists had no interest in being cosy with dark, Spanish-Speaking, Catholic Cubans, nor were they interested in giving off-shore resorts and Casinos back to the mob, so The AC Cubans and mob got double-crossed with the LN scenario. 

    It can explain why evidence for LHO in MC was generated, but obfuscated, buried and confused, after the fact.

    But, I am repeating myself here. I have opened another thread on this.

    Cheers,

    Michael

    Does Lifton's Best Evidence indicate that the coverup and the crime were committed by the same people?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    Just now, Sandy Larsen said:


    Now that's an interesting theory. I'd love to hear of any evidence pointing to that.

    Though the Mexico City thing makes me think that the perps were interested primarily in war (with Russia) in Cuba. Not Vietnam.

     

    Sandy, the way that this is unfolding for me is not so much that the evidence is pointing me to the theory, but the theory is making more sense of the evidence. 

    I have a list of supporting circumstances but I am much more interested in seeing if others pick-up the same nuggets that I am finding, or find other nuggets that I have not found yet myself.

    Cheers,

    Michael

    Does Lifton's Best Evidence indicate that the coverup and the crime were committed by the same people?

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    2 minutes ago, Ron Ecker said:

     .....The theory in this case being Operation Northwoods Revised Edition, with a decision then made not to blame Cuba, making the long sheep-dipping of Oswald a waste of time, for reasons that can be debated, though a crucial factor would be Oswald being captured.......

    Agreed. My working theory is that a the Dealy Plaza tactical group were Anti-Castro Cubans who were sheep-dipped and credentialed as Communist Cubans. An unveiled Communist Conspiracy would lead to a Cuban invasion. The Cubans were double-crossed by right wing industrial interests who wanted the Vietnam War, 10,000 miles away, with no risk of a nuclear war.

     

    The Discharge Of Lee Harvey Oswald And Other Related Issues

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    6 minutes ago, Ray Mitcham said:

    Michael, this was posted several years ago on this forum, by Malcolm Ward

    Re Tidy Laundromat.

    I believe the Penningtons saw Oswald at the Tidy Lady Laundromat

    in the 12:50's before one o'clock. Most people will only accept a one

    Oswald involvment and will forced to choose between the modes of potential

    transporation. It fits well with me with two Oswalds, in all the modes of

    transportation, with one setting the other one up...then, and the days and

    weeks prior which are so well documented.

    Source:

    http://groups.google...a0abee?lnk=raot

    The Tidy Lady Laundromat was located on Davis Street as well.

    Source:

    http://www.jfkassass...p?topic=5830.24

    The light-colored Rambler station wagon that was seen with someone who was practically a double for Lee Harvey Oswald passed under the triple-underpass at 12:40 P.M.

    A few blocks beyond that overpass is the Commerce Street Viaduct, leading directly into Oak Cliff. It is practically certain that after the Rambler with an unknown driver and a “Oswald impostor” left the Depository it crossed the viaduct, and after turning left on Sylvan Street drove 12 blocks further going south on Davis St. Three blocks away was the Tidy Lady Launderette. The drive from the Texas School Book Depository, would have taken 7 or 8 minutes. It is at the launderette where the car stopped. It would have been within a minute or so of 12:47 P.M.

    The Tidy Lady (1227 Davis) was at the corner of Davis St and North Clinton St. There were only two people in the laundromat, at that time John Wesley and Oda Pennington. The car with the two fugitives parked on the east side of North Clinton St., by the side door of the laundromat. The young man who exited the car passed the laundromat and then turned around and entered, making a beeline towards the payphone. A brief pause and the Pennington’s heard the caller speaking in Spanish, in the FBI report, the Pennington’s felt that the man acted as if he was in trouble, under the circumstances, the Pennington’s were no doubt, accurate in their were perception. What happened to the driver is not certain but he may have left the scene as soon as he parked the car, which is what the Oswald impostor did as soon as he finished his call. He was last seen walking South on North Clinton St.

    The car had been abandoned. When the couple were shown a photograph of Lee Harvey Oswald, they said he “appeared” to be the same person.

    Just as compelling is how close the laudromat was to Jefferson Street, the location of the Texas Theater, and on the other side of Jefferson St. in the distance was the apartment of Jack Ruby. The Tidy Lady Lauderette on Clinton Street was only five blocks south away from Jefferson Street.

    paraphrased from pages 831-832 Harvey and Lee - John Armstrong

    So if you are trying to ascertain if another person was "in play" on Jefferson Street besides Lee Oswald, this scenario definitely seems pertinent. End of account. Yes....End of story? Definitely not.

    There was also a Clarence Otis Pennington in W. Virginia who was interviewed by the FBI, at this point it is not known whether the individual Oda Pennington was related to Clarence Pennington. However there is a very sophisticated genealogy website and Family organization named Pennington Research Association, that almost without question makes mention of an C.O. Pennigton and “his wife Ida!”......If you surmised that the Pennington’s are interesting you would be right....

    Source:

    http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=3128&st=150

     

     

    Thanks Ray, interesting read. 

    The Discharge Of Lee Harvey Oswald And Other Related Issues

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    4 minutes ago, Alistair Briggs said:

    I'm sure I have come across such photos but can't find them now...

    Anyway,

    In terms of what he saw on that day I too think he was telling the truth...

    as mentioned in Jim Marrs Crossfire:

    and, as you know, as mentioned in JFK and the Unspeakable, his story is also corroborated (to varying degrees) by Richard Randolph Carr, Helen Forrest, James Pennington and Roy Carr. Taking all that in to account then I think it does become clear that when Roger Craig said he saw someone run away from the TSBD and get in to a car he was indeed telling the truth...

    ... was it Oswald though (some people might think it was the Oswald, or maybe just an Oswald), as far as I'm concerned though it could just as easily be some random person. The question I ask myself is 'does it make sense' and I can't think of any reasonable reason for 'Oswald' to be making such an 'escape' at that time - if anyone can offer up an explanation at all that would be appreciated.

    Regards

    I am convinced that Craig wished that he was in Antarctica with Fletcher Prouty that week. I don't see him falsely interjecting himself in anything at all.

    Cheers,

    Michael

    A Couple of Real Gems from the "Harvey and Lee" Website

    in JFK Assassination Debate

    Posted

    1 minute ago, Jim Hargrove said:

    It’s just a guess, but since that Russian letter tended to make LHO look guilty for the Walker shooting, it might have been shown early, especially since Hoover knew the bullet evidence was bogus.  I was always suspicious of that letter, but there is a lot of other Russian-language stuff allegedly from Oswald in evidence.  It just doesn’t seem likely to me that Harvey Oswald would have learned that much by reading a Russian dictionary in his USMC spare time and spending 2-1/2 years working full-time in a Minsk factory.

    De Mohrenschildt said Oswald preferred Russian to English and read Russian classics in the original Russian.  Hell, I had a hard time getting through War and Peace in English!

    Thanks Jim, After putting my handwriting analysis hat on top of my Russian penmanship hat, (I felt kind of silly), I concluded that LHO did not write CE 1.

    Cheers,

    Michael

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