Rick McTague

DVP, If it hasn't been said before, thank you for your efforts and expense in archiving so much JFK-related media. It sure is valuable. Thanks

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Adam, Thanks much for the reply. Maybe I'll have to listen to it again, but I recall in the podcast, Mr. Horne says that HL Hunt's copy was a third generation one from the extant film generated at Hawkeyeworks, not from the camera original. However, if he got that copy on 11/22, it would obviously be from a Dallas copy of the camera original. It seems like everything about this case, from the films, to the medical evidence, to the evidence around LHO, appeared one way in Dallas and a completely different way once it hit DC. Those additional hobnobs' viewing would be interesting to explore; Mr. Horne says he knows of just a few, one of which is Greg Burnham (sp?) who have seen the "other" Z film. He didn't mention those others in Dallas. Thanks

Right between the painted yellow marks on the curb of Elm street, right at the place where the Umbrella Man pumps his umbrella up and down, right where DCM pumps his fist. These actions and that stretch of Elm were, in my opinion, planned in advance, for triangulation of fire. Thanks

MWN Episode 107 – Douglas Horne on the Zapruder Film Alteration Debate While much of this has been discussed in available films (such as "The Zapruder Film Mystery"), it is very refreshing to hear from Mr. Horne fresh and new this year. He describes some of the reasons for his absence from the research community lately, and offers a very cogent discussion of the providence of the Zapruder film. The timeline: Zapruder had (3) unslit 16mm contact copies made on 11/22/63 from the camera original, at Jameson in Dallas, (4) total first day 16 mm films. He had the original and the (3) copies developed / slit by Kodak in Dallas in 8mm format. He gave (2) of the (3) 8mm slip copies to the SS in Dallas as a loan: Max Phillips put one of these copies on a plane immediately to Washington, DC, arriving 11/23, before 3:00 am. He gave one of these 8mm copies to the FBI on 11/23; they flew it to BWI airport in Baltimore, DeLoach (#3 in the FBI) examines this after midnight, early on Sunday 11/24. (NOTE: DeLoach says JFK's head moves violently FORWARD from this viewing). Zapruder showed his family the 8mm film (either the original or the remaining copy) Saturday 11/23 morning. Zapruder also showed Dick Stolley at Life and the SS the camera original 8mm film Saturday 11/23 morning in his office in Dal-Tex. Zapruder negotiated a (1) week loan of the 8mm camera original to Life for $50,000.00 for print rights on Saturday 11/23. He still has the one remaining copy. Stolley from Life sent the camera original to Chicago on Saturday 11/23. Zapruder shows several people his remaining 8mm copy to Dan Rather and others in Dallas, on Saturday 11/23. (NOTE: Rather says JFK's head moves violently FORWARD from this viewing). Dino Brugioni at NPIC got the camera original, slit 8mm film Saturday night 11/23 from two SS agents to make briefing boards from 12-14 stills. These boards no longer exist. Homer McMahon at NPIC in DC received from one SS agent, Bill Smith, an unslit 16mm film Sunday night 11/24 to make (3) briefing boards from 28 stills. Smith says this is the camera original (lie #1), developed at Hawkeyeworks in Rochester, NY (lie #2). One set of these briefing boards exist today; it is not the one Dino B made, with completely different images, content and format. These briefing boards match the extant film that is available today. From this timeline, it is evident that the extant Zapruder film available today is not the same film as the camera original. Who: Kodak, with the CIA. Where: Hawkeyeworks in Rochester, NY When: During the day Sunday 11/24 Thanks

Jim, But wasn't Prayer Man filmed on the front entrance to WTC 7? 😎

David, Isn't it ironic that this newspaper clipping includes an announcement about GHWB's Zapata company selling shares of another company in the lower right corner? Thanks

John, I am firmly convinced that this is the reason the press bus, with the army of professional photographers in it, was placed so far back in the Dallas motorcade. In other motorcades, it was placed in front of the presidential limo to get the best view and shots of the president. In Dallas, it was placed significantly further back to prevent nice, clear, detailed imagery that could be studied. All we are left with is amateur imagery, with few exceptions (such as Ike Altgens). You do bring up a good point: any evidence in the assassination that contradicts the WC findings (such as altered photographs, testimony, what the Parkland medical staff saw compared to the x-rays and autopsy photos, etc.) is to be ridiculed and explained away by people being "mistaken" or just plain lying. Thanks

And Kellerman said that he heard JFK say "My God I'm hit!" - which could not have been the throat shot, had to have been the shallow shot to his back. He could not have said this if these were caused by the magic bullet. The WC and it's apologists expect us to disregard every piece of evidence that runs counter to it's conclusions. Much like the Parkland nurses and doctors, I am more inclined to believe "day of" testimony by those who were there. Any thoughts on the multiple ammo types and how they fit in? Thanks

Joe, As always, I appreciate your logic and reason in your posts and replies here as we look at the evidence and draw conclusions. In addition to the complexity of the shots which you accurately describe here, I might also add the uncanny ability of LHO to partially load the 6-shot capacity MC clip with only 4 rounds of mixed type in the exact right order: #1: Full metal jacket round that missed and caused the wound to James Tague #2:The so-called magic bullet being of the full metal jacket variety that penetrates and keeps on going (see CE399) #3: The frangible / soft-nosed round that caused the head wound with the cloud of tiny lead fragments seen in x-rays #4: FMJ round left in the rifle There just isn't a logical explanation for how anyone could make those shots with those mixed ammunition types from that window in those conditions - with the added complexities that you point out - with that rifle. No one I know who uses firearms loads a magazine / clip with mixed purpose ammunition. I'm not even sure that frangible / soft-nosed ammunition was available then for the MC. There is also the related duality of ammunition types / manufacturers in the Tippet murder. Thanks

Francois, It was more than conjecture, he was stating his observations, the day of the event. Of course they didn't do an autopsy. They stated what they saw, but it was with years of experience which is why I tend to believe him on that day - there was no official story that needed to be adhered to. The WC conjectured that the neck would was one of exit when they invented the SBT out of whole cloth; they hardly "established" it, AND YOU KNOW IT. And you can keep your lame little dig at me about not being honest. You don't know me and I take offense at your implication. This is one forum where, for the most part, people can debate the issues without getting personal and nasty. Of course there are exceptions ... I for one will refrain.

Francois, Dr. Perry did not agree with the official conclusion on the day of the assassination when he told reporters at the press conference three times that the wound in his throat was one of entrance. If anyone is qualified to make that judgment, he would since he had seen hundreds of gunshot wounds. Obviously, he made a radical change after the "official conclusions" were released; he had "help" arriving at that change by a secret service agent, whose name escapes me now. I now await your reply that he was "mistaken" like the other Parkland witnesses who described the back of the head wound and did not describe the red/orange/white blob/flap as shown in the Z film. Thanks

Mr. Von Pein, To carry your 3rd option to it's logical conclusion, not only were they all mistaken that they didn't see the large wound in the back of the head, but they were all mistaken when none of them reported seeing the wound as shown in the Zapruder film, correct? None of them said they saw the huge red/orange/white blob/flap as shown in the Z film, in addition to being mistaken about the wound in the back of the head? So they were doubly mistaken, is that your position? Thanks

Jake, Welcome as a new member to the forum! I've found even with the back and forth debate, the EF is not as far down in the gutter as other forums are as related to personal attacks, etc. We can disagree here without being disagreeable. I'm curious, how do you reconcile what is seen on the Z film, the giant red/orange/white blob-flap above the right ear and temple, and the complete absence of that wound at Parkland? Thanks

Jim, To take this to the conclusion, David Ferrie (like so many other key witnesses and others in this case) was suicided and shut up forever. Quite curious in two murders that were supposedly committed by a lone nut on a spontaneous whim for personal glory. Why the eliminations? Why the forced signatures to agreements of secrecy for those who witnessed the autopsy if it was so open and shut? Why did GDM off himself the day he was going to be interviewed by Gaeton Fonzi if LHO acted alone? Thanks

Interesting that he claims (around 11:00 in) that Mr. Zapruder started filming while the limo was on Houston, kept on filming, then stopped to rewind the camera, then resumed filming which is an explanation for the limo jumping down Elm in the extant version today. I hadn't heard that before, I think Mr. Zapruder said that once he began filming, he didn't stop. Groden says a full wind would last for 30-40 seconds, which seems like a short amount of time, to have to stop every 40 seconds to rewind the camera. In addition, it was not 30-40 seconds from when he started filming while the limo is on Houston until the film stops after it goes into the triple underpass, more like 20 seconds I'd guess. My folks had an 8mm camera that captured our old home movies, and they didn't have to stop every 30-40 seconds to rewind the thing, those movies are continuous. I'm not sure where he gets the evidence for the camera winding, maybe others have heard that? I've assumed that someone (as described by Doug Horne and others) altered the film, removing inconvenient / anti-WC frames which includes whatever the original showed during the turn from Houston onto Elm - the limo almost hitting the concrete median on the annex street in front of the TSBD. Thanks

Joe, Throughout this book, he goes into an incredible level of medical detail on the wounds and medical evidence, to the point of needing a medical terminology specialist to interpret many passages. This isn't a criticism, just my perception. Having said that, it was very interesting about the difficulty he had in infusing the brain they took out since the arteries were not freshly cut and not easy to get the needles properly inserted. He said the condition of the arteries and the brain itself looked to him as having been removed a significant amount of time before they took it out of JFK's head at the official autopsy. Finally, he described the differences between the wounds in the head that they saw, the x-rays and photographs and the brain they removed. He repeatedly states that the brain he removed could not have been the one that the wounds represented. If what Jenkins documents in this book is accurate, it is groundbreaking and devastating to those who do not believe in a conspiracy. Did you get some of those impressions from the book too? Thanks

I'm listening to the archive of your show now, Jim. Congrats! http://www.blackopradio.com/archives2018.html Rick

I'd like to know what happened to LEE once he was released by Westbrooke or whomever. Was he taken to the Trinity River basin after putting on a flight suit / coverall and joined by a Hispanic-looking man to board the CIA flight to NM with Mr. Vinson? Were there any sightings of LEE after his release, once HARVEY was in police custody? Thanks

Isn't this the same paper that had all the details about Oswald and how he supposedly killed JFK from the TSBD, the rifle info and everything, at an incredibly early time/date after the assassination? Like so early that it defies anything except pre-assassination information being sent? I could be off here ... Thanks

David, Maybe a little OT, but why would the evidence from SA Drain only contain (2) 6.5 cartridge cases from TSBD, when there were supposedly (3)? Any ideas? If there were only (2), that means only (2) shots unless I'm missing something here. Plus, I recall that one of the cases had a dent in it that made it impossible for it to have been fired. I wonder why that wasn't called out. Thanks

Ron, The position you describe is about exactly where I was standing when I posted my recent picture from the vantage point of just to the south side of the last decorative pillar above Tague in your picture. Easily concealed and quick egress to the SK parking area. I think the trajectory from there would lend itself to a through the windshield frontal throat shot because of the steep incline of Elm. Back up near the turn, the height of the limo would allow this. Thanks Rick Thanks Rick

Since this is a discussion pertaining to the south knoll, I thought I would re-post a picture I took about a year ago from the concrete walkway portion of the triple underpass. I am standing about 20' or so from the end of the walkway, right above where James Tague was standing down at street level. You can see how a shooter from there would have the proper trajectory into the car for both frontal shots. The two maroon cars in the center lane are just about over the two X's in that lane marking two shots that hit JFK. The one in the back is where the front throat shot hit, and the car in front is where the head shot hit. With the curve in Elm, the position of JFK (ala Sherry Fiester) and the Parkland / other witnesses description of the wounds, you can see how the SK is a likely spot - much more likely IMO than the north knoll. Hope this helps. Thanks

Francois, Can you please provide your explanation of how a multitude of medical professionals describe the same back of the head blowout that is not seen on the "genuine and has never been faked by anyone" Z film? They can't both be true. Thanks