CIA WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE ASSASSINATION OF

[William Kelly]

Thanks Bill.

Upon what are you basing your opinion that Bill Smith--who Homer McMahon said was a Secret Service agent--was the same "Bill Smith" who worked for NPIC? Is it just the "same name" --and the fact that the Secret Service denied anyone by that name having been in their employ--or is there more?

Yes, Greg. Same name. But he was well known at NPIC as Bill Smith, not William Smith. I'm quite confident it is him and he can tell us who the briefing boards McMahon and Hunter helped make were for. But of course, ARRB missed him because they were chasing the Secret Service. The young man who McMahon said made the briefing boards is probably still alive too since McMahon said he was young at the time.

My point being that there are identifiable witnesses who can still answer the unanswered questions but those Congressmen responsible for the oversight of the JFK Act and the work of the ARRB have never had an oversight hearing in the ten years since the ARRB went out of existence. Like McMahon, the oversight committee is the only responsible party capable of giving the former CIA employees the proper dispensation to discuss the Z-film at NPIC and require their testimony under oath.

These questions that we are posing are not, as Rollie Zavata suggested, unanswerable.

BK

Edited June 1, 2010 by William Kelly

[William Kelly]

http://www.bigredchilli.co.uk/2010/05/cia-was-responsible-for-the-assassination-of-u-s-president-john-f-kennedy/

Here's the story that B. posted the link to in the first post on this thread:

CIA responsible for the assassination of U.S. President John F. Kennedy</H1>By Michael Webster: Syndicated Investigative Reporter. June 1, 2009 at 11:00 AM PDT

According to this documentary the CIA was responsible for the assassination of U.S. President John F. Kennedy in November of 1962 at Daley Plaza in Dallas Texas. John Barbour produced this landmark film, The Garrison Tapes.

This documentary tells the story of District Attorney Jim Garrison, who investigated the 1963 assassination of Ptresident John F. Kennedy his independent investigation according to the movie looked closely into evidence available to him and came forward with an interpretation that went beyond the Warren Commission's authorized report. The film examines occurrences before and after the assassination and considers theoretical connections with the FBI, the CIA, the Mafia, the Cuban situation, the war in Vietnam, and other national and international concerns. An interview with Garrison is included in the film. Footage of the tragedy and interviews with witnesses offer further information and ideas. The complete "Garrison Tapes" can be viewed below for free.

Last night George Knapp of the nationwide Coast to Coast Am radio show welcomed award-winning broadcaster John Barbour for a discussion about the JFK assassination. Parts of Barbour's interview with the late Jim Garrison were played during the show. Garrison as the New Orleans district attorney conducted his own investigation into the assassination and implicated the CIA. According to listeners and reported on the Coast to Coast Am web site Barbour said his three-hour interview with Garrison was inspiring and exhilarating, but when portions aired on his TV show Real People in 1988, it was edited without his consent to make Garrison look delusional.

He told Barbour that he believed six people killed Kennedy, acting in three teams of two, while around 32 individuals were involved in the conspiracy. Included was Lawrence V. Meyers, a businessman with ties to the CIA, who reportedly met with Jack Ruby on Nov. 23rd, 1963. Researcher Jim Marrs has said the CIA used Meyers to get Ruby to eliminate Lee Harvey Oswald.The popular broadcast indicated that there was evidence that the changing of JFK's motorcade route in Dallas was part of the conspiracy, and there were also Mafia connections to the killing, Barbour noted. Interestingly, a CIA agent named Richard Case Nagell who had been assigned to keep an eye on Oswald, claimed he wrote a letter to J. Edgar Hoover in September 1963, warning of a plot to assassinate Kennedy in November. He was ignored and subsequently jailed.

Allin noted that even after all these years, people still want answers in the JFK assassination, and that the 9-11 truth movement has served to re-energize the public's interest in conspiracies. During the Barbour's interview he said that the head of the CIA Dulles and his second in command were fired by President Kennedy, as an interesting note the 2nd in command's brother was at the time of the President killing the Mayor of Dallas and had at the last moment changed the route of the Kennedy motor cade to pass by the Dallas book depositary.

Barbour also claimed during the interview that his efforts to distribute the Film in the USA has met real resistance from the powers to be, but did well in global markets.

The "evidence" this documentary presents makes more since then many other conspiracy theories do and less confusing but still no one can say with any certainty who actually killed JFK. There are so many loose ends like without knowing what really happened, like what the wounds actually looked like and what was taken from JFK's body, one can only speculate. It is true, some conspiracy theorists have placed gunmen behind the picket fence on the knoll, also on top of both the TSBD and the County Records Building, among other places.

Actor Woody Harrelson's Father Charles Harrelson confessed to the FBI that he was a member of the assassination team that shot the president. Harrelson was tried and convicted for the assassination of U.S. District Judge John Wood in San Antonio. While he was behind bars in the Dallas jail he told the FBI investigators that he was the hobo seen behind the fence beyond the grassy knoll and was one of the shooters.

Harrelson was sentenced to two life terms for the May 29, 1979, assassination of U.S. District Judge John H. Wood, Jr. Harrelson was convicted of shooting and killing Wood in the parking lot outside of Wood's San Antonio, Texas, townhouse after being hired by drug dealer Jimm y Chagra of El Paso. Wood — nicknamed "Maximum John" because of his reputation for handing down long sentences for drug offenses — was originally scheduled to have Chagra appear before him on the day of his murder, but the trial had been delayed.

Harrelson was apprehended with the aid of an anonymous tip and a taped conversation between Jimmy (Jamiel) and his brother, lawyer Joe Chagra.

Harrelson was eventually convicted based largely on Chagra's conversation with his brother who was visiting him in prison. Both Harrelson and Chagra's brother Joe were implicated in the assassination. Joe Chagra received a ten-year sentence. Jamiel Chagra was acquitted of the murder when his brother Joe refused to testify against him. Chagra was represented by current mayor of Las Vegas, Oscar Goodman. In a plea bargain, Chagra admitted to his role in the murder of Judge Wood and the attempted murder of a U.S. Attorney.

Jamiel Alexander "Jimmy" Chagra, brother of famous El Paso criminal trial Lawyer Lee Chagra who was murdered by Ft. Bliss solders, and younger brother lawyer Joe Chagra who was also killed in an auto accident after serving time in prison himself. All brothers now dead.

Joe Chagra died by injuries from an automobile accident on Dec. 6 1996.

Assassin Charles Harrelson died in prison on March 15, 2007.

Jimmy Chagra the man accused of a plot to kill judge in San Antonio died in 2008. He was freed on parole in '03, he had been living in Mesa Arizona in a federal protection program. He had been battling cancer since November, said his sister, Patsy Chagra of El Paso.Most all of the conspiracies out there are only guesses, some more educated then others as are most of the investigations, Garrison's was the only official to bring a case against anyone ever in the assassination of our president and this matter is still an open unsolved case of the century.

For the full articles showing Harrelson's story of his confession and for more details of the Chagra family saga in-depth articles appeared in the El Paso Journal newspaper and the "fifth estate" news magazine featured on the cover was Jimmy and several other family members, titled "Cash Is King" both publications can only be found and read at the El Paso public Library heritage section.

Editors Note: Michael Webster's Syndicated Investigative Reports are read worldwide, in 100 or more U.S. outlets and in at least 136 countries and territories. He publishes articles in association with global news agencies and media information services with more than 350 news affiliates in 136 countries. Many of Mr. Webster's articles are printed in six working languages: English, French, Arabic, Chinese, Russian and Spanish. With ten more languages planed in the near future.

Mr. Webster is America's leading authority on Venture Capital/Equity Funding. He served as a trustee on some of the nation's largest trade Union funds. A noted Author, Lecturer, Educator, Emergency Manager, Counter-Terrorist, War on Drugs and War on Terrorist Specialist, Business Consultant, Newspaper Publisher. Radio News caster. Labor Law generalist, Teamster Union Business Agent, General Organizer, Union Rank and File Member Grievances Representative, NLRB Union Representative, Union Contract Negotiator, Workers Compensation Appeals Board Hearing Representative. Mr. Webster represented management on that side of the table as the former Director of Federated of Nevada. Mr. Webster publishes on-line newspapers at www.lagunajournal.com and www.usborderfirereport.com and does investigative reports for print, electronic and on-line News Agencies.

Edited June 1, 2010 by William Kelly

[William Kelly]

http://www.bigredchilli.co.uk/2010/05/cia-was-responsible-for-the-assassination-of-u-s-president-john-f-kennedy/

Here's the story that B. posted the link to in the first post on this thread:

CIA responsible for the assassination of U.S. President John F. Kennedy</H1>By Michael Webster: Syndicated Investigative Reporter. June 1, 2009 at 11:00 AM PDT

According to this documentary the CIA was responsible for the assassination of U.S. President John F. Kennedy in November of 1962 at Daley Plaza in Dallas Texas. John Barbour produced this landmark film, The Garrison Tapes.

This documentary tells the story of District Attorney Jim Garrison, who investigated the 1963 assassination of Ptresident John F. Kennedy his independent investigation according to the movie looked closely into evidence available to him and came forward with an interpretation that went beyond the Warren Commission's authorized report. The film examines occurrences before and after the assassination and considers theoretical connections with the FBI, the CIA, the Mafia, the Cuban situation, the war in Vietnam, and other national and international concerns. An interview with Garrison is included in the film. Footage of the tragedy and interviews with witnesses offer further information and ideas. The complete "Garrison Tapes" can be viewed below for free.

Last night George Knapp of the nationwide Coast to Coast Am radio show welcomed award-winning broadcaster John Barbour for a discussion about the JFK assassination. Parts of Barbour's interview with the late Jim Garrison were played during the show. Garrison as the New Orleans district attorney conducted his own investigation into the assassination and implicated the CIA. According to listeners and reported on the Coast to Coast Am web site Barbour said his three-hour interview with Garrison was inspiring and exhilarating, but when portions aired on his TV show Real People in 1988, it was edited without his consent to make Garrison look delusional.

He told Barbour that he believed six people killed Kennedy, acting in three teams of two, while around 32 individuals were involved in the conspiracy. Included was Lawrence V. Meyers, a businessman with ties to the CIA, who reportedly met with Jack Ruby on Nov. 23rd, 1963. Researcher Jim Marrs has said the CIA used Meyers to get Ruby to eliminate Lee Harvey Oswald.The popular broadcast indicated that there was evidence that the changing of JFK's motorcade route in Dallas was part of the conspiracy, and there were also Mafia connections to the killing, Barbour noted. Interestingly, a CIA agent named Richard Case Nagell who had been assigned to keep an eye on Oswald, claimed he wrote a letter to J. Edgar Hoover in September 1963, warning of a plot to assassinate Kennedy in November. He was ignored and subsequently jailed.

Allin noted that even after all these years, people still want answers in the JFK assassination, and that the 9-11 truth movement has served to re-energize the public's interest in conspiracies. During the Barbour's interview he said that the head of the CIA Dulles and his second in command were fired by President Kennedy, as an interesting note the 2nd in command's brother was at the time of the President killing the Mayor of Dallas and had at the last moment changed the route of the Kennedy motor cade to pass by the Dallas book depositary.

Barbour also claimed during the interview that his efforts to distribute the Film in the USA has met real resistance from the powers to be, but did well in global markets.

The "evidence" this documentary presents makes more since then many other conspiracy theories do and less confusing but still no one can say with any certainty who actually killed JFK. There are so many loose ends like without knowing what really happened, like what the wounds actually looked like and what was taken from JFK's body, one can only speculate. It is true, some conspiracy theorists have placed gunmen behind the picket fence on the knoll, also on top of both the TSBD and the County Records Building, among other places.

Actor Woody Harrelson's Father Charles Harrelson confessed to the FBI that he was a member of the assassination team that shot the president. Harrelson was tried and convicted for the assassination of U.S. District Judge John Wood in San Antonio. While he was behind bars in the Dallas jail he told the FBI investigators that he was the hobo seen behind the fence beyond the grassy knoll and was one of the shooters.

Harrelson was sentenced to two life terms for the May 29, 1979, assassination of U.S. District Judge John H. Wood, Jr. Harrelson was convicted of shooting and killing Wood in the parking lot outside of Wood's San Antonio, Texas, townhouse after being hired by drug dealer Jimm y Chagra of El Paso. Wood — nicknamed "Maximum John" because of his reputation for handing down long sentences for drug offenses — was originally scheduled to have Chagra appear before him on the day of his murder, but the trial had been delayed.

Harrelson was apprehended with the aid of an anonymous tip and a taped conversation between Jimmy (Jamiel) and his brother, lawyer Joe Chagra.

Harrelson was eventually convicted based largely on Chagra's conversation with his brother who was visiting him in prison. Both Harrelson and Chagra's brother Joe were implicated in the assassination. Joe Chagra received a ten-year sentence. Jamiel Chagra was acquitted of the murder when his brother Joe refused to testify against him. Chagra was represented by current mayor of Las Vegas, Oscar Goodman. In a plea bargain, Chagra admitted to his role in the murder of Judge Wood and the attempted murder of a U.S. Attorney.

Jamiel Alexander "Jimmy" Chagra, brother of famous El Paso criminal trial Lawyer Lee Chagra who was murdered by Ft. Bliss solders, and younger brother lawyer Joe Chagra who was also killed in an auto accident after serving time in prison himself. All brothers now dead.

Joe Chagra died by injuries from an automobile accident on Dec. 6 1996.

Assassin Charles Harrelson died in prison on March 15, 2007.

Jimmy Chagra the man accused of a plot to kill judge in San Antonio died in 2008. He was freed on parole in '03, he had been living in Mesa Arizona in a federal protection program. He had been battling cancer since November, said his sister, Patsy Chagra of El Paso.Most all of the conspiracies out there are only guesses, some more educated then others as are most of the investigations, Garrison's was the only official to bring a case against anyone ever in the assassination of our president and this matter is still an open unsolved case of the century.

For the full articles showing Harrelson's story of his confession and for more details of the Chagra family saga in-depth articles appeared in the El Paso Journal newspaper and the "fifth estate" news magazine featured on the cover was Jimmy and several other family members, titled "Cash Is King" both publications can only be found and read at the El Paso public Library heritage section.

Editors Note: Michael Webster's Syndicated Investigative Reports are read worldwide, in 100 or more U.S. outlets and in at least 136 countries and territories. He publishes articles in association with global news agencies and media information services with more than 350 news affiliates in 136 countries. Many of Mr. Webster's articles are printed in six working languages: English, French, Arabic, Chinese, Russian and Spanish. With ten more languages planed in the near future.

Mr. Webster is America's leading authority on Venture Capital/Equity Funding. He served as a trustee on some of the nation's largest trade Union funds. A noted Author, Lecturer, Educator, Emergency Manager, Counter-Terrorist, War on Drugs and War on Terrorist Specialist, Business Consultant, Newspaper Publisher. Radio News caster. Labor Law generalist, Teamster Union Business Agent, General Organizer, Union Rank and File Member Grievances Representative, NLRB Union Representative, Union Contract Negotiator, Workers Compensation Appeals Board Hearing Representative. Mr. Webster represented management on that side of the table as the former Director of Federated of Nevada. Mr. Webster publishes on-line newspapers at www.lagunajournal.com and www.usborderfirereport.com and does investigative reports for print, electronic and on-line News Agencies.

Edited June 1, 2010 by William Kelly

[Greg Burnham]

Good stuff, Bill. Thanks again.

Thanks Bill.

Upon what are you basing your opinion that Bill Smith--who Homer McMahon said was a Secret Service agent--was the same "Bill Smith" who worked for NPIC? Is it just the "same name" --and the fact that the Secret Service denied anyone by that name having been in their employ--or is there more?

Yes, Greg. Same name. But he was well known at NPIC as Bill Smith, not William Smith. I'm quite confident it is him and he can tell us who the briefing boards McMahon and Hunter helped make were for. But of course, ARRB missed him because they were chasing the Secret Service. The young man who McMahon said made the briefing boards is probably still alive too since McMahon said he was young at the time.

My point being that there are identifiable witnesses who can still answer the unanswered questions but those Congressmen responsible for the oversight of the JFK Act and the work of the ARRB have never had an oversight hearing in the ten years since the ARRB went out of existence. Like McMahon, the oversight committee is the only responsible party capable of giving the former CIA employees the proper dispensation to discuss the Z-film at NPIC and require their testimony under oath.

These questions that we are posing are not, as Rollie Zavata suggested, unanswerable.

BK

[Michael Hogan]

The CIA is a front operation for the REAL Intelligence Agencies of the US Government. Make no mistake--JFK was assassinated by the MILITARY's Intelligence apparatus. He was treasonously removed by them because he was erroneously viewed as an incompetent "Commander-in Chief" who might cause WWIII by accident.

In the year 2010 this should not even be in question any longer.

Jim Garrison reached essentially the same conclusion in 1970. He wrote about it in his book, A Heritage of Stone:

Dealey Plaza should be recognized as a highly effective assault on civilian control over the military.

Correspondingly, the Warren Commission can be seen as a delegation of the civilian leaders of our country accepting the terms laid down to them by the military. The military conceded one condition which clearly was in the initial planning; they dropped their requirement for an invasion of Cuba. Beyond that concession, the assassination and the inquiry are best recognized for what they were: a military takeover of the United States. It was nothing less.

If we are to understand and bring under control the forces which are shaping today's America and are endeavoring to shape our future, we cannot rest with the official version of the killing of John Kennedy. The model of explanation offered here explains the available data. We must employ this tool of analysis until or unless another one is offered which better explains the evidence.

If we cannot have the truth once and for all about the government's murder of John Kennedy, if the warfare interests in our government are so powerful that they cannot be questioned about such things, then let us have an end to the pretense that this is a government of the people.

If the American people choose to do nothing about what was done to John Kennedy and about the subtle conversion of their country from a democracy into a thinly disguised version of the warfare state, then the republic is lost and we will never see it again in our time.

In any event, we need no longer pretend that there is any mystery left about the assassination of John Kennedy. The cold war was the biggest business in America, worth eighty billion dollars a year as well as tremendous power to men in Washington. The President was murdered because he was genuinely seeking peace in a corrupt world. As tired as we are of the horror of the subject, all of us must address ourselves honestly to the meaning and implications of the assassination of John Kennedy, or all of us will pay the price of living in tyranny.

[Cliff Varnell]

Big Jim sez:

The military conceded one condition which clearly was in the initial planning; they

dropped their requirement for an invasion of Cuba.

Was it "the military" who called Air Force One 3 or 4 hours after the assassination

to inform the new President that the lone assassin had been captured?

Was it "the military" who met with LBJ in the White House mere minutes

after his arrival the evening of 11/22/63 to inform him definitively that the

Soviets were not involved in the assassination?

Was it "the military" who coerced Jack Ruby into silencing the patsy?

The answer to all three questions is -- "No."

If "the military" killed JFK because he was a weakling in the Cold War why

would they drop their desire to invade Cuba after only a few hours?

Was their desire to invade so flimsy that they suddenly became as "weak"

on Castro as Kennedy had been?

Of course not.

To pin the assassination on "the military" is as fruitless as blaming "the CIA"

or "the Mob," imo.

My reading of the evidence has convinced me that the assassination was

pan-organizational and cannot be attributed to a single entity or institution.

Edited June 1, 2010 by Cliff Varnell

[Ron Ecker]

Actor Woody Harrelson's Father Charles Harrelson confessed to the FBI that he was a member of the assassination team that shot the president.

How can Webster make that statement and discuss Harrelson in detail without once mentioning the fact that Harrelson retracted his confession and said that he was not in Dallas that day?

God, I hate that kind of writing. Maybe Harrelson "shot Kennedy" and maybe he didn't. But shouldn't writers try to be honest with their readers?

[David Josephs]

Hi Cliff...

I disagree with your assessment - and if you have the answers to your questions please post them as I see these three things very much militarily controlled.

Was it "the military" who called Air Force One 3 or 4 hours after the assassination

to inform the new President that the lone assassin had been captured?

from Salandria "Tale of Two Tapes"

Despite the evidence of conspiracy of which Dealey Plaza reeked, the White House Situation Room had informed President Johnson and the other occupants of Air Force One that, notwithstanding what they may have smelled, seen and felt in Dealey Plaza which spoke of a conspiratorial crossfire, Oswald was to be designated as the lone assassin.

Who do you suppose was in the WH Situation room telling them this? How many non-military people are even allowed in the WH Situation room?

Was it "the military" who met with LBJ in the White House mere minutes

after his arrival the evening of 11/22/63 to inform him definitively that the

Soviets were not involved in the assassination?

Are you speaking of Bundy? McCone? Logged meetings/Calls or not? please explain, thanks

Was it "the military" who coerced Jack Ruby into silencing the patsy?

I guess it depends on how you look at it... If guns and drugs are being run in and out of the country then those who would have the authority to order Ruby to kill Oswald may have done so at the insistence of the military who was in essence overseeing those operations... or at least turning a blind - and very well paid - eye.

I made the argument before that in 1963 EVERYONE had been in the military in one form or another... everyone given any real responsibility at least.

By the age of 18 you were registered, drafted and indoctrinated to the military way of things... the "pan-organization" you speak of is ultimately controlled by the military establishment... no? Business caters to them, countries are used for their resources by them, and they are intimately connected (and in most cases direct the activities of) the military and security forces of these other countries... a standing military force is one of the founding principle of the US government - been around since the early 1700's. They have the most money, loyalty, organization, reach, men/women and power. No matter where you were... CIA, NSA, Congress, Legal, etc... you came out of the military.

and you followed your orders, regardless of whether you were inside or out... or else.

If "the military" killed JFK because he was a weakling in the Cold War why

would they drop their desire to invade Cuba after only a few hours?

Because there were plenty of other countries in central and south american to control... Cuba had limited land mass, hostile environment and was too close.. Vietnam was the issue not Cuba and the military/CIA/Henry Cabot Lodge knew it. Billions in drugs and weapons and no one looking over your shoulder... that's why.

If not all stemming from and thru the military, then we have LBJ, the Cabinet and Congress... the 25th Amendment with the express cooperation of the Joint Chiefs

I'm very interested in your explanation of the "pan-organizational" entity... thanks

DJ

[Greg Burnham]

Cliff,

I think you make some valid points. For instance, I agree that placing the blame on any one group (or individual) is inaccurate. However, my assertion is that the CIA was NOT "operationally" in control or engaged in Dallas. It's not what they do. And, time and time again, when they attempt it, they screw up...and usually they're caught RED handed to boot! So, from an "operational" view point, it was a Military Operation--all the way.

I also agree with you that there was a consensus of several "groups" that executive action was necessary. The loudest voice, the strongest proponent, the most "operationally" capable, and the "biggest kid on the block" with the most to lose (funding) if JFK remained in office--however, WAS the military. Not only had they been reigned in by JFK (through both McNamara and Taylor) as evidenced by the rather restrained approach employed to resolve the Cuban Missile Crisis, but JFK's speech at the American University and the signing of NSAM 263 calling for withdrawal from Vietnam threatened to disrupt, if not destroy, the very paradigm under which the cold warriors functioned. Without that paradigm their existence (as they conceived it to be) was no longer necessary.

As to your points about "Was it the military who..." did various things in the aftermath -- I think the answer to many of those questions is, "Yes, indirectly." It would serve no purpose for a coup to be undone by the people within hours of it having been "operationally" successful. Had the military directly revealed its hand there very well could have been an all out revolution--a "Civil War" if you will -- The People vs The Millitary Police State, in short order. It would have been a mess and by no stretch of the imagination would it have been considered a victory.

So, the perps use surrogates. They were already lined up to go. McGeorge Bundy had just signed the draft of NSAM 273 on the day before the assassination, which began the reversal of the NSAM [263] that JFK had signed only 6 weeks previously! I think it naive for anyone in 2010 to believe that the military (among others) had no stake in the escalation of the war in Vietnam.

It's still a difficult thing each Memorial Day to reflect on the names of 58,000+ Americans who gave their lives to fight an ill conceived war, the longest in our history, and the only one we ever lost...so far--and all because the man that was the duly elected Commander-in Chief by the people was murdered before he could stop it.

Edited June 1, 2010 by Greg Burnham

[David Josephs]

Well put Greg... excellent post

[John Dolva]

Well, that's pretty competent incompetency. So how incompetent are they really?

Indeed. They are extremely competent at lies, deception, cover stories, propaganda, red herrings, and the like. IOW: They're very good at "the manipulation of information" since they are, first and foremost, "of academia" for that is from where they recruit their agents. As you imply, they can manipulate information so competently as to appear incompetent in any area necessary to persuade, divert attention, or otherwise protect "interests" judged to be of paramount importance.

Bill Cosby once said [paraphrased]:

"The father in a family is brilliant because he is the only one who can get out of doing chores believably. All he has to do is perform them so poorly that his wife sends him back to his room because he didn't do them right, which is exactly where he wanted to be in the first place! Watching a father operate is beautiful...he's a genius."

I'd note also the later investigation of the intelllgence services (Buchanan) which pretty much detailed a shape shifting organ that subsided under the radar if necessary emerging in another format but with the same purpose ie not beholden to the people no matter what. (I'd also consider the real Iranian revolution when huge numbers of documents were pieced together from shreds in the taking of the embassy and then the support for Saddam in the 7 year war that left a Clergy dictatorship in place and a million Iranians, IraqIs and Kurds dead. Later Saddam is discarded. It's about power and it's about taking the power back.

Edited June 1, 2010 by John Dolva

[Greg Burnham]

Thanks David.

Edited June 1, 2010 by Greg Burnham

[Jack White]

Monk...I agree that the military played a chief role.

But that is to downplay that Allen Dulles initiated the participation of LBJ and JEH.

Dulles was a tool of the international bankers and industrialists who were the

real culprits...and none of THEM controlled the military. No one person in the

military chain was powerful enough to act unilaterally, and would not have

dared risk treason on their own. But as a group, the military WAS EAGER to

perform their designated role. The military did not control the CIA, which

controlled LHO and other major players like Hunt and Phillips and Lansdale

and Conein. Your mentor L. Fletcher Prouty believed this, and I am surprised

that you do not.

There were many groups motivated to join the cabal...once it was INITIATED

by Dulles. On the cabal active participant pyramid, Dulles was at the apex.

Below Dulles were LBJ and JEH. On the crowded third level was the military,

along with the CIA, SS, FBI, and many others.

The military did not act alone. It was just one of MANY sub-participants

in the organization chart of the cabal. Dulles was the CEO, acting at the behest

of a powerful multi-national secret group of people like David Rockefeller.

Jack

Edited June 1, 2010 by Jack White

[Peter McGuire]

Allen Dulles in his book on spook work (I forget the title) made a point of the fact that something always goes wrong in a covert operation. Cover is blown. But people don't notice or don't think anything of it.

So it's not that the CIA is incompetent. Blown cover is the nature of the business. With the exception of the Bay of Pigs, all of the CIA's best known operations, in which cover has been blown, have been successful. (And it can be argued that the Bay of Pigs operation was designed to fail, which it succeeded in doing).

Cover has been blown, the American people have noticed, but the fact is they don't give a damn. They don't give a damn time and again.

I will enter into this discussion on that note....

The cover was blown early in 1964, yet they still get away with murdering a U. S. President.

There is something wrong with the American people, in my opinion.

Murderers will be murderers-- you can't blame them when you think about it...they have to do these things to survive in their world. They are flawed human beings who will meet their justice eventually.

But an average citizen not blinking an eye to the obvious removal of their sitting president!

Edited June 1, 2010 by Peter McGuire

[Jack White]

Allen Dulles in his book on spook work (I forget the title) made a point of the fact that something always goes wrong in a covert operation. Cover is blown. But people don't notice or don't think anything of it.

So it's not that the CIA is incompetent. Blown cover is the nature of the business. With the exception of the Bay of Pigs, all of the CIA's best known operations, in which cover has been blown, have been successful. (And it can be argued that the Bay of Pigs operation was designed to fail, which it succeeded in doing).

Cover has been blown, the American people have noticed, but the fact is they don't give a damn. They don't give a damn time and again.

I will enter into this discussion on that note....

The cover was blown early in 1964, yet they still get away with murdering a U. S. President.

There is something wrong with the American people, in my opinion.

Murderers will be murderers-- you can't blame them when you think about it...they have to do these things to survive in their world. They are flawed human beings who will meet their justice eventually.

But an average citizen not blinking an eye to the obvious removal of their sitting president!

I agree.