What evidence is there that Lee Harvey Oswald beat Marina?

[Sandy Larsen]

I have new information regarding Marina's bruise.

But first I need to go over the reasons for my earlier conclusion. (For anybody interested, you can see a summary of the facts in Post 2 of this thread, and a timeline and analysis in Post 3.)

I made the following conclusion regarding the bruise many months ago:

Prior Conclusion

Oswald probably hit his wife. Once.

I made that conclusion largely because of Marguerite's testimony, which was IIRC that Marina told her in the other room (meaning, not in Oswald's presence) that Oswald had hit her. Then Marguerite went to her son and asked him about the bruise. And his response was that it wasn't her affair. Which to me sounded like an admission of guilt.

The reason I concluded "probably hit her" rather than "did hit her" is because there were no witnesses other than Marina. And because Marina at first said she had run into the door. (I found a forum thread on that topic and found out that people really do run into doors and get a bruised face. They run into the edge of the door or the door frame, almost always in the dark.) And because at the time Marina was using the beating story to get things from the White Russian friends.... they showered her with gifts. (This isn't just my opinion. I remember one of Marina's friends siding with Oswald in her testimony.)

Anyway, I read something today that makes a difference IMO. According to a friend of the Oswalds, in late August 1962, Marina fell down, dropped the baby, and hit the ground so hard that he thought she might have been seriously injured. The friend, Paul Gregory, wrote:

Marina took a step backward and fell, thumping her head on the hard, dry ground and dropping June. The thud was so loud that I feared she might be seriously injured; Lee, however, screamed at her for her clumsiness as she lay curled on the ground clutching for her baby.  (Source)

It just so happens that this occurred at the same time (latter part of August) as when Marina's face got bruised!

Suppose for a moment that the fall was indeed the cause of the bruise. Does the testimony fit with that narrative?

• Paul Gregory didn't specifically mention the bruise. But I know from experience that bruises don't always appear right away.
• Marina at first blamed it on the door. Why would she do that? Maybe because she was ashamed she dropped the baby. (She could have just said that she fell and not mentioned the baby. But maybe she was afraid that, if word got around about the fall, people might ask questions and discover that she also dropped the baby. Remember, there was a witness to that.)
• Marina told Marguerite that the bruise was caused by Oswald hitting her. Why would she do that? Well that's a better story (less shameful) than the one about her dropping the baby.
• Oswald told his mother that the bruise was not her affair. Why would he do that? He probably also didn't want to talk about a fall the resulted in dropping the baby. Oswald was so upset at Marina dropping the baby that he didn't speak to her the rest of the evening, according to Paul Gregory.

I just think it's an incredible coincidence that Marina hit her head on the hard ground with a loud thump, and then just happens to get a head bruise from some other cause at the same time. Remember, this is the only instance of Marina ever being bruised.

I personally believe that this is what happened.

People say that Oswald was a wife beater. But there is no evidence for that. Wife beaters don't just hit their wife one time and stop. Wife beaters have a awful time with controlling themselves. And men who aren't wife beaters... well, I don't have the statistics, but I think that it's probably a rare man who hits his wife once and then never does it again.

Plus, keep in mind that EVERYBODY said that Oswald had no violence in him. Even Marina testified to that.

I am therefore changing my conclusion to...

New Conclusion

Oswald may have hit his wife. Once.

Even though I personally believe that this fall explains Marina's bruise, I'm still concluding Oswald may have hit her because Marina did say so to Marguerite. Plus we don't know for sure if the fall did cause a bruise. Well, it likely did cause a bruise. And if she is like the women I've known, it probably was a pretty bad bruise. (I don't bruise easily myself. But it sure seems like all the women I've known well do.) Still, one questions remains: Where was the bruise located... on her face or hidden by her hair?

 

Edited September 3, 2017 by Sandy Larsen

[Michael Walton]

48 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Even though I personally believe that this fall explains Marina's bruise, I'm still concluding Oswald may have hit her because Marina did say so to Marguerite. Plus we don't know for sure if the fall did cause a bruise. Well, it likely did cause a bruise. And if she is like the women I've known, it probably was a pretty bad bruise. (I don't bruise easily myself. But it sure seems like all the women I've known well do.) Still, one questions remains: Where was the bruise located... on her face or hidden by her hair?

Sandy, to be honest - does it really matter? There was a link way at the beginning of this thread that showed an old link by a guy named Dunne who showed that all of the White Russian community folks who tried to show LHO was a wife beater were all debunked. That debunking pretty much shows that the people LHO were surrounded by when he returned to TX with Marina in tow were there for a not-so-innocent reason.

So according to your find that he did hit his wife - once - OK. Fine. In the final analysis it still does not change the fact that the sole purpose of all of this "he was a wife beater" testimony was a way to make LHO look like a crazed Marxist wife-beating (violent) LONE ASSASSIN.

[Sandy Larsen]

2 minutes ago, Michael Walton said:

Sandy, to be honest - does it really matter? There was a link way at the beginning of this thread that showed an old link by a guy named Dunne who showed that all of the White Russian community folks who tried to show LHO was a wife beater were all debunked. That debunking pretty much shows that the people LHO were surrounded by when he returned to TX with Marina in tow were there for a not-so-innocent reason.

So according to your find that he did hit his wife - once - OK. Fine. In the final analysis it still does not change the fact that the sole purpose of all of this "he was a wife beater" testimony was a way to make LHO look like a crazed Marxist wife-beating (violent) LONE ASSASSIN.

Mike,

I read the White Russian's testimony myself before I knew about the Dunne debunking. I had already drawn a timeline and found that there was only one bruise. That is to say, bruises weren't recurring... it was just one bruise that took a few weeks to heal. Then I found out about Dunne's work. His work is better in the sense that he quotes the testimony. But I feel mine is better in that is makes sense of all the evidence and forms a cohesive narative. I feel that I can say what really happened, and that anybody who reads the testimony will find no fault in what I say. (My timeline and analysis in Post 3 tells the story.)

The downside to my analysis is that I don't quote sources or provide links.

If I felt the story was important enough, I would spend the time sourcing everything and polishing my analysis. But I agree with you that it is not that important.

I quit researching this topic not long after I began and have done nothing since. I came across this new evidence this morning and spent a little time documenting it. No big deal.

If anybody tells me that Oswald was physically abusive to Marina, I can tell them with a great deal of confidence they are wrong. And I know that they can't prove me wrong. (Of course they can disagree with my conclusion.) Just like I know that nobody can prove me wrong about the school records showing Oswald attending two schools simultaneously.

 

[Sandy Larsen]

1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said:

New Conclusion

Oswald may have hit his wife. Once.

Not long after I finished writing the above post I came to realize that the Paul Gregory article reveals more than I had imagined. I'll post it tomorrow.

Stay tuned....

[Micah Mileto]

2 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

I have new information regarding Marina's bruise.

But first I need to go over the reasons for my earlier conclusion. (For anybody interested, you can see a summary of the facts in Post 2 of this thread, and a timeline and analysis in Post 3.)

I made the following conclusion regarding the bruise many months ago:

Prior Conclusion

Oswald probably hit his wife. Once.

I made that conclusion largely because of Marguerite's testimony, which was IIRC that Marina told her in the other room (meaning, not in Oswald's presence) that Oswald had hit her. Then Marguerite went to her son and asked him about the bruise. And his response was that it wasn't her affair. Which to me sounded like an admission of guilt.

The reason I concluded "probably hit her" rather than "did hit her" is because there were no witnesses other than Marina. And because Marina at first said she had run into the door. (I found a forum thread on that topic and found out that people really do run into doors and get a bruised face. They run into the edge of the door or the door frame, almost always in the dark.) And because at the time Marina was using the beating story to get things from the White Russian friends.... they showered her with gifts. (This isn't just my opinion. I remember one of Marina's friends siding with Oswald in her testimony.)

Anyway, I read something today that makes a difference IMO. According to a friend of the Oswalds, in late August 1962, Marina fell down, dropped the baby, and hit the ground so hard that he thought she might have been seriously injured. The friend, Paul Gregory, wrote:

Marina took a step backward and fell, thumping her head on the hard, dry ground and dropping June. The thud was so loud that I feared she might be seriously injured; Lee, however, screamed at her for her clumsiness as she lay curled on the ground clutching for her baby.  (Source)

It just so happens that this occurred at the same time (latter part of August) as when Marina's face got bruised!

Suppose for a moment that the fall was indeed the cause of the bruise. Does the testimony fit with that narrative?

• Paul Gregory didn't specifically mention the bruise. But I know from experience that bruises don't always appear right away.
• Marina at first blamed it on the door. Why would she do that? Maybe because she was ashamed she dropped the baby. (She could have just said that she fell and not mentioned the baby. But maybe she was afraid that, if word got around about the fall, people might ask questions and discover that she also dropped the baby. Remember, there was a witness to that.)
• Marina told Marguerite that the bruise was caused by Oswald hitting her. Why would she do that? Well that's a better story (less shameful) than the one about her dropping the baby.
• Oswald told his mother that the bruise was not her affair. Why would he do that? He probably also didn't want to talk about a fall the resulted in dropping the baby. Oswald was so upset at Marina dropping the baby that he didn't speak to her the rest of the evening, according to Paul Gregory.

I just think it's an incredible coincidence that Marina hit her head on the hard ground with a loud thump, and then just happens to get a head bruise from some other cause at the same time. Remember, this is the only instance of Marina ever being bruised.

I personally believe that this is what happened.

People say that Oswald was a wife beater. But there is no evidence for that. Wife beaters don't just hit their wife one time and stop. Wife beaters have a awful time with controlling themselves. And men who aren't wife beaters... well, I don't have the statistics, but I think that it's probably a rare man who hits his wife once and then never does it again.

Plus, keep in mind that EVERYBODY said that Oswald had no violence in him. Even Marina testified to that.

I am therefore changing my conclusion to...

New Conclusion

Oswald may have hit his wife. Once.

Even though I personally believe that this fall explains Marina's bruise, I'm still concluding Oswald may have hit her because Marina did say so to Marguerite. Plus we don't know for sure if the fall did cause a bruise. Well, it likely did cause a bruise. And if she is like the women I've known, it probably was a pretty bad bruise. (I don't bruise easily myself. But it sure seems like all the women I've known well do.) Still, one questions remains: Where was the bruise located... on her face or hidden by her hair?

 

Sandy, doesn't the whole context of the paragraph imply that Gregory believed that Lee did hit Marina in that instant?

 

EDIT: Nevermind, just saw your edit

[Michael Walton]

3 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

If anybody tells me that Oswald was physically abusive to Marina, I can tell them with a great deal of confidence they are wrong. And I know that they can't prove me wrong. (Of course they can disagree with my conclusion.)

I agree. All part of the character assassination of LHO.

 

Just like I know that nobody can prove me wrong about the school records showing Oswald attending two schools simultaneously.

We'll  just have to continue to disagree on the HL fantasy.

 

 

[Paul Trejo]

On 6/24/2017 at 1:16 AM, Sandy Larsen said:

 

I will list here, in chronological order, what every witness to the bruise said. Read the blue text:

 

Marina Meets Elena Hall
Date:  July 1962     (Estimate according to Mrs. Hall)
Location: Oswald' apartment.
Mrs Hall:  "black and blue over half of her face"
Note: Bouhe took Marina to Elena's house. The date must be wrong because Bouhe testified that he first saw the bruise when the group went to visit Marina. That was at the end of August.
 

White Russian Group Visits Marina
Date: Late August 1962
Location: Oswald apartment.
Mr. Bouhe:   "black eye"
Mrs. Meller:  "terrible blue spot over her eye."  "Under her eye was [blue] and over here [pointing].")
 

 

The Oswalds Attend a Luncheon Party
Date: Early September 1962
Location: Meller home.
Mrs. Ford:  "bruises on her face"
Mr. Ford:    "[bruises] on her face"
 

 

 

That's it Tracy. They all saw Marina's bruise at the end of August and beginning of September 1952. Elena Hall said that Bouhe took her to see Marina in July, at which time she saw the bruise. But according to Bouhe, he didn't see the bruise till late August. So Elena Hall was mistaken about the month. She must have also seen the bruise in late August.

Jeane de Mohrenschildt also saw the bruise, but didn't say when. She said, "We saw her with a black eye once." Notice that she said "once!"

George Bouhe said he saw a "black eye" on two occasions. The first occasion is noted above. The second occasion has been discredited. First of all, he wasn't even present to see Marina's face on the occasion he describes. Second, the person who did see Marina (Mrs. Meller) made no mention of a bruise! (See this post.).

I didn't list George de Mohrenschildt's testimony because he's been shown to be untrustworthy. But it should be no different than his wife's. And she specifically said they saw only one black eye.

And of course I didn't list the outlier l.i.a.r, Alexander Kleinlerer. But for kicks I just looked and found that he doesn't say anything about bruises.

So I repeat, they all saw Marina's bruise at the end of August and beginning of September 1952. There was a bruise just one time. 

Sandy,

Your feedback is biased.   You deliberately left out witnesses because of your personal bias.   

You actually left out Lee Harvey Oswald's own mother -- for just one of many.    This is biased reporting.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

[Paul Trejo]

23 hours ago, Michael Walton said:

Sandy, to be honest - does it really matter? There was a link way at the beginning of this thread that showed an old link by a guy named Dunne who showed that all of the White Russian community folks who tried to show LHO was a wife beater were all debunked. That debunking pretty much shows that the people LHO were surrounded by when he returned to TX with Marina in tow were there for a not-so-innocent reason.

So according to your find that he did hit his wife - once - OK. Fine. In the final analysis it still does not change the fact that the sole purpose of all of this "he was a wife beater" testimony was a way to make LHO look like a crazed Marxist wife-beating (violent) LONE ASSASSIN.

Michael,

The following is my opinion.

I fully agree that Lee Harvey Oswald (LHO) was NEVER a "crazed Marxist wife-beating (violent) LONE ASSASSIN.

Nevertheless -- the evidence is overwhelming that LHO beat Marina Oswald -- perhaps only twice.   

LHO never beat Marina in the USSR.    LHO never beat Marina in New Orleans.   LHO never beat Marina in Irving, Texas.

It was perhaps once in Fort Worth (where Marguerite Oswald reported it) and once in Dallas (where Marina Oswald reported it).  Or perhaps a third time if you count Alexander Kleinlerer's observation.

It is unacceptable for Sandy to omit the testimony of Marina Oswald herself -- it is ridiculous, actually.   Why would she lie about it?   No credible reason is offered.   If she was caught in a lie -- she would be deported -- and she knew it.  When Marina Oswald took the oath and took the WC stand, she told the TRUTH.  

Marina Oswald knew NOTHING about the JFK assassination plot.   LHO was set up as a Patsy -- but Marina Oswald knew NOTHING about it.

It is absurd to try to link LHO to the JFK assassination just because he really beat Marina Oswald (twice, over his jealousy of the Dallas Russians).

It is absurd to try to link LHO to the JFK assassination just because he really shot at Ex-General Walker (to impress George DeMohrenschildt, Volkmar Schmidt and others).

Just because LHO was innocent of the actual JFK shooting doesn't mean he was a choir boy in every other aspect of his life.  He wasn't.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 4, 2017 by Paul Trejo
Alexander Kleinlerer

[Paul Trejo]

12 hours ago, Michael Walton said:

...There was a link way at the beginning of this thread that showed an old link by a guy named Dunne who showed that all of the White Russian community folks who tried to show LHO was a wife beater were all debunked....

Michael,

Some years ago on this Forum, I myself debunked every single paragraph of Robert C Dunne's accusations against Marina Oswald.  It took me weeks, IIRC.

I completely debunked Dunne.  Years later the person who created that thread deleted the entire thread -- and all my work.

When I found out, I appealed to the Moderators of the Forum to retrieve my work, but they insisted that it is all lost.   (Tom Scully was able to produce those parts of the thread that attacked me for this current thread --  but he didn't dare reproduce the whole thread.)

I cannot find Robert C. Dunne's work by using Google. 

Anyway -- as much as I object to re-work -- I ask somebody on the Forum to kindly re-post Robert C. Dunne's attacks on Marina Oswald so that I can -- again -- debunk them paragraph by paragraph, and finally set his silly attacks to rest.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 4, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Michael Walton]

8 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

I cannot find Robert C. Dunne's work by using Google. 

Paul - the link to it is way up above.  You basically have to use the Way Back Machine website and it finds it.

[Paul Trejo]

3 hours ago, Michael Walton said:

Paul - the link to it is way up above.  You basically have to use the Way Back Machine website and it finds it.

Michael,

OK, thanks, I found it.  It's now on James DiEugenio's "Kennedys and King" web site.    

Here we go again.

Thanks,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 4, 2017 by Paul Trejo
typos

[W. Tracy Parnell]

1 hour ago, Paul Trejo said:

Michael,

OK, thanks, I found it.  It's now on the James DiEugenio's "Kennedys and King" web site.    

Here we go again.

Thanks,
--Paul Trejo

Great that you are taking this task on Paul, look forward to reading it!

[Paul Trejo]

Here's my critique of Robert Charles Dunne's superficial accounting of the 7 eye-witness accounts of the beatings that Lee Harvey Oswald gave to Marina Oswald in 1962-1963.  I will argue that in his effort to discount the facts, Dunne shuffles in 12 non-eye witnesses, to muddy the waters.

1.  Robert Dunne will quote direct testimony from 19 WC witnesses, starting with those who admit they saw nothing, so that he can add his sarcastic remarks -- to set the stage for what James DiEugenio calls a "tour de force."   

2.  Regarding the actual 7 witnesses who openly testified to seeing the actual bruises on Marina's face, and hearing Marina clearly say that Lee beat her, or actually saw Lee striking Marina personally -- Robert Dunne forgets one (Marguerite Oswald), refuses to present the testimony of another (Marina Oswald), omits the main part of another because he provided only a sworn affidavit (Alex Kleinlerer) and offers many sarcastic remarks about the other four: Elena Hall, George Bouhe, George DeMohrenschildt, Jeanne DeMohrenschildt.

3. As for the 12 second-hand ear-witnesses -- who heard of the wife-beating from other Russian Emigres in Dallas/Ft. Worth -- they shouldn't even count at all -- although their ample testimony is a witness to the tight-knit community of the Russian Emigres in Dallas/Ft. Worth, as well as to the difficulty that perhaps most of them had with the English language -- both in understanding the questions asked of them, and in forming the English sentences in response to those questions.  Robert Dunne adds his sarcasm to their difficulties in communication, probably in hopes of casting doubt on all Russian Emigre testimony.

4.   My main objection is that by starting his essay with these 12 who did not claim to be eye-witnesses, Robert Dunne deliberately wastes our time and energy, probably hoping to wear the reader down with pages of sarcastic remarks.

5.  The 7 remaining eye-witnesses are direct and positive.   Some of them have English language issues, but their testimony remains clear.  They personally saw bruises on the face of Marina Oswald and confirmed from Marina that Lee beat her.   Let's briefly recap their actual testimony:

5.1.  MRS. HALL: ... I said, Marina, what was on your face? And she told me that he beat her...

5.2.  MR. BOUHE:   Yes; and she had a black eye. And not thinking about anything unfortunate, I said: "Well, did you run  into a bathroom door?" Marina said, "Oh, no, he hit me."

5.3.  MRS. DE MOHRENSCHILDT.  Well, you see, he mistreated his wife physically. We saw her with a black eye once.

5.4.  MR. DE MOHRENSCHILDT.  ...A black eye, and scratched face, and so on and so forth...She said, "He has been beating me." ...

5.5.  MR. KLEINLERER:  "When Marina reached the doorway Lee rudely reprimanded her in a flat imperious voice about being careless in her dress and slapped her hard in the face, twice.  Marina still had the baby in her arms. Her face was red and tears came to her eyes.  All this took place in my presence."

5.6.  MARGUERITE OSWALD: <here we should reproduce text from WC Vol. I, Monday 10 February 1964>
MR. RANKIN. Did you ask Marina how she got the black eye or anything about it?
MARGUERITE OSWALD. Yes, in the bedroom. I was shocked.  “Mama-Lee.” Just like that.  So I went in the living room and I said. “Lee, what do you mean by striking Marina?”  He said. “Mother, that is our affair.”  And so that ended. I wasn’t going to interfere any further... 

5.7.  MARINA OSWALD: <here we should reproduce text from her testimony in Vol. V, Sunday 6 September 1964>
SENATOR RUSSELL. Did he beat you on many occasions?
MARINA OSWALD. Rather -- many...
SENATOR RUSSELL. Well, you only testified to one, did you not, before the Commission?
MARINA OSWALD. I was rather embarrassed to discuss this before the Commission, but he beat me on more than on one occasion...

6.  It's beyond mere bias when a writer omits the key witnesses, and starts out with a wave of irrelevant witnesses, to build up a case based on sarcasm.

7.  In any case, it's clear that there was more than one eye-witness, and the facts should be obvious now, to the impartial reader.  Lee Harvey Oswald didn't beat Marina Oswald in the USSR, in New Orleans, or in Irving, Texas.  For the most part, Lee was not violent with Marina.  However, in the stress of competition with during a six month period with well-to-do White Russians in the Dallas/Ft. Worth area, it appears that LHO beat Marina on perhaps three different occasions.

8.  This certainly has NOTHING to do with alleging that LHO tried to kill JFK.  There's really no connection at all.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 4, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Sandy Larsen]

On 9/3/2017 at 6:41 PM, Paul Trejo said:

On 6/24/2017 at 0:16 AM, Sandy Larsen said:

 

I will list here, in chronological order, what every witness to the bruise said. Read the blue text:

 

Marina Meets Elena Hall
Date:  July 1962     (Estimate according to Mrs. Hall)
Location: Oswald' apartment.
Mrs Hall:  "black and blue over half of her face"
Note: Bouhe took Marina to Elena's house. The date must be wrong because Bouhe testified that he first saw the bruise when the group went to visit Marina. That was at the end of August.
 

White Russian Group Visits Marina
Date: Late August 1962
Location: Oswald apartment.
Mr. Bouhe:   "black eye"
Mrs. Meller:  "terrible blue spot over her eye."  "Under her eye was [blue] and over here [pointing].")
 

 

The Oswalds Attend a Luncheon Party
Date: Early September 1962
Location: Meller home.
Mrs. Ford:  "bruises on her face"
Mr. Ford:    "[bruises] on her face"
 

 

 

That's it Tracy. They all saw Marina's bruise at the end of August and beginning of September 1952. Elena Hall said that Bouhe took her to see Marina in July, at which time she saw the bruise. But according to Bouhe, he didn't see the bruise till late August. So Elena Hall was mistaken about the month. She must have also seen the bruise in late August.

Jeane de Mohrenschildt also saw the bruise, but didn't say when. She said, "We saw her with a black eye once." Notice that she said "once!"

George Bouhe said he saw a "black eye" on two occasions. The first occasion is noted above. The second occasion has been discredited. First of all, he wasn't even present to see Marina's face on the occasion he describes. Second, the person who did see Marina (Mrs. Meller) made no mention of a bruise! (See this post.).

I didn't list George de Mohrenschildt's testimony because he's been shown to be untrustworthy. But it should be no different than his wife's. And she specifically said they saw only one black eye.

And of course I didn't list the outlier l.i.a.r, Alexander Kleinlerer. But for kicks I just looked and found that he doesn't say anything about bruises.

So I repeat, they all saw Marina's bruise at the end of August and beginning of September 1952. There was a bruise just one time. 

Sandy,

Your feedback is biased.   You deliberately left out witnesses because of your personal bias.   

 

Paul,

I didn't leave anybody out... at least not deliberately.

You probably didn't notice my mention of Jeane de Mohrenschildt because her testimony didn't fit in the timeline. I did write what she said below the timeline. I left out George de Mohrenschildt's testimony because he's been shown to be untrustworthy regarding the bruising. (He doesn't say much more than the others anyway. Yes, he did see the bruise. Big deal.)  I wrote that below the timeline. And the, of course, there is the outlier l.i.a.r, Alexander Kleinlerer. He actually made no mention of bruises. Anyway, I commented on him too.

 

Quote

You actually left out Lee Harvey Oswald's own mother -- for just one of many.    This is biased reporting.

You're right... my mistake. But in my analysis and many other places I made her the most important witness. I forgot her in my post to Tracy because she wasn't among the White Russian friends that I have listed in my timeline.

 

Quote

You actually left out Lee Harvey Oswald's own mother -- for just one of many.    This is biased reporting.

I did NOT leave out "many." As far as I can figure, I forgot only Marguerite.

 

Edited September 5, 2017 by Sandy Larsen

[Sandy Larsen]

On 9/3/2017 at 7:49 AM, Sandy Larsen said:

New Conclusion

Oswald may have hit his wife. Once.

I have an important update.

In this 2013 New York Time article, Lee and Marina's friend writes about the experiences he had with the couple during the summer of 1962. After reading it, I recalled what he'd written about an incident where Marina had fallen to the ground. His description of her head hitting the hard ground made me wonder if that fall could have explained Marina's facial bruising that she initially said was a result of her running into a door in the dark, and later said was the result of Lee hitting her. Here is what their friend, Paul Gregory, wrote:

Marina took a step backward and fell, thumping her head on the hard, dry ground and dropping June. The thud was so loud that I feared she might be seriously injured; Lee, however, screamed at her for her clumsiness as she lay curled on the ground clutching for her baby.

I checked that paragraph in the article to see if I could find the timing, and I discovered it happened at the latter part of August. I found it quite a coincidence that Marina had likely received bruises on her head at pretty much the same time she (allegedly) did from her husband's hand.

As a result of reading that account a couple days ago, I revised my earlier conclusion from "Oswald probably hit his wife. Once" to "Oswald may have hit his wife. Once."  I figured the fall may have been the actual cause of the bruise and that Marina hid that fact from others out of her shame for dropping the baby.

Well, not long after making that change, it occurred to me that Gregory had likely seen the bruise on Marina's face himself. So I checked the article again and found that he was the person who had introduced the Oswalds to the White Russians. It was actually at that time that the White Russian group saw Marina's bruise! So Gregory most definitely did see the bruise.

Now here is the odd thing about this whole story. If you read Gregory's article, you will see that he takes every chance possible to write something bad about Oswald. Indeed, the reason he wrote about the Marina falling incident was clearly so he could point out how badly Oswald treated Marina after her obviously-accidental fall. (I'll be the first to say Oswald was wrong in responding to the fall the way he did. On the other hand, I can see why a young person who hasn't learned to control his emotions could lash out like that upon seeing his or her baby dropped.) Anyway....

The whole article is like that, Gregory saying bad things about Oswald.

Now here comes the pertinent question:  Why didn't Gregory say ANYTHING about Oswald hitting his wife?

There is simply no way the bruise on Marina's face could have escaped Gregory, and the accusations of Oswald having hit Marina. Read for yourself what he wrote, beginning with what I quoted above. He writes about Marina falling and Oswald being angry with her as she lies on the ground. And in the very next paragraph he starts talking about Bouhe and Meller (some of the White Russians) and how they became friends with the Oswalds. This was when everybody saw the bruise!

Are we to believe that Gregory attacked Oswald on everything else, but spared him the wife beating rap? I don't buy it.

I believe Gregory didn't mention the wife beating thing because he knew the bruise was caused by Marina falling and hitting the hard ground with a loud thud. And I am now convinced that the fall was the source of that bruise. I am updating my conclusion accordingly, here and in Post 3.

Updated Conclusion

Oswald probably did not hit his wife. Her bruise was likely due to the fall she experienced in the latter part of August, 1962, as witnessed by a friend of the Oswald couple, Paul Gregory. Marina probably blamed her husband to get sympathy and favors from her White Russian friends.

 

Edited September 5, 2017 by Sandy Larsen