"The Lansdale Deviation"

[David Andrews]

Interesting Dallas Report podcast with minority opinion on Ed Lansdale's involvement in the assassination planning, based on prior CIA internal documents among Helms, Harvey and McCone:

https://www.spreaker.com/user/7338953/107-april-8-2017-the-lansdale-deviation

On the other hand...if Dealey Plaza was "the blackest of black operations"...then...

One question to be considered: Why would Helms claim in a memo that Lansdale was a political fixture at CIA who had to be kept on and worked around, despite his unworkable contributions?  Who put and maintained Lansdale in this unassailable position?  The podcast cites deputy Defense secretary Roswell Gilpatric for making Lansdale a general.  Fletcher Prouty said Dulles urged him to put Lansdale on LeMay's promotions list.  But who kept Lansdale above Helms, Harvey and McCone's disapprobation?

Edited February 5, 2019 by David Andrews

[Paul Brancato]

Who do you think David? Interesting question for sure.

[David Andrews]

I dunno yet.  Prouty claimed that CIA was calling the shots on Lansdale's tenure at Defense. 

How many serving military officers were ever in line for an ambassadorship?

EDIT: Helms' memo responded to Harvey's complaint (seconded by McCone) that Lansdale's plans to augment Operation Mongoose were ungainly and inoperable.  Helms noted that Lansdale was useful for work that other CIA leadership would otherwise be tasked with themselves - so it's possible that Helms' recommendation that Lansdale be handled politically and not bureaucratically in future was Helms' indulgence and protection of Lansdale, in case of need.  What's interesting is Helms' expression that it was common knowledge among them that Lansdale's position in the Agency was not to be tampered with. 

Yet Lansdale retires soon...

Edited February 5, 2019 by David Andrews

[Cliff Varnell]

If my job was to mastermind the murder of JFK I wouldn't be any where near Dealey Plaza at the time of the tramps photos.

If my job was to manage the patsy chain and the murder of Lee Harvey Oswald I'd be in the plaza bringing back-up patsies in from the cold.

E Howard Hunt wore the patsy jacket for Watergate, Charles V. Harrelson wore the patsy jacket for Judge Woods -- my top prospects for the back-up patsy roles called for by contingency plans to blame the hit on right wingers.

 

Edited February 6, 2019 by Cliff Varnell

[Michael Clark]

23 hours ago, David Andrews said:

Interesting Dallas Report podcast with minority opinion on Ed Lansdale's involvement in the assassination planning, based on prior CIA internal documents among Helms, Harvey and McCone:

https://www.spreaker.com/user/7338953/107-april-8-2017-the-lansdale-deviation

On the other hand...if Dealey Plaza was "the blackest of black operations"...then...

One question to be considered: Why would Helms claim in a memo that Lansdale was a political fixture at CIA who had to be kept on and worked around, despite his unworkable contributions?  Who put and maintained Lansdale in this unassailable position?  The podcast cites deputy Defense secretary Roswell Gilpatric for making Lansdale a general.  Fletcher Prouty said Dulles urged him to put Lansdale on LeMay's promotions list.  But who kept Lansdale above Helms, Harvey and McCone's disapprobation?

I have tried to listen to these podcasts before and, like this one, I cannot suffer the time-filling devices he uses to fill-out his show. I would like to hear a synopsis, skip to interesting sections, or press-on listening if there were some assurances that it gets better as it drags-on.

[David Andrews]

On 2/5/2019 at 8:06 PM, Michael Clark said:

I have tried to listen to these podcasts before and, like this one, I cannot suffer the time-filling devices he uses to fill-out his show. I would like to hear a synopsis, skip to interesting sections, or press-on listening if there were some assurances that it gets better as it drags-on.

I hear you.  But so far Dallas Action podcasts are generally worth suffering through for the gems.  And I hate everything, so...

Every podcast on conspiracy topics is a tendentiousness crapshoot, anyway..."You never know what you gonna get."

One way to outflank the MSM would be to sound as professional as it does.  But even the best CT podcast out there is handicapped by crushing synthesizer theme music.

Edited February 7, 2019 by David Andrews

[B. A. Copeland]

On 2/5/2019 at 5:06 PM, Michael Clark said:

I have tried to listen to these podcasts before and, like this one, I cannot suffer the time-filling devices he uses to fill-out his show. I would like to hear a synopsis, skip to interesting sections, or press-on listening if there were some assurances that it gets better as it drags-on.

Well typically, Doug's shows has an intro song > sponsor message > podcast > a break/interim song > podcast > outro song type format. Its not so bad and honestly you can skip. I would encourage you to check out his podcasts as they are quite good and certainly worth listening to even if there were undesirable audio bits. The good far outweighs any bad someone might find whilst listening. One things for sure, I don't think anyone can walk away from his shows thinking it was horrible in content. His guests are also pretty learned in the case (Akhtar, Hancock, Boylan, Simpich, Clark, Brown, Kamp, Rubenstein, et.al)

As for the subject, I personally will not conclude that we see Lansdale in Dealey. I'm open but even Krulak believing it is him doesn't prove it as such. Its possible but nothing concrete as of yet. Has anyone ever asked Lansdale about the famous photo when he was living?

Edited February 12, 2019 by B. A. Copeland

[David McLean]

Just guessing that Lansdale's connection(perhaps even case officer status )with Ngo Dinh Diem  was an important factor. Those who got rid of Diem and his brother then had little further use for Lansdale and cleared the decks for all that followed. I believe the  CIA station in Saigon was in real flux from mid 1963, with John Richardson and Peer Da Silva holding the fort as the US geared up for war over 1963-64.

[B. A. Copeland]

Thanks for that bit of info David. Much appreciated.

[David Andrews]

On 2/8/2019 at 10:03 PM, David McLean said:

Just guessing that Lansdale's connection(perhaps even case officer status )with Ngo Dinh Diem  was an important factor. Those who got rid of Diem and his brother then had little further use for Lansdale and cleared the decks for all that followed. I believe the  CIA station in Saigon was in real flux from mid 1963, with John Richardson and Peer Da Silva holding the fort as the US geared up for war over 1963-64.

Not a bad interpretation.  Did you listen to the internal documents as read in the podcast, though?

[Sandy Larsen]

On 2/7/2019 at 3:19 PM, B. A. Copeland said:

I personally will not conclude that we see Lansdale in Dealey. I'm open but even Krulak believing it is him doesn't prove it as such.

 

Have you considered the following:

The tramps photo shows alleged Lansdale wearing glasses. The lens part of his glasses don't cast a shadow on the fence behind him. This pretty much proves that the glasses are fake (either plain glass or no glass) because real glasses always bend light and create a shadow. (Try it.)

How many people do you know walk around wearing fake glasses? IMO the odds are very high that the Lansdale figure is somehow involved in the assassination and is taking a simple measure to help conceal his identity.

 

Edited February 12, 2019 by Sandy Larsen

[B. A. Copeland]

22 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Have you considered the following:

The tramps photo shows alleged Lansdale wearing glasses. The lens part of his glasses don't cast a shadow on the fence behind him. This pretty much proves that the glasses are fake (either plain glass or no glass) because real glasses always bend light and create a shadow. (Try it.)

How many people do you know walk around wearing fake glasses? IMO the odds are very high that the Lansdale figure is somehow involved in the assassination and is taking a simple measure to help conceal his identity.

 

Well, given that we, as students and researchers do not fully know *all* personnel involved, it could be almost anyone, and it is logical to conclude that out of that “anyone” someone could actually look similar to Lansdale.

As far as the question about fake glasses, well....I mean I guess I know about as many folks who’d have fake secret service badges that day as well lol. I mean to see disguises is all part of the operation that terrible day. Badges, glasses, clothing, you name it. I’d imagine that whatever assists in accomplishing the covert operation and evading enemy capture is key.

You bring up thoughtful points but in the end, personally? It could be Lansdale or not. I’ve not come across any concrete evidence that isn’t without reasonable doubt. I remain an agnostic about the figure.

I’d like to know if Lansdale was ever asked about this super famous photograph and I’d also like to know if any researchers ever worked on figuring out where he was on 11/22/63.