Critique of Jim DiEugenio's Destiny Betrayed

[Steve Roe]

On 5/12/2021 at 4:55 PM, James DiEugenio said:

This will be the last time I reply on this thread.

I will not debate people who, as with Litwin and Gerdes, do not do their homework.

In addition to my talks with Gary Schoener, here are three other public sources

See CE 3067

Probe Volume 6 No 5, p. 4

Probe Vol. 2 No. 6 pp. 13-14

Adios Mr Roe, at least for here and now.

When you talked with Mr. Schoener, did he tell you about the "Silver Slipper Club"? 

It had nothing to do with the Silver Slipper Club in Eunice, LA, where the Cheramie story in your Probe articles mention. 

It was the Silver Slipper Club in Las Vegas, Mr. DiEugenio.

Here you can read Gary Schoener's report for yourself (4th paragraph). 

http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg Subject Index Files/F Disk/Fenandez Julio Cesar Dr/Item 06.pdf

[W. Tracy Parnell]

Good work again Steve. Fred has a blog post out with an excellent summary of the whole silly affair:

Did a Piece of Paper with the Names of Jack Ruby and Lee Oswald Provide a Link to Rose Cherami? (onthetrailofdelusion.com)

[Steve Roe]

22 hours ago, W. Tracy Parnell said:

Good work again Steve. Fred has a blog post out with an excellent summary of the whole silly affair:

Did a Piece of Paper with the Names of Jack Ruby and Lee Oswald Provide a Link to Rose Cherami? (onthetrailofdelusion.com)

Thanks Tracy. 

Yes Fred does a good job detailing all the documents and correspondence. The bottom line here is the "Ruby Slipper" allegedly written on a trailer advertisement had nothing to do with the Rose Cheramie "story". It was the "Ruby Slipper" casino in Las Vegas. Absolutely no question about that. 

As usual, if Mr. DiEugenio hasn't put me on ignore, he is most welcome to comment directly on these topics. 

Other than some teenager prank meme, the comments have dropped to zero here. 

More to come in the near future.......

[Andrew Prutsok]

On 5/14/2021 at 8:30 AM, Steve Roe said:

 

3. Probe Vol. 2 No. 6 pp. 13-14  (I believe that was a typo, should be Vol. 2 No. 5 September 22, 1995)  This is Lisa Pease's article on "Gun Runner Ruby and the CIA, Part Two". Pease makes a mention of the Margaret Hoover incident.  Again she repeats most of the information in CE 3067, and just her own speculation on Dr. Julio Fernandez, and short on evidence. Another opinion based article. 

 

Neither really here nor there, just kind of interesting to me at least, as an admirer of Lisa Pease's work on the JFK and RFK assassination,  but I stumbled recently on a 2003 Google Groups thread in which Pease was apparently spreading rumors that "aging actresses" Merle Oberon and Jean Seberg were sleeping with members of the Black Panthers in about 1970.

I'm a bit of classic film buff as well and had never seen or heard anything about Merle Oberon engaging in this activity and searched for anything corroborating it and came up completely empty...not even a mention. Oberon would have been in her late 50s at the time.

The Seberg allegations were even more troubling. Seberg, whom Pease described as "aging" at 32,  did certainly donate to the Panthers and other left wing causes, which prompted the FBI (COINTELPRO) to begin a smear campaign against her in which it was alleged that she was carrying the baby of a member of the Black Panthers.  Seberg went into labor and delivered a 4-lb baby girl prematurely. The child died a couple days later. She had her an open casket funeral to show the baby was white. 

This is from Wikipedia about it:

The FBI operation against Seberg, directly overseen by J. Edgar Hoover, used COINTELPRO program techniques to harass, intimidate, defame, and discredit her.^[8][9] The FBI's stated goal was an unspecified "neutralization" of Seberg with a subsidiary objective to "cause her embarrassment and serve to cheapen her image with the public", while taking the "usual precautions to avoid identification of the Bureau".^[34] FBI strategy and modalities can be found in FBI inter-office memos.^[35]

The smear campaign continued involving in-person surveillance and wire taps, resulting in her being effectively black listed by Hollywood.  Apparently it continued right up to the time of her suicide in 1979, and no doubt contributed to it.

I just find it odd that a noted, respected researcher would air these thinly-sourced sensational rumors on a public forum without offering a shred of evidence of their veracity, other than it was something some woman told her.

If this is not the same Lisa Pease, then I apologize for bringing it up. If it is, then I'll look a little more skeptically on her work moving forward.

https://groups.google.com/g/alt.gossip.celebrities/c/Sd0yvcmdXQ4?pli=1

[Steve Roe]

17 hours ago, Andrew Prutsok said:

Neither really here nor there, just kind of interesting to me at least, as an admirer of Lisa Pease's work on the JFK and RFK assassination,  but I stumbled recently on a 2003 Google Groups thread in which Pease was apparently spreading rumors that "aging actresses" Merle Oberon and Jean Seberg were sleeping with members of the Black Panthers in about 1970.

I'm a bit of classic film buff as well and had never seen or heard anything about Merle Oberon engaging in this activity and searched for anything corroborating it and came up completely empty...not even a mention. Oberon would have been in her late 50s at the time.

The Seberg allegations were even more troubling. Seberg, whom Pease described as "aging" at 32,  did certainly donate to the Panthers and other left wing causes, which prompted the FBI (COINTELPRO) to begin a smear campaign against her in which it was alleged that she was carrying the baby of a member of the Black Panthers.  Seberg went into labor and delivered a 4-lb baby girl prematurely. The child died a couple days later. She had her an open casket funeral to show the baby was white. 

This is from Wikipedia about it:

The FBI operation against Seberg, directly overseen by J. Edgar Hoover, used COINTELPRO program techniques to harass, intimidate, defame, and discredit her.^[8][9] The FBI's stated goal was an unspecified "neutralization" of Seberg with a subsidiary objective to "cause her embarrassment and serve to cheapen her image with the public", while taking the "usual precautions to avoid identification of the Bureau".^[34] FBI strategy and modalities can be found in FBI inter-office memos.^[35]

The smear campaign continued involving in-person surveillance and wire taps, resulting in her being effectively black listed by Hollywood.  Apparently it continued right up to the time of her suicide in 1979, and no doubt contributed to it.

I just find it odd that a noted, respected researcher would air these thinly-sourced sensational rumors on a public forum without offering a shred of evidence of their veracity, other than it was something some woman told her.

If this is not the same Lisa Pease, then I apologize for bringing it up. If it is, then I'll look a little more skeptically on her work moving forward.

https://groups.google.com/g/alt.gossip.celebrities/c/Sd0yvcmdXQ4?pli=1

Andrew, I believe that is the same Lisa Pease.

Ms. Pease published a book a few years back, "A Lie too big to Fail" about the RFK assassination. In that book Ms. Pease theorizes that Sirhan fired "Blanks" from his 0.22 caliber Iver-Johnson revolver. Yes you read that right, BLANKS. 

You are well founded in applying a healthy dose of skepticism in her published works.