What is the Deep State?

[David Andrews]

So, wait - Americans stood by while Iraq was practically destroyed, only to pay $6.99 at the pump today?  Aren't criminals rewarded for countenancing murder anymore?

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, David Andrews said:

So, wait - Americans stood by while Iraq was practically destroyed, only to pay $6.99 at the pump today?  Aren't criminals rewarded for countenancing murder anymore?

Shell & BP treble profits based on the same quarter last year. Turns out war and scarcity is good for business. But it's gotta be ordinary folk who suffer. 
 

A friend who works for an oil company in Aberdeen was on a huge Microsoft teams call last year. The CEO said: what we need is a good war. My friend questioned the statement as to whether it was ethical. They muted him on the call and he’s never had a promotion or bonus since. 

[David Andrews]

21 hours ago, Chris Barnard said:

Shell & BP treble profits based on the same quarter last year. Turns out war and scarcity is good for business. But it's gotta be ordinary folk who suffer. 
 

 

It hardly seems fair.  I mean, if gas prices had lowered after we killed all those Iraqis, we could sleep well at night and have faith in government, right?

We never got our war dividend or our peace dividend.

[Guest]

4 hours ago, David Andrews said:

It hardly seems fair.  I mean, if gas prices had lowered after we killed all those Iraqis, we could sleep well at night and have faith in government, right?

We never got our war dividend or our peace dividend.

This is true. It illustrates the underlying mindset of the public. ie what they’d turn a blind eye to and find acceptable. We might wait 10-20 years to view Russia / Ukraine in a slightly different light. Most of us like me swallowed the Iraq 1 & 2 propaganda. In hind sight it was infinitely more nuanced and corrupt. 

[Paul Brancato]

Yes - no peace dividend, because we had a new enemy - the Islamic state. Invasion of Iraq did not enrich our coffers with oil, as predicted. 
The question I’m pondering now:the current inflation is being blamed officially on supply chain problems due to Covid and Chinese shutdowns, and the Ukraine war. Federal reserve is now aggressively raising interest rates to, they say, combat inflation. The US dollar is at multi-year highs relative to other currencies. Strangely, the ruble has gotten much stronger of late. 
Is it weird to anyone that inflation is being blamed, perhaps caused, by our erstwhile enemies? Is that coincidence? Unintended consequences? I’m wondering …
 

Edited June 15, 2022 by Paul Brancato

[Paul Brancato]

I’ll answer it with another suggestion, which is that it’s very convenient for the US to blame China and Russia for the current inflationary spike. Maybe it’s largely corporate greed. I also wonder whether this guarantees a Republican takeover of Congress in 2022, amd whether that might be causative. 

[Benjamin Cole]

2 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

I’ll answer it with another suggestion, which is that it’s very convenient for the US to blame China and Russia for the current inflationary spike. Maybe it’s largely corporate greed. I also wonder whether this guarantees a Republican takeover of Congress in 2022, amd whether that might be causative. 

¡IMHO!

Paul-

I may think the word "takeover" is loaded, as it suggests gamed elections, but you may be correct that the Donks will get trampled by the 'Phants come November. 

Biden inherited a troubled economy, and he will get blamed for it. China and Russia are doing what they do, and that is not helping. Inflation was probably baked into the cake by the time Biden got into office. Recession is pending? 

The US never raised federal taxes on gasoline, and so remains dependent on fossil fuels much more so than a Japan or Europe. 

On the other hand, Trump got blamed for C19, which swept the developed world with similar results everywhere, and yet stuck on Trump---he probably lost the election on C19 and the economic fallout thereof (as well as his truly awful character and personality). 

The Donks want to make Trump the issue again, and not lower living standards, the destruction of the middle class, or the $1.4 trillion spent every year on the global guard service for multinationals.

Biden want to cut tariffs on China imports, open the borders to cheap illegal labor. Oooof. 

My guess is the Donks have overplayed the Trump card, and the ID politics card. 

But we will see, come November. 

And remember, when the 'Phants sweep the Donks---US election results are above reproach! 

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

Yes - no peace dividend, because we had a new enemy - the Islamic state. Invasion of Iraq did not enrich our coffers with oil, as predicted. 
The question I’m pondering now:the current inflation is being blamed officially on supply chain problems due to Covid and Chinese shutdowns, and the Ukraine war. Federal reserve is now aggressively raising interest rates to, they say, combat inflation. The US dollar is at multi-year highs relative to other currencies. Strangely, the ruble has gotten much stronger of late. 
Is it weird to anyone that inflation is being blamed, perhaps caused, by our erstwhile enemies? Is that coincidence? Unintended consequences? I’m wondering …
 

How significant is the creation of new money during the pandemic? $13trn 

IMHO Russia knew this would be a consequence. China would have anticipated it. US experts would have predicted it. 
 

If the guys with the crystal balls at the WEF are to be right; that we’ll own nothing by 2030, then we should expect more of this. The emptying of our coffers and the flowing of wealth upwards. 
 

If you were ahead of the curve on these disasters for most of society, you’re assets wouldn’t be in cash, they’d be in the commodities that are becoming more scarce and that are increasing in value. That sounds simplistic but, its the long and the short of it. 
 

 

[Paul Brancato]

10 hours ago, Chris Barnard said:

How significant is the creation of new money during the pandemic? $13trn 

IMHO Russia knew this would be a consequence. China would have anticipated it. US experts would have predicted it. 
 

If the guys with the crystal balls at the WEF are to be right; that we’ll own nothing by 2030, then we should expect more of this. The emptying of our coffers and the flowing of wealth upwards. 
 

If you were ahead of the curve on these disasters for most of society, you’re assets wouldn’t be in cash, they’d be in the commodities that are becoming more scarce and that are increasing in value. That sounds simplistic but, its the long and the short of it. 
 

 

The problem I have with the WEF theory is that it is so chaotic that there is no way any law and order could exist. Global Corporations are so profitable that I fail to see any reason they would be so disruptive. Could you flesh out how you view that new world order and how this plays out in that scenario? 

[Pat Speer]

On 6/14/2022 at 7:18 AM, David Andrews said:

So, wait - Americans stood by while Iraq was practically destroyed, only to pay $6.99 at the pump today?  Aren't criminals rewarded for countenancing murder anymore?

The current problem is the global market for energy and food. Russia and Ukraine energy and food are currently unavailable, so their former customers are buying from American companies and competing with the American consumer. Thus, more demand for the same pie. Thus, higher prices. 

If we were to withdraw from these global markets, moreover, it would open up a new can of worms. Some of our allies would come crawling back to Russia, and embolden Hitler to move on from the Sudetenland to Poland. So we're pretty much screwed as long as Putin plays Risk or whatever that board game was where you conquered the world. 

One solution might be for Biden to put a limit on profits, and force American companies to sell their products at a lower mark-up here than they get elsewhere. But this is a no-win situation for a Democrat. He would immediately be labeled a socialist and the big companies would flood the airwaves and internet with commercials and exposes on how Joe Biden is a wanna-be Stalin, or some such thing. 

So if we're looking for a Deep State. That would be it, IMO. "The business of America is business". And boy, do they know it... 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

The problem I have with the WEF theory is that it is so chaotic that there is no way any law and order could exist. Global Corporations are so profitable that I fail to see any reason they would be so disruptive. Could you flesh out how you view that new world order and how this plays out in that scenario? 

As controversial as it sounds. They are the marketing department for the NWO. It’s the open conspiracy. Have you read Schwabs book? They collapse the old system and and provide the solution, people will be grateful, thinking they only did the latter. Look at the way they are marketing the Great Reset as a once in a lifetime opportunity to change the system. Yet their supporters are the poster boys for the old system. 
Every crisis is an opportunity to maximise profits, not a setback. They’ll collapse the system that they know has a shelf life according to their schedule. People in despair will welcome in technocracy and a new system which will be a wolf in sheep’s clothing. 
 

I think C19 won’t be our last pandemic this decade and we’ll see a series of conflicts/crisis and things that immiserate the average person. Do we think experts didn’t know what the pandemic measures do in realtime? There were no voices in MSM warning of the consequences. 
 

[Guest]

A GF just sent me this right now....

https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/wefs-scary-ideas-future-cola/?fbclid=IwAR2TcXrTzZAz-e7aRxxpesDeQBKfXI7KmsBf8HOfcczuQO2dH77wE9p74ac&fs=e&s=cl

[Paul Brancato]

5 hours ago, Chris Barnard said:

A GF just sent me this right now....

https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/wefs-scary-ideas-future-cola/?fbclid=IwAR2TcXrTzZAz-e7aRxxpesDeQBKfXI7KmsBf8HOfcczuQO2dH77wE9p74ac&fs=e&s=cl

When I read something like this I try to fact check. It’s mostly spin. Naomi Klein’s article in The Intercept buys into some of this, but she at least can see the spin. What started as criticism from the Left of all such Supra-National Capitalist groups (corporations and their leaders) has morphed into criticism from the Right which now blends all that with their old bugaboos - the New World Order, anti-Nationalist globalist agenda, big government control of our lives (which covers Covid policy, gun control, free (hate) speech and more. Similar to the Right wing donning of the anti-Deep State mantle. Now - do I think something is terribly wrong? You bet. I just don’t think we’ve really identified the enemy. I’m weary of the defenders of the Democratic Party, whose recent leaders have failed, and even more weary of the Republicans. That the only bipartisan thing they can agree on is sending arms to Ukraine, or Iraq Afghanistan Syria Yemen etc etc - all of it shameful and done in the service of Empire and the MIC. 
 

Edited June 17, 2022 by Paul Brancato

[David Andrews]

9 hours ago, Pat Speer said:

The current problem is the global market for energy and food. Russia and Ukraine energy and food are currently unavailable, so their former customers are buying from American companies and competing with the American consumer. Thus, more demand for the same pie. Thus, higher prices. 

If we were to withdraw from these global markets, moreover, it would open up a new can of worms. Some of our allies would come crawling back to Russia, and embolden Hitler to move on from the Sudetenland to Poland. So we're pretty much screwed as long as Putin plays Risk or whatever that board game was where you conquered the world. 

One solution might be for Biden to put a limit on profits, and force American companies to sell their products at a lower mark-up here than they get elsewhere. But this is a no-win situation for a Democrat. He would immediately be labeled a socialist and the big companies would flood the airwaves and internet with commercials and exposes on how Joe Biden is a wanna-be Stalin, or some such thing. 

So if we're looking for a Deep State. That would be it, IMO. "The business of America is business". And boy, do they know it... 

It's true enough, Pat.  But for all the murder Americans have stood by and ignored, we all ought to be slouching on thrones of skulls, drinking from the craniums of dead overseas children.  You pick the country.  I fancy East Timor.

We're really getting short-shrifted here.  But, complain and they'll kill you, too.

Edited June 17, 2022 by David Andrews

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Paul Brancato said:

When I read something like this I try to fact check. It’s mostly spin. Naomi Klein’s article in The Intercept buys into some of this, but she at least can see the spin. What started as criticism from the Left of all such Supra-National Capitalist groups (corporations and their leaders) has morphed into criticism from the Right which now blends all that with their old bugaboos - the New World Order, anti-Nationalist globalist agenda, big government control of our lives (which covers Covid policy, gun control, free (hate) speech and more. Similar to the Right wing donning of the anti-Deep State mantle. Now - do I think something is terribly wrong? You bet. I just don’t think we’ve really identified the enemy. I’m weary of the defenders of the Democratic Party, whose recent leaders have failed, and even more weary of the Republicans. That the only bipartisan thing they can agree on is sending arms to Ukraine, or Iraq Afghanistan Syria Yemen etc etc - all of it shameful and done in the service of Empire and the MIC. 
 

Hi Paul, 

I have a couple of things things to say. What did you think of my first post and explanation? 

If you were going to control the USA, the dominant military and economic force in the world and China, a country outwardly appearing to compete for that role, how would you do it? What I mean is; would such an undertaking benefit from tremendous organisation and structure? Or, could you do without it? 

As you know, I like to independently think, and often start with "who benefits" and work backwards to an event, as opposed to started with a SCAD (state crime against democracy) and work outwards. Both methods should match. If a random collection of variables converge and it benefits a group of people once, that can be an isolated thing. If it happens time and time again, it's a pattern. If we get a pattern that defies probability, then our way of thinking surely most centre on that idea of the "cui bono" logic. 

Ultimately, when the Defender and co are running articles like the one I skim read before firing it over, lt's perhaps telling. Its becoming not quite commonplace, but, popular. Now this could be an idea that is infectious but, it could also be the normalising of an agenda that's gone on for 100 years. If the agenda does exist, I think this would be the final stage before it really comes to fruition. We actually see the normalisation of all sorts of things via media, film, editorials and in popular culture. Let's take the CIA for example as just one of many organisations who appear as a facilitator or corrupt doings. Film now openly portrays them as doing tremendous wrongs but, they lace such productions with a hero archetype of vies against some bad dudes in the same organisation. We leave the cinema thinking not thinking that the organisation is very dangerous but, that there is good and bad within it but, that a hero triumphs for good. This then explains away our past 60-70 years of wrongful policy. There are those who believe in 'predictive programming' as a tool and IMO I don't see why it wouldn't work. Measuring public opinion I can see a lot of apathy, timidity and the feeling of futility. Individual thinkers are in short supply and groupthink is the norm. People just crave entertainment and pleasure, anything that distracts them from a reality that troubles of nags the subconscious. I think the social scientists and psychologists have done a great job at this. We have an afraid world and relative safety in the west since WW2, a constant supply of fear and an ever increasing insatiable appetite for safety. What this all largely amounts to is taking away the public appetite for mass civil unrest and potential revolution. The media set at opposing poles spins any catastrophic events on factions linked to political ideologies, or, on some supposedly random things like a pandemic or mad Russo tyrant with illusions of new empire or taking back the old. What never is pointed out is the oligarchy, the beneficiaries, raking in wealth at an almost ever increasing rate. ie the people who own the media and their class. 

IMHO, we're at the point where various alternative media sources are waking up and smelling the coffee. They might not exactly understand the how (the finer details) but, they know, like yourself, that something is happening and it isn't good for us. You mentioned you spend an hour per day studying the markets. I have another question; if you did subscribe to the idea that the Davos lot, the WEF were pulling the strings globally and invested accordingly, would you have made money or lost money? I sat and had this conversation last night at dinner with a good friend who has a background as and qualifications in economics. He is staunchly pro capitalism and says we need more free markets and that the system has been corrupted. He too, like me, thinks we're in a rigged game, as the oligarchy has it tentacles controlling everything they possibly can and that he can see socialism being used as the tool to completely stop any social mobility, there will be no way to go up social strata and no way to go down. He doesn't call this system any of the terms we use here in this thread but, his view is very similar to mine. Again, I'll ask; would this work better if there. was a great deal of organisation to accomplish this, or could it be done through whispers and winging it? I believe it needs a lot of organisation, which starts with controlling the money supply and bodies like the CFR and Royal Institute of International Affairs. The MO for control seems eerily like the one Prouty talked about when he described how the CIA infiltrated the military. 

What do you make of the long list of illustrious WEF future leaders? What is the actual function of the WEF?