Question About Harvey, Lee, and the "Two Marguerites"

[Henry Frost]

The 1945 "Marguerite Claverie Oswald" has the same mole on her right lower eyelid as the older "Marguerite Oswald":

Edited September 4, 2022 by Henry Frost

[Guest]

51 minutes ago, Henry Frost said:

The 1945 "Marguerite Claverie Oswald" has the same mole on her right lower eyelid as the older "Marguerite Oswald":

That's pretty clear to me. Thanks.

[Kirk Gallaway]

15 hours ago, Gerry Down said:

I tracked down the fake Marguerite:

https://youtu.be/z7HfSAw0LRI

 

Yeah,  obviously a joke. Very funny Gerry.

But I did take the time to track her down and her turnaround is rather uplifting. She  completely left behind a sordid past and unlike the fake Marguerite, dared to live a vital life to a very late age. In the course of her life she married a several  more times and attained notoriety as a relationship counselor to young people.   Never give up!

 

https://youtu.be/ENTiMnGpTck

[W. Niederhut]

Henry, 

Two questions.

1)  Where did you find this enlarged 1945 photo of Marguerite Claverie Oswald (above?)

2)  Any possibility that it has been photo-shopped by people promoting the WCR Lone Nut narrative?

 

Also, where is the alleged mole in the following photos of Marguerite Claverie Oswald?

 

Below: Marguerite Claverie Oswald (1960)

Look, Ma-- no mole!

Below: Marguerite Claverie Oswald (1945)

 

Below: (?) Marguerite Oswald (1963)

Notice the mole below the right eyelid-- not on the eyelid

Edited September 4, 2022 by W. Niederhut

[Gerry Down]

1 hour ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Yeah,  obviously a joke. Very funny Gerry.

But I did take the time to track her down and her turnaround is rather uplifting. She  completely left behind a sordid past and unlike the fake Marguerite, dared to live a vital life to a very late age. In the course of her life she married a several  more times and attained notoriety as a relationship counselor to young people.   Never give up!

 

https://youtu.be/ENTiMnGpTck

Another fake Marguerite 😄

[W. Niederhut]

C'mon Kirk and Gerry.  I've got nothing against having a few Margaritas, but...

Do you two guys really believe that the two Marguerites in the photographs (above) are the same person?

My hunch is that one of the McAdams-type WCR/CIA propagandists photo-shopped the 1945 wedding photo to pencil in a mole on the eyelid.

(But they sketched it on the lid, instead of below the lid.)

Edited September 4, 2022 by W. Niederhut

[Henry Frost]

42 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Where did you find this enlarged 1945 photo of Marguerite Claverie Oswald (above?)

I used a higher resolution image to start with, found here:

https://www.gettyimages.ca/photos/marguerite-oswald

The images you posted (with no moles) are low resolution or heavily retouched.  I enlarged the photo myself using software (it's like a digital blow up).

Here's a direct link to the image I used:

https://i.imgur.com/PqPbk2a.jpg

 

Edit: the digital enlargement does not "add" information, just makes it easier to see.  It was not uncommon for studio photographers to retouch photos to make their clients happier. So when you say "Any possibility that it has been photo-shopped by people promoting the WCR Lone Nut narrative? ", I would say the opposite is true in this case. The use of blurry low res images to hide information...

Edited September 4, 2022 by Henry Frost

[Henry Frost]

17 hours ago, Gerry Down said:

I tracked down the fake Marguerite:

https://youtu.be/z7HfSAw0LRI

 

I have saved this for, uh, future analysis.

[Jonathan Cohen]

3 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

As for the alleged "debunking" of John Armstrong's doppelganger research about Oswald, I'm underwhelmed. 

There seems to be ample evidence of Oswald doppelgangers.   I actually reviewed several Harvey & Lee threads in the forum archives yesterday before starting this thread, and didn't find any bona fide "debunking" of Armstrong's theory.

There's a HUGE difference between Armstrong's ludicrous doppelganger theory and the theory that the one and only historical Lee Harvey Oswald may have been impersonated at certain points prior to the assassination. There's actual evidence for the latter. As Jeremy points out, the evidence for the former is completely built on Armstrong's misinterpretation of documents and photos.

[W. Niederhut]

40 minutes ago, Henry Frost said:

I used a higher resolution image to start with, found here:

https://www.gettyimages.ca/photos/marguerite-oswald

The images you posted (with no moles) are low resolution or heavily retouched.  I enlarged the photo myself using software (it's like a digital blow up).

Here's a direct link to the image I used:

https://i.imgur.com/PqPbk2a.jpg

 

Edit: the digital enlargement does not "add" information, just makes it easier to see.  It was not uncommon for studio photographers to retouch photos to make their clients happier. So when you say "Any possibility that it has been photo-shopped by people promoting the WCR Lone Nut narrative? ", I would say the opposite is true in this case. The use of blurry low res images to hide information...

Henry,

    Thanks for partially clarifying this. 

    Any idea where and when this particular 1945 imgur.com photo of Marguerite Claverie Oswald first appeared on the internet?  Or who posted it?

    Also, to reiterate, the apparent mole in the photo is on the eyelid, not below the eyelid.

    And the faces, height and body habitus of the two Marguerites are quite noticeably different.

    Furthermore, if I recall the details, Claverie was living and working in New Orleans in the early 60s, while chubby Marguerite was living Fort Worth, wasn't she?

[Henry Frost]

25 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Any idea where and when this particular 1945 imgur.com photo of Marguerite Claverie Oswald first appeared on the internet?  Or who posted it?

I don't know who posted it to gettyimages or when.  I do know they want $575.00 CAD for a large print!  Where did you get the low res version?

You do know that eyelids sag and droop with age? Plastic surgery is big business.  Age may also account for other differences you're seeing, as others have mentioned.

 

Edit: here is the direct gettyimages link: link

Hover your mouse over the image and click on the arrows that appear in the upper right corner.  Then right click on the image and save it to your computer.  That's the pic I uploaded to imgur...

Edited September 4, 2022 by Henry Frost

[W. Niederhut]

12 minutes ago, Henry Frost said:

I don't know who posted it to gettyimages or when.  I do know they want $575.00 CAD for a large print!  Where did you get the low res version?

You do know that eyelids sag and droop with age? Plastic surgery is big business.  Age may also account for other differences you're seeing, as others have mentioned.

 

Henry,

     I've done a lot of physical exams on patients over the years, and I don't perceive the 1963 Marguerite facial mole as part of a "drooping eyelid."  Rather, it appears to be located on the face below the right lower lid.

     Also, the difference in age between the 1960 Claverie photo (above) and the 1963 Marguerite Oswald photo is only three years.  Not enough time to account for such dramatically different appearances between the two women.

     So, if I call this one as I see it, these two Marguerites are different ladies.

     (Incidentally, I learned in medical school years ago to "call it as I see it," even if other people disagree.  Long story.)

     Regarding the repeated claim that Armstrong has been "debunked," has anyone debunked John Pic's claims that he didn't recognize the Lee Harvey Oswald arrested and murdered in Dallas, or in the childhood Bronx Zoo photo, as his younger half-brother Lee?

[Henry Frost]

Lower eyelids change with age too:

"baggy lower eyelids are a significant result of aging and fat expansion":
https://www.uclahealth.org/news/why-do-eyelids-sag-with-age-ucla-study-answers-mystery

But I won't stop you from pursuing your line of inquiry.  I may not agree with it though.

Edit: you are fixating on the location of the mole by a few millimetres, I'm saying there is a mole.

 

Edited September 4, 2022 by Henry Frost

[W. Niederhut]

24 minutes ago, Henry Frost said:

Lower eyelids change with age too:

"baggy lower eyelids are a significant result of aging and fat expansion":
https://www.uclahealth.org/news/why-do-eyelids-sag-with-age-ucla-study-answers-mystery

But I won't stop you from pursuing your line of inquiry.  I may not agree with it though.

Edit: you are fixating on the location of the mole by a few millimetres, I'm saying there is a mole.

 

Henry,

     Look closely.  The 1963 "Marguerite" mole is clearly below the eyelid.

     And the apparent mole on your imgur.com Claverie photo (of unknown origin) isn't visible on other extant photos of Claverie.

     Honestly, I'm wondering if the CIA photo-shopped that imgur.com image after Armstrong's 2003 research appeared in print.  Damage control.

     A related example was the way Nobel Laureate Luis Armstrong promulgated his bogus cellophane-wrapped melon propulsion theory about JFK's head after the public finally got to see the Zapruder film.

     

[Gerry Down]

2 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

C'mon Kirk and Gerry.  I've got nothing against having a few Margaritas, but...

Do you two guys really believe that the two Marguerites in the photographs (above) are the same person?

My hunch is that one of the McAdams-type WCR/CIA propagandists photo-shopped the 1945 wedding photo to pencil in a mole on the eyelid.

(But they sketched it on the lid, instead of below the lid.)

I believe there was only one Marguerite. But John Armstrong in his book probably has unearthed some oddities that have yet to be explained.