Phil Shenon runs diversion campaign for CIA - again

[Michaleen Kilroy]

Despicable article in every way…

https://www.politico.com/amp/news/magazine/2022/11/15/jfk-assassination-files-conspiracy-fbi-00066780

[Benjamin Cole]

3 hours ago, Michaleen Kilroy said:

Despicable article in every way…

https://www.politico.com/amp/news/magazine/2022/11/15/jfk-assassination-files-conspiracy-fbi-00066780

Nice to see MK in action. 

Yeah, there much be a bottomless well of money or general support somewhere for the LN crowd or anyone who points away from US intel agencies. 

 

 

[Michaleen Kilroy]

7 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Nice to see MK in action. 

Yeah, there much be a bottomless well of money or general support somewhere for the LN crowd or anyone who points away from US intel agencies. 

 

 

You gotta give them credit - saying all the obfuscation has only been to save seniors in old folks homes across the world from being killed has been their only reason for withholding files.

Apparently a simply black marker over the name isn’t good enough.

IMO all this means is the can will be kicked down the road again because that’s what the Intel agencies want and no American president will go against them.
 

 

 

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by Michaleen Kilroy

[Michaleen Kilroy]

3 minutes ago, Michaleen Kilroy said:

You gotta give them credit - saying all the obfuscation has only been to save seniors in old folks homes across the world from being killed has been their only reason for withholding files.

Apparently a simply black marker over the name isn’t good enough.

IMO all this means is the can will kicked down the road again because that’s what the Intel agencies want and any American president won’t tell them no. 
 

 

 

 

And Shenon conveniently overlooks the fact that every agency and POTUS has not followed the letter of the law - that EVERY record withheld requires a thorough explanation to the public regarding why it should remain secret.

It’s just a ‘nothing to see here’ gambit by the agencies thru Shenon to once again subvert the law and will of the people.

Whatta load of BS.

[Michaleen Kilroy]

7 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Nice to see MK in action. 

Yeah, there much be a bottomless well of money or general support somewhere for the LN crowd or anyone who points away from US intel agencies. 

 

 

And Shenon conveniently overlooks the fact that every agency and POTUS has not followed the letter of the law - that EVERY record withheld requires a thorough explanation to the public regarding why it should remain secret.

It’s just a ‘nothing to see here’ gambit by the agencies thru Shenon to once again subvert the law and will of the people.

Whatta load of BS.

[Michaleen Kilroy]

What really chaps my hide is how Shenon couches all his subterfuge in what appears to be very thorough, reasonable article on the surface. But if you know any of the background, you realize it’s all horse shyte and yet another play to deny the American people what is rightfully theirs.

It just never ends. And it’s obvious to anyone paying attention there is something HUGE in the files they don’t want known. 
 

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by Michaleen Kilroy

[Lawrence Schnapf]

Hey Guys- I spoke with Phil numerous times about this article. the impetus was because he was offended that the american people did not know that NARA disagreed with the the grounds that the agencies asserted when they asked Trump to postpone the records. The only public records had the Archivist RECOMMENDING postponement and saying this was consistent with the JFK Records Act. 

This was hugely important fact for citizens and our representatives to know.

I gave him the documents that were provided to me as a result of my lawsuit. He correctly quotes from them. The agencies were asserting and continue to assert that release will expose informants. 

The real problem is that there are still outstanding records searches from 1998 before the ARRB went out of business that have not been completed. There are records held by FBI, CIA as well as under seal by courts that are not part of the JFK Collection. 

I dont understand why you have leaped to the conclusion that Shenon is protecting the agencies. He wrote what was exactly in the documents I shared with him that I obtained as part of my FOIA litigation.   

[James DiEugenio]

Larry,

 

Do you like a writer  who leads off with that demeaning  rubric "conspiracy theorists", who then implies there is not really anything pertinent in the documents being withheld, and then in the entire long article, never once mentions one single thing that the ARRB uncovered already that indicates the WR was wrong?

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[Roger Odisio]

2 hours ago, Michaleen Kilroy said:

What really chaps my hide is how Shenon couches all his subterfuge in what appears to be very thorough, reasonable article on the surface. But if you know any of the background, you realize it’s all horse shyte and yet another play to deny the American people what is rightfully theirs.

It just never ends. And it’s obvious to anyone paying attention there is something HUGE in the files they don’t want known. 
 

 

Possibly.  Or, the CIA and FBI could be posing the longest running, most sophisticated "false mystery" for the war machine

 

17 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

Larry,

 

Do you like a writer   off with that demeaning  rubric "conspiracy theorists", who then implies there is not really anything pertinent in the documents being withheld, and then in the entire long article, never once mentions one single thing that the ARRB uncovered already that indicates the WR was wrong?

I agree with Larry that it is important to tell the public that NARA has been opposing many of the efforts by govt agencies to still delay document release.  It changes the story from Biden vs the war machine (we know the likely ending of that) to  Biden + the agency responsible for releasing files, NARA, vs the war machine.  It gives Biden some cover and in fact puts some pressure on him to justify siding with the CIA again.  He probably wants to run again in '24.

It is also important for the article to explain that NARA has undergone a massive review over the last year of the JFK Collection and has already made recommendations to Biden.  I was told by email that the review included an assessment of their basic approach to the Collection, including the process for adding new information, which they clearly have not been doing much since the ARRB closed in 1998..

But to get that we have to put up with the usual conspiracy theory baiting, as well as  false or misleading statements and diversionary tripe.  We can just ignore that.

As to the continual refusal to release records, it could indicate they are harboring something crucial.  More likely, I think, the refusal could be the longest running "false mystery" designed to divert researchers from the real question: did Oswald do it, and if not who did?  Look over here.  We have important information but we're not going to let you see it, nor are we going to say why (national security) or follow what the law requires.  We're more powerful than a president who comes and goes and there's nothing you can do about it.  But please keep asking.

Information they have, if released, may help solve a few of the peripheral puzzles that intrigue researchers, but it is very hard to believe anything that would counter the Oswald fairy tale hasn't already been gotten rid of in the last 59 years.  Given the well documented amount of files already missing.  Which includes only ones that were known to have existed in the first place.

[Michaleen Kilroy]

2 hours ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

Hey Guys- I spoke with Phil numerous times about this article. the impetus was because he was offended that the american people did not know that NARA disagreed with the the grounds that the agencies asserted when they asked Trump to postpone the records. The only public records had the Archivist RECOMMENDING postponement and saying this was consistent with the JFK Records Act. 

This was hugely important fact for citizens and our representatives to know.

I gave him the documents that were provided to me as a result of my lawsuit. He correctly quotes from them. The agencies were asserting and continue to assert that release will expose informants. 

The real problem is that there are still outstanding records searches from 1998 before the ARRB went out of business that have not been completed. There are records held by FBI, CIA as well as under seal by courts that are not part of the JFK Collection. 

I dont understand why you have leaped to the conclusion that Shenon is protecting the agencies. He wrote what was exactly in the documents I shared with him that I obtained as part of my FOIA litigation.   

Lawrence - I’m sure it was all good faith on your part and agree that the NARA pushback is a good new wrinkle to know about.

I just feel Shenon’s implicit LN take permeates his story. Does he really expect us to believe the only or even the main reason the agencies have held onto these files for 60 years is to protect the innocent?  That’s the key takeaway and I don’t believe it.

Whether Shenon is friendly to the CIA, his position is. And it sure looks like the usual media sugarcoating they do each year in the run up to the JFKA anniversary.

It sets the table for another illegal refusal to release the files by them and POTUS.

And that does NOT serve the American people as he purports he wants to do.

“Nothing in the files but you’ll never know because we’re holding them for humanitarian reasons. We’re the good guys here. Ignore these crazy conspiracy theorists when they whine about this latest withholding in December.”

That’s some major, well-timed propaganda however salient the materials you gave him.

 

 

[James DiEugenio]

Look, it this was the case, then all Biden has to do is obey the law right?  Trump could have done that five years ago back in 2017.

The president is supposed to write a memo explaining why each document he wants to withhold needs to be classified since it would endanger an agent in place or an ongoing operation.  

My suspicion is that neither one of those would apply, without a stretch.  I have a very hard time thinking that there is still an agent in place from 59 years ago or there is an ongoing operation from six decades ago.  But if they can prove, go ahead.

[Benjamin Cole]

8 hours ago, Michaleen Kilroy said:

What really chaps my hide is how Shenon couches all his subterfuge in what appears to be very thorough, reasonable article on the surface. But if you know any of the background, you realize it’s all horse shyte and yet another play to deny the American people what is rightfully theirs.

It just never ends. And it’s obvious to anyone paying attention there is something HUGE in the files they don’t want known. 
 

 

MK--

For the longest time I thought there must be nothing in the files, that the paper records would have scrubbed clean decades ago. And CIA officers like Bill Harvey have said they never put assassination records into files, and they even created and inserted misleading info into files to cover assassinations. 

Now, I am beginning to wonder. 

Some researchers, such as John Newman, have reported files they previously accessed in the National Archives have disappeared. 

Could there be something real in the remaining files? Protecting sources and methods a half-century on seems rather feeble. 

I maintain my low regard for the work of Shenon. 

 

 

 

[James DiEugenio]

Hey, look what the HSCA and ARRB withheld on the work of Betsy Wolf.

The CIA rigged Oswald's file while he was going to Russia.

That did not come out until 2007.

[Benjamin Cole]

48 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

Hey, look what the HSCA and ARRB withheld on the work of Betsy Wolf.

The CIA rigged Oswald's file while he was going to Russia.

That did not come out until 2007.

It is also possible while the files have been scrubbed, there is fear that remaining files still contain telltale clues.

The JFKA research community has made a few mistakes, but also shown great tenacity and forensic skill in connecting real-world dots. 

BTW, the mistakes of the JFKA research community were made in earnest, and largely result from trying to decipher government opacity. 

One cannot say the same for those hiding documents, and their allies. 

 

 

[Anthony Thorne]

7 hours ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

Hey Guys- I spoke with Phil numerous times about this article. the impetus was because he was offended

I'm not sure why Shenon cares one way or the other, but anyway - 

 

7 hours ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

I gave him the documents that were provided to me as a result of my lawsuit. He correctly quotes from them. The agencies were asserting and continue to assert that release will expose informants. 

Yeah I gather that the agencies are asserting this, and asserting that.

Someone should clear up for me then why Shenon starts off mentioning what the agencies are 'asserting', as in

Quote

The Archives correspondence reveals, for the first time, their detailed justifications, providing a rare window into reasoning inside the CIA and FBI. In many cases, it shows, the CIA and FBI pressed to keep documents secret because they contained the names and personal details of still-living intelligence and law-enforcement informants

and then he continues with a gee whiz recitation of what the agencies asserted, while providing zero truth that any of it is true, as in

Quote

Many of those sources — now elderly, if not close to death — are foreigners living outside the United States, which means it would be more difficult for the American government to protect them from threats. 

Did the documents you gave Shenon list who all those endangered foreigners were, or did the documents just quote people from within the intelligence agencies saying that those folk existed, and that everyone should trust that they exist, and that the documents should be withheld for that reason? 

Disclaimer - I generally view Shenon as the mainstream guy brought out every time anyone wants him to stand in front of something awkward so he can stand there with his arms stretched wide blocking the doorway saying "Nothing to see here folks!".

Edited November 17, 2022 by Anthony Thorne