“New evidence” why the SBT is impossible so says the video

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

9 hours ago, Bill Fite said:

I had a thought concerning the idea of moving Connally & possibly JFK.

Originally, it seemed a good approach to use a 3D model would be to go from the wound path back.

Maybe it should go the other way - start at a location then see what has to be moved in the limo for it to work.

Now, if it was me and I had those animation skills I would test the SBT by testing possible locations, TSBD, DalTex, County Records.

For each possible location

1. The height and approximate distance to the limo is known
2. The slope of the street is known
3. The approximate position of the limo is know from the film
4. The horizontal and vertical angles could then be calculated

So then the idea would be to 

* move the virtual JFK & Connally torsos until the horizontal angles matched up

* then move the torso postures up / down & rotated left / right until the wounds matched

I'd guess that they would have to be in some strange, even impossible, positions for some shot sources.  

This could then be used to reject SBT locations and possibly the SBT in demonstrations to interested parties if the torsos have to be moved to improbable locations.

btw:  I don't personally believe the SBT.

I dont remember anyone ever stating what should be obvious ie that slugs almost always veer inside a body/jelly/wax.

I reckon that the SBT can invoke say 8 deg of veer (i think upwards) in say 8" while in jfk's neck/back. Why hasnt veer been mentioned/invoked?

8 deg of veer would also explain why the (stainless steel i suppose) thin probe at autopsy would not go all the way throo to the throat.

Edited December 2, 2023 by Marjan Rynkiewicz

[Pat Speer]

6 hours ago, Marjan Rynkiewicz said:

I dont remember anyone ever stating what should be obvious ie that slugs almost always veer inside a body/jelly/wax.

I reckon that the SBT can invoke say 8 deg of veer (i think upwards) in say 8" while in jfk's neck/back. Why hasnt veer been mentioned/invoked?

8 deg of veer would also explain why the (stainless steel i suppose) thin probe at autopsy would not go all the way throo to the throat.

The SBT is a hoax. The WC admitted they only wanted to show it was possible, and didn't care if it was unlikely. Since 1978, however, the powers that be have tried to claim that a bullet striking JFK in the location of his back wound would go through JFK, exit his throat at the location of his throat wound, and strike JBC in the location of his armpit wound. In reality, of course, they couldn't honestly have claimed this, as there are too many variables, even if the men were actually in alignment. But it's worse than that. They knew they weren't in alignment, and the presentations showing them to be in alignment are a refinement of the original hoax. 

Edited December 2, 2023 by Pat Speer

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

41 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

The SBT is a hoax. The powers that be have tried to claim from 1964 on that a bullet striking JFK in the location of his back wound would go through JFK, exit his throat at the location of his throat wound, and strike JBC in the location of his armpit wound. In reality, of course, they couldn't honestly have claimed this, as there are too many variables, even if the men were actually in alignment. But it's worse than that. They weren't in alignment, and the presentations showing them to be in alignment are just echoes of the original hoax. 

I have read your SBT wordage, & Dale Myers'. 

If the slug veered say 4  deg inside jfk then that changes the impact on Connally by 2.5" in 36" after exiting jfk. But apparently jelly tests show that a Carcano slug seldom veers much (in a short distance).

If the slug veered 4 deg then that explains why the autopsy probe stuck (halfway along jfk). Put another way, the sticking probe proves there was veer.

I dont remember which inshoots & outshoots were difficult to align, nor do i remember whether the difficulty involved too much or too little vertical angle (& horizontal angle). But a few deg of veer helps fix things for the SBT.

i dont know whether this needed veer haztabe up or down or left or right. Up i think. In which case the slug yawed (tumbled) upwards.

For sure the jfk & Connally positions & alignments can make a giant difference. But we dont really know what was what behind the sign. And the slug hit at Z218 (or Z219 at latest), when Jfk was "at" center of sign. Not Z169, not Z190, not Z224.

Anyhow, Lattimer proved that the lapel flip could not happen unless the slug firstly passed throo jfk & had a large tumbling action when it exited Connally. But i know that u dont agree with this.

Edited December 2, 2023 by Marjan Rynkiewicz

[David Von Pein]

https://dvp-potpourri.blogspot.com/2009/11/single-bullet-theory.html

• "At that angle, no matter WHERE it came from [the bullet that struck Governor Connally], it had to pass through the President's body first!" -- Albert E. Jenner, Jr. (Warren Commission Assistant Counsel); February 11, 1967

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

3 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

https://dvp-potpourri.blogspot.com/2009/11/single-bullet-theory.html

• "At that angle, no matter WHERE it came from [the bullet that struck Governor Connally], it had to pass through the President's body first!" -- Albert E. Jenner, Jr. (Warren Commission Assistant Counsel); February 11, 1967

Yes, the anti-SBTers have to replace a simple clearly correct SBT with 3 magic bullets. How silly.

Re the SB hitting at Z224. U are wrong. Lattimer's tests show us that the SB hit at Z218-219.

We see a slight  jacket bulge in Z222 (it looks like a mini lapel flip)(but is actually mainly bulge), which deflates in Z223, & then we see a full lapel flip in Z224 (plus some bulge), all of which is in full accord with Lattimer's tests.

[Chris Davidson]

15 hours ago, Marjan Rynkiewicz said:

I dont remember anyone ever stating what should be obvious ie that slugs almost always veer inside a body/jelly/wax.

I reckon that the SBT can invoke say 8 deg of veer (i think upwards) in say 8" while in jfk's neck/back. Why hasnt veer been mentioned/invoked?

8 deg of veer would also explain why the (stainless steel i suppose) thin probe at autopsy would not go all the way throo to the throat.

There is an alternative variation related to 8°

[Bill Fite]

2 minutes ago, Chris Davidson said:

There is an alternative variation related to 8°

I've seen that photo before, but the red lines illustrate exactly how much you have to fudge the evidence to make it work.

The bottom line also confirms the 'Way Beyond the Magic Bullet' simulated shot by the Australian team on the Discovery channel that exited the JFK torso dummy's chest.

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

4 hours ago, Chris Davidson said:

There is an alternative variation related to 8°

Yes the SB might have gone straight.

But the failed back to front probe test at autopsy demands that a scientific analysis include at least some veer inside jfk (did they try a front to back probe?).

For example 4 deg of veer also probly helps the SBT laser etc analysis, koz 4 deg gives 2.5" of dogleg per 36" between jfk & Connally.

And 4 deg of veer is not a big ask based on my memory of Carcano veer in gelatin on youtube etc. Alltho it has been shown that a Carcano usually goes fairly straight for a long distance in gelatin in most tests.

Anyhow a Carcano might veer say 4  deg in 8" in jfk's lower neck

(especially if the veer & consequent tumble is upwards)

(due to impacting the skin on an angle, ie not squarely)

(tests using an angled front face on gelatin with skin on the face would confirm this).

Likewise that already slightly tumbling Carcano SB might have veered say 5 deg in 10" (upwards i suppose) while passing throo Connally. This upwards should also help a laser analysis i think (or would it hurt)(in which case i would have to play my a tumbling Carcano duznt veer card)(dunno).

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

4 hours ago, Bill Fite said:

I've seen that photo before, but the red lines illustrate exactly how much you have to fudge the evidence to make it work.

The bottom line also confirms the 'Way Beyond the Magic Bullet' simulated shot by the Australian team on the Discovery channel that exited the JFK torso dummy's chest.

Did they place the jfklimo at Z160 (wrong) or Z190 (wrong) or Z218 (correct, that is where shot-2 hit) or Z224 (wrong)?

[Pat Speer]

13 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

https://dvp-potpourri.blogspot.com/2009/11/single-bullet-theory.html

• "At that angle, no matter WHERE it came from [the bullet that struck Governor Connally], it had to pass through the President's body first!" -- Albert E. Jenner, Jr. (Warren Commission Assistant Counsel); February 11, 1967

He is incorrect, as proved by the 5-24-64 re-enactment photos. 

[David Von Pein]

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

He is incorrect, as proved by the 5-24-64 re-enactment photos. 

Wrong.

[Pat Speer]

12 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

Wrong.

The photos taken from the SN on 5-24-64 prove Connally could be hit by a bullet fired from behind that did not hit JFK. 

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

The photos taken from the SN on 5-24-64 prove Connally could be hit by a bullet fired from behind that did not hit JFK. 

I think that Queen Mary was sitting at Z190. Should have been at Z218, ie about 2 limo lengths further down Elm, where jfk would be moreso in the way of a shot at Connally.

And i think that that pix (taken from the SN) shows that Connally is sitting way too high, judging by the 3 heads in that 1964 pix (taken from the SN)(jfk head, Connally head, Kellerman head). Connally's head should be a  lot lower than it is (in the pix from the SN). Even tho jfk in the back seat of Queen Mary is they say 10" too high (in every pix of Queen Mary) compared to his height in the jfklimo in 1963, all the same Connally is too high in Queen Mary (in the pix from the SN), by a lot.

 

Edited December 3, 2023 by Marjan Rynkiewicz

[Pat Speer]

42 minutes ago, Marjan Rynkiewicz said:

I think that Queen Mary was sitting at Z190. Should have been at Z218, ie about 2 limo lengths further down Elm, where jfk would be moreso in the way of a shot at Connally.

And i think that that pix (taken from the SN) shows that Connally is sitting way too high, judging by the 3 heads in that 1964 pix (taken from the SN)(jfk head, Connally head, Kellerman head). Connally's head should be a  lot lower than it is (in the pix from the SN). Even tho jfk in the back seat of Queen Mary is they say 10" too high (in every pix of Queen Mary) compared to his height in the jfklimo in 1963, all the same Connally is too high in Queen Mary (in the pix from the SN), by a lot.

 

Here is an image from Warren Commission Exhibit 895, showing the view from the sniper's nest at Z-225. It's obvious Connally's armpit is to the right of JFK from this angle, even if Connally was a few inches to his left. Jenner, who was not involved in the re-enactment, and knew nothing of the trajectories, was thereby blowing smoke when he claimed the WC's re-enactments proved any bullet hitting Connally must have gone through JFK. 

 

[Marjan Rynkiewicz]

12 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

Here is an image from Warren Commission Exhibit 895, showing the view from the sniper's nest at Z-225. It's obvious Connally's armpit is to the right of JFK from this angle, even if Connally was a few inches to his left. Jenner, who was not involved in the re-enactment, and knew nothing of the trajectories, was thereby blowing smoke when he claimed the WC's re-enactments proved any bullet hitting Connally must have gone through JFK. 

 

Yes i agree that Connally's rhs is showing in that pix.

But less so if jfk is moved hard right (say one head right), & Connally is moved a little left (say half a head)(& is turned to right)(& leans to left), & if Connally is lowered (say half a head).

Plus we know that jfk had his right arm held high waving to his right, & as jfk goes behind the sign he is now looking to his left but his right arm is still held high but not as high, & we can assume that he is still holding his rt arm highish waving (to the african american dad&mum&son) at Z218 (shot-2).

So, in the end, in the pix, we should have the inshoot on jfk's lower neck in line with the inshoot on Connally's shoulder blade.

In which case Connally could be hit without hitting jfk, but only hi up on Connally's right shoulder, & hi up on left shoulder i suppose.