From Dallas to Gaza-- JFK's Assassination and U.S.-Israeli History

[James DiEugenio]

William:

This was the point of my talk at the Wecht Conference in Pittsburgh.  Which I did not really include in my substack article.

But I did hint at it above.  Kennedy tried to maintain a balance of influence and power in the Middle East, no tipping over to either side.

And Nasser very much appreciated this.  Kennedy also understood the Palestinian refugee problem.  And again Nasser appreciated this.

When Kennedy passed on, the balancing point was lost.  And I don't just mean toward Israel but toward Saudi Arabia.  

Once Nasser died, I think things got even worse.  As I have mentioned elsewhere, IMO, Nasser would have never signed on to the Camp David Accords.  Just by chance, last night, I met up with a friend of mine Leo Zahn, and his girlfriend who is from Syria.  She was quite learned and astute and she said that Sadat sold out the Palestinians by not having them there in any real form.  Contrast this with how the Palestinians reacted upon the news of Nasser's death: 75,000 of them chanted in unison, "Nasser will live forever." 

My point: the evidence is that things would have never gotten to this mess if Kennedy had lived.

I mean what was the idea behind trying to overthrow a secularist leader, Assad, and never anticipating that the Russians would come in because they did not want the Nusra Front, made up of radical Islamic fundamentalists, near their border? That woman from last night told me that today, Syria is being protected on one half by Russia and the other half by Iran.  The USA is uniting some strange bedfellows in their strategic blundering.

Edited January 1 by James DiEugenio

[Robert Burrows]

On 1/1/2024 at 4:02 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Yes. The Biden Administration apparently felt that a cease fire would allow Hamas to regroup, which would have prolonged the war. And the Administration felt that Israel was capable of reducing civilian casualties while continuing to fight.

Humanitarian corridors can be made without having a cease fire. But nobody is cooperating in order to make that work. Not Biden's fault.

Furthermore, even if the U.S. hadn't vetoed the resolution, and the resolution passed, that would have made no difference. Netanyahu would have continued his offensive regardless.

In the meantime, it appears that only Biden has been able to get Netanyahu to take ANY measures to reduce civilian casualties.

 

 

That's not true. Again, it is only in your mind.

The purpose of the emergency military supplies is to fight Hamas, not to indiscriminately bomb residential neighborhood in Gaza.

Kindly stop posting your anti-Biden propaganda.

 

 

Yes, and that's a terrible thing.

It is Netanyahu's doing, not Biden's.

 

 

How would JFK and RFK handled the situation? What's your opinion?

 

 

First, Biden embraced Netanyahu and told him he felt his pain, was on his side, and would help him. Publicly he supported Netanyahu.

Privately Biden told Netanyahu that he needed to minimize civilian casualties. There's no way of knowing what exactly he asked Netanyahu to do, but we do know what Netanyahu agreed to. First, the Israelis gave a warning to the Gazans in the north part of the city to get out before bombing started. Then, when the Israelis began bombing buildings, they would first drop pellets that would make a distinctive sound as a warning to evacuate the building.

When the ground offensive started, the Israelis were supposed to do things to minimize civilian casualties.

That said, obviously the Israeli's haven't done a good job of minimizing civilian casualties. But it's not been for lack of Biden's trying.

The blame for this catastrophe lies squarely on the shoulders of the Hamas militants and the Netanyahu government. This is 

Deleted

 

Edited January 3 by Robert Burrows

[Sandy Larsen]

14 minutes ago, Robert Burrows said:

Please watch this. 

 

 

I already know what was conveyed in the video. And I agree with what the host of the show said. (It was hard for me to understand him with his accent, but I got the gist of what he is saying.)

Yes, there are Israelis who -- like Netanyahu -- want to destroy the Palestinians. And yes, the war is horrific for the Gazans. I know that.

Yet my posts are consistent with that message. So I don't know why you wanted me to watch the video.

 

[Robert Burrows]

On 1/1/2024 at 4:47 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Deleted

Edited January 3 by Robert Burrows

[Sandy Larsen]

34 minutes ago, Robert Burrows said:

To point out that the Israeli government, and most of its population, regard all Palestinians as legitimate military targets. 

 

Okay, but I already knew that.

 

[Robert Burrows]

On 1/1/2024 at 5:43 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Deleted

Edited January 3 by Robert Burrows

[W. Niederhut]

4 hours ago, Robert Burrows said:

Do you support the Biden administration's decision to bypass congress in order to send more American arms to Israel, arms that will be used to slaughter thousands of more Palestinian civilians?

Biden has, basically, functioned as a Likud Party puppet-- as has the U.S. Congress.

Trump did the same thing-- moving the U.S. Embassy to Jerusalem and formally recognizing Syria's Golan Heights as Israeli territory.

It's political suicide for U.S. politicians to criticize the Netanyahu administration.

The few members of Congress who have criticized Netanyahu for killing thousands of civilians in Gaza have already been explicitly targeted for retaliation in the U.S.

As Ariel Sharon said in 2000, "Israel controls America, and the Americans know it."

Netanyahu said the same thing in a videotaped meeting posted on Professor Juan Cole's Informed Comment website recently.

[Sandy Larsen]

4 hours ago, Robert Burrows said:

Do you support the Biden administration's decision to bypass congress in order to send more American arms to Israel, arms that will be used to slaughter thousands of more Palestinian civilians?

 

I support the Biden administration's decision to bypass congress in order to send more American arms to Israel, arms that will be used to kill Hamas militants.

 

[W. Niederhut]

28 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

I support the Biden administration's decision to bypass congress in order to send more American arms to Israel, arms that will be used to kill Hamas militants.

 

Sandy,

     The U.S.-supplied weapons are also being used to kill civilians, and to destroy apartments, schools, and hospitals in Gaza, aren't they?

     Here's a discussion of the case recently filed at the International Court of Justice by the government of South Africa against the Netanyahu regime, for genocide.*

     The South African plaintiffs, like most of the international community, don't share your view of the IDF's indiscriminate bombing of Gaza's civilian population, residential buildings, schools, hospitals, doctors, and journalists as a mere "war against Hamas."   It, certainly, looks more like genocidal ethnic cleansing.

     For example, are the 8,000+ slain children in Gaza Hamas combatants?  How about the slain women and elderly?  

     And let's not forget that some of Netanyahu's associates have openly called for the extermination and/or expulsion of the Palestinians in Gaza.

   *   South Africa Charges Israel with Genocide at Int'l Court of Justice, as Global South charges West with Hypocrisy (juancole.com)

Excerpt

In international law, genocide is not the same as annihilation. As defined in contemporary treaties such as the Rome Statute, it can involve killing relatively few individuals, but doing it in such a way as to deliberately cripple their ability to survive as a people. The key elements are intentionally targeting a people because of its ethnic identity and attempting to wipe out its peoplehood. Israel’s destruction of all Gaza universities and many other schools, and its killing of so many professors and journalists in what looks like a campaign of targeted assassinations, looks genocidal, since schools and universities and the press carry a people’s identity.

Edited January 2 by W. Niederhut

[Robert Burrows]

On 1/1/2024 at 10:48 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Deleted 

Edited January 3 by Robert Burrows

[Robert Burrows]

10 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

Sandy,

     The U.S.-supplied weapons are also being used to kill civilians, and to destroy apartments, schools, and hospitals in Gaza, aren't they?

     Here's a discussion of the case recently filed at the International Court of Justice by the government of South Africa against the Netanyahu regime, for genocide.*

     The South African plaintiffs, like most of the international community, don't share your view of the IDF's indiscriminate bombing of Gaza's civilian population, residential buildings, schools, hospitals, doctors, and journalists as a mere "war against Hamas."   It, certainly, looks more like genocidal ethnic cleansing.

     For example, are the 8,000+ slain children in Gaza Hamas combatants?  How about the slain women and elderly?  

     And let's not forget that some of Netanyahu's associates have openly called for the extermination and/or expulsion of the Palestinians in Gaza.

   *   South Africa Charges Israel with Genocide at Int'l Court of Justice, as Global South charges West with Hypocrisy (juancole.com)

Excerpt

In international law, genocide is not the same as annihilation. As defined in contemporary treaties such as the Rome Statute, it can involve killing relatively few individuals, but doing it in such a way as to deliberately cripple their ability to survive as a people. The key elements are intentionally targeting a people because of its ethnic identity and attempting to wipe out its peoplehood. Israel’s destruction of all Gaza universities and many other schools, and its killing of so many professors and journalists in what looks like a campaign of targeted assassinations, looks genocidal, since schools and universities and the press carry a people’s identity.

To quote Bob Dylan:

Some things are too hot to touch;

The human mind can only stand so much

[Sandy Larsen]

8 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

The U.S.-supplied weapons are also being used to kill civilians, and to destroy apartments, schools, and hospitals in Gaza, aren't they?

 

Yes. I never said they weren't.

What I keep saying is that it is Netanyahu and his ilk who are guilty of war crimes, not Biden.

 

8 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

       The South African plaintiffs, like most of the international community, don't share your view of the IDF's indiscriminate bombing of Gaza's civilian population, residential buildings, schools, hospitals, doctors, and journalists as a mere "war against Hamas."   It, certainly, looks more like genocidal ethnic cleansing.

 

That's not my view. It looks like ethnic cleansing to me too.

But it is not Biden doing it, and in fact Biden wants them to quit. But not at the expense of halting the war with a cease fire. Because a cease fire would allow Hamas to regroup and allowing that to happen would only prolong the war.

 

[Sandy Larsen]

11 minutes ago, Robert Burrows said:

You're unwilling to face the truth of what's unfolding. That doesn't change the truth: that Israel is conducting a war of genocide. 

Not so. I fully understand what is going on. And I understand why Biden is doing what he is doing.

Suppose Biden had done everything you and others here wanted him to do... do you know what difference that would have made? It would have made the genocide worse! Because the way Biden handled Netanyahu, he was able to get Netanyahu's ear. And Biden was able to temper the Israeli response to 10/7 to some degree.

Had Biden not gotten Netanyahu ear, Netanyahu would have done NOTHING to save civilian lives. The way it stand now, Netanyahu HAS done some things to save civilian's lives.

 

[Robert Burrows]

9 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Yes. I never said they weren't.

What I keep saying is that it is Netanyahu and his ilk who are guilty of war crimes, not Biden.

 

 

That's not my view. It looks like ethnic cleansing to me too.

But it is not Biden doing it, and in fact Biden wants them to quit. But not at the expense of halting the war with a cease fire. Because a cease fire would allow Hamas to regroup and allowing that to happen would only prolong the war.

 

Something much worse than Hamas is being created with every American bomb that's dropped on the civilians in Gaza. The generational hatred being sown will not end well for the United States or Israel. It's a tragedy. 

[Kirk Gallaway]

Sperlin:  Kennedy was not biased in favor of Israel

That's true, JFK kept asking for inspections at Dimona . But  Ben Gurion shut him down.

But  the bottom line is this:

In fact, while American military aid to Israel between 1953 and 1961 had only amounted to slightly less than a million dollars total, by the end o f 1963 it reached nearly 13 million each year.

Money talks, and bullsh-t political rhetoric walks!

JFK , effectively started  the historic escalation of military aid to Israel.!The whole purpose of this column is congratulating JFK for being concerned, but essentially doing nothing about Israel.

." Perspectives on power" by April Summit."

Israel:"The problem was, of course, Israel. Why Kennedy decided to sell HAWK missiles to Israel is frequently debated. It is clear that the President hoped to use the missile to gain Israeli cooperation on the refugees and the Dimona reactor. In both cases, this policy failed. His willingness to sell the missiles before Israel signed any agreements, however, leads one to believe that he would have sold the missiles anyway. If Israel maintained, not just military equality, but superiority, then Arab countries might think twice before attacking.

The result of this reasoning was two-fold: the creation of an arms race in the Middle East,and a tip in the balance o f U.S. policy toward Israel.

 

In both cases, Israel continued its own policies while giving lip service to American interests. Kennedy’s fear that Israel would develop nuclear weapons became a valuable tool Ben-Gurion used, along with the refugee negotiations, to obtain HAWK missiles."

 

Performance wise, Isn't this really a low bar to set for JFK?

******

Joe Biden is at such a crossroads now, but the stakes are much higher.  Netanyahu now says  the war on Hamas will go way into 2024!

On Oct. 12th, I said this;

You do have to wonder what Hamas was thinking. Sure they have lot of hostages, but they murdered so many innocent people! They had to know that Israel will be so mad they'll be quite willing to lose some hostages, and wreak 20 times the destruction and kill considerably more people  first.

I predicted this and Joe Biden couldn't?  The Israeli's accomplished that in about 2 weeks. I think they exacted a death of 4100, while initially losing 1400 in the Hamas attack. (Now some estimate 20,000!) At first Biden had to show the gravity and his awareness and respect for the magnitude of the atrocity committed to our ally. But the war events of the last almost 3 months have been predictable! We don't really know what Biden's said, in private to Netanyahu, but he should have escalated the pressure much sooner than he has. At a certain point , BS walks again! He's had 3 months  now!

 

 

 

Edited January 2 by Kirk Gallaway