From Dallas to Gaza-- JFK's Assassination and U.S.-Israeli History

[Robert Burrows]

53 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Of course I see that. I don't defend the Israeli government, I defend Biden. Somehow you don't see the difference.

 

 

Your response shows cognitive dissonance at work in all of its awful glory.

Edited January 4 by Robert Burrows

[Paul Bacon]

45 minutes ago, Sean Coleman said:

Silly question(s) maybe….WHY does the US prop up Israel? Isn’t it a big boy now? Can’t it fight it its own battles on its own? Has this not created the (ongoing) anti US resentment in the Middle East? 
Domino effect? Dunno. Madness.

The United States needs a strong Israel because of its position (geographically and idealogically) in the Middle East.

[Sean Coleman]

9 minutes ago, Paul Bacon said:

The United States needs a strong Israel because of its position (geographically and idealogically) in the Middle East.

For what?

[Paul Rigby]

Q & A - Gaza Is Starving

The chief economist of the World Food Program explains how the scarcity of food may tip the territory into famine.

By Isaac Chotiner

January 3, 2024

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/gaza-is-starving

Last month, a United Nations report on hunger described a catastrophic situation in Gaza, where more than ninety per cent of the population has been facing “acute food insecurity,” and where “virtually all households are skipping meals every day.” Much of Gaza is at risk of famine in the next several months. Parents have been going without food to insure that their kids have at least something to eat; where food is available, moreover, prices have skyrocketed, making it inaccessible even for middle-class families. The report noted, “This is the highest share of people facing high levels of acute food insecurity” ever recorded “for any given area or country.” I recently spoke by phone with Arif Husain, the chief economist at the United Nations World Food Program, which was one of the partner organizations that compiled the report. The W.F.P. also collects data on hunger around the world and delivers food to needy people. During our conversation, which has been edited for length and clarity, we discussed what the people of Gaza are currently facing, the reasons many cannot access food, and why this crisis is so unprecedented.

Could you describe the food-access situation in Gaza right now?

The bottom line is that, in Gaza, pretty much everybody is hungry at the moment. In the food-security-analysis business, we do something called I.P.C., or Integrated Phase Classification. This is an exercise that has about twenty-three partners, including nineteen U.N. agencies and international N.G.O.s and about four donors. This group analyzes the food-security situation. And, on the basis of that, it presents a report, which is independent. It is not one agency or one entity. There’s a consensus-based analysis. This exercise is done in between forty and fifty countries worldwide that may have a food-security issue, whether it is because of conflict or climate or anything else. What an I.P.C. does in any given location is put people in five different classifications. I.P.C. Phase 1 is that everything is fine; I.P.C. Phase 2 is that people are stressed in terms of their food-security situation; I.P.C. Phase 3 is that people are, in fact, in a food-security crisis; I.P.C. Phase 4 is that people are in food-security emergencies; and the last phase is called the famine, or catastrophe, phase. Now, the same analysis was done for Gaza, which came out in December, and, according to that, pretty much the entire population of 2.2 million people is in a food-security crisis or a worse situation.

Can you describe the difference between crisis, emergency, and famine?

It is a scale that looks at people’s food security and consumption, how they’re able to access food, and what type of coping strategies they use. It also looks at other indicators, including socioeconomic indicators. We ask, what is the situation now, and, also, what would you expect in the next, let’s say, few months? Classification on those three thresholds, as the severity increases, is different: crisis; then, if it’s worse than crisis, it turns into emergency; and then, if it’s worse than emergency, it turns into famine or catastrophe.

But let me give you the criteria for famine: It’s essentially that, in any given place in the geographic unit, twenty per cent of the population must be starving—that’s criteria No. 1. Criteria No. 2 is that thirty per cent of the children must be severely malnourished or wasted. And then the third criteria is that the mortality rate, the death rate, should be double the average, meaning, for adults, from one per ten thousand a day to two per ten thousand a day. And, for children, from two per ten thousand a day to four per ten thousand a day. When these three conditions come together in a single place, it’s a famine.

So the bottom line is that you hope not to say, “O.K., let’s act because there is a famine.” You need to act to avoid a famine, right? Because if you say, “O.K., let’s act when there is a famine,” that means you’re saying people have already died, children are already wasted, people are already starving. That’s not the point. The point is that we should never let a population reach that state.

Now, in the case of Gaza, a quarter of the population is already in that state, meaning they’re in catastrophic levels of hunger. We don’t call it a full famine. Why? Because they haven’t met the other two conditions, meaning it’s very hard to say whether thirty per cent of the children over there are already wasted or whether their death rate has doubled. Why? Because their health systems are broken. But what the report says is that, if what is happening continues or worsens, pretty soon—within the next six months—we will have a full-fledged famine.

How does Gaza seem similar to other conflict zones, and how does it seem different?

I’ve been doing this for the past two decades, and I’ve been to all kinds of conflicts and all kinds of crises. And, for me, this is unprecedented because of, one, the magnitude, the scale, the entire population of a particular place; second, the severity; and, third, the speed at which this is happening, at which this has unfolded, is unprecedented. In my life, I’ve never seen anything like this in terms of severity, in terms of scale, and then in terms of speed.

There have been reports that in some places in Gaza food has become really expensive. Can you talk about what we’re seeing in Gaza specifically?

Access comes in two types: one is physical access to food, and the other is economic access to food—food has to come, and supply chains need to work. And then, if the food is there, is it affordable? It’s always first and foremost about whether a population or community is able to access food. The same story is applicable in Gaza. What is happening in Gaza is that it’s reliant on imports of food and other essential commodities, right? That was the case before the war, and it is the case now.

[Robert Burrows]

2 hours ago, Sean Coleman said:

Silly question(s) maybe….WHY does the US prop up Israel? Isn’t it a big boy now? Can’t it fight it its own battles on its own? Has this not created the (ongoing) anti US resentment in the Middle East? 
Domino effect? Dunno. Madness.

 

In an acronym: AIPAC.

[Sean Coleman]

15 minutes ago, Robert Burrows said:

In an acronym: AIPAC.

Had to look it up - get it now, thanks.

[Kirk Gallaway]

Sean, from the other thread:Silly question(s) maybe….WHY does the US prop up Israel? Isn’t it a big boy now? Can’t it fight it its own battles on its own? Has this not created the (ongoing) anti US resentment in the Middle East? 
Domino effect? Dunno. Madness.

Good question, Sean!, I think some of this fascination with Israel is Cold Warish in origin, and has to do with Israel having a very successful capitalist system that  the U.S. can point out as an example to other fledgling countries. (You see? you can do this too!. You can start from nothing , and live your own dream! ) It's primarily about their exemplary Capitalist economic system, and not Democracy as we were supporting puppet dictators as long as they had a free market capitalist system.

And what sustains it is , I don't know what kind of sordid Israel/U.S.lobbying practices. But in the case of this illustration, I can't blame us too much!

But in reality, we're not getting near as much out of this as our man below!

 

heh heh   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 5 by Kirk Gallaway

[Robert Burrows]

1 hour ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Sean, from the other thread:Silly question(s) maybe….WHY does the US prop up Israel? Isn’t it a big boy now? Can’t it fight it its own battles on its own? Has this not created the (ongoing) anti US resentment in the Middle East? 
Domino effect? Dunno. Madness.

Good question, Sean!, I think some of this fascination with Israel is Cold Warish in origin, and has to do with Israel having a very successful capitalist system that  they can point out as an example to other fledgling countries. (You see? you can do this too!. You can start from nothing , and live your own dream! ) It's primarily about their exemplary Capitalist economic system, and not Democracy as we were supporting puppet dictators as long as they had a free market capitalist system.

And what sustains it is , I don't know what kind of sordid Israel/U.S.lobbying practices. But in the case of this illustration, I can't blame us too much!

But in reality, we're not getting near as much out of this as our man below!

It's just the kind of spooky relationship, that at least without the sex, would be intriguing to Michael!

heh heh     Just a joke, Michael!

 

 

The meme perfectly expresses an update of Washington's dictum to avoid foreign entanglements. Foreign copulation is a more accurate way to characterize the relationship between the United States and Israel. 

Edited January 4 by Robert Burrows

[Paul Bacon]

22 hours ago, Sean Coleman said:

For what?

For the intelligence and it's hegemonic goal among other things.  As Kirk said, it's partly a hold-over from the cold war.  I wasn't saying it's a good thing.

[W. Niederhut]

18 hours ago, Robert Burrows said:

The meme perfectly expresses an update of Washington's dictum to avoid foreign entanglements. Foreign copulation is a more accurate way to characterize the relationship between the United States and Israel. 

But who is screwing whom here, historically, in the U.S. relationship with the Neocons and Likudniks?

Kirk's meme has assigned precisely the wrong genders to the U.S. and Israel.

"Greater Israel": The Zionist Plan for the Middle East - Global ResearchGlobal Research - Centre for Research on Globalization

[Robert Burrows]

13 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said:

But who is screwing whom here, historically, in the U.S. relationship with the Neocons and Likudniks?

Kirk's meme has assigned precisely the wrong genders to the U.S. and Israel.

"Greater Israel": The Zionist Plan for the Middle East - Global ResearchGlobal Research - Centre for Research on Globalization

That's true. It should be redone with Lady Liberty representing the United States and Netanyahu as the state of Israel. 

[W. Niederhut]

1 hour ago, Robert Burrows said:

That's true. It should be redone with Lady Liberty representing the United States and Netanyahu as the state of Israel. 

Incidentally, Robert, since we're all talking about DiEugenio's essay on JFK and Israel, and the later rise of the Neocons in U.S. politics, I wonder if people remember the reports about Zbigniew Brzezinski's advice to Obama in 2012.

At the time, Brzezinski told Obama that he shouldn't let Israel lead him by the nose into a U.S. war with Iran, "like a stupid mule." *

Obama took Brzezinski's advice, and had John Kerry work with the international community to negotiate the Iranian nuclear disarmament treaty.

Later, Trump unilaterally withdrew the U.S. from the Iranian treaty-- like a stupid mule.

Here's the question for 2024.

Is Biden being led, like a stupid mule, into a war with Iran?

*  Brzezinski: U.S. won’t follow Israel 'like a stupid mule' (arabamericannews.com)

Edited January 5 by W. Niederhut

[Kirk Gallaway]

2 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

But who is screwing whom here, historically, in the U.S. relationship with the Neocons and Likudniks?

Kirk's meme has assigned precisely the wrong genders to the U.S. and Israel.

"Greater Israel": The Zionist Plan for the Middle East - Global ResearchGlobal Research - Centre for Research on Globalization

W; Kirk's meme has assigned precisely the wrong genders to the U.S. and Israel.

What w.? i assigned the wrong genders? i didn't make the meme! Besides it's called a joke! Lighten up!

I suppose you could say the U.S. is the male in that in that it's the world's dominant superpower. But to change you're view of us being in a subservient position. I hope you're not advocating sending U.S.troops in there. First you have no support from Congress, nor the American people.

But getting back on topic, and this knee jerk acceptance that JFK would have an instant answer to this problem.

But did JFK ever really buck his Congress? JFK's backing of Nasser was no revolutionary act but was backed by Congress with funds.

W. you, Robert  and I can huff and puff about the atrocities in Gaza. But a political reality you're ignoring is that Congress is solidly behind Israel. Though I expect that will change in time.

Besides, I'm gender neutral!

heh heh

 

[Robert Burrows]

1 hour ago, W. Niederhut said:

Incidentally, Robert, since we're all talking about DiEugenio's essay on JFK and Israel, and the later rise of the Neocons in U.S. politics, I wonder if people remember the reports about Zbigniew Brzezinski's advice to Obama in 2012.

At the time, Brzezinski told Obama that he shouldn't let Israel lead him by the nose into a U.S. war with Iran, "like a stupid mule." *

Obama took Brzezinski's advice, and had John Kerry work with the international community to negotiate the Iranian nuclear disarmament treaty.

Later, Trump unilaterally withdrew the U.S. from the Iranian treaty-- like a stupid mule.

Here's the question for 2024.

Is Biden being led, like a stupid mule, into a war with Iran?

*  Brzezinski: U.S. won’t follow Israel 'like a stupid mule' (arabamericannews.com)

We'll have to wait and see. And what if Trump wins in November? Maybe he'll bring the stolen Iranian war plans back to the White House. 

[W. Niederhut]

3 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

W; Kirk's meme has assigned precisely the wrong genders to the U.S. and Israel.

What w.? i assigned the wrong genders? i didn't make the meme! Besides it's called a joke! Lighten up!

I suppose you could say the U.S. is the male in that in that it's the world's dominant superpower. But to change you're view of us being in a subservient position. I hope you're not advocating sending U.S.troops in there. First you have no support from Congress, nor the American people.

But getting back on topic, and this knee jerk acceptance that JFK would have an instant answer to this problem.

But did JFK ever really buck his Congress? JFK's backing of Nasser was no revolutionary act but was backed by Congress with funds.

W. you, Robert  and I can huff and puff about the atrocities in Gaza. But a political reality you're ignoring is that Congress is solidly behind Israel. Though I expect that will change in time.

Besides, I'm gender neutral!

heh heh

 

Kirk,

    You and Ben Cole both failed to grasp the essential, accurate theses of the DiEugenio and Sterling essays about JFK and the history of U.S.- Israeli relations before and after JFK's assassination.

     Did you and Ben even read Sterling's excellent essay at the top of this thread?

     Thesis:  JFK wanted to establish an equitable solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.  And he was privately wary of militant, right wing Zionists.

      He also opposed Israel's goal of acquiring nukes, and insisted on inspections of Dimona.

      And RFK worked to properly register Israeli lobbyists in the U.S. as agents of a foreign government.

      After 11/22/63, AIPAC and the Neocons became increasingly powerful in shaping U.S. foreign policy to serve Israel's interests, while abandoning advocacy for Palestinian rights.

       By 2000, Ariel Sharon accurately boasted that, "Israel controls America, and the Americans know it."

       Zbigniew Brzezinski used the 21st century metaphor of Israel leading America around by the nose, "like a stupid mule."