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The Rifle


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Tom,

Sorry for my tardiness...but I no longer "come out to play" here on a daily basis. [When I did, strange things kept happening to my computer...probably just a coincidence.]

Evidently I missed the photos you had originally posted with your most recent series of posts. So I obviously missed the point(s) your photos were supposed to make.

And while you have my last name confused, probably with Gerald McKnight, I won't complain about being remembered with such company...although Mr. McKnight may not feel the same way about the situation.

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Tom,

Sorry for my tardiness...but I no longer "come out to play" here on a daily basis. [When I did, strange things kept happening to my computer...probably just a coincidence.]

Evidently I missed the photos you had originally posted with your most recent series of posts. So I obviously missed the point(s) your photos were supposed to make.

And while you have my last name confused, probably with Gerald McKnight, I won't complain about being remembered with such company...although Mr. McKnight may not feel the same way about the situation.

And while you have my last name confused, probably with Gerald McKnight, I won't complain about being remembered with such company...although Mr. McKnight may not feel the same way about the situation.

Happens more and more along with the grey hairs.

Hang in there and I will dig out the photo's again and repost them.

Tom

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Tom,

Sorry for my tardiness...but I no longer "come out to play" here on a daily basis. [When I did, strange things kept happening to my computer...probably just a coincidence.]

Evidently I missed the photos you had originally posted with your most recent series of posts. So I obviously missed the point(s) your photos were supposed to make.

And while you have my last name confused, probably with Gerald McKnight, I won't complain about being remembered with such company...although Mr. McKnight may not feel the same way about the situation.

And while you have my last name confused, probably with Gerald McKnight, I won't complain about being remembered with such company...although Mr. McKnight may not feel the same way about the situation.

Happens more and more along with the grey hairs.

Hang in there and I will dig out the photo's again and repost them.

Tom

The barrel band/sling swivel mount are completely interchangable to either side of the 91/38 Carcano rifle.

In order to move it from the left-side normal mount, to the right side, all that one has to do is take the assembly off, turn the barrel band around (reverse it) and slide it back onto the weapon and thereafter mount the assembly with the screw/bolt coming through from the left side of the weapon and the sling keeper (and nut) on the right side.

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Tom,

Sorry for my tardiness...but I no longer "come out to play" here on a daily basis. [When I did, strange things kept happening to my computer...probably just a coincidence.]

Evidently I missed the photos you had originally posted with your most recent series of posts. So I obviously missed the point(s) your photos were supposed to make.

And while you have my last name confused, probably with Gerald McKnight, I won't complain about being remembered with such company...although Mr. McKnight may not feel the same way about the situation.

And while you have my last name confused, probably with Gerald McKnight, I won't complain about being remembered with such company...although Mr. McKnight may not feel the same way about the situation.

Happens more and more along with the grey hairs.

Hang in there and I will dig out the photo's again and repost them.

Tom

The barrel band/sling swivel mount are completely interchangable to either side of the 91/38 Carcano rifle.

In order to move it from the left-side normal mount, to the right side, all that one has to do is take the assembly off, turn the barrel band around (reverse it) and slide it back onto the weapon and thereafter mount the assembly with the screw/bolt coming through from the left side of the weapon and the sling keeper (and nut) on the right side.

[When I did, strange things kept happening to my computer...probably just a coincidence.]

Then you can make that a "double coincidence" as this one became so infected that I had to do a total recovery, and it almost did not take that.

As noted in these photo's, the "sling keeper" can actually slide up or down through a hole which is in the nut portion of the screw/bolt & nut head assembley.

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Hope that resolves the great mystery and enigma of the "bottom" mounted sling swivel.

Tom

This is one of the more fluid threads on the Forum, where a lot of more than pertinent information is being brought out. It is worth mentioning that George Michael Evica's landmark "And We Are All Mortal" delved into the Mannlicher-Carcano issue at considerable length.

This material [from his ARRB Testimony] shows what I am talking about.

See

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/arrb/index8.htm

"About the rifles, I think you realize that there is -- finally, we'll get at the heart of the problem and the hard evidence as we look at the rifles, plural, and most people do not know about the SIFAR documents.

The SIFAR documents are the Italian armed forces intelligence service documents identifying the rifle reputedly found on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository and photographed so that the photographs went around the world as a 7.35 rifle in appearance, re-barrelled to 6.5.

That means every discussion on the possibility of it being a larger millimeter size is justified by its apparent appearance. I'm not speculating now. I have some of the SIFAR documents but not all of them.

It's very important for you, therefore, to get all the SIFAR documents -- that's the military -- Italian military intelligence service documents -- in their original Italian, including those documents generated by SIFAR in Italy but not shared with U.S. intelligence agencies, all SIFAR documents received by the FBI, the CIA, the Treasury Department from SIFAR directly or indirectly transmitted......

........."It is very important, by the way -- it was very important at the time -- I didn't realize why, but then Defense Minister Giulio Andreotti was quite concerned about the fact that it was, in fact, a Mannlicher-Carcano, and if you're wondering if the Italian bureaucracy and the media found that of interest, they flew two people over from Panorama, which is the Italian equivalent of Time magazine, to interview me in Connecticut for three hours when I broke this story on the SIFAR documents, at Giulio Andreotti's request to the Italian military that they explore the whole story of the alleged assassination rifle."

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Hope that resolves the great mystery and enigma of the "bottom" mounted sling swivel.

Tom

No, it does not. There is NO evidence that Oswald owned a rifle. There IS evidence

that there were TWO MC rifles with the same serial number. The rifle in the fake backyard

photos IS NOT the same one found in the TSBD. You are not up to speed on the rifle

evidence. I suggest that you study a website by Jerry McCleer, who has done his homework:

http://www.geocities.com/jfkresearch/c2766.html

Jack

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Hope that resolves the great mystery and enigma of the "bottom" mounted sling swivel.

Tom

No, it does not. There is NO evidence that Oswald owned a rifle. There IS evidence

that there were TWO MC rifles with the same serial number. The rifle in the fake backyard

photos IS NOT the same one found in the TSBD. You are not up to speed on the rifle

evidence. I suggest that you study a website by Jerry McCleer, who has done his homework:

http://www.geocities.com/jfkresearch/c2766.html

Jack

And!

Not unlike the "SIX GROOVE BULLET", I would suggest that you go examine a Carcano or two and mount the sling swivel onto the right hand side of the weapon and examine it, prior to launching off into some "Fake" photo episode based on completely un-evaluated photographic evidence.

The problems with the rifle, which include the specific model as well as repetitious serial numbers is difficult enough for most to fully understand without throwing in what is absolutely un-researched and completely speculative (& invalid I might add) information as regards a sling swivel location.

I do believe the rumor was that the moon was made of green cheese or some such item, based on what someone thought that they once saw.

Want to take a bet on how many persons actually believed that one too?

Personally, I have absolutely no problems with the FACTUAL evidence as relates to Carcano Rifles and their various and confusing model's as well as the complete repetition of serial numbers.

I do have problems with evidence evaluation by the "Amazing Kresgin" method of holding a photograph up, looking at it, and thereafter claiming something as fact when absolultely no independent research and/or verification has complimented the claim.

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Everyone is entitled to believe in whatever they wish to believe in. I would stick to the hard evidence, which when it comes to the notorious Carcano carbine, shows many discrepancies. The strongest evidence is in the different characteristics of the rifles presented as evidence, one of the most powerful differences being the two sets of serial numbers.

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  • 1 year later...

http://jfkassassination.net/russ/testimony/frazr1.htm

Mr. EISENBERG - Have you been able to confirm that the serial number on this weapon is the only such number on such a weapon?

Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, it is.

Just got these two photo's back in a camera which was found laying around for what was apparantly a long time.

The top photo is of course a 6.5mm Carcano Model 91/38 (Short Rifle) which is identical to the weapon recovered from the sixth floor of the TSDB, and which weapon was utilized in the assassination of JFK.

The bottom photo is a 6.5mm Model 38 (fixed rear sight) Truppe Special (TS) 36-inch length Carbine.

The Carbine also bears the "Beretta Gardone" stamp for place of manufacture, the year mark "1940 XVII", and more importantly, the serial number C5522.*

*This one is most assuredly a "keeper" as it is completely original and the stock also bears the original serial number C5522 stamped into it as well.

As has been stated multiple times, serial numbers on these weapons have little value in regards to tracebility of the weapon.

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