New Orleans - The beginning of the end?

[Mark Knight]

Now, put yourself in the shoes of one of the poorest of New Orleans...annual income of under $10,000 a year. You rent your home, and you don't own a car.

An order comes down to evacuate the city. But they don't offer buses, they don't offer hotel/motel costs when you get wherever you might end up. So what do you do? Do you stay put, and hope they're wrong about the hurricane...or do you start off walking, not knowing where to go, and not sure you can walk your way out of the path of the destruction? You sure as hell can't sleep in the car you don't have, can you? We've all heard about folks who didn't have sense enough to come in out of the rain; and yet these people are supposed to take off walking into a HURRICANE?

Obviously there must not have been any school buses available on a Sunday for the state or city to commandeer...after all, that's a pretty busy day for school buses, traditionally. Church buses? New, all these folks were busy gettin' outa Dodge themselves. City buses? Military buses/ troop transport trucks? The entire evacuation situation was FUBAR from the get-go, and the response in the aftermath of the destruction was WORSE.

NOW...rather than sit here and AFFIX the BLAME...maybe someone can FIX THE PROBLEM! In light of the debacle in New Orleans, MAYBE the executive offices [mayors, city councils, etc.] in other cities can sit down and map out a strategy in case an evacuation becomes necessary in THEIR city. Sit down with school officials and make arrangements for the use of buses in emergencies, WITHOUT having to wait a week for a directive from Washington; Make arrangements for medivac helicopters to get sick and injured people out of hospitals IN LARGE NUMBERS in case the need arises. And--shades of the Cold War days and the old Civil Defense--make PLANS for shelters and supplies of food and drinking water in case it's needed.

New Orleand was a disaster waiting to happen, and it finally did. It wasn't so much that emergency folks planned to fail, but more that they FAILED TO PLAN. "Those who fail to learn the lessons of history..." well, you know the rest.

Edited September 4, 2005 by Mark Knight

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Now, put yourself in the shoes of one of the poorest of New Orleans...annual income of under $10,000 a year.  You rent your home, and you don't own a car.

An order comes down to evacuate the city.  But they don't offer buses, they don't offer hotel/motel costs when you get wherever you might end up.  So what do you do?  Do you stay put, and hope they're wrong about the hurricane...or do you start off walking, not knowing where to go, and not sure you can walk your way out of the path of the destruction?  You sure as hell can't sleep in the car you don't have, can you?  We've all heard about folks who didn't have sense enough to come in out of the rain; and yet these people are supposed to take off walking into a HURRICANE?

Obviously there must not have been any school buses available on a Sunday for the state or city to commandeer...after all, that's a pretty busy day for school buses, traditionally.  Church buses?  New, all these folks were busy gettin' outa Dodge themselves.  City buses?  Military buses/ troop transport trucks?  The entire evacuation situation was FUBAR from the get-go, and the response in the aftermath of the destruction was WORSE.

NOW...rather than sit here and AFFIX the BLAME...maybe someone can FIX THE PROBLEM!  In light of the debacle in New Orleans, MAYBE the executive offices [mayors, city councils, etc.] in other cities can sit down and map out a strategy in case an evacuation becomes necessary in THEIR city.  Sit down with school officials and make arrangements for the use of buses in emergencies, WITHOUT having to wait a week for a directive from Washington; Make arrangements for medivac helicopters to get sick and injured people out of hospitals IN LARGE NUMBERS in case the need arises.  And--shades of the Cold War days and the old Civil Defense--make PLANS for shelters and supplies of food and drinking water in case it's needed.

New Orleand was a disaster waiting to happen, and it finally did.  It wasn't so much that emergency folks planned to fail, but more that they FAILED TO PLAN.  "Those who fail to learn the lessons of history..." well, you know the rest.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Those who have never been to this area of New Orleans, will and can never understand or appreciate the simple facts.

1. The French Quarter section has become a haven for derelicts. At any given time, the numbers range into and excess of a thousand or more who merely live on the streets and out of the trash cans and dumpsters.

You do not see these persons on the "Tourist" advertisements as the police forces long ago were tasked to keep these persons out of the Bourbon St./Canal St./etc. portion of the Quarter that were the main tourist attraction.

This is a segment of society who live like animals, from day to day, and take no concern for tomorrow.

Evacuation merely means no one around to prevent them from taking whatever they want.

2. The "off-section" just behind the tourist section, is filled with houses and properties which were derelict and of which frequently multiple families lived.

Much of these properties were in fact owned by the wealthy of New Orleans Society, however, not unlike most other areas, one is not likely to place monies into a rental property, knowing that it will merely be torn up or destroyed by those who live in it.

These "back-street" sections of the French Quarter have become far worse than many of the social attempts at providing adequate housing, which are referred to as "project" housing.

Most of these homes/buildings are of extremely old and dilapidated frame condition, and are of themselves a tremendous fire hazard.

Little known to most, these back streets of the French Quarter, long ago became the "slum" area, not unlike, and somewhat worse than most other slum areas in any major city within the US.

No one will invest monies into these areas as the residents themselves will destroy any attempt at improvements.

Any business which attempts to operate here does so not unlike those of some third world country in which steel bars and steel doors cover the business entrance.

The crime rate in this section by far exceeds the worst area of any other location in the United States.

The U.S. Government has offered and expended millions of dollars in job training programs in an attempt to incorporate such masses of persons into the economic mainstream of American life.

And, although those who want something better for themselves and their children have taken full advantage of these opportunities, more have enjoyed their day to day existence and life style and see no benefit to become fully and gainfully employed, especially if it means that they have to leave the area.

Nothing new in this regards, as the same thing happened in the Appalachia area of this country with what was primarily caucasian persons.

The "slum" area of the French Quarter is the drug and prostitute haven of New Orleans.

In most cases, the Fire Department must have Police escort in order to respond to a fire within this "tinderbox" area, and much of it is considered to be a "no man's land" as police enter only in considerable numbers.

In many cases, the police know exactly where within the area, known criminals live and stay. Yet, they will not go in after them as to do so places the police force at risk.

Instead, they wait for the person to eventually step outside the zone for apprehension.

Any of those who resided here and actually had anything of value, knew that if they left the area, anything which they possessed would be stolen.

In fact, there is a large portion of this population which survives by preying on the remainder of the residents.

As to owning cars, there is little usage in owning a car when there is no place to park it.

Just as most New Yorkers do not own cars.

A car is just something, which one has no place to park, and even if they did have such a place, one could not keep tires; batteries; gasoline; or anything else necessary for operation on it. It would be stolen by the same inhabitants of the area as what one sees looting on TV.

The back-street sections of New Orleans are by far worse than any section of Juarez or Tijuana, in Old Mexico. It is a type of lifestyle with which most americans are fully unaware.

Certainly, there are elderly and poor who are here because this is all they can afford.

However, most are there because it is where they want to be, not because they are forced to be there.

And, one can easily walk our of the flood zone/below sea level portion of New Orleans, not to mention catching any one of the hundreds of city buses which run throughout this area.

The "innocent" are those who were placed into this situation by others.

Children who rely upon the often absent mature judgement of their parents.

Elderly who could not evacuate.

For less than about $2.00, virtually any one of these persons could have taken a bus out of the flood zone.

That they have decided to live a "day to day" lifestyle in this area of New Orleans is to a large degree of their own chosing (the adults).

When one looks at the looting of such items as "video" equipment; TV's; jewelry; etc; etc; etc; then it is recognized that such mentality has not even come to realize that food and water are by far more important.

When rescue helicopters attempting to extract patients from hospitals are fired upon by these looting forces, and must retreat, whose fault is this.

Most of the New Orleans society, be they black/white/or of another race, long ago accepted that if that element had no better motivation than to live this type life then the best thing to do was leave them to their own outcome.

And, if you have never been there and been confronted by this, then it is of little use to criticize, and I am certain that those of New Orleans who have moved on for the betterment of their and their children's lives could care less for the opinions of outsiders who have no idea as to what this section is actually like.

In actually reality, I have little doubts that the "money" portions of New Orleans are relieved that this has finally happened and that perhaps this section of New Orleans can now progress to a newer and higher standard of living.

Sort of like the "cleansing" of the Watt's Riot.

Especially since this type of lifestyle long ago cost New Orleans at least one attempt at having the "World's Fair" in their city.

Many years ago, my father accepted employment as the Superintendent over construction of a 60-inch water line through this area. As part of his employment condition, he wanted me as part of his work force/crew.

We attempted to employ many of these persons as the water line went directly through the neighborhood.

Many wanted to get paid, but few wanted to work.

It finally dawned on my father and I, as well as every other "outsider" that we were not safe even in broad daylight, working through this area.

Ultimately, my father quit the position and we both left for areas of the US where one could safely work with little or no personal risk from the local inhabitants.

And, it is quite obvious that the "Black" Mayor of New Orleans, has done little to improve the conditions of those who resided throughout this area, and since he is ultimately the one responsible for the well being of the inhabitants of his city, then one does not have to look far to know to whom to point the first finger at.

The anarchy you see on TV has existed after dark in much of the French Quarter of New Orleans, for a considerable number of years.

As much as I enjoyed the lifestyle of the French Quarter in the early 60's, and the old Playboy Club was like a home away from home, I have made only one antique shopping trip there in the past nine years, and only one other "tourist" trip to take my children to see the French Quarter prior to that.

That is about two visits in the past 20 years.

Guess why?

[Terry Mauro]

Oh, and BTW, the last time I was in New Orleans was for a visit in 1991. I walked the same backstreets that I did when I lived there in 1965, on Esplanade between Royal and Chartres, giving someone a tour of the area. I never noticed this element that you've been describing, either in 1965, nor in 1991. What I did find fault with was the way they had relocated the original "Morning Call" from it's original building right up against the riverfront, and had it [or what was supposed to have been "it", because it now had two stories to it and was all mirrored and gussied up], situated a block or two inland. And, after walking to the river's edge where I remembered it being, and finding the original building, which had a rounded front to it's facade, which the present one did not have. I found it had been painted an beige-pink color and had been turned into a warehouse, or storage facility. And in 1991, I also found the area to have been renovated and overly commercialized, as it resembled an attempt to upscale it in much the same way they do with mini-malls or galleria-type shopping venues. It took away all the charm and antiquity of the area, as I had remembered it. As a sideline, the original "Morning Call" that I frequented, was the same one my Grandfather and Mother used to go to when taking their crops to market after harvest. My mother had given me directions and a description of the place when she knew I was going to be living there, to be sure I'd go and frequent it, as she had loved it so, as a young girl in the 30's and 40's.

VHeadline.com

Commentary

Published: Thursday, September 01, 2005

Bylined to: Arthur Shaw

Can you believe it? GOPs watched as a category 5 approached New Orleans...

VHeadline.com commentarist Arthur Shaw writes: The rescue workers in New Orleans ... mostly the Red Cross and the Federal Emergency Management Administration (FEMA) until Thursday, September 1 ... brag cavalierly on national TV that they aren't trying at this time to collect dead bodies ... they are concentrating on trying to rescue the survivors.

Given the limitations of the resources that have been made immediately available to the rescue operation, their concentration on rescuing survivors is not a bad choice.

But in a country like the United States, which can afford to give the rich hundreds of billions of dollars in tax cuts and Israel US$30 billion dollar every year in various forms of aid ... why is there a limitation on the resources immediately available to the Katrina survivors.

Unless the resources are immediately available, the "survivors" won't remain survivors for long. Thanks a lot, GOPs, for your liberality after the potential survivors have perished.

The body count of the dead in New Orleans is certain to reach 10,000 and maybe ten times 10,000, with many of the dead being lost during the three or four days after Katrina hit New Orleans when the GOPs intentionally or negligently responded to the disaster with extreme incompetence.

The GOPs calmly watched as a category 5 approached New Orleans.

Did the GOPs now pretend that they did not ask themselves: "What are the probabilities that a category five or four or three will breach the levees in New Orleans?"

We know the GOPs ask themselves this question because the federal law requires certain agencies -- the US Army Corps of Engineers, FEMA and, etc. -- to make such preliminary assessments of threats to strategic facilities.

But GOP-loving US citizens are pretending otherwise.

Common sense, conventional wisdom, and foregone conclusions tell us that a category five or four would breach or wipe out all, or some of the levees. Surely, this had to be the finding of the mandated technical studies by the US government of the threat to the levees posed by Katrina.

Given this unavoidable finding of the GOP technical studies, the GOPs had to ask themselves: if the levees are breached how many people in New Orleans will drown?

It will be interesting to discover the answer to this question through litigation under the US Freedom of Information Act.

One thing is for sure, as they watched the category five approached the New Orleans levees, the GOPs stayed calm.

Did the GOPs ask: "Will New Orleans -- almost certainly without power and under water -- have the resources to handle the emergency resulting from a visit by a category Five or Four to the levees?"

Of course, the GOPs ask this question.

How could the GOPs avoid asking themselves this question?

What's more, the GOPs answered this question ... "without power and under water the overwhelmed local authorities wouldn't be in a position to do anything for the survivors, if any of the levees breached.

All of this was known before Katrina made landfall, or as it did, as a category five, moving north at 15 miles per hour, headed toward the strategic levees.

The evidence is that the GOPs in Washington, watching the imminent calamity in News Orleans, said to one another "Them New Orleans folk elected a Democratic mayor and ... worse ... help to elect a Democratic governor. Let the liberal mayor and the liberal governor ... without power and under water ... help the inevitable liberal victims of Katrina."

The GOPs are in state power and thereby command the immense resources of the United States ... but they are pretending that they did not know that New Orleans was NOT similarly situated to other cities that become the targets of powerful hurricanes.

New Orleans has special vulnerabilities as a result of being under sea level and surrounded by three bodies of water, all of which threaten the city's existence.

And the lying and stinking GOPs knew it .. although they lie and deny it. And didn't do anything. Nothing!

The GOPs treated New Orleans just like any other city threatened by a major hurricane. But they knew! Can you believe that? They knew!

The point is that the GOPs in the White House knew that there was a very real probability of a historic calamity in New Orleans because of the peculiarities of the city's geography next to several adjacent bodies of water, so once the Category five had included New Orleans in its projected path, a total effort toward evacuation became a necessity.

The mayor of New Orleans and the governor of Louisiana went to the media and begged the residents of the city to leave. GOPs in the White House watched the disaster unfold. The GOPs knew its would require tens of thousands of armed troops to accomplished the kind evacuation of a city of the size of New Orleans that a threat of Katrina's magnitude posed. The GOPs saw that the pitiful resources of Louisiana were already stretched to the limit. The GOPs did nothing to help the evacuation.

FEMA has state of art and very sophisticated technologies that measure the success or failure of evacuation efforts ... so the GOPs knew that the New Orleans "evacuation" was a sham. The GOPs did nothing. FEMA, for example, has methodologies that can statistically measure current demographic density by the degree of telephone usage ... but the GOPs, knowing how many people were still in New Orleans, did nothing.

And in little Cuba, the government there sometime moves as many as 3,000,000 people out of harm's way who were less threatened than the precariously situated citizens of New Orleans.

The GOPs botched the evacuation and deliberately botched it.

The GOPs knew their help was essential to an effective evacuation, but the GOPs played coy "Cross your fingers, New Orleans."

If the GOPs, out of partisan reasons, chose not to lend a hand with the total evacuation of New Orleans, then that's one thing. But the GOPs could have at least timely lent a hand with the rescue operation which was bound to occur in the wake of Katrina. The GOPs didn't even do this.

The mainstream media announced early Monday, August 29 morning about 9:00 am eastern standard time that a levee in New Orleans at Tennessee Street had been breached and water was pouring into the city from a huge adjacent lake.

So, even the GOP-loving base and GOP leaders knew as of 9:00 am, Monday, that New Orleans was about be drowned. We all knew it. We presume that the GOPs, who run the country, would do something. They did nothing either on August 29 ... or immediately after ... when they and the rest of us were informed that the calamity was imminent or indeed occurring.

Even if the scum who run the country did not earlier ask and answer the question: can a category Five or Four breach a levee? ... they should have known that a levee was breached after the mainstream media announced the breach. Monday morning at nine.

As of Wednesday night, they still did't have a rescue operation in place.

The GOPs didn't do anything before the disaster happened even though they knew, at least three days before about the probability of a calamity. They didn't do anything immediately after the calamity happened even though they knew almost to the second when the calamity occurred ... letting an untold number of US citizens die while the citizens waited for help that only they ... not the local authorities possessed.

Generally, it's believed that one can double the number of casualties resulting from a natural disaster by commencing the rescue operations belatedly two or three days after the disaster.

This evidently is what the GOPs did.

From the aspects as evacuation or rescue, Katrina is not just a natural disaster. Katrina is a natural disaster aggravated and magnified by extreme GOP incompetence or magnified by their partisan malice. Some of it is natural disaster ... no doubt. But a lot of this disaster is not natural, it's low-down, dirty spite.

The GOPs didn't do anything about evacuation and waited a few days until casualties mounted until they did something about rescue even though they had at least six days warning or notice that rescue operations were inevitable.

Within hours after the Katrina has left New Orleans with thousands of people stranded and starving on rooftops and on expressway overpasses and wherever after being trapped by the visiting hurricane for two days, they and the lying mainstream media are appalled by the "looting."

Can you believe it?

These people plainly abandoned by their rulers, bereft of drinking water, food, clothes, bedding, etc., are "looting."

What do you think of that ... yes, "looting" right here in River City?

The surviving population of New Orleans should loot!

The survivors of Katrina must loot to stay alive ... ... loot your drinking water from the flooded stores ... much of the canned food in flooded stores should still be good, loot it. Clothes and bedding and tents ... loot that too.

The GOPs stance of the on "looting" resembles their stand on medication for HIV/AIDS ... "afflicted, please don't violate our AIDS drugs intellectual property rights in ... please just go ahead and die quietly and accommodatingly ... OK!"

The GOPs want the survivors in New Orleans to perish quietly without "looting" or noise ... this is also what they want for Latin America.

Arthur Shaw

belial4444@aol.com

More VHeadline.com commentaries by Arthur Shaw

Any opinions expressed in various VHeadline.com storyfiles across

this e-publication are the sole responsibility of the individual authors

Edited September 5, 2005 by Terry Mauro

[Ron Ecker]

"I don't think anyone anticipated the breach of the levees." - George W. Bush to Diane Sawyer

[Terry Mauro]

"I don't think anyone anticipated the breach of the levees." - George W. Bush to Diane Sawyer

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, right. Just like they'll claim they hadn't anticipated a Category 5 Hurricane, yet continued to assure New Orleans that the levees would hold in a Category 3. Hello??? Well they classified Katrina as a Category 5 at 16:30 hrs on Sunday. Excuse me, but he should have had the National Guard deployed the minute it went to a 5, by no later than Sunday evening! Shoulda, woulda, coulda, but all we got was Dumb and Dumber.

[Tim Gratz]

The Democrat mayor of New Orleans is blaming Bush (naturally) for what happened after Katrina struck New Orleans. But perhaps the responsibility should begin with hs honor the Mayor.

The problem, of course, is the large number of people who did not evacuate the City. That is, of course, the only reason for the current disaster.

It was not the responsibility of the federal government to evacuate the city. It was the responsibility of the mayor.

People say the people who were left behind were poor and had no way to evacuate. Well, there were hundreds of school buses just sitting in the flood. Why did not the mayor use the resources available to him to evacuate his constituents?

Perhaps the mayor is so quick to blame the federal government because he understands full well that the ultimate responsibility is his own. Had the mayor not failed so miserably in his responsibilty to get his constituents out of harm's way, we would not be facing a disaster of these proportions.

So where is the examination and criticism of the first responsible governmental unit to fail? Unless such examination takes place, it will be easy to conclude that the finger pointing at the federal government is motivated by a political agenda.

I would analogize the situation to parents who so willfully neglect their child, even failing to feed him, that the child is close to death but the parents then criticize 911 for not responding quickly enough. Perhaps 911 could have reacted faster but the child would never have been in that condition had the parents fulfilled their parental obligations to the child.

It is time to consider the utter failure of New Orleans to ensure a complete evacuation prior to the arrival of Katrina.

When I lived in the Midwest the danger was tornadoes that could form with little advance warning. In the southern United States there is adequate opportunity to take precautions when a hurricane approaches.

[Tim Gratz]

Terry wrote:

The mayor of New Orleans and the governor of Louisiana went to the media and begged the residents of the city to leave.

Terry, talk is cheap. What actions did the mayor take to evacuate the City? Are you blaming the residents for not leaving? As I stated above, the City had the resources for evacuation in place but failed to use them.

THe mayor talked on television (to poor people who may not have even had tv sets) and urged the poor people to evacuate (when he knew or should have known they had a complete inability to evacuate). This was his disaster plan?

Terry, your post states the GOP knew New Orleans was a disaster waiting to happen. Well, how do you suppose the GOP kept this information from the Mayor? Or do you suppose the mayor knew too? And if he did know, do not his inactions in the face of the approaching hurricane rise to the level of criminal negligence?

Edited September 5, 2005 by Tim Gratz

[Tim Gratz]

Mark wrote:

NOW...rather than sit here and AFFIX the BLAME...maybe someone can FIX THE PROBLEM! In light of the debacle in New Orleans, MAYBE the executive offices [mayors, city councils, etc.] in other cities can sit down and map out a strategy in case an evacuation becomes necessary in THEIR city. Sit down with school officials and make arrangements for the use of buses in emergencies, WITHOUT having to wait a week for a directive from Washington; Make arrangements for medivac helicopters to get sick and injured people out of hospitals IN LARGE NUMBERS in case the need arises. And--shades of the Cold War days and the old Civil Defense--make PLANS for shelters and supplies of food and drinking water in case it's needed.

Mark is right--sorry, Mark, Mark is correct. We ought not be assessing blame for blame's sake but we ought to be trying to figure out how to FIX the problem. Mark even mentions the use of school buses for evacuation. I am not aware why local officials would need permission from the federal government to use school buses for evacuation.

Again, it seems to me the first failure that set the stage for the disaster was the failure to adequately evacuate the city.

Edited September 5, 2005 by Tim Gratz

[Tim Gratz]

To follow along on Mark's point, it would seem every major city should have an evacuation plan in place. Many cities do not face hurricanes but there are other possible disasters including possible terrorist attacks. The plans ought to be formulated and debated in public proceedings so the public can evaluate the plans. And the plans ought, I suggest, be distributed to other cities so ideas could be generated through the collective wisdom of many people. And the plans must include not only evacuation but also how to handle basic human needs e.g. food, hydration and sanitation.

[Ron Ecker]

I would analogize the situation to parents who so willfully neglect their child, even failing to feed him, that the child is close to death but the parents then criticize 911 for not responding quickly enough.  Perhaps 911 could have reacted faster but the child would never have been in that condition had the parents fulfilled their parental obligations to the child.

Okay, to extend the analogy: George W. Bush, on 911 being criticized for late response to a case of child neglect: "I don't think anyone anticipated a child being neglected."

Why does Bush feel a need to lie ("I don't think anyone anticipated the breach of the levees") if he or the federal government is not at fault for the breach or its consequences? Simply force of habit?

[Tim Gratz]

Well, the plot thickens!

This is from "The Washington Post":

Behind the scenes, a power struggle emerged, as federal officials tried to wrest authority from Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Babineaux Blanco (D). Shortly before midnight Friday [september 2, 2005], the Bush administration sent her a proposed legal memorandum asking her to request a federal takeover of the evacuation of New Orleans, a source within the state's emergency operations center said Saturday.

The administration sought unified control over all local police and state National Guard units reporting to the governor. Louisiana officials rejected the request after talks throughout the night, concerned that such a move would be comparable to a federal declaration of martial law.

The federal government could not co-ordinate the city's woefully inadequate evacuation efforts because it lacked the legal authority to get it. When the Bush administration attempted to obtain such permission, its efforts were frustrated and compromised by the Governor of Louisiana! Rather incredible!

[Ron Ecker]

As I cited David Broder earlier, Bush will no doubt manage to come out of this smelling like a rose.

If I didn't know better (Katrina being an act of God), I would theorize that this whole catastrophe was a dirty trick concocted by Karl Rove to bring Bush's poll numbers back up.

[Tim Gratz]

I just finished reading Tom Purvis' posts (on the previous page on this thread). They were excellent and demonstrated why Mississippi does not face the disaster that Louisiana does. Mississippi enforced a mandatory evacuation. Louisiana did not.

Perhaps the response of the federal government could have been quicker but I think Tom has effectively made the point I was trying to make: that we face the crisis in Louisiana precisely because the local officials failed in their responsibility. And as noted in my previous post, only a few days ago the Governor of Louisiana was frustrating the efforts of the federal government to assume total control over the operation.

John claimed on the previous page that the problem is that US citizens are not taxed high enough to support adequate federal resources. Well, my Republican spirit tells me that normally it is the government closest to the scene that is best able to handle a crisis. I really don't think the problem is that FEMA lacked the financial resources. John claims that because of inadequate tax dollars resources were not available to evacuate the citizens of New Orleans. But that is just not the case. The buses were all there, parked. The City of New Orleans simply failed to use the resources available to it to do what Mississippi did. As a result, its citizens died or are now suffering. The cause was not a lack of money, John. On either the city or federal level.

And Tom has wisely pointed out that there may have been economic factors involved in the failures of the City of New Orleans and the State of Louisiana.

[Tim Gratz]

John wrote:

As you know, I constantly find your moral judgements totally repulsive. Another example of your moral code can be found on the thread on Abortion and Nazi Germany.

John, what moral code of mine on the abortion thread is repulsive? That the sanctity of unborn human life ought to be protected? You may or may not agree with that position, but how can you characterize it as repulsive? In the last campaign, John Kerry stated that he was personally opposed to abortion. I assume you would also consider Kerry's position on abortion repulsive?

[David G. Healy]

I just finished reading Tom Purvis' posts (on the previous page on this thread).  They were excellent and demonstrated why Mississippi does not face the disaster that Louisiana does.  Mississippi enforced a mandatory evacuation.  Louisiana did not.

Perhaps the response of the federal government could have been quicker but I think Tom has effectively made the point I was trying to make: that we face the crisis in Louisiana precisely because the local officials failed in their responsibility.  And as noted in my previous post, only a few days ago the Governor of Louisiana was frustrating the efforts of the federal government to assume total control over the operation.

John claimed on the previous page that the problem is that US citizens are not taxed high enough to support adequate federal resources.  Well, my Republican spirit tells me that normally it is the government closest to the scene that is best able to handle a crisis.  I really don't think the problem is that FEMA lacked the financial resources.  John claims that because of inadequate tax dollars resources were not available to evacuate  the citizens of New Orleans.  But that is just not the case.  The buses were all there, parked.  The City of New Orleans simply failed to use the resources available to it to do what Mississippi did.  As a result, its citizens died or are now suffering.  The cause was not a lack of money, John.  On either the city or federal level.

And Tom has wisely pointed out that there may have been economic factors involved in the failures of the City of New Orleans and the State of Louisiana.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thank GOD for a Repugnican, by-the-way, best let Rumsfeld know he looks like an idiot in that suit cheering on the troops...

Shrub has met his Waterloo...Where-oh-where is the Christian right? Ya know, the M O R A L majority? Truck loads of water sitting on a freeway in the south, won't move till authorized, all the 'authorizers' are posing for photos while townspeople need a drink of potable water -- you got a world class cluster f*** underway, Mr. Gratz! How will Karl Rove, ole buddy, fix this ONE?

F E M A? What's FEMA?