Dean Hagerman

Unanswered? These were taken by Oliver Stones camera man! During the shooting recreation by Kevin Costner in court, they use this short filmed part to show JFK being pushed forward by a shot in the back Pop in your copy of JFK and fast forward to the end of the movie and when the shot that hits JFK in the back is fired you will see all of these frames that you posted as a film It was Stone mixing in real footage and his own footage that he shot, just look at all the bystanders, they are in different spots with different clothes on How anybody thinks this is anything other then footage shot by Stone for the film JFK just blows my mind

Easy to prove There is no way that a 3+ inch fold happened in the 1 second (or less) between the time Croft and Betzner were taken And Craig there is no way you can say that you see a 3+ inch fold in Croft, you know and I know and everybody knows that Croft shows nothing even close to a 3+ inch fold

Oh man! That is just horrible! Doug was a great researcher! And I will also never forget how he stuck up for me over and over again in the Judyth Baker thread after I was attacked for telling a story about how a bum threatened my wife and I stuck up for her I thanked Doug over email and we talked back and forth a couple times Im glad I got to know him a little, I wish I could have known him personaly RIP Doug

Oh my gosh thats sooooooooo scary!

Every single one of your replies make you sound just like the upper class snobs you claim to hate Don is the best mod on this forum, the way you are talking to him is out of line Now some of the other mods is a different story

I reside in my place of buisness as well, my wife and I run a public buisness (not some sit at home selling stuff on Ebay fake job) and our home suffers severe abuse every day The only reason we are sticking with it is the great income it provides

This whole thing is crazy I agree with Greg, what could Lifton (or anybody) sue for? Who could they sue? If I was the judge I would throw this case out so fast it would make everybodys head spin

Good one Chris I bet Bob will say tht only the passangers in the lim heard the shots

Thats because your only looking at it through your eyes, if you had my eyes you could clearly see what is the begining of the limo stop with the passangers being jolted forward Not reacting to the sound of a shot If thats the case where are all the "reactions" to the first shot?

To me it looks like he is holding a highball glass filled with Gin and Tonic

This is what I see while reading your post That you just watched the movie JFK for the first time recently Just about everything in your post comes across as being said word for word in the movie JFK Not from your "extensive research"

Its Lovelady for sure, anybody who doubts that needs to read Robert Grodens "The Killing of a President" Groden proves that its Lovelady And not only that LHO was in the 2nd floor Lunchroom during the assassination.......

Good call David! Thats what popped into my head

1. Alien abductions: I do not believe in single Alien Abduction case, and I have read all of the famous ones 2. Bigfoot: I was born and raised in the heart of Big Foot Country (and still live here) I going to say there is a 50/50 chance of Bigfoot 3. Princess Di being murdered by MI6: No way 4. God: I do not believe in God at all 5. The resurrection of Elvis: After some hard thought im going to say............ No 6. Whether the movie ET is based on a true story: Im going to say........ Maybe Lee I thought long and hard about each answer

This has always been the reason I have always backed Cliff in his and Craigs on going debate Even Craig has to admit that Croft does NOT show the fold or bunching that Craig claims Betzner shows How in the world could JFKs tailor made clothes all of the sudden fold and bunch up in the 2 seconds (probably less then 2 seconds) between Croft and Betzner? I know Craig is smart enough to know how impossible that would be I have no idea why he still claims that its possible Thank you for your support, Dean. I appreciate it very much. I think Errol Morris should do a documentary on Craig Lamson and the effects of hard-right ideology on human cognition. Anytime Cliff And I can see Craig right now calling us all wingnuts who live on Fantasy Island together

This has always been the reason I have always backed Cliff in his and Craigs on going debate Even Craig has to admit that Croft does NOT show the fold or bunching that Craig claims Betzner shows How in the world could JFKs tailor made clothes all of the sudden fold and bunch up in the 2 seconds (probably less then 2 seconds) between Croft and Betzner? I know Craig is smart enough to know how impossible that would be I have no idea why he still claims that its possible Croft shows the same fold as Betzner Dean. In fact it was the fold in Croft that made me realize the neck shadow was missing in Betzner. And of course the missing neck shadow in Betzner was the nail in the coffin for cliff's (and it appears your) fantasy. Learn to live with it. There is not a 3+ inch fold in Croft! No amount of posts that you make can change that Craig

This has always been the reason I have always backed Cliff in his and Craigs on going debate Even Craig has to admit that Croft does NOT show the fold or bunching that Craig claims Betzner shows How in the world could JFKs tailor made clothes all of the sudden fold and bunch up in the 2 seconds (probably less then 2 seconds) between Croft and Betzner? I know Craig is smart enough to know how impossible that would be I have no idea why he still claims that its possible

Bingo! And this is especially true in regards to the back and throat wounds. In SSID Tink ceded ground on the cardinal facts of the case with arguments he's embarrassed to make today. He has always dismissed certain "sinister facts" re back/throat wounds and now he turns up on the NYT to pooh-pooh the very notion of "sinister facts". What's wrong with this picture? What's wrong with this picture? How about Cliff Varnell dismissing the very real properties of light and shadow that show us only a 3"+ fold of fabric on the back of JFK's jacket could produce the image we see in Betzner. Why? Because Varnell is so invested in his silly claims he can't deal directly with the truth he has it wrong. Sunlight and shadow work in very well defined and proven ways. Varnell's claims of the "indentation" won't work given the angles of incidence seen in Betzner. Which is why he can't offer a single proof of concept image that supports his claims. He can't because it simply won't work. And despite his rambling attempts to change the subject *which are sure to come* his position continues to fail, because he can't replicate the Betzner shadow pattern with his "indentation" Cliff Dont reply to Craig I know your right about Betzner as do many other members So there is no need to fight with Craig in this thread over that This thread already has enough of that in it

Perfect Barb! This is exactly what im talking about Why cant this happen? Why cant egos be checked at the door? We need to fight the correct fight

The flip flopping on Witt is killing me, but thats not the main reason Tink not only insulted Cutler, he insulted every single one of us that has a conspiracy theory that we back up It makes no difference that I dont agree with Cutler, Tinks comment that Cutler is a wingnut is the same as calling you and I wingnuts for backing Z-film alteration This enrire thread has some very good posts from Don and Lee but nobody seems to notice I really wish that all of us could just stay together and present a united front I know thats wishful thinking but do know how strong we would be fighting against the LNers then amongst ourselves?

This thread makes me want to throw up Im so disgusted

Wait a second, so now Jim believes that Witt was TUM because he said he saw the limo stop? And now Robert believes Witt was TUM because a single researcher told him that he was and that made Robert just change his mind? Am I hallucinating? Or am I reading the last couple pages of this thread wrong? I cant believe what im seeing, two researchers flip flopping like its nothing

You must have missed Tink calling Robert Cutler and "idiot" (not that exact word but he was for sure saying as much about Cutler)