Jim Hargrove

That’s pretty funny, Tony. I have to admit the “Man in the White Suit” look really doesn’t match my image of our patsy. But Harvey Oswald’s whereabouts for the weeks prior to the assassination have been under a microscope for more than half a century, and no one knows this data better than John Armstrong…. Harvey checked out of the YMCA on October 4th, spent the nights of the 4th, 5th, and 6th at Ruth Paine’s house, and then moved into one of Mrs. Bledsoe’s bedrooms at 621 N. Marsalis on Oct. 7th. He used her phone (WH 2-1985) to call Marina and tell her had had rented a room. He gave Marina the WH 2-1985 number, and Marina subsequently contacted him there to tell him that R.L. Adams from the Texas Employment Commission was trying to contact him. Mrs. Bledsoe let him make other calls from her phone looking for a job. If you have any evidence that contradicts this timeline, both John and I would LOVE to hear about it. We want to get these details right, which isn't made much easier by the bang-up investigation our tax dollars funded.

June Oswald was born in Feb. 1962, making her less than 2 years old when Bledsoe and Harvey Oswald met. Sounds like a baby to me. As for the shirt and maniacal expression, no doubt Bledsoe was playing to the cameras.

Tony, Let’s be clear here. “Oswald” left Mrs. Bledsoe’s and moved to the N. Beckley rooming house on October 14, six days before Marina gave birth to Rachel on Oct. 20. About that, Bledsoe testified that when she first met “Oswald” he showed her a picture of his wife and baby—one baby (emphasis added by me). And then we got inside the house and he had a thing where this---pictures of his wife and baby, and he said he was in the Marine Corps, and I tried to be nice to him, and so, he paid me $7, and…. When the relationship soured days later, Bledsoe told him to leave and testified as follows: Mrs. BLEDSOE - Not going to rent to you any more. He said, "Give me back my money." Now, $2. I said, "Well, I don't have it." So, he left Saturday morning and, in the meantime, I think his wife was going to have a baby---- Mr. BALL - How did you know that? Mrs. BLEDSOE - Well, I found---I read it in the papers. Now here, with more context, is the quote you posted above. Note that in answer to Jenner’s question about “a picture of his wife and child,” she answered affirmatively. Mrs. BLEDSOE - And so, that give me a lead, something to talk about, and I said, "Well, what kind of work do you do? "Oh, I do electronics," he said, and I said, "Well, there is some good jobs because you are young, and you can get a good job a young man like you." And then went on. Then something about him being in the Marines, and I said, "Well, that is wonderful. My son was in the Navy." And talking about him, you know, just getting to know him, and--but, "here is a picture of my wife, and picture of the girl, and the baby." And I said, "Oh, she has got a baby, hasn't she?" And he said, "Yes." And everything he said, I had to pull it out of him to talk about something for him to say what it was. Mr. JENNER - But, he volunteered the picture of his wife and child? Mrs. BLEDSOE - Yes; he did that. Showed me that picture. Whether Bledsoe was coached to put LHO on McWatters’ bus or not, your quote alone hardly impeaches her, though Paul J’s analysis may. I’d be the last person to say there was no chicanery from the authorities in this case. Nevertheless, the totality of the evidence for the bus and taxi ride is simply overwhelming, and much of it unfolded in large part just hours after the assassination. I understand that the idea that brown shirted Oswald took the bus and taxi ride while white-shirted Oswald left in a Nash Rambler is difficult for researchers to accept, but that doesn’t make the trainload of evidence for the bus and taxi ride go away.

Treason doth never prosper? What's the Reason? For if it prosper none dare call it treason

Tony and Ray.... From your comments, I assume you guys doubt the bus and taxi ride happened at all, despite the fact that the brown-shirted Oswald apparently said he took the bus and taxi in front of numerous witnesses at DPD headquarters. I'm sure others here believe this too, but just because the memories of witnesses who saw “Oswald” briefly on the bus are less than perfect, it hardly means the whole episode was fabricated. John Armstrong wrote a point-by-point critique of this belief by writing the following on my website. Here’s a partial listing of his points: Naysayers criticize bus driver Cecil McWatters because he could not positively identify Oswald as a passenger on his bus. Naysayers ignore McWatters' description of this one passenger and his clothing—a man who rode in the middle of the bus for only 4 minutes. These naysayers forget there were perhaps dozens of bus passengers on several of McWatters' bus runs on 11/22/63, yet they endlessly criticize him for not remembering details about this one passenger. Naysayers criticize the testimony and memory of Milton Jones, who remembered Oswald as a passenger and remembered his light blue jacket and grey pants. Naysayers conveniently forget that Oswald sat behind Jones, and he only saw Oswald for a few seconds when he boarded and got off McWatters' bus. Naysayers criticize Mary Bledsoe and say that she did not see Oswald on the bus, because she saw “only a glimpse of him.” Naysayers forget that Oswald rented one of 3 bedrooms in her home and she saw him on a daily basis only 5 weeks before the assassination. He talked on the telephone constantly and interrupted her naps. Mrs. Bledsoe remembered that Oswald often spoke in a foreign language on her telephone. She was very familiar with Oswald's face and physique. Mrs. Bledsoe only needed a “glimpse” of Harvey Oswald to recognize him instantly. Naysayers constantly criticize Bledsoe and Jones and Whaley for their less than perfect memories. But Oswald was only in their presence for a mere 4-6 minutes. Naysayers conveniently forget that Bledsoe and Jones and Whaley all remembered that Oswald wore light colored grey pants on the bus and taxi. Oswald told Capt. Fritz that he had changed his dirty trousers (light colored grey pants) in his room. When arrested, Oswald was wearing very dark pants. His dirty light colored grey pants were later found in his room by police. How could Bledsoe and Jones and Whaley have known Oswald was wearing light grey pants on the bus/taxi unless they had personally seen him? Naysayers claim that McWatters never gave Oswald a bus transfer. If McWatters never gave bus transfer #004459 to Oswald, then perhaps naysayers would care to explain why Dallas Police called the Dallas Transit Division Superintendent. Explain how Mr. F.F. Yates was able to immediately identify McWatters as the driver who issued the bus transfer. Do the naysayers expect us to believe that Dallas Transit supervisors were coerced into going along with a fabricated story that the bus ride never happened? Naysayers ignore the fact that transfer #004459 came from McWatters' transfer book. They ignore McWatters' testimony that he remembered giving a transfer to Oswald and a transfer to a blond haired lady when both were getting off the bus. Naysayers ignore Mary Bledsoe's testimony that she spoke briefly with the blond lady when McWatters gave her a transfer. How would Oswald know about a blond-haired lady on McWatters bus unless he had ridden on that bus? Naysayers claim the bus transfer at the National Archives does not have a crease in the middle, so it was never folded and put in Oswald's pocket. Naysayers ignore the fact that National Archivist Steve Hamilton confirmed that the bus transfer has a crease in the middle, indicating that it had at one time been folded. Naysayers question the number of transfers given out by McWatters on 11/22/63. They know the first transfer McWatters issued was #004452, and they know the police found transfer #004459 in Oswald's shirt pocket. They claim, correctly, that McWatters gave out 8 transfers (#004452 to #004459). But they then claim that because McWatters told the WC that he gave out only two transfers, that 6 transfers were “missing.” Once again, these naysayers are simply misreading testimony. McWatters told the WC, “Yes, sir; I gave him one [bus transfer] about two blocks from where he got on [at Griffin]...that is the transfer because it had my punch mark on it....I gave only two transfers going through town on that trip [going through town on that trip!] and that was at the one stop of where I gave the lady and the gentlemen that got off the bus, I issued two transfers....But that was the only two transfers were issued [on that ONE trip thru town]. Very simple. McWatters issued six transfers prior to picking up Oswald and the blond lady (prior to 12:40 PM). He then issued a transfer to the blond lady and a transfer to Oswald when they got off the bus (circa 12:44 PM). Oswald told Capt. Fritz and his interrogators about a blond woman asking William Whaley to call her a taxi, just after Oswald got into Whaley's taxi. William Whaley told the WC the same story--that just after Oswald got into the front seat of his taxi, a blond lady asked him to call a taxi for her. How is it possible that Oswald's and Whaley's stories match perfectly, unless this incident actually occurred and was remembered by both Oswald and Whaley? Naysayers conveniently forget that Oswald's reference to a blond-haired lady, which he told to Capt. Fritz and numerous law enforcement officers during interrogations, was also remembered by McWatters, Bledsoe, and Jones. Naysayers criticize William Whaley for saying that Oswald had a silverlike strip on his shirt. Naysayers ignore and intentionally overlook that Whaley also said Oswald was wearing a brown long-sleeve shirt and a t-shirt with a soiled collar. Naysayers criticize William Whaley because he said Oswald's bracelet was a “stretchband,” when it looks like a “chain link” bracelet. But naysayers, once again, should do their homework. Oswald's bracelet is listed on a DPD property form, found in Box 1, folder 8, item 1 at the Dallas Archives. It is identified as "One I.D. stretch band with 'Lee' inscribed.” Naysayers also fail so explain how Whaley could have known that Oswald was wearing any kind of silver-colored bracelet, unless he saw the bracelet himself on Oswald's left arm while riding in his taxi. Naysayers criticize William Whaley when he said that he drove Oswald to Neches and Beckley, because this address is non-existent. Naysayers conveniently fail to remember that Oswald instructed Whaley to drive to the 500 block of N. Beckley. As Whaley was driving south on N. Beckley, Oswald said “this will do.” Whaley then stopped randomly in the street, at an unknown address, and Oswald got out of his taxi. Whaley wrote “500 N. Beckley” in his manifest because that is what he remembered Oswald told him when he first got into his taxi. Naysayers criticize William Whaley because he wrote down the time of Oswald's taxi ride incorrectly in his manifest. Naysayers conveniently forget that Whaley explained to the WC that he always wrote the times of his taxi rides in 15-minute intervals. And said that he often wrote two, three, or four of these entries in his manifest at the same time, long after the taxi rides. Whaley said that when he got back to the Union Terminal he made an entry of the trip (to N Beckley) on his manifest for the day. Naysayers criticize taxi driver William Whaley for naming the number 3 man in the police lineup as Oswald, when he was identified by the police as the number 2 man. Naysayers ignore the explanation that Whaley gave to the WC. Whaley simply said that LHO, walking from left to the right, was the 3rd man brought out for the lineup. From left to right, according to the police, Oswald was the #2 man. Naysayers criticize and criticize these witnesses over the smallest of details, in an attempt to “prove” that the bus and taxi ride never happened. This is the extent of their “research.” Naysayers ignore the fact that Capt. Fritz and many law enforcement officers heard Oswald say that he rode a bus, got a bus transfer, got into a taxi, offered to let a blond-haired lady have his taxi, and paid an 85 cent fare. The facts are that Bledsoe and Jones testified that Oswald was on McWatters bus, transfer #004459 was found in Oswald's shirt pocket, Whaley testified that Oswald rode in his taxi, that Oswald offered to let a blond-haired lady have his taxi, and that Oswald paid 95 cents in taxi fare. Witness testimony and evidence match pretty well with what Oswald told his interrogators. Naysayers criticize, criticize, and criticize these witnesses for not having perfect memories. Yet these naysayers never produce a single document or a single witness by which to prove the taxi and bus ride never happened. Nor can they offer an ounce of PROOF as to what they think COULD HAVE happened—only speculation, fantasies, and daydreams. John continued by writing the following: To these naysayers, I would ask them to simply identify the person or persons who came up with the idea to fabricate a story in which the bus and taxi rider never happened. I would ask them to name the person or persons who had the knowledge, presence, and ability to fabricate such a hoax within hours of Oswald's arrest.. I would remind naysayers that Oswald himself said during his first and second interrogations that he rode a bus, long before the police knew about Cecil McWatters. And Oswald made these statements in the presence of Capt. Fritz, James Hosty, Thomas Kelley, James Bookhout, and numerous officers. These people took notes, made reports, and/or gave WC testimony about statements made by Oswald. These naysayers would have us believe that a person or persons unknown convinced all of these people (SS agents Kelley, Nully and Forrest: FBI agents Hosty, Grant, Odum and Bookout; US Marshall Nash; Capt Fritz, DPD officers Sims, Boyd, Turner, Hall, Dhority, Owens, Leavelle, and Senkel, taxi driver Whaley, bus driver McWatters, bus passengers Bledsoe and Jones, bus and taxi officials) to lie and go along with a fabricated story that the bus and taxi ride never happened. But no matter how much evidence researchers produce to prove that Oswald rode on a bus and in a taxi on 11/22/63, we can be sure that irresponsible naysayers can and will find the most trivial, superficial, and inconsequential reasons to continue their criticism. Rather than nit-pick the statements and memories of witnesses who saw “Lee Harvey Oswald” riding in either the station wagon, bus, or taxi, naysayers should study the overwhelming amount of evidence that shows there were two “Lee Harvey Oswalds” who looked very similar. At 12:40 PM LEE Oswald got into a Nash Rambler station wagon in front of the TSBD, while HARVEY Oswald was getting into McWatters' city bus at Elm and Griffin. An hour and a half later HARVEY Oswald was arrested, handcuffed, and sitting in a room at Dallas Police headquarters. When Capt Fritz pointed to Roger Craig and said to Oswald, “This man saw you leave....what about the car?” Oswald replied, “that station wagon belongs to Mrs. Paine.....” HARVEY Oswald dared not say any more, but his statement about Mrs. Paine and a station wagon shows that he knew a lot more than what he told his interrogators . George Lardner, of the Washington Post, reported that “[CIA Director] Richard Helms told reporters that no one would ever know who or what Lee Harvey Oswald...represented.” In 1977 Helms became the only CIA director to be convicted of misleading Congress.

Eight or nine years ago here, Tom Scully found and reproduced the article below on Stuart Reed. Note, toward the end of the piece, that Reed was "decorated with the degree of Cavalier Officer of the Italian Order of Merit by the President and Prime Minister of Italy...." Ring any bells?

Paul J’s post above admirably covered your first question, I think. As for the timings…. According to the FBI, Reed said that the picture of the TSBD was taken about an hour after the assassination. No similar statements exist for the other photos, but the Texas Theater arrest photo speaks for itself (it was taken a little after 1:50 pm). I’ve heard researchers say that the bus photos, from the traffic snarls and the early afternoon shadows, appear to have been taken soon after the assassination. The photographic details seem entirely consistent with assuming the image is actually of McWatters’ bus with the brown-shirted Oswald on it. I’d guess that Reed snapped the bus photos first, just minutes after the hit, and that he then hung around for a half hour or so and took the image of the TSBD (let’s just for grins take the FBI's word for it that he said that he took it around 1:35), and that he then traveled to the Texas Theater, where he snapped his last money shot around 1:52 pm or so. People who believe "Oswald" DID get on that Marsalis bus have always had to wonder why. More than six years ago, Robert Charles-Dunne wrote on this very forum: “If it seems counterintuitive for an escaping assassin to walk many blocks east in order to catch a westbound bus, the fact that he allegedly caught it almost directly in front of the building housing 112th US Military Intelligence may be illuminating. It is also where purported Umbrella Man Stephen Louis Witt was employed.” Emphasis added above. FBI REPORT ON REED'S PHOTOS

IMO the evidence that a brown-shirted Oswald took a bus and taxi ride from the TSBD is every bit as good as the evidence that a white-shirted Oswald got into the Nash Rambler. Some people here believe the bus and taxi ride were invented by the Dallas Police the evening of 11/22/63, but the evidence for it is simply overwhelming. And yet as Tony points out, as an escape vehicle or even as a casual ride home, McWatters’ bus was a ridiculous choice. But since so much evidence shows it did happened, the only logical explanation is that brown-shirted Oswald was instructed to get on that bus. That it was part of a detailed plan to frame him is obvious from the photos taken that day by U.S. Army civilian employee Stuart Reed, who in quick succession took a series of color pictures of the front of the Book Depository, two images of the Marsalis bus, and pictures of Oswald being dragged out of the Texas Theater. Reed dropped off his film at the Dynacolor Company film processor in Dallas and soon left the country (he lived in the Canal Zone). On 11/26/63, Reed signed a document that gave the FBI “unrestricted permission” to pick up and utilize his film and slides for their investigation. Are we seriously to believe that Reed JUST HAPPENED TO TAKE ALL THE PHOTOS BELOW?

Here's the article from the 11/6/1969 Dallas Morning News describing Curry's press conference held the previous day during which he said, "No one has ever been able to put him [Oswald] in the Texas School Book Depository with a rifle in his hand."

Mr. Tanenbaum testified about his experiences on the HSCA and his beliefs about the assassination at a Los Angeles ARRB hearing on September 17, 1996. The ARRB's rather sloppy transcript of his testimony can be read on my website at the link below. https://harveyandlee.net/Tan.html His opening words were: "Good morning. You look at me in stunned silence. I'm here at the request of you to answer questions...."

To me, both shirts look brown. Mrs. Bledsoe said "Oswald" wore a brown shirt on the bus.

Tony, Sure, but even the HSCA recognized Marina's difficult position in front of the WC juggernaut when it wrote that her "testimony has all the weight of a handful of chicken feathers...." This was in the context of the Walker shooting, but it strikes me as quite an admission from the government.

The Washington Daily News, Wednesday, October 2, 1963, p.3 'SPOOKS' MAKE LIFE MISERABLE FOR AMBASSADOR LODGE 'Arrogant' CIA Disobeys Orders in Viet Nam By Richard T. Starnes .... Others Critical, Too Other American agencies here are incredibly bitter about the CIA. "If the United States ever experiences a 'Seven Days in May' it will come from the CIA, and not from the Pentagon," one U.S. official commented caustically. ("Seven Days in May" is a fictional account of an attempted military coup to take over the U.S. Government.) CIA "spooks" (a universal term for secret agents here) have penetrated every branch of the American community in Saigon, until non-spook Americans here almost seem to be suffering a CIA psychosis. An American field officer with a distinguished combat career speaks angrily about "that man at headquarters in Saigon wearing a colonel's uniform." He means the man is a CIA agent, and he can't understand what he is doing at U.S. military headquarters here, unless it is spying on other Americans. Another American officer, talking about the CIA, acidly commented: "You'd think they'd have learned something from Cuba but apparently they didn't."

Yeah, but only if all of them knew about a recording system. Less than a decade after the Kennedy assassination, Richard Nixon’s White House voice-activated taping system became famous. What also became famous was the fact that very few people knew about it. Fritz was not a rube, but I have no idea what kind of sophisticated crap he may have had access to. Assuming he recorded Oswald, how can we know how many others knew?

Joe, My bet is that the man the world knows as “Lee Harvey Oswald” at some point during his interrogations began to realize how much weight was behind his frame-up. At that point, he surely began spilling the beans. He may have, considering his probable intel training, started talking quietly, perhaps just to Fritz or someone like him… but before he was killed he was surely saying that he was a trained intelligence operative of some kind and had been following strict instructions about where to be and when for weeks, and especially on Nov 22, 1963. And that’s when the tape recordings or Dictabelt recordings or whatever was used suddenly disappeared, gathered up and swallowed up by someone whose name I’ll bet we never heard. Portable recording equipment was reasonably sophisticated in 1963. I'm old enough to remember. Is it conceivable that Oswald wasn’t recorded? The question I’ve always had was how many of the people sitting in during the interrogations were aware of the recordings and therefore had to keep their mouths shut for year after year.

Thanks so much for your detailed overview of Fritz’s interrogation notes, Steve. Comparing the Box 1 draft with the Box 15 version is fascinating. Besides what you noted above about the timing of his questioning about the so-called Backyard Photo(s), something else struck me in the initial comparison. Although the syntax isn’t one hundred percent clear, on page 7 of the Box 1 version he SEEMS to be saying that Robert Oswald was a close friend of the Paines, although it could be interpreted differently. But adding to my suspicions that he was really referring to Robert is the handwritten edit to the same basic paragraph on page 6 of the Box 15 version. This edit moves the sentence just enough to make it seem as if it is no longer a reference to Robert. Fritz clearly admits that “this report was made from rough notes and memory” but it strikes me as utterly remarkable that it is undated and unsigned. Do you have any clues about when it might have been composed and/or typed? Even more remarkable than the above is Fritz’s statement: “I have no recorder in this office and was unable to record the interview.” I seem to recall seeing years ago a somewhat contemporaneous floor plan of DPD headquarters, and marked on it was an enclosed space called “Recording Room.” No doubt the recording equipment was busy monitoring more important suspects.

Steve, Thanks for the handy links. Do you think it was Fritz who had the following notes typed out? 3. Interrogation, by an unknown author. Draft of interrogation of Lee Harvey Oswald, (Original), date unknown. 00001376 13 pages 05 03 003 1376-001.gif 1376-002.gif 1376-003.gif 1376-004.gif 1376-005.gif 1376-006.gif 1376-007.gif 1376-008.gif 1376-009.gif 1376-010.gif 1376-011.gif 1376-012.gif 1376-013.gif

Correction to the above: It was Bill Shelley who was in direct charge of the flooring work on the sixth floor. Thanks, DJ, for the date and photographer info.

Three Depository employees shown in the picture taken by Dillard were on the fifth floor of the building when the shots were fired: James Jarman, Jr., age 34, a wrapper in the shipping department; Bonnie Ray Williams, age 20, a warehouseman temporarily assigned to laying a plywood floor on the sixth floor and Harold Norman, age 26, an "order filler." --Warren Commission Report, p. 68 (emphasis added) Roy Truly would have been in charge of the flooring work. Astounding coincidence, eh?

Still sticking with the opinions, eh? Why don't you share with us your theory of how the sixth floor assassins came down unseen and unheard. And, by the way, this is just a theory, as John has been clear about from the beginning: From the article: Passenger elevator The purpose of this essay is not to "prove" how two men vanished from the 6th floor. My purpose is to show researchers that there is at least one alternative "escape route." By using one plausible "escape route," which I will explain, we may be able to understand the reason why the electricity was briefly turned off, why the 3 men on the 5th floor heard nobody run across the 6th floor to the stairway, why neither the 3 men on the 5th floor (Jarman, Williams, Norman) or the lady office workers on the 4th floor (Styles, Adams) saw anybody running down the stairway or riding the freight elevators, and why Officer Baker and Roy Truly saw nobody on the freight elevators or stairway. What follows is an alternate, and very discreet and secret way by which to go from the 6th floor to the 1st floor. I BELIEVE THE 2 MEN ON THE 6TH FLOOR USED THE PASSENGER ELEVATOR.

And, by the same rationale, Andrej, I assume you do not wish to be in the category of CT critics who present any opinions they can conjure as established facts simply in order to discredit a CT theory. For example…. You may believe your “two-minute estimate” for Mrs. Stanton’s return is realistic, but in reality it is just your opinion. You offered Geneva Hine’s testimony as “proof” that Mrs. Stanton returned within two minutes, when in reality it does no such thing. Mrs. Hine’s description of the lights and telephones going out and then going on again only after she had visited a number of different offices, and her coworkers returning inside ONLY AFTER THAT backs our theory perfectly. You do not know when Mrs. Stanton entered the passenger elevator. Please prove that she entered it “1 minute after the shooting.” And please offer real proof, not something like your previous “proof.” The lights may have remained on in parts of the building as JFK was murdered, but Mrs. Hine said “all the lights went out” in her office, which was on the second floor. As you should know, the second, third and fourth floors of the TSBD had just recently been renovated for offices, and the passenger elevator was added. We suspect—but can’t prove—that separate circuit breakers were added in a new panel for the new circuitry. Unlike you, we will not offer this as proof, but I’d suggest you consult a commercial builder if you think our suspicion is unreasonable. You do not know that “at least two phones on the second floor were in operation just seconds after the last shot….” That is your opinion that you are masquerading as a fact. It is also your opinion, apparently, that the phones stopped operating as the motorcade approached because “people were watching the motorcade” or eating lunch. This is a silly argument. The TSBD provided books to a wide geographical area, including several states. Not everyone was paying attention to the motorcade. And people obviously were making phone calls during lunch hour because Geneva Hine noticed it when she said “the lights all went out and the phones went dead” just as the motorcade approached. Once again, your statement that “The conspirator Bill Shelley was not at the back of the first floor within one minute of shooting,” is your opinion, not a fact. You use his WC testimony to buttress your argument, but you ignore how much the statements of both Shelley and Lovelady changed from their first-day affidavits of 11/22/63. We have discussed this at length. Why do you ignore it now? The existing sworn testimony of Vickie Adams is that she saw Shelley and Lovelady at the base of the stairs within a minute or so of the assassination. I don’t believe those words were put into her mouth later by crooked attorneys because of the questions asked just a few hours later of both Shelley and Lovelady by the WC attorney. It is true that Barry Ernest interviewed Adams thirty years later and she said she had not said those words, but analyzing the evidence as a whole, I still believe she originally saw the men that day. As to your opinions about the flooring on the sixth floor and the condition of the elevator shaft, I think you will have to admit that it is a REMARKABLE COINCIDENCE that, according to the Warren Report, the flooring on the sixth floor of the TSBD was being redone on 11/22/63. And exactly who would have been in charge of that? Please stop pretending your opinions are facts. If I am guilty of that, I’ll try to do the same.

Thanks, Andrej, but I don’t see how this proves Miss Hine believed Stanton and the others were back as fast as you say. Read Hine’s testimony before the part you quoted. Those other office doors she knocked on and tried to enter, the last one being Southwestern Publishing, where she “called and called and shook the door,” and heard a woman talking on the phone. And then…. “I went straight up to the desk because the telephones were beginning to wink; outside calls were beginning to come in.” At that point, the electricity, at least in the recently renovated part of the building (offices on floors 2, 3, 4, and the front passenger elevator) had been turned back on. Only after that does she talk about the people who came back in from the street.

Andrej, I’m trying to figure out how to answer your question without starting a flame war with the PrayerMan people. But, if you go to that website and start examining the pictures, you should find one on the front steps identifying in red letters “Pauline Sanders” and “Sarah Stanton.” (I have no idea if that is really them because the images are far too fuzzy, at least in my opinion.) To be honest, I think PrayerMan is Sarah Stanton. The still photo I'm talking about is a capture from the Darnell film clip. But whoever is Sarah Stanton, the photo appears to have been taken after the shots, because you can see people walking up into the building. Can you prove that Sarah Stanton went into the building as early as you say she did?

Andrej, Look at the film clips of people entering the TSBD several minutes after the shots were fired. There is Sarah Stanton and her friend standing side by side on the east side of the steps. Geneva Hine said that after hurrying to the adjoining offices on the first floor (John says it’s about a 40 foot walk), she returned to her office and found the lights had been turned back on. We don’t know how long she was away from her office, but I doubt it was much longer than a minute or two. The men on the sixth floor just had to get into the elevator car, and then they needed the electricity turned back on so they could proceed down to the second floor, where, according to John’s theory, the white-shirted Oswald got off. Not sure whether it was Sarah Stanton or Inspector Sawyer who were first to use the passenger elevator after the shooting. Remember that Sawyer said when the elevator door opened, a man got off as Sawyer was getting on. John believes this was the man in the brown jacket who had been on the sixth floor and probably walked past Shelley and Lovelady as he exited the rear of the building to eventually get into the Nash Rambler when it was on Record St. (The same car that soon picked up the white-shirted Oswald). According to John’s analysis, the electricity to all or parts of the building (including the elevators) was turned off and back on twice: once during the hit, and again a few minutes later.

Paul, Looking at the statements by Baker and Arnold and Biffle and Holmes (and yes, Holmes should be considered with extreme care), I’m beginning to think “Oswald” was stopped not once, but twice: once on the second floor by the lunch room and again in the first floor lobby. Which doesn’t seem unreasonable, considering the circumstances. Carolyn Arnold saw Oswald in the 2nd floor lunchroom just five minutes before the shots rang out. And the FBI blew thick smoke around that fact. We know Oswald made it to the lobby because McNeil reported it as happening, though McNeil never saw Oswald go out the front door. The evidence that Oswald was also challenged on the first floor is a little more obtuse, but I’m working on it with a friend. More soon, hopefully.