Andrej Stancak

Jim, there is obviously a confusion about the shirt. Please find here a part fo Cpt. Fritz's notes saying he changed shirts and trousers. Lee Oswald did not have time to change the shirt earlier because he went to Irving on Thursday with the same shirt he wore on Friday morning. How did the ticket occur in the pocket of his darker shirt, this I do not know, however, it could also be one of Lee's small puzzles he was producing on a continuous basis. He might not have wished that anyone found it when his room would be inspected, or on the contrary, that he couls use it as a proof of his whereabouts. He could also mechanically pull out the ticket from one shirt and put it into another. "At appt. Changed shirts + tr. Put in dirty clothes - long sleeve red sh + gray tr."

Jim: Lee Oswald did not wear the same shirt while at work and during PM hours after he went to his rooming house. He had his long sleeves rolled up to the elbows. The shirt was not stuck in his pants, rather it was loose with both front facings of the shirt out on his pants. This loose shirt makes the impression that he was thicker than he really was. Of note, the shirt Lee wore in the afternoon did not have the front facings as leaves, it was of equal length around its diameter. Also, the shirt Lee wore in the afternoon was much darker than the one he wore in the morning and which is of identical colour as we see in Darnell film. Warren Commission Exhibits related to Marina Oswald's testimony:

Jim: the best frame is perhaps the one posted on Robin Unger's jfkassassinationgallery.com: The image, of course, is slightly blurred, yet it reveals several features supporting the possibility that Prayer Man was Lee Oswald: 1. It is a male. 2. He wears worker type of clothes of grey colour matching well the shirt and pants worn by Lee on that Friday (Marina Oswald's testimony). 3. The man measures 5'9'' which is Lee Oswald's body height. 4. The hair and hairline of the man are similar to Lee Oswald's features. 5. The posture of this man is featured by his right leg being backward and left leg forward and bent, which are the features seen in Lee's childhood pictures and numerous adult pictures. This man came out to his spot very late, perhaps just a few seconds before the commencement of Wiegman film as he is not seen at his spot in Hughes film (at least no one has shown him there so far). Therefore, Prayer Man most likely came out through the glass door after Kennedy's limo passed the building. The critics of Prayer Man = Oswald theory have been often pointing to the alternative explanation which was that Prayer Man was Sarah Stanton. There were two ladies on the top landing during the time of the shooting, Mrs. Stanton and Mrs. Saunders. Fortunately, none of the ladies could have possibly posed as Prayer Man. Mrs. Saunders stood close to the glass door in the eastern section of the doorway, and Mrs. Stanton in the cluster of people: Bill Shelley, Billy Lovelady and Otis Williams. While there is only a partial face of a person seen in Altgens6 at her assumed location on the top landing, confirming that she did not stand at the western wall as Prayer Man did, a more convincing proof excluding Mrs. Stanton as Prayer Man comes from the heigh analysis. Mrs. Stanton was too tall to be Prayer Man. There are certainly a number of other issues such as hair colour and shape of her hair and her overall body build which also dismiss Mrs. Stanton as Prayer Man. I have posted the recent height analysis on Mrs. Stanon's body height in "Pauline Sanders" thread because I saw that this thread is getting more in direction of the second-floor encounter. Sean Murphy provided a logical analysis of possible candidates for being Prayer Man back in 2013. The analysis revealed that there is simply no one else who could be Prayer Man than Lee Oswald. After eliminating now the two uncertain possibilities (Mrs. Stanton, Mrs. Saunders), Sean's question is getting even more impetus. Who was Prayer Man? Points 1-5 on top of my post give enough reasons to pursue Prayer Man = Lee Oswald line. This is the picture showing Mrs. Stanton as a lady 5'5'' and standing close to Larry (who was not in the doorway, of course) and Buell Wesley Frazier. This analysis excludes Mrs. Stanton as Prayer Man for good.

Right, let us continue pursuing the possibility of Sarah Stanton being Prayer Man. We now know that Mrs. Stanton considered herself to be 5'4'' - 5'6''. However, the thick layer of her hair makes it difficult to say exactly how tall, within the range given by herself, she actually was. Therefore, I constructed a 3D model of Mrs. Stanton by copying as many of her features as possible. A slightly less elaborate model of Larry was also made because Larry was 6' or 6'1'' and his figure was useful in checking Mrs. Stanton's body height. The figure below shows the original family photograph (left) and the reconstructed figures (right) with a 30% and 70% overlays in the middle. It is important to note that Mrs. Stanton had a very thick but not a long upper forearm. Also, please note that Larry stands slightly behind Mrs. Stanton which can confound readings of his body height from a photograph. After obtaining correct proportions of both figures, it was possible to import them into the 3D doorway model to see how would they look like in comparison to Mr. Frazier. The next figure shows the doorway with Mrs. Stanton and Larry on the left and Mr. Frazier at his usual location on the right. Mrs. Stanton's body height was set to 5'5''. It is not too difficult to see that Larry was of the exact same height as Mr. Frazier. Also, the top of Mrs. Stanton head is much higher that Mr. Frazier shoulder/lower chin line which Prayer Man's figure shows in Darnell. And the same figures with measuring sticks crossing their bodies so that everyone can check the body heights. Of course, Larry was 6' and not 5'10'' which the best photoanalyst has professionally determined just by looking on the picture. We will also explore how would Mrs. Stanton fare as Prayer Man. This promises to be a lot of fun.

Jim: I spent three years reconstructing the doorway in 3D. The logic is the following: if we have an accurate 3D model of the doorway, based on measured dimensions of all its aspects, it is possible to orient the doorway to the same view as seen in a historic photograph. Then, by just decreasing or increasing the size of one of the images (the original or a 2D picture of the 3D doorway), one can achieve a very good alignment between the model and the doorway. I am checking the quality of the alignment by overlaying the original (e.g., Darnell) still with the 3D model. The essential added value of this method is that various objects in the historic photograph (e.g., people) also achieve realistic dimensions (inherited from the 3D model), and it is possible then to read their sizes. Therefore, I am able to read the height of the top of Prayer Man's head and can see it is 5'2''. If my mannequin would be e.g., taller than Prayer Man, the overlay would reveal a mismatch in the model's body height. As far as the body orientations and leaning and tilting are concerned, those need to be reproduced as accurately as possible. I am using Poser 11.1 to model some characters, such as Prayer Man. You can read more about my methods on my blog: http://thejfktruthmatters.wordpress.com . I am placing here one overlay of my 3D model and a Darnell still. Please note a light spot to the right of Mr. Shelley's head (the man in a black suit on the top platform). This, in my humble opinion, is what belongs to Mrs. Stanton who stood back there on the top landing, and to the left of Mr. Frazier. And this is an example of my 3D reconstruction of Altgens6 (in development) showing a very good alignment between the 3D model and Altgens6. A-D show overlays at different blending rates. I hope this may help you to understand my methods better.

This interview alone seals the case. Mr. Frazier confirmed very clearly without any hesitations that a lady stood to his left, not to his right. This is consistent with the person, which I have estimated earlier to be 5'4'', standing behind Mr. Shelley's right shoulder and to the left of Mr. Frazier. There was enough space there, and Mrs. Stanton obviously needed space since she was a huge lady. This puts her in the back row of spectators and this is the reason we only see glimpses of her figure in Darnell. Fortunately, there is a partial face in Altgens6 which was at a similar location (slightly more forward though) as in Darnell and at a height corresponding to the height at which Mrs. Stanton would have her face.

This leads us to the question when did Mrs. Stanton see Lee Harvey Oswald on Friday, November 22. In my opinion, Mrs. Stanton went out early, possibly around 12.10 PM, and that was the time when she met Lee Oswald on stairs. This early time estimate refers to two testimonies: the testimony of Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady. 1. Billy Lovelady came to the first floor at 11.50 or 12.00noon: Mr. BALL - What time did you quit work that day or knock off for lunch that day? Mr. LOVELADY - Same time, 12. Mr. BALL - A little before 12? Mr. LOVELADY - Well, we came down at 10 minutes til to wash up and get ready for it. He washed his hands, went up to the second floor to buy a coke, and came back with the coke to the first floor. In the next, he saw Mrs. Stanton through the glass door and decided to go out. He saw Mrs. Stanton there: Mr. BALL - What did you do after you went down and washed up; what did you do? Mr. LOVELADY - Well, I went over and got my lunch and went upstairs and got a coke and come on back down. Mr. BALL - Upstairs on what floor? Mr. LOVELADY - That's on the second floor; so, I started going to the domino room where I generally went in to set down and eat and nobody was there and I happened to look on the outside and Mr. Shelley was standing outside with Miss Sarah Stanton, I believe her name is, and I said, "Well, I'll go out there and talk with them, sit down and eat my lunch out there, set on the steps," so I went out there. Mr. BALL - You ate your lunch on the steps? Mr. LOVELADY - Yes, sir. Mr. BALL - Who was with you? Mr. LOVELADY - Bill Shelley and Sarah Stanton, and right behind me Mr. BALL - What was that last name? Mr. LOVELADY - Stanton. Mr. BALL - What is the first name? Mr. LOVELADY - Bill Shelley. Mr. BALL - And Stanton's first name? Mr. LOVELADY - Miss Sarah Stanton. 2. Bill Shelley confirmed the presence of Mrs. Stanton in the doorway before Billy Lovelady came out and even before he himself came out: Mr. SHELLEY - Oh, several people were out there waiting to watch the motorcade and I went out to join them.Mr. BALL - And who was out there?Mr. SHELLEY - Well, there was Lloyd Viles of McGraw-Hill, Sarah Stanton, she's with Texas School Book, and Wesley Frazier and Billy Lovelady joined us shortly afterwards.Mr. BALL - You were standing where?Mr. SHELLEY - Just outside the glass doors there.Mr. BALL - That would be on the top landing of the entrance? Mr. SHELLEY - yes. It should be noted that neither Bill Shelley nor Billy Lovelady would be able to spot Mrs. Sarah Stanton if she stood at Prayer Man's location. Taken together, it is impossible that Mrs. Stanton would get to the doorway at 12.25, at the time when Carolyne Arnold allegedly saw Lee Oswald on the second floor. The motorcade was due to arrive at 12.25, and that would be too late for Mrs. Stanton to start preparing for the motorcade as she was describing it to the members of her family.

The interview also sheds some light on the conflict between Mrs. Stanton's testimony for the FBI in which she claimed that she did not see Oswald in Friday, November 22, and her description of her encounter with Lee Oswald which she conferred to her family members. Mrs. Stanton was most likely coerced by the FBI to lie about her encounter with Lee Oswald before the shooting. Mrs. Stanton agreed, possibly in exchange for receiving some guarantees that she would never be called to testify again. Further, although she did sign the FBI statement, she did not make any statement under oath, and so she did not perjure herself. Knowing that she did not sign a truthful account, Mrs. Stanton avoided talking with anybody about her encounter with Lee Oswald on that fateful Friday, possibly because someone would flag up the contrast between her FBI statements and her true account. She did say it to people whom she trusted because she did not feel bound to lie to her family. We should be thankful to Mrs. Stanton for that. The reason for suppressing Mrs. Stanton's account was most likely the fact that Mrs. Stanton saw Lee Oswald with a soda too long before the assassination. Late edit: Mrs. Stanton's story actually played into the lone shooter theory which was well established with the FBI early on and even more so in the spring of 1964 when Mrs. Stanton was interviewed by the FBI. So, why would the FBI suppresss a testimony in which Lee is seen by another Depository employee to go upstairs, and even saying that he was going upstairs and will not have a lunch. This would fit with Lee Oswald's plan to kill the President - he went downstairs and then went back upstairs to accomplish his misdeed. Yet, the FBI was not interested in anyone hearing Mrs. Stanton's story. Why is it so? The coke is the problem: Mrs. Stanton saw Lee with a bottle of coke very early on, maybe at 12.10, or 12.15 as the latest. However, the made-up second floor encounter also needed a fresh coke (at least so it has been arranged) and that would not fare well with Mrs. Stanton's account.

Of course, the interview is fatal to the theory that Sarah Stanton was Prayer Man. As I explained in a different thread, it is not worthy to argue about the hair colour or the shape of the hairline as this will end in both sides claiming their points ad infinitum without any resolution. Sarah Stanton was a tall person (given that the average height of females in her age category was 5'2'' in 1963) and it turns out that she was just too tall to be Prayer Man. The most simple way to demonstrate Mrs. Stanton's body height in the doorway is by fitting a measuring stick to Mr. Frazier's body. As his body height was 6' or 6'1/2 '', it is possible to draw a line at 5'5''. The line runs far above Prayer Man's head which reached to 5'2''. This does not mean that Prayer Man was 5'2'' because he stood with his right foot on the second step and therefore, Prayer Man's body height was 5'2'' + 7'' (the height of one step) = 5'9''. And if anyone would like to have the same in 3D to account for the factor of perspective, please have a look on my 2006 model illustrating the relationships between a person 5'6'' standing on the top landing and Prayer Man. This analysis shows the same as the simple measuring stick analysis. A person 5'6'' is too tall to be Prayer Man.

Jim: thanks for posting this audio recording. In spite of containing many leading questions and maneuvering the two ladies to adopt certain views, the interview does contain useful information. Importantly, the interview confirms the authenticity of the photograph in which Mrs. Stanton was photographed with her son Larry. The paragraph below contains the points which the ladies have confirmed: 00:25 Sarah Stanton talked about the assassination with members of her family, it was always the same story. 01:21: Sarah stood on the front steps during the shooting and she left the doorway immediately after the shooting to get a better view. 01:26: Lee Oswald was drinking a soda when he was seen by Sarah. 01:36: Sarah Stanton was a very big woman. 02:08: Sarah Stanton saw Lee Oswald on stairs. She asked if she was going down, and he said he is going upstairs. 02:32: "No, I am going upstairs" "I came down to get the soda and I am going back ... to the room where he was working" 03:12: Sarah saw Lee Oswald holding a soda in his hand. 04:26: Lee got the soda from the machine there. 05:03: Sarah said Lee was going to eat and he just came to get a soda. 05:48: Sarah asked if Lee was going to have lunch. He said: "No, I am going back to my room." 06:09: "The reason ... She wanna to talk to him because he was a very quiet person... and he was not going to... to have a conversation with nobody". 06:23: "So, she said he never talked, so she asked him if he was going out to lunch. And he said, "No, just a soda". " 07:19: Sarah went down because President was already coming but he was not there yet. So she went to prepare herself and be on the stairs where she met Oswald. 08:15: "He went upstairs". 08:35: When asked if Sarah spoke to the FBI, the answer was "I dont' think so". Wanda explains: "She did not wanna speak. And we don't know her reasons for it... but she did not want to speak to anybody, and they were harassing her.... not harassing her, but any calls or I don't know they were coming over and trying to get information ... she really did not want to say anything, she did not want to be bothered." 09:50: The ladies could not confirm that Sarah spoke to the FBI. 09:59: Lee Oswald was a very quiet person, did not speak to anybody. 11:41: "We would not know what she told them" (the FBI). 12:23: Confirmed that Sarah was Prayer Man because of the body shape. 12:28: Oswald went up before the motorcade came through. 13:58: When asked to confirm that Sarah had the same characteristics as Prayer Man, both women confirmed. 14:07: Confirmed that Sarah was about 5'5''. 14:37: Sarah could also be 5'6''. 14:49: Sarah herself said she was 5'4'' - 5'6''. 15:00: Agreed that their conclusion that Sarah was Prayer Man was owing to Sarah being taller than other doorway occupants. 15:36: Sarah weighed at least 300 pounds. She was over 300 pounds. 16:11: Sarah was big at the bottom and her hips, less so at her top. Her arms were big. 16:30: The picture with Sarah and her son Larry is not exactly from 1963 because Sarah was even bigger at that time than when she was photographed with Larry. 17:28: The colour of Sarah's hair was grey in 1963. 18:41: Not remembered that Sarah would be ever dying her hair. 19:09: Maybe Sarah had a wig (laughing). 21:26: Did not agree that the face seen in Davidson's enhancement of Wiegman frame was Sarah's face. 22:20: Sarah was looking at the street, not in a purse. 22:30: The ladies think that Prayer Man was a woman. 22:48: Larry was tall over 6 feet. 23:29: Larry was 6'1''.

The audio linked below was posted by Denis Morrisette on FaceBook and Youtube. Ed Shields says that Lee Oswald went up to Mrs. Reid's desk after the assassination and told her that the President has been shot. Lee spotted a bus at that time and left. Mr. Shields was not a witness to these events, however, he gives the names of people who told him about Lee Oswald's movements after the shooting. It would be much appreciated if anyone would be willing to transcribe this short interview, I am not the best person to do it as I may not hear and interpret some words correctly. Kudos to Denis for getting this and other good quality audio recordings of HSCA testimonies from NARA. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKOeM6zk6S8

Bart: I can see that you already made up your mind about the people in the doorway. I have added to your picture some lines which delineate the figure of who I think is Mrs. Stanton, just in case you would in future like to consider this option too.

Bart: the Darnell scene could not change too much during the time which elapsed from the end of Wiegman till when Darnell captured the doorway, some 20 seconds. What the people in the doorway did (except Prayer Man) was that they optimised their views of the Tripple Underpass. The ladies in the lower eastern part of the doorway turned their heads more towards their right side. Mrs. Reese walked up from the sixth to the third step to tackle the problem that she was short and needed an elevated vantage point. Carl Jones left entirely after Wiegman and moved in direction of the Grassy Knoll. Otis Williams is at a similar spot in Darnell as he was in Altgens and Wiegman, he only changed arms; he was shielding his eyes with his right arm in Altgens and he used his left arm in Darnell. Mr. Frazier was close to the glass window, deep in the shadow in Wiegman, and he moved forwards to the spot which was occupied by Billy Lovelady seconds earlier. Billy Lovelady is seen stepping down at end of Wiegman, however, he stopped and is on the fifth step in Darnell. Joe Molina stepped down one step and rotated his torso towards his right and this together with Darnell's camera view angle causes him to be viewed from the profile. Mrs. Saunders moved slightly more towards the west so she is seen close to the middle door window in Darnell, and cannot be seen in Wiegman or Altgens. In Wiegman, she fell into the "dead space", a space not seen by Wiegman's camera. In Altgens, her small figure is hidden behind Shelley's figure. Mr. Shelley wore a suit, and he stood in the centre of the top landing throughout the films. Mrs. Stanton stood between Billy Lovelady and Bill Shelley in Altgens and stepped back into the shadow and behind Mr. Shelley's right shoulder just before Darnell film was shot. As far as the two men seen in Couch/Darnell who you consider to be Shelley and Lovelady, I also believed that they would be them. I was mistaken. The man in suit is taller than the other man wearing the shirt which cannot be. Bill Shelly was only 5'6'', he was shorter than Billy Lovelady. Billy Lovelady had a disticnt forward head posture (a hunch) which that man in Couch/Darnell does not have. While I was at ROKC, there was a gentleman there, I guess his name was Lee Farley. He was the first to raise the possibility that the man close to the western wall on the fifth step was Billy Lovelady. His suggestion did not fare well at that time, however, after looking at the film frames and checking all the details later, including the body height, I think Mr. Farley was correct and deserves a credit for his discovery. If you would wish to discard Williams, Molina, Shelley and Lovelady as the doorway occupants in Darnell, you would need to say who are the people which are now unlabelled.

Jim Hargrove: you are being used by that individuum. If you cannot evaluate Prayer Man data yourself, what is left to you is to automatically condone that person's diatribes. I asked you to provide evidence for the statements provided by the family members of Mrs. Sarah Stanton and for the possibility to contact them. You work with John Amstrong and know very well that everything you say or write needs to be provable. Facebook is not a reliable source of research data. Please ask your source to provide recordings of phone calls, screenshots of emails, and the contact details for family members so that we can verify data and use them further. Do you agree with your source that the height of a human head is 7 1/2 inch? Have you measured the height of your head to confirm your contact's allegations?

Bart: I am not sure if your location of Sarah Stanton in Darnell is plausible. Of course, the pictures are blurred to the extent that it is difficult to understand who is who. The light object which you have highlighted may be Joe Molina. Please see all doorway frames in Darnell and you may see that this person has stepped down one step about 10 frames earlier. I have played the doorway part of Darnell many times to understand this and all other details. It looks like this person is shielding his eyes with an arm, however, in fact, he uses both his arms but since he is seen from the profile, it looks like he is using one arm only. This is what Mr. Molina did in Altgens and Wiegman, and what he continues to do in Darnell. Please find here an overlay of the particular Darnell frame with the 3D model. It helps, at least me, to visualise the body contours in blurred blobs. ... and the full model:

I modelled various body heights of Prayer Man for the situation if Prayer man stood with both his feet on the top landing in my blog article dated April 2016 (http://thejfktruthmatters.wordpress.com). In the figure below, copied from my blog post, Prayer Man has been set to measure 5'6'', only an inch more than the height estimate of 5'5'' (Mrs. Stanton). However, a range of 5'4'' - 5''6'' was provided by Mrs. Stanton's family and therefore, the example is relevant. The horizontal blue line is the line crossing the top of Prayer Man's head in Darnell still. One can easily see that the height difference between 5'6'' and 5'2'' invalidates the possibility of such person to be Prayer Man.

This is a simple variation on the theme of Mrs. Stanton' appearance in the doorway if she had posed as Prayer Man. It is a very simple analysis which anyone can replicate. We know that Mr. Frazier was 6' tall and can use this known dimension to place a measuring stick in such a way that the 6' tick aligns with the top of Mr. Frazier's head. In the next, Mrs. Stanton's figure, cut from the garden photograph, is placed into the scene in such a way that the top of her head aligns with the 5'5'' tick. The yellow and purple horizontal lines highlight the problem: the yellow line connects the tip of Prayer Man's head with the lower edge of Mr. Frazier's head, something which has been demonstrated many times and it is well acknowledged. This line crosses the measuring stick at 5'2''. The purple line is, of course, 3'' higher than the yellow line. Mrs. Stanton with her 5'5'' was too tall to be Prayer Man. In the figure below, the top of Mrs. Stanton head was taken simply as the top of her hair. The 5'5'' line is actually what matters most in this example. One can also use this simple analysis to estimate the height of Mr. Frazier's head. It was 10''.

Let us now move the whole garden picture to the east so that the face of Mrs. Stanton would be close to Mr. Shelley's figure in the centre of the doorway. The face of Mrs. Stanton is delineated with a yellow line to indicate the relative height of her face if she stood back there in the shadow. The inset in the right part of the picture is from another Darnell frame which shows a blurred head of a person who stood behind Mr. Shelley's right shoulder. The inset is aligned to match the figure of Mr. Frazier. The red half-circle is where a faint contour of a head is seen (please see http://thejfktruthmatters.wordpress.com for more details). Mrs. Stanton's face would match the height at which this faint face can be seen. Mrs. Stanton stood in the shadow, very close to Mr. Frazier, just as he told in his 2013 interview. The figure below (C) shows where the face of Mrs. Stanton was in that particular frame. I understand that some researchers would like to have a clear view of Mrs. Stanton to confirm the identity, unfortunately, no frame shows any details. This is the reason why her figure has not been identified for 54 years. If it would all be simple and straightforward, she would have been already spotted by previous generations of researchers.

And so, Larry was 6' as was also Buell Wesley Frazier. Let us fit Larry onto Mr. Frazier's figure in Darnell, as they were of the same body height, and we will see how would Mrs. Stanton fare as Prayer Man. In the figure above, the garden picture was overlayed onto the doorway together with the measuring stick. Larry was fitted onto Mr. Frazier and the rest is determined by the dimensions of both photographs. Please note the thin blue line aligned horizontally with the top of Prayer Man's head. It crosses the measuring stick at 5'2''. Mrs. Stanton would never make it as Prayer Man. She is just too tall to be Prayer Man. I am not mentioning other details such as body build and hairlines which are so much different in Mrs. Stanton compared to Prayer Man, however, this is because I would not like to be involved in silly games: "I say the hairlines are identical" and " And I say the hairlines are different" - this is a typical ego game usually ending with locking a thread. And this is all she wrote. Prayer Man could be neither Mrs. Saunders nor Mrs. Stanton. So, who was Prayer Man?

Mrs. Stanton was a tall person, however, her son Larry was even taller which is not surprising. He was a male and children often are taller than parents. The question is how much was Larry taller than Mrs. Stanton. I have analysed the body heights of both these figures in detail and it appears that Mrs. Stanton's head reached about to the middle of the naso-labial space, the space between the bottom of the nose and upper lip of the mouth. The sizes of human heads are known as well as the distances between the top of the head to the bottom of the nose. Here are some data: The difference between the dimension labelled (14) and the dimension labelled (16) is about 6 1/2 inch for tall people (the relevant values framed with ellipses). However, how tall was Larry? The figure below shows the method of estimation of Larry's body height using the 7.5 head-to-body ratio which I have used in several of my previous posts. I used the 7.5 ratio to estimate the ground level in the garden picture of Mrs. Stanton and her son. I then also applied the same method to Mrs. Stanton. The top of the heads is a bit difficult to estimate because both people had bushy hair which could be pressed by an inch lower to the skull. Therefore, I took the half of the distance between the forehead hairline and the top of hair as the estimate of the top of the head. In the next, a measuring stick was placed next to Mrs. Stanton who we know measured between 5'4 - 5'6''. The middle of the range (5'5'') was taken to align with the top of Mrs. Stanton's head. At this stage, it was possible to read Larry's body height, and it was 6'. It could also be slightly more tahn 6' but not more than 1''. The two pink rectangles are the nose-to-nose differences between the two prople. One of the rectangle is placed close to the measuring stick to allow reading. The nose-to-nose distance was 7''. I use nose-to-nose distance to compare the body height difference because the tips of the noses can be reliably identified in both figures, unlike the tops of the heads. So, let us make a small math: 6' = 72''. 72'' - 7'' = 65''. And 65'' is 5' 5'', which is Mrs. Stanton's body height.

Let us look further into Mrs. Stanton's appearance. Linda Zambanini, after months of intense effort and with sacrifices, was able to link one picture, currently posted on Find A Grave server, with Mrs. Stanton. That picture is shown in the left-hand panel in the figure below. Sarah was photographed as a child with her younger siblings. Later, one former member of the Forum posted on Facebook ("PrayerWoman" page) another picture of Mrs. Stanton. Mrs. Stannton was photographed with a young man, allegedly her son Larry. The family of Mrs. Stanton conferred that Mrs. Stanton was a tall woman between 5'4'' and 5'6''. I took some time to compare the faces of these two females and, in my opinion, both pictures depict the same person, once when she was a child and once when she was older. The signs which confirm the identity are highlighted with yellow lines in the figure below: curling of hair on sides of the forehead, distinct cheeks, mouth situated deep in the face, the line of the mouth (and a constant smile), and the chin protruding forwards. As a result of the chin-cheek-mouth configuration, there appeared to be a shadow lateral to the corners of the mouth. These strong features are important not only because they confirm the identity of Mrs. Sanders but also that these facial features should be present in any new picture of Mrs. Stanton. The childhood picture shows few interesting details. First, young Sarah used to or liked to wear glasses, perhaps sunglasses. The sunglasses have a white frame. Similar white-frame sunglasses can be seen on the left-hand woman in the double picture (5/31) which, however, was not confirmed yet Linda that it would show Mrs. Stanton. Further, Sarah had a relatively short forearm compared to the length of the forearm which both Prayer Man and Lee Harvey Oswald) had. Lee' forearm was 10-15% longer than it should be for a man of his body height.

Jim: you may wish to check my analysis of the locations and body heights of Mrs. Stanton and Mrs. Sanders: http://thejfktruthmatters.wordpress.com (January 31).

Jim: what is the serious new evidence, what is your source's biased interpretation, and what is your translation of what you were told? Would you please put down the factographic evidence and allow other researchers to contact the grand daughter to verify all information independently. I would know whom to ask to act as an independent investigator, and would be happy to supply some questions. Screenshots of emails, recordings of phone conversations and the opportunity to ask questions independently is what is required for members of this forum to pursue this further. The new information is certainly surprising in the light of what Mrs. Stanton told to the FBI (report in WC, CD7): "She knows LEE HARVEY OSWALD by sight, being employed by the same concern, but is not personally acquainted with him and did not see OSWALD on November 22, 1963, and she never seen him with a gun." and in another FBI statement (3/18/1964): I did not see Lee Harvey Oswald at that time or at any time during that day." How does this fare with what the grand daugher of Mrs. Stanton says? What is the truth? Now, the timing of the encounter between Mrs. Stanton and Lee Oswald is interesting. We know that Mrs. Stanton was outside with Bill Shelley around or just very shortly after 12noon because when Billy Lovelady came to the first floor (before 12noon), he only washed his hands, went up to buy a Coke, took his lunch, peeked into the Domino room, and went out because there he saw Mrs. Stanton with mr. Shelley. If Billy was slow, he would be out at 12.10-12.15 as the latest: Mr. BALL - What did you do after you went down and washed up; what did you do? Mr. LOVELADY - Well, I went over and got my lunch and went upstairs and got a coke and come on back down. Mr. BALL - Upstairs on what floor? Mr. LOVELADY - That's on the second floor; so, I started going to the domino room where I generally went in to set down and eat and nobody was there and I happened to look on the outside and Mr. Shelley was standing outside with Miss Sarah Stanton, I believe her name is, and I said, "Well, I'll go out there and talk with them, sit down and eat my lunch out there, set on the steps," so I went out there. Mr. BALL - You ate your lunch on the steps? I am not sure and cannot know if Mrs. Stanton met Lee Oswald and when on that Friday. If she saw and talked to Lee, it could be that Lee Oswald replicated Billy Lovelady's actions - went down around 12noon (he was seen by Mr. Shelley close to the phone) and went back to the second floor to buy a Coke (just like Billy Lovelady), and returned down to the domino room to have his lunch. He bought the Coke for the lunch. If the story you present here is true, we have a clear evidence that the witnesses lied or were coerced to lie about seeing Lee Oswald. They could likewise see him in the doorway and then deny it.

David (L): Thank you for your explanations of Lee's deceptive behaviour and of the impact it had on Marina. Your first-hand, direct encounters with Marina is something which cannot be substituted with any amount of reading. I cannot wait for the Final Charade to be published. I certainly do not need to remind you, however, with the amount of detailed knowledge which you have, it is important that it gets to the public. In the meantime, notwithstanding how funny it may sound to many people, I will continue analysing blurred images with the hope to show Lee outside... Addendum: And in case that no one has thanked you for the therapeutic coming out you provided to Marina, I thank you.

If there were no rifle traceable to Lee Oswald, his framing would not be feasible. Thus, Lee had to have (own) the rifle at some points. However, it is also true that there were obvious problems with the paper trail related to the purchase of this rifle which has been convincingly demonstrated by John Amstrong. In my view, it is one more example of Lee's deceptive actions: the rifle was traceable to his post box via A.J. Hidell, however, the documents would not prove that he, in fact, had purchased that rifle. Thus, if Lee's case would ever come to a trial, the rifle would most likely be dismissed as evidence against him as there were major discrepancies regarding the purchase of the rifle, summarised by Jim. The backyard pictures also bear a mark of plausible denial. Lee was photographed by Marina with his rifle, handgun and two newspapers on March 30. However, the photographs clearly show major problems suggesting photographic manipulations, which Jack White and others have shown, also convincingly. Lee immediately pointed out to the falsification of the pictures during the interrogations and said he would demonstrate the manipulations when the time came. Unfortunately, the time never came. The point is that the backyard pictures were both genuine and manipulated, and would be dismissed as evidence during a trial based on the latter. With Marina not testifying against his husband, the backyard photographs would not be admissible in a trial against Lee Oswald. This is how Lee had been moving in the world which was harsh, secretive and very dangerous - he agreed to risky moves but always ensured that there was a plausible deniability intertwined in the matter. I strongly believe that Lee Oswald was not on the sixth floor during the shooting but that he had some foreknowledge of some risky enterprise, such as a phony assassination attempt on the President. So, how did he ensure plausible deniability for himself in that case? Well, I guess he went out just when shots rang out and let himself filmed. A man who was positively outside during or just after the shooting could not be the shooter, phony or real.