George Sawtelle

Paul T Who had the power to place a brigade of troops on standby over Wash DC in case of rioting as per Prouty? \

The plotters of the coup need the backing of the military. They need troops on the ground when it becomes necessary to control rioting or small scale engagements or firefights if they break out as a result of the assassination. Without the backing of the military the plotters could be captured and executed if something goes wrong. Who among the various groups named by one or more researchers as responsible for the assassination could get the backing of the military to provide soldiers and weapons to defend the objectives of the coup if necessary?

Paul T Only Allen Dulles had the resources on hand to pull off the assassination and then cover it up. No other man, entity or country could have done it. Can you imagine how many parts were needed to pull this off? Only Dulles was able to marshall the forces required.

David VP There is no reason for us to continue. It is obvious to all on this forum that Doctor Gregory was used to boost the SBT. His statement makes no sense. And you know it but you must defend him because what he said is needed to validate the SBT. You are not after the truth and our little sparring session proves it.

David VP Why would Doctor Gregory look for a BULLET embeded in Connally's thigh if the wound is superficial? There would be no reason to look for a bullet within Connally's body. Without an x-ray (assuming no x-ray right David) where would he look? The missile could be in his foot for all anyone knows. As I stated previously Doctor Gregory's statement is full of errors. You can't use Doctor Gregory's statement to beef up the assertion that the magic bullet was found on Connally's stretcher. Look for other testimony that makes sense.

David VP I sense desperation in your post. You didn't think intuitively about the bullet entering Connally's body. If you had we wouldn't be arguing now. Doctor Gregory said the bullet "struck the thigh in a reverse fashion", i.e., butt end first, apparently scrathed the skin of the thigh but did not enter the thigh and "was found in the clothing". He goes on to say in the same quote that the bullet was not found in the clothing. WTF? Back to intuitive thinking. The bullet enters butt end first, tears a hole in the pantleg and then dies and falls onto the pantleg. The bullet had to have momentum to tear a hole in the pantleg with the butt end of the bullet but then the fabric stopped most or all of the momentum and it didn't enter Connally's thigh. Doctor Gregory's statement is riddled with errors. It's a false statement. I would hope you address these discrepancies before we proceed since you base your assertion about the magic bullet and where it was found on Doctor Gregory's statement.

David VP I'm not a fan of after-the-fact-testimony. Dr. Shaw stated clearly what he saw. The bullet must have appeared on the x-ray photo for him to make a definitive statement as he did. Think intuitively. The bullet enters his back, exits the right nipple, smashed into his wrist and then what? So the bullet is out of the clothing. The bullet must have made a hole in Connally's pantleg and then according to Doctor Gregory, he "thinks" it entered the thigh only slightly and was dislodged into his clothing. He goes on to say they did not find the bullet in his leg or clothing. He does not mention the wound (was it a scratch, small hole or what, was there blood). He does not strike me as being totally sure of what he is saying. Connally's bullet could not have been the bullet Tomlinson found because Kennedy was brought in on that stretcher, stretcher "B". A nurse found a bullet on the floor but you don't like that theory. I don't blame you, too much stench. So where did the magic bullet originate?

David VP A doctor announced to the world (press conference) that the bullet that injured Connally was still in his calf. As`of the press conference it hadn't been removed. At this point Connally had already been x-rayed.

Paul T Files said he was the only person behind the picket fence as far as he could determine. But I believe he was protecting someone. I think there were two shooters. According to Dallas policeman Roger Craig, Dallas policemen were told to stand down for Kennedy's parade. The "policemen" who were behind the picket fence were fake. They were there to protect the shooters.

Eddy B You hit the nail on the head. The CTs are the most vociferous when it comes to criticism concerning other CT theories, not the LNs. They own their theories and it's just human nature to protect what's yours. However there are some posters here that help those understand some intricacies about the assassination. Jim D does a good job on the "why". David Jacobs and Davidson do a good jobs on the "how". Once upon a time Sean Murphy used to post on CT forums. It seems like he has dissappeared. Great analyzer, researcher and detective. I miss his knowledge on the subject. As to the "who", look no further than David Talbot's book "Devil's Chessboard".

David A You have me all wrong. I don't care who does or doesn't believe Files. I believe him. That is all that matters to me. I answer questions about Files because I am asked, not because I attempt to convince anyone. You and most of the folks on this forum believed Eaglesham. How did that turn out? Read my last post on that subject if you are interested.

Roger D More about who would benefit from the ouster of Kennedy and Castro. pg 297 "The Brothers" Kinzer "During the 21 December 1960 meeting of the Special Group, Allen Dulles briefed the attendees on a meeting that he had participated in the previous day in New York with a group of American businessmen", according to a CIA account that remained secret for nearly half a century. "In attendance at this meeting were the vice president of Latin America of Standard Oil of New Jersey, the chairman of the Cuban-American Sugar Company, the president of the American Sugar Domino Refining Company, the president of the American and Foreign Power Company, the chairman of the Freeport Sulphur Company and representatives from Texaco, International Telephone and Telegraph, and other American companies with business interests in Cuba. The tenor of the conversation was that it was time for the US to get off dead center and take some direct action against Castro".

David A Files asked for immunity regarding his participation in the assassination. Money. He asked Dankbaar for peanuts. He asked that Joe West's widow be given enough to cover Joe West's hospital bills and his funeral. He also asked that his wife and daughter be given $25,000. He would have made a lot more money by hiring an author and authored a book with him about his early life, his experiences in the army, the Kennedy assassination capped off by his arrest for trying to kill an Illinois state police officer. Probably ten times more money. I'm talking about a real book with a reputable publisher and not something Dankbaar would cook up. As far as notoriety, he didn't ask that Joe West come to talk to him. Joe West found out about him from an FBI agent. If not for the FBI agent, Files would have died telling no one about his experiences. The fact that he asked for immunity led me to believe initially he is truthfull. Signing documents for immunity would be a waste of time and wouldn't help him if he is lying. The FBI said Files was not credible. Well duh, you think the mafia owns up to hiring Files for the assassination? And why would anyone believe the FBI about evidence, eyewitness testimony, documents , etc., involving the assassination?

Ty C Holt mentioned that he made the fake badges in an interview with Dankbaar. There is no greater example of mafia participation in the assassination than Jack Ruby. Yet what did the US government say about Ruby? No evidence that Ruby was motivated by the mafia to kill Oswald. No credible ties to the mafia. He killed Oswald to spare Mrs. Kennedy from having to return to Dallas for Ruby's trial. Same would have happened to Files. The story would have concentrated on a young man who was court martialed from the US army for insubordination and some drug running while in the army. No credible ties to the mafia. Malcontent psychopath who was in and out of trouble with the law. Files had a more negative baggage than Oswald. Files did not need to be sheep-dipped as a commie. He was a lone nut. Once you are in jail with no consul they can plant all kinds of documents on you and how can you respond? We must remember that Files was secondary. In a pinch he would do.

Paul T The mafia participated in the assassination. They were not the ringleaders.

Roger D Why? Because he and Castro had agreed to seek peace. There are several reasons why Kennedy was killed, mainly his foreign policy, but peace with Castro was the last straw. The CIA had given Lisa Howard, who was Kennedy's emissary to Castro, some questions to ask Castro that they hoped would sabotage the talks but Castro agreed to meet Kennedy to talk peace. I believe the wheels were set in motion to kill Kennedy after Howard was debriefed by the CIA upon her return from Cuba in May 1963. Who benefited? Arms dealers, anyone or business who supplied material for war, LBJ stayed out of jail, CIA wasn't splintered, Hoover keeps his job, there are other beneficiaries too many to name. Who has the power to cover it up? CIA and FBI

David A I believe Files. He has no reason to lie.

Paul T I think "accussed" is too strong a word. Should have used "may". The article says may have unknowingly flown in an assassination team instead of an abort team. Plumlee said Roselli was with him when his plane landed in Garland, Texas the early morning of the assassination. He goes on to say Roselli deboarded and left by car. Files says Roselli told Nicoletti to stop the assassination.

Paul T Plumlee was accused of flying in not only an abort team but also part of an assassination team. And that is exactly what he did, unknowingly. He flew in John Rosselli who was an assassination team member and an abort team member.

Paul B I agree 100%. It's time to start concentrating on who ordered the hit. Many great researchers have already found enough evidence on the conspiracy. It's obvious, it was a conspiracy. I think Jim D's efforts on why is important also and as new evidence turns up I'm sure Jim will keep everyone posted.

Chris Following the calculation in the first link you provided, 19degrees26minutes was derived using the height of 89.94ft. The height measured from the ground to the window sill of the southeast window TSBD is therefore 89.94ft., according to CE884. Using 89.94ft gives a story height of about 18ft, could that be correct?

Chris So the angle 17degrees48minutes30seconds is the trajectory of the bullet from the southeast window sixth floor TSBD. According to Doctor Shaw, the bullet entered Kennedy's back, exited his throat and then entered Connally's back. Doctor Shaw goes on to say (in the interview with Spector bottom of the photo) that the bullet had to be at that trajectory in order for the bullet to exit Connally's right nipple and come from the southeast window sixth floor of the TSBD (caption upper left of photo). Furthermore, the limo was located at Z 236 when Connally was shot, according to the doctor. The SBT, which the WC said occurred as the limo became visible in the ZAP film as it moves from behind the Stemmons sign, puts the SBT at approximately Z 224. That is the frame where Kennedy is seen clutching his throat for the first time. How does the good doctor reconcile the differences in frames?

Cliff V I read the account you provided but did not read anything about a doctor diagnosing Dulles with dementia or Alzheimers. Anything short of a doctor's diagnoses smacks as cover up for Dulles transgressions. His friends seem to be saying we need to absolve poor Dulles because he had dementia. Dulles was known to play the fool. That is why he was taken in by many.

Cliff Okay so detachment is proof of Alzheimers. I got you. Thanks