The Sling

[William Kelly]

The HSCA interviewed Alba on January 24, 1978:

""One time OSWALD came into the garage with a rifle sling and asked if he could put a rivet in a piece of leather. Alba did, using a small anvil from his shop which he still has in his possession. The piece that he put in was a light tan color and slightly wider, but not as thick as the original which, according to him, was black leather. OSWALD told him it was from his Italian rifle."

Tom Wrote: P.S. Relative to the issue or not, Adrian Alba has direct family relations to a WWII Army Air Corps Officer/B17 (Navigator) who was shot down over Germany and served some 11 months as a POW in a German POW Camp prior to being released by Patton's advancing forces. Kind of makes one wonder if there is a "family" connection to the WWII Army Air Corps shoulder holster strap which Alba assisted LHO in placement on the Carcano.

BK: BTW, David Atlee Phillips also served in the Army Air Corps during WWII, was shot down over Germany in a B-17 and escaped from a POW camp. LeMay also commanded a squadron of B-17s. Maybe Oswald got the holster from Phillips' or LeMay's garage sale. Ha, ha.

I also recently read that an editor of Gun World magazine received a letter from Oswald when in New Orleans asking about ammunition for Manlicher Carcano, a magazine Oswald most likely obtained from Alba's shop.

The name of the guy was Cotterman - an associate editor at Gun World Magazine, who after the assassination, said that he received a letter from Oswald in New Orleans requesting information about Manlicher Carcano ammunition, though he said he never responed and couldn't find the letter.

Tom: Since LHO ordered and received the Carcano some two months prior to even going to New Orleans and hanging out at Adrian Alba's garage, I personally have doubts that reading Alba's magazines have any bearing on Oswald's ordering of a Carcano weapon. (other than to confuse the issues). And, in event that one accepts the "Walker Bullet" as being a factual exhibit, then it most certainly is not from an Italian Carcano round and has all of the characteristics of the WCC Carcano bullet. Which would tend to point out that LHO/aka the Walker shooter, was in possession of WCC Carcano ammo prior to beginning to play his games with Adrian Alba.

BK: So if he was the Walker shooter, and the MC rifle was the weapon he used, he had, at least, one bullet, even though such bullets couldn't be purchased one at a time and had to be bought in boxes and lots.

And there is still the issue of the magazines, and what Oswald did with them, other than read them?

Alba's partner in the garage said that on the morning of Saturday, November 23rd, a man came into the shop saying he was a very close friend of Albas and asked permission to take a few magazines. Alba then came in and said he didn't know the guy. Who was that?

Then the FBI and SS came in and took magazines, and there WAS an issue about the mags at Alba's garage, though I don't know what it is.

BK

[William Kelly]

Military historians will note that it is not an original Italian military issue intended for this rifle; in fact, it is the shoulder strap from a rare U.S. Air Force shoulder holster issued during the 1950's. These holsters were withdrawn from military use is (sic in) short order and sold as war surplus. Look in a copy of the Warren report or any of the numerous books about this event and you will see the same strap on Oswald's Manlicher-Carcano. More information about this strap is on page 297 in the book Kennedy and Lincoln by Dr. John K. Lattimer.

http://www.worthpoin...n-carcano-rifle

Mr. Eisenberg.

Now, I would like to draw your attention for a moment to this sling on Exhibit 139, and I would like to state for the record that this sling is not thought to be actually a rifle sling, but some type of homemade sling, that is, the firearms expert has so testified.

Does this sling appear in either Commission Exhibits 133A or 133B?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

It is my opinion that it does not. Commission Exhibit 133A has such a small portion of the sling showing that it--you cannot establish that it is or is not the same sling that is presently on the, rifle.

However, Commission Exhibit 133B does show the sling, since it shows the bottom of the rifle, and I find it to be different from the sling that is presently on the rifle. It has the appearance of being a piece of rope that is tied at both ends, rather than a leather sling, and it is my opinion that it is a different sling than is presently on the rifle.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Just again a homemade simulated sling, is that it?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

It has that appearance, yes.

Mr. Eisenberg.

You testified that you have a much smaller view of the sling, or what passes for a sling, on 133A than on 133B. Is the sling or simulated sling on 133A, that portion of it which is visible, consistent with the sling on 133B?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

Yes; it is entirely consistent.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Also looks like a piece of rope, is that it?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

Yes; it has that appearance.

http://webcache.goog...n&ct=clnk&gl=us

…and a sling consisting of two leather straps, one of which had a broad patch, which apparently had been inserted on the rifle and cut to length. 10. The sling was not a standard rifle sling, but appeared to be a musical instrument strap or a sling from a carrying case or camera bag. 11. A basis purpose of a rifle sling is to enable the rifleman to steady his grip, by wrapping the arm into the sling in a prescribed manner. The sling on the rifle was too short to use in the normal way, but might have served to provide some additional steadiness. 12.

http://www.jfk-assas...wcr/page554.php

The sling on the TSBD rifle was a part of a U.S. Air Force holster and harness set, patented by Norris N. Murray, on March 6, 1956, patent No. 2,819,830. ( see U.S. Military Holsters and Pistol cartridge Boxes By Edward Scott Meadows, 1987 , 376.) http://groups.google...onspiracy.jfk/mThe sling on the TSBD rifle was a part of a U.S. Air Force holster and harness set, patented by Norris N. Murray, on March 6, 1956, patent No. 2,819,830. ( see U.S. Military Holsters and Pistol cartridge Boxes By Edward Scott Meadows, 1987 , 376.)

http://groups.google...6a4e495a963b2bd

xxx

Edited November 12, 2010 by William Kelly

[Bernice Moore]

Military historians will note that it is not an original Italian military issue intended for this rifle; in fact, it is the shoulder strap from a rare U.S. Air Force shoulder holster issued during the 1950's. These holsters were withdrawn from military use is (sic in) short order and sold as war surplus. Look in a copy of the Warren report or any of the numerous books about this event and you will see the same strap on Oswald's Manlicher-Carcano. More information about this strap is on page 297 in the book Kennedy and Lincoln by Dr. John K. Lattimer.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Now, I would like to draw your attention for a moment to this sling on Exhibit 139, and I would like to state for the record that this sling is not thought to be actually a rifle sling, but some type of homemade sling, that is, the firearms expert has so testified.

Does this sling appear in either Commission Exhibits 133A or 133B?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

It is my opinion that it does not. Commission Exhibit 133A has such a small portion of the sling showing that it--you cannot establish that it is or is not the same sling that is presently on the, rifle.

However, Commission Exhibit 133B does show the sling, since it shows the bottom of the rifle, and I find it to be different from the sling that is presently on the rifle. It has the appearance of being a piece of rope that is tied at both ends, rather than a leather sling, and it is my opinion that it is a different sling than is presently on the rifle.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Just again a homemade simulated sling, is that it?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

It has that appearance, yes.

Mr. Eisenberg.

You testified that you have a much smaller view of the sling, or what passes for a sling, on 133A than on 133B. Is the sling or simulated sling on 133A, that portion of it which is visible, consistent with the sling on 133B?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

Yes; it is entirely consistent.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Also looks like a piece of rope, is that it?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

Yes; it has that appearance.

…and a sling consisting of two leather straps, one of which had a broad patch, which apparently had been inserted on the rifle and cut to length. 10. The sling was not a standard rifle sling, but appeared to be a musical instrument strap or a sling from a carrying case or camera bag. 11. A basis purpose of a rifle sling is to enable the rifleman to steady his grip, by wrapping the arm into the sling in a prescribed manner. The sling on the rifle was too short to use in the normal way, but might have served to provide some additional steadiness. 12.

The sling on the TSBD rifle was a part of a U.S. Air Force holster and</SPAN> <BR sb_id="ms__id9809">> > > harness set, patented by Norris N. Murray, on March 6, 1956, patent <BR sb_id="ms__id9810">> > > No. 2,819,830. ( see U.S. Military Holsters and Pistol cartridge <BR sb_id="ms__id9811">> > > Boxes By Edward Scott Meadows, 1987 , 376.)http://groups.google...onspiracy.jfk/mThe sling on the TSBD rifle was a part of a U.S. Air Force holster and</SPAN> <BR sb_id="ms__id9809">> > > harness set, patented by Norris N. Murray, on March 6, 1956, patent <BR sb_id="ms__id9810">> > > No. 2,819,830. ( see U.S. Military Holsters and Pistol cartridge <BR sb_id="ms__id9811">> > > Boxes By Edward Scott Meadows, 1987 , 376.)

xxx

Bill; would any of these views help...b

Edited November 6, 2010 by Bernice Moore

[William Kelly]

Military historians will note that it is not an original Italian military issue intended for this rifle; in fact, it is the shoulder strap from a rare U.S. Air Force shoulder holster issued during the 1950's. These holsters were withdrawn from military use is (sic in) short order and sold as war surplus. Look in a copy of the Warren report or any of the numerous books about this event and you will see the same strap on Oswald's Manlicher-Carcano. More information about this strap is on page 297 in the book Kennedy and Lincoln by Dr. John K. Lattimer.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Now, I would like to draw your attention for a moment to this sling on Exhibit 139, and I would like to state for the record that this sling is not thought to be actually a rifle sling, but some type of homemade sling, that is, the firearms expert has so testified.

Does this sling appear in either Commission Exhibits 133A or 133B?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

It is my opinion that it does not. Commission Exhibit 133A has such a small portion of the sling showing that it--you cannot establish that it is or is not the same sling that is presently on the, rifle.

However, Commission Exhibit 133B does show the sling, since it shows the bottom of the rifle, and I find it to be different from the sling that is presently on the rifle. It has the appearance of being a piece of rope that is tied at both ends, rather than a leather sling, and it is my opinion that it is a different sling than is presently on the rifle.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Just again a homemade simulated sling, is that it?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

It has that appearance, yes.

Mr. Eisenberg.

You testified that you have a much smaller view of the sling, or what passes for a sling, on 133A than on 133B. Is the sling or simulated sling on 133A, that portion of it which is visible, consistent with the sling on 133B?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

Yes; it is entirely consistent.

Mr. Eisenberg.

Also looks like a piece of rope, is that it?

Mr. Shaneyfelt.

Yes; it has that appearance.

…and a sling consisting of two leather straps, one of which had a broad patch, which apparently had been inserted on the rifle and cut to length. 10. The sling was not a standard rifle sling, but appeared to be a musical instrument strap or a sling from a carrying case or camera bag. 11. A basis purpose of a rifle sling is to enable the rifleman to steady his grip, by wrapping the arm into the sling in a prescribed manner. The sling on the rifle was too short to use in the normal way, but might have served to provide some additional steadiness. 12.

The sling on the TSBD rifle was a part of a U.S. Air Force holster and</SPAN> <BR sb_id="ms__id9809">> > > harness set, patented by Norris N. Murray, on March 6, 1956, patent <BR sb_id="ms__id9810">> > > No. 2,819,830. ( see U.S. Military Holsters and Pistol cartridge <BR sb_id="ms__id9811">> > > Boxes By Edward Scott Meadows, 1987 , 376.)http://groups.google...onspiracy.jfk/mThe sling on the TSBD rifle was a part of a U.S. Air Force holster and</SPAN> <BR sb_id="ms__id9809">> > > harness set, patented by Norris N. Murray, on March 6, 1956, patent <BR sb_id="ms__id9810">> > > No. 2,819,830. ( see U.S. Military Holsters and Pistol cartridge <BR sb_id="ms__id9811">> > > Boxes By Edward Scott Meadows, 1987 , 376.)

xxx

Bill; would any of these views help...b

Thanks B.

I think that last photo of the strap in evidence from the NARA and the one provided by Dr. Lattimer clinces it.

If it was a picture of a person you could argue about it, but I think that the two are identical, and that the strap on the rifle found on the Sixth Floor of the TSBD had a strap that was made from the Air Force shoulder holster strap pictured.

However, the caption is inncorrect, as they answer the queston of what it is, but not the mystery of where it came from.

Lattimer credits one Leon Day as the source of this discovery. Does anyone know who Leon Day is or anything about him?

BK

Edited November 6, 2010 by William Kelly

[William Kelly]

The HSCA interviewed Alba on January 24, 1978:

""One time OSWALD came into the garage with a rifle sling and asked if he could put a rivet in a piece of leather. Alba did, using a small anvil from his shop which he still has in his possession. The piece that he put in was a light tan color and slightly wider, but not as thick as the original which, according to him, was black leather. OSWALD told him it was from his Italian rifle."

Tom Wrote: P.S. Relative to the issue or not, Adrian Alba has direct family relations to a WWII Army Air Corps Officer/B17 (Navigator) who was shot down over Germany and served some 11 months as a POW in a German POW Camp prior to being released by Patton's advancing forces. Kind of makes one wonder if there is a "family" connection to the WWII Army Air Corps shoulder holster strap which Alba assisted LHO in placement on the Carcano.

BK: BTW, David Atlee Phillips also served in the Army Air Corps during WWII, was shot down over Germany in a B-17 and escaped from a POW camp. LeMay also commanded a squadron of B-17s. Maybe Oswald got the holster from Phillips' or LeMay's garage sale. Ha, ha.

I also recently read that an editor of Gun World magazine received a letter from Oswald when in New Orleans asking about ammunition for Manlicher Carcano, a magazine Oswald most likely obtained from Alba's shop.

The name of the guy was Cotterman - an associate editor at Gun World Magazine, who after the assassination, said that he received a letter from Oswald in New Orleans requesting information about Manlicher Carcano ammunition, though he said he never responed and couldn't find the letter.

BK: So if he was the Walker shooter, and the MC rifle was the weapon he used, he had, at least, one bullet, even though such bullets couldn't be purchased one at a time and had to be bought in boxes and lots.

And there is still the issue of the magazines, and what Oswald did with them, other than read them?

Alba's partner in the garage said that on the morning of Saturday, November 23rd, a man came into the shop saying he was a very close friend of Albas and asked permission to take a few magazines. Alba then came in and said he didn't know the guy. Who was that?

Then the FBI and SS came in and took magazines, and there WAS an issue about the mags at Alba's garage, though I don't know what it is.

BK

Tom: Since LHO ordered and received the Carcano some two months prior to even going to New Orleans and hanging out at Adrian Alba's garage, I personally have doubts that reading Alba's magazines have any bearing on Oswald's ordering of a Carcano weapon. (other than to confuse the issues). And, in event that one accepts the "Walker Bullet" as being a factual exhibit, then it most certainly is not from an Italian Carcano round and has all of the characteristics of the WCC Carcano bullet. Which would tend to point out that LHO/aka the Walker shooter, was in possession of WCC Carcano ammo prior to beginning to play his games with Adrian Alba.

Tom, the issue is not whether the mags at Alba's garage had anything to do with the ordering of the rifle, we are discussing the use of Alba's equipment to adjust the sling for the rile, and whether he uesd any ads in the magazine to obtain ammo, and apparently the editor of Gun World Mag said he got a letter from Oswald asking him specifically about this.

BK

[Thomas H. Purvis]

The HSCA interviewed Alba on January 24, 1978:

""One time OSWALD came into the garage with a rifle sling and asked if he could put a rivet in a piece of leather. Alba did, using a small anvil from his shop which he still has in his possession. The piece that he put in was a light tan color and slightly wider, but not as thick as the original which, according to him, was black leather. OSWALD told him it was from his Italian rifle."

Tom Wrote: P.S. Relative to the issue or not, Adrian Alba has direct family relations to a WWII Army Air Corps Officer/B17 (Navigator) who was shot down over Germany and served some 11 months as a POW in a German POW Camp prior to being released by Patton's advancing forces. Kind of makes one wonder if there is a "family" connection to the WWII Army Air Corps shoulder holster strap which Alba assisted LHO in placement on the Carcano.

BK: BTW, David Atlee Phillips also served in the Army Air Corps during WWII, was shot down over Germany in a B-17 and escaped from a POW camp. LeMay also commanded a squadron of B-17s. Maybe Oswald got the holster from Phillips' or LeMay's garage sale. Ha, ha.

I also recently read that an editor of Gun World magazine received a letter from Oswald when in New Orleans asking about ammunition for Manlicher Carcano, a magazine Oswald most likely obtained from Alba's shop.

The name of the guy was Cotterman - an associate editor at Gun World Magazine, who after the assassination, said that he received a letter from Oswald in New Orleans requesting information about Manlicher Carcano ammunition, though he said he never responed and couldn't find the letter.

BK: So if he was the Walker shooter, and the MC rifle was the weapon he used, he had, at least, one bullet, even though such bullets couldn't be purchased one at a time and had to be bought in boxes and lots.

And there is still the issue of the magazines, and what Oswald did with them, other than read them?

Alba's partner in the garage said that on the morning of Saturday, November 23rd, a man came into the shop saying he was a very close friend of Albas and asked permission to take a few magazines. Alba then came in and said he didn't know the guy. Who was that?

Then the FBI and SS came in and took magazines, and there WAS an issue about the mags at Alba's garage, though I don't know what it is.

BK

Tom: Since LHO ordered and received the Carcano some two months prior to even going to New Orleans and hanging out at Adrian Alba's garage, I personally have doubts that reading Alba's magazines have any bearing on Oswald's ordering of a Carcano weapon. (other than to confuse the issues). And, in event that one accepts the "Walker Bullet" as being a factual exhibit, then it most certainly is not from an Italian Carcano round and has all of the characteristics of the WCC Carcano bullet. Which would tend to point out that LHO/aka the Walker shooter, was in possession of WCC Carcano ammo prior to beginning to play his games with Adrian Alba.

Tom, the issue is not whether the mags at Alba's garage had anything to do with the ordering of the rifle, we are discussing the use of Alba's equipment to adjust the sling for the rile, and whether he uesd any ads in the magazine to obtain ammo, and apparently the editor of Gun World Mag said he got a letter from Oswald asking him specifically about this.

BK

Since I have shared it with others, consider this:

The "Adrian Alba" affair was merely another of the actions of LHO in his little game of leaving a "scent" here, leaving a "scent" there, for someone to "bark up the wrong tree".

Adrian Alba was an entremely active member of the "Minutemen", and had himself been arrested for his involvement in attempting to train personnel to fight against Castro.

LHO's intentional association with Alba, as well as his attempts to get Alba to sell him a rifle, coupled with the use of Alba's garage to construct the leather sling and the pilfering of Alba's magazines which bore the "Carcano Ad", when placed into there proper perspective, appear as nothing more than LHO's continued games at providing the "wrong tree" for someone to bark up.

Arf, arf, arf!------sound of squirrel dog barking up wrong tree!

Tom

[William Kelly]

The HSCA interviewed Alba on January 24, 1978:

""One time OSWALD came into the garage with a rifle sling and asked if he could put a rivet in a piece of leather. Alba did, using a small anvil from his shop which he still has in his possession. The piece that he put in was a light tan color and slightly wider, but not as thick as the original which, according to him, was black leather. OSWALD told him it was from his Italian rifle."

Tom Wrote: P.S. Relative to the issue or not, Adrian Alba has direct family relations to a WWII Army Air Corps Officer/B17 (Navigator) who was shot down over Germany and served some 11 months as a POW in a German POW Camp prior to being released by Patton's advancing forces. Kind of makes one wonder if there is a "family" connection to the WWII Army Air Corps shoulder holster strap which Alba assisted LHO in placement on the Carcano.

BK: BTW, David Atlee Phillips also served in the Army Air Corps during WWII, was shot down over Germany in a B-17 and escaped from a POW camp. LeMay also commanded a squadron of B-17s. Maybe Oswald got the holster from Phillips' or LeMay's garage sale. Ha, ha.

I also recently read that an editor of Gun World magazine received a letter from Oswald when in New Orleans asking about ammunition for Manlicher Carcano, a magazine Oswald most likely obtained from Alba's shop.

The name of the guy was Cotterman - an associate editor at Gun World Magazine, who after the assassination, said that he received a letter from Oswald in New Orleans requesting information about Manlicher Carcano ammunition, though he said he never responed and couldn't find the letter.

BK: So if he was the Walker shooter, and the MC rifle was the weapon he used, he had, at least, one bullet, even though such bullets couldn't be purchased one at a time and had to be bought in boxes and lots.

And there is still the issue of the magazines, and what Oswald did with them, other than read them?

Alba's partner in the garage said that on the morning of Saturday, November 23rd, a man came into the shop saying he was a very close friend of Albas and asked permission to take a few magazines. Alba then came in and said he didn't know the guy. Who was that?

Then the FBI and SS came in and took magazines, and there WAS an issue about the mags at Alba's garage, though I don't know what it is.

BK

Tom: Since LHO ordered and received the Carcano some two months prior to even going to New Orleans and hanging out at Adrian Alba's garage, I personally have doubts that reading Alba's magazines have any bearing on Oswald's ordering of a Carcano weapon. (other than to confuse the issues). And, in event that one accepts the "Walker Bullet" as being a factual exhibit, then it most certainly is not from an Italian Carcano round and has all of the characteristics of the WCC Carcano bullet. Which would tend to point out that LHO/aka the Walker shooter, was in possession of WCC Carcano ammo prior to beginning to play his games with Adrian Alba.

Tom, the issue is not whether the mags at Alba's garage had anything to do with the ordering of the rifle, we are discussing the use of Alba's equipment to adjust the sling for the rile, and whether he uesd any ads in the magazine to obtain ammo, and apparently the editor of Gun World Mag said he got a letter from Oswald asking him specifically about this.

BK

Since I have shared it with others, consider this:

The "Adrian Alba" affair was merely another of the actions of LHO in his little game of leaving a "scent" here, leaving a "scent" there, for someone to "bark up the wrong tree".

Adrian Alba was an entremely active member of the "Minutemen", and had himself been arrested for his involvement in attempting to train personnel to fight against Castro.

LHO's intentional association with Alba, as well as his attempts to get Alba to sell him a rifle, coupled with the use of Alba's garage to construct the leather sling and the pilfering of Alba's magazines which bore the "Carcano Ad", when placed into there proper perspective, appear as nothing more than LHO's continued games at providing the "wrong tree" for someone to bark up.

Arf, arf, arf!------sound of squirrel dog barking up wrong tree!

Tom

If LHO was playing any game at all, it was the GREAT GAME, the one SUN TZU writes about in The Art of War - under the Chapter the Use of Secret Agents, and therefore Oswald was just a pawn in the bigger game, and part of the net - the Divine Skein - skein is a net - the network that includes five different types of agents - of which Oswald served as three at different times in his life - and in the end he was the expendable agent, but not one that devised the schemes you attribute to him. Tom is the one barking up the wrong tree. You would think that after all these years studying this case that his view of the Patsy would have changed with new information, but he's still stuck with the false judgement of the character of the accused assassin and designated Patsy, despite knowing better.

BK

[Thomas H. Purvis]

The HSCA interviewed Alba on January 24, 1978:

""One time OSWALD came into the garage with a rifle sling and asked if he could put a rivet in a piece of leather. Alba did, using a small anvil from his shop which he still has in his possession. The piece that he put in was a light tan color and slightly wider, but not as thick as the original which, according to him, was black leather. OSWALD told him it was from his Italian rifle."

Tom Wrote: P.S. Relative to the issue or not, Adrian Alba has direct family relations to a WWII Army Air Corps Officer/B17 (Navigator) who was shot down over Germany and served some 11 months as a POW in a German POW Camp prior to being released by Patton's advancing forces. Kind of makes one wonder if there is a "family" connection to the WWII Army Air Corps shoulder holster strap which Alba assisted LHO in placement on the Carcano.

BK: BTW, David Atlee Phillips also served in the Army Air Corps during WWII, was shot down over Germany in a B-17 and escaped from a POW camp. LeMay also commanded a squadron of B-17s. Maybe Oswald got the holster from Phillips' or LeMay's garage sale. Ha, ha.

I also recently read that an editor of Gun World magazine received a letter from Oswald when in New Orleans asking about ammunition for Manlicher Carcano, a magazine Oswald most likely obtained from Alba's shop.

The name of the guy was Cotterman - an associate editor at Gun World Magazine, who after the assassination, said that he received a letter from Oswald in New Orleans requesting information about Manlicher Carcano ammunition, though he said he never responed and couldn't find the letter.

BK: So if he was the Walker shooter, and the MC rifle was the weapon he used, he had, at least, one bullet, even though such bullets couldn't be purchased one at a time and had to be bought in boxes and lots.

And there is still the issue of the magazines, and what Oswald did with them, other than read them?

Alba's partner in the garage said that on the morning of Saturday, November 23rd, a man came into the shop saying he was a very close friend of Albas and asked permission to take a few magazines. Alba then came in and said he didn't know the guy. Who was that?

Then the FBI and SS came in and took magazines, and there WAS an issue about the mags at Alba's garage, though I don't know what it is.

BK

Tom: Since LHO ordered and received the Carcano some two months prior to even going to New Orleans and hanging out at Adrian Alba's garage, I personally have doubts that reading Alba's magazines have any bearing on Oswald's ordering of a Carcano weapon. (other than to confuse the issues). And, in event that one accepts the "Walker Bullet" as being a factual exhibit, then it most certainly is not from an Italian Carcano round and has all of the characteristics of the WCC Carcano bullet. Which would tend to point out that LHO/aka the Walker shooter, was in possession of WCC Carcano ammo prior to beginning to play his games with Adrian Alba.

Tom, the issue is not whether the mags at Alba's garage had anything to do with the ordering of the rifle, we are discussing the use of Alba's equipment to adjust the sling for the rile, and whether he uesd any ads in the magazine to obtain ammo, and apparently the editor of Gun World Mag said he got a letter from Oswald asking him specifically about this.

BK

Since I have shared it with others, consider this:

The "Adrian Alba" affair was merely another of the actions of LHO in his little game of leaving a "scent" here, leaving a "scent" there, for someone to "bark up the wrong tree".

Adrian Alba was an entremely active member of the "Minutemen", and had himself been arrested for his involvement in attempting to train personnel to fight against Castro.

LHO's intentional association with Alba, as well as his attempts to get Alba to sell him a rifle, coupled with the use of Alba's garage to construct the leather sling and the pilfering of Alba's magazines which bore the "Carcano Ad", when placed into there proper perspective, appear as nothing more than LHO's continued games at providing the "wrong tree" for someone to bark up.

Arf, arf, arf!------sound of squirrel dog barking up wrong tree!

Tom

If LHO was playing any game at all, it was the GREAT GAME, the one SUN TZU writes about in The Art of War - under the Chapter the Use of Secret Agents, and therefore Oswald was just a pawn in the bigger game, and part of the net - the Divine Skein - skein is a net - the network that includes five different types of agents - of which Oswald served as three at different times in his life - and in the end he was the expendable agent, but not one that devised the schemes you attribute to him. Tom is the one barking up the wrong tree. You would think that after all these years studying this case that his view of the Patsy would have changed with new information, but he's still stuck with the false judgement of the character of the accused assassin and designated Patsy, despite knowing better.

BK

For the uninformed:

The purported "Patsy" attempted to purchase a rifle from a known member of the "Minutemen", as well as also making attempt to purchase a rifle from a convicted gun smuggler who had provided weapons to Fidel Castro.

Therefore, one should preface with "Completely Stupid"----Patsy, if they wish to follow along that incorrect trail.

Arf---Arf-----Arf!

[William Kelly]

The HSCA interviewed Alba on January 24, 1978:

""One time OSWALD came into the garage with a rifle sling and asked if he could put a rivet in a piece of leather. Alba did, using a small anvil from his shop which he still has in his possession. The piece that he put in was a light tan color and slightly wider, but not as thick as the original which, according to him, was black leather. OSWALD told him it was from his Italian rifle."

Tom Wrote: P.S. Relative to the issue or not, Adrian Alba has direct family relations to a WWII Army Air Corps Officer/B17 (Navigator) who was shot down over Germany and served some 11 months as a POW in a German POW Camp prior to being released by Patton's advancing forces. Kind of makes one wonder if there is a "family" connection to the WWII Army Air Corps shoulder holster strap which Alba assisted LHO in placement on the Carcano.

BK: BTW, David Atlee Phillips also served in the Army Air Corps during WWII, was shot down over Germany in a B-17 and escaped from a POW camp. LeMay also commanded a squadron of B-17s. Maybe Oswald got the holster from Phillips' or LeMay's garage sale. Ha, ha.

I also recently read that an editor of Gun World magazine received a letter from Oswald when in New Orleans asking about ammunition for Manlicher Carcano, a magazine Oswald most likely obtained from Alba's shop.

The name of the guy was Cotterman - an associate editor at Gun World Magazine, who after the assassination, said that he received a letter from Oswald in New Orleans requesting information about Manlicher Carcano ammunition, though he said he never responed and couldn't find the letter.

BK: So if he was the Walker shooter, and the MC rifle was the weapon he used, he had, at least, one bullet, even though such bullets couldn't be purchased one at a time and had to be bought in boxes and lots.

And there is still the issue of the magazines, and what Oswald did with them, other than read them?

Alba's partner in the garage said that on the morning of Saturday, November 23rd, a man came into the shop saying he was a very close friend of Albas and asked permission to take a few magazines. Alba then came in and said he didn't know the guy. Who was that?

Then the FBI and SS came in and took magazines, and there WAS an issue about the mags at Alba's garage, though I don't know what it is.

BK

Tom: Since LHO ordered and received the Carcano some two months prior to even going to New Orleans and hanging out at Adrian Alba's garage, I personally have doubts that reading Alba's magazines have any bearing on Oswald's ordering of a Carcano weapon. (other than to confuse the issues). And, in event that one accepts the "Walker Bullet" as being a factual exhibit, then it most certainly is not from an Italian Carcano round and has all of the characteristics of the WCC Carcano bullet. Which would tend to point out that LHO/aka the Walker shooter, was in possession of WCC Carcano ammo prior to beginning to play his games with Adrian Alba.

Tom, the issue is not whether the mags at Alba's garage had anything to do with the ordering of the rifle, we are discussing the use of Alba's equipment to adjust the sling for the rile, and whether he uesd any ads in the magazine to obtain ammo, and apparently the editor of Gun World Mag said he got a letter from Oswald asking him specifically about this.

BK

Since I have shared it with others, consider this:

The "Adrian Alba" affair was merely another of the actions of LHO in his little game of leaving a "scent" here, leaving a "scent" there, for someone to "bark up the wrong tree".

Adrian Alba was an entremely active member of the "Minutemen", and had himself been arrested for his involvement in attempting to train personnel to fight against Castro.

LHO's intentional association with Alba, as well as his attempts to get Alba to sell him a rifle, coupled with the use of Alba's garage to construct the leather sling and the pilfering of Alba's magazines which bore the "Carcano Ad", when placed into there proper perspective, appear as nothing more than LHO's continued games at providing the "wrong tree" for someone to bark up.

Arf, arf, arf!------sound of squirrel dog barking up wrong tree!

Tom

If LHO was playing any game at all, it was the GREAT GAME, the one SUN TZU writes about in The Art of War - under the Chapter the Use of Secret Agents, and therefore Oswald was just a pawn in the bigger game, and part of the net - the Divine Skein - skein is a net - the network that includes five different types of agents - of which Oswald served as three at different times in his life - and in the end he was the expendable agent, but not one that devised the schemes you attribute to him. Tom is the one barking up the wrong tree. You would think that after all these years studying this case that his view of the Patsy would have changed with new information, but he's still stuck with the false judgement of the character of the accused assassin and designated Patsy, despite knowing better.

BK

For the uninformed:

The purported "Patsy" attempted to purchase a rifle from a known member of the "Minutemen", as well as also making attempt to purchase a rifle from a convicted gun smuggler who had provided weapons to Fidel Castro.

Therefore, one should preface with "Completely Stupid"----Patsy, if they wish to follow along that incorrect trail.

Arf---Arf-----Arf!

So Oswald is either a stupid Patsy, or a brilliant lone assassin, and not the idiot lone nut you try to make him out to be.

BK

[Greg Burnham]

Nice one, Bill!

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Nice one, Bill!

Which, demonsrates exactly why you (as well as many others) are absolutely "nowhere" on the subject matter.

Don't suppose that any light bulbs actually came on and illuminated the extremely high possibility/probability that someone in a position to "know", just may have been directing LHO as to what to do, where and when??????

Sure as hell would have thought that some of those whose brain is relatively well eaten up with the "conspiracy bug", would have recognized that even in this day of the internet, LHO would have had difficulty in location of all of the "false scents" that he left, which also lead to so many false trails for those such as yourself to folllow.

Considerable difference between being a "lone nut", and a "lone assassin".

The first means that one is relatively "squirrely", which could also apply to the great majority of JFK (purported) researchers.

The second merely means that one is the only person involved in the actual deed. It does not negate the possibility that one was not involved in some sort of conspiracy which ultimately lead to the event.

If, and when the true researchers come to recognize the difference, then they will also recognize he importance of LHO's "past life" in New Orleans.

[John Dolva]

I agree completely with you Tom. I don't think I get it though. I keep on looking again and again at the Louisiana and Mississippi Sovereignty Councils and particularly at the White Camelias. There's a, to me, coherent theme there. But just speculation which seems to knit together into a simple coherent whole.

Is that another of the rabbit holes you often refer to?

[Greg Burnham]

Nice one, Bill!

Which, demonsrates exactly why you (as well as many others) are absolutely "nowhere" on the subject matter.

Don't suppose that any light bulbs actually came on and illuminated the extremely high possibility/probability that someone in a position to "know", just may have been directing LHO as to what to do, where and when??????

Sure as hell would have thought that some of those whose brain is relatively well eaten up with the "conspiracy bug", would have recognized that even in this day of the internet, LHO would have had difficulty in location of all of the "false scents" that he left, which also lead to so many false trails for those such as yourself to folllow.

Considerable difference between being a "lone nut", and a "lone assassin".

The first means that one is relatively "squirrely", which could also apply to the great majority of JFK (purported) researchers.

The second merely means that one is the only person involved in the actual deed. It does not negate the possibility that one was not involved in some sort of conspiracy which ultimately lead to the event.

If, and when the true researchers come to recognize the difference, then they will also recognize he importance of LHO's "past life" in New Orleans.

Tom,

I am unfamiliar with your position. Are you saying you believe that although Oswald was part of a wider conspiracy, he was the lone gunman?

In all due respect, obviously, if that's what you believe, such a stance must be burdensome for you to maintain. I know that we must disagree on what the physical evidence indicates, whereby I believe that the physical evidence precludes a lone assassin and you apparently do not. In my view, maintaining the position that the evidence is consistent with a single gunman is precarious, at best. I don't envy you your task of defending such an unlikely, even impossible, argument. If I have misunderstood you, my apologies.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

I agree completely with you Tom. I don't think I get it though. I keep on looking again and again at the Louisiana and Mississippi Sovereignty Councils and particularly at the White Camelias. There's a, to me, coherent theme there. But just speculation which seems to knit together into a simple coherent whole.

Is that another of the rabbit holes you often refer to?

Well! In addition to the fact that the Law Firm of which LHO's (great) Uncle was a member, lets take note:

1. It was through members of this law firm that Marguerite (as well as LHO) had the connections to various employment.

2. One member of this law firm was the "President" of the "Sons of the Confederacy"

3. One member of this law firm was connected to the 1954 Guatemala coup.

4. One member of this law firm had an Uncle who was killed in the first battle of the Civil War. Thereafter, family member were named "Malvern Hill"

5. One member of this law firm (same family as above) named family members "Sumpter", after the battle of Ft. Sumpter, SC.

6. Two early members of this law firm (to include the great Uncle) originally operated out of the old United Fruit Building in New Orleans.

7. One of the two above, frequently represented United Fruit.

8. One of the "early" founders of the law firm was a highly noted Commander (of a Louisiana Artillery Unit) in the Civil War.

9. This "Commander", had the honor of having Jefferson Davis, President of the Confederate States of America, die in his home in New Orleans.

10. One of the Commander's sons defended Tulane in it's attempt to prevent integration of Tulane University (against the Kennedy imposed desegration orders).

11. One of the Commander's sons was the head of a New Orleans Stock Brockerage firm, which had offices in Havanna, Cuba, and which firm later merged with Merrill Lynch.

12. One member of the law firm was the legal representative for the "Parking Garage" where LHO applied for employment.

That should be a "good start" summary.

Tom

P.S. Forgot to mention LHO's mississippi cousin who was highly involved with the "Citizen's Council" of Mississippi and was instrumemental in attempting to prevent integration of the south Mississippi beaches.

Which was occurring at exactly the same time as LHO was attending Radar Operator training school at Keesler AFB, Biloxi, MS.

Edited November 23, 2011 by Thomas H. Purvis

[John Dolva]

Yup.