Greg Parker Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Steve, you and Jim need to talk before you post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Hargrove Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 OCCAMS RAZOR DOES NOT APPLY IN SPY CRAFT . The public never ever really looked into the spy game except via fiction prior to 11/22/63 = The Duck was to appear to be a Duck. However with connecting the dots via government agency spy documents (the public never ever saw before),the duck is really TWO ducks and a masquerade IS exposed. Thus Hargrove is right in the context of a deeper document/witness examination. gaal quack quack More on the CIA's James Jesus Angleton. Alberto Gutierrez writes: "Angleton is credited with coining the term "Wilderness of Mirrors " meaning the confusion of the world of intelligence and espionage. He wrote that the "Wilderness of Mirrors "consists of the myriad stratagems, deceptions and all the other devices of disinformation that the Soviet Union and its coordinated intelligence services used to confuse and split the West, producing an ever-fluid landscape where fact and illusion merge. The term was used by David Martin as the tittle of his book about Angleton, Wilderness of Mirrors. (Seeley) Absolutely! And look how effectively that Wilderness of Mirrors has worked for more than fifty years. You take what is fundamentally an obvious spy game, and even after it has been been subjected to far, far more scrutiny than it was ever supposed to receive, most of us are still unaware of the basic facts. That was part of the genius behind setting up “Lee Harvey Oswald” as the patsy. With the Oswald Project's connection to both the Agency and Hoover's FBI, it was clear that a real government investigation into the assassination would be shut down before it started. Thus you have FBI agents confiscating Oswald school records and teen-aged employment records within hours of the assassination, with no apparent thought given to potential co-conspirators or even to whether other government officials were being targeted. Compare that to the 9/11 attack, which kept President Bush in the air for many hours and Cheney in some “undisclosed bunker” for days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 "After all, Occam's razor would suggest that if it looks, walks, and quacks like a duck, it probably is a duck--rather than something else masquerading as one or trying to somehow become one..." - Jim Hargrove Talk about irony. Here is a JCB load to add to the mountain. Apply the above sentence to those successfully debunking the whole H&L edifice - and you will understand your detractors better. The lack of insight by the H & L Brigade continues apace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Josephs Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) "After all, Occam's razor would suggest that if it looks, walks, and quacks like a duck, it probably is a duck--rather than something else masquerading as one or trying to somehow become one..." - Jim Hargrove Talk about irony. Here is a JCB load to add to the mountain. Apply the above sentence to those successfully debunking the whole H&L edifice - and you will understand your detractors better. The lack of insight by the H & L Brigade continues apace. First off you'd need to find someone who is actually successfully debunking anything... Parker runs whining from a direct posting of the actual evidence related to the correct years and what was actually said along with what it meant. I posted the calander Parker... show us by counting there are over 125 school days in less than half a semester... and where exactly the stay at Youth House - which was not any of the three PS44's in NYC - is reflected in this PERM record... Maybe also address why there are multiple copies of the same record which do not match each other... Stick to the evidence Parker and deal with IT, All I'm doing here is posting it and watching you and your brigade stumble over yourselves trying and debunk it with nothing but the air in your lungs... Just count the days Parker... you can do that, unless math is also different down under fitting 125+ days into less than a single semester is almost as good as the SBT... Edited June 5, 2015 by David Josephs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) Hi, Paul, Yes, thank you, I've heard and read that position before, often presented by people who know every bit or more about this case than I do. But I simply find the explanation unlikely. After all, Occam's razor would suggest that if it looks, walks, and quacks like a duck, it probably is a duck--rather than something else masquerading as one or trying to somehow become one. My opinion is that Russian-speaking Harvey Oswald trained for his entire adult (and almost adult) life for his undercover assignment in Russia, and when he failed to impress the Comrades-in-charge there, he was so despondent that he tried, or almost tried, to commit suicide. That's pretty far to go for a wannabe. I posted this once before, so please forgive the repetition, but here is one of my favorite short passages from Harvey and Lee: NOTE: In a 1997 interview Robert Webster told JFK researcher and author Dick Russell that he met Marina Prusakova in Moscow in the summer of 1959 and spoke with her in English. Webster said that Marina spoke English well, but with a heavy accent. A year after Webster was sent to Leningrad by the Soviet Government, 400 miles from Moscow, he met Marina again shortly after he applied for an exit visa so that he could return to the US. [interview of Robert Webster by Dick Russell at Cape Cod, MA. 1997] Marina's friend in Dallas, Katya Ford, said that when she asked Marina why Oswald went to Russia, Marina told her that he worked for the Rand Corporation and helped set up the American exhibit at the World Trade Exposition in Moscow.[WC Document 5, p. 259; FBI interview of Katherine Ford by SA James P. Hosty, 11/24/63] Marina had momentarily confused Harvey Oswald with Robert Webster, the 1st US "defector," whom she met in Moscow (1959) and again in Leningrad (1960). It is not a coincidence that both Webster and Oswald "defected" a few months apart in 1959, both tried to "defect" on a Saturday, both possessed "sensitive" information of possible value to the Russians, both were befriended by Marina Prusakova, and both returned to the United States in the Spring of 1962. These US "defectors," acting in perfect harmony, were both working for the CIA. --H&L p. 799 Just my take (and JA's). Well, Jim, I've also read that before. Some try to use that quote to prove that Marina Oswald was fluent in English back in Russia, and so her troubles with English in the USA were all a sham. But that's pushing too hard with too little data. Some dude heard Marina Oswald speak a few words of English, in some social gathering in Russia, and concluded that she spoke English "fluently?" Where's the scientific testing? Almost any American can speak a few words of Spanish in a social gathering in the USA, but would be like a fish out of water if they were in Mexico City talking to a cab driver. Without scientific testing, such anecdotal evidence is a weak foundation to conclude that Marina was "fluent" in English. Also, it's virtually impossible to FAKE trouble with a foreign language. Also, Marina was a teenager when she married Lee Harvey Oswald -- so its very unlikely that she was already a skilled superspy. Also, Marina's confusion of Oswald's background with Webster's background isn't really unusual; she knew Oswald very little time before they were married -- and no Russian teenage girls were virgins in the USSR. The fact that her uncle was affiliated with the KGB may have influenced her social life, but she married poorly with Lee Harvey Oswald -- I think she'd agree when she was in Fort Worth, under the sneering eyes of Oswald's mother. So, this wasn't part of any spy planning. It was dumb fate. No -- the evidence suggests that Oswald was poor as a Church mouse, and struggling like thunder to get a good paying job to support his growing family. Oswald was desperate, really, but he truly believed he could get a job with the CIA if he just did MORE. Yet Oswald had left the USSR like a Maverick -- my guess is that his contract with the ONI wasn't yet finished when he left -- and that is why his Marine discharge was downgraded -- and why he never got that job with the CIA that he had been promised. Sorry -- he doesn't look or quack like a duck to me, Jim. Instead, Lee Harvey Oswald looks and sounds like a CIA "wannabe" from start to finish. There is no way that Oswald could have been made the Patsy of the JFK murder if he was a bona fide CIA Officer. The best explanation -- using Occam's Razor -- for Oswald being the JFK Patsy is that he got too close to the fire and got burned, i.e. he craved for a job in the CIA, and so he fell prey to liars and plotters who used this weakness to exploit him for evil. Regards, --Paul Trejo Edited June 5, 2015 by Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) WILLIAM WESTON DOES HARVEY AND LEE ======================================= THE FURNITURE MART---------------------4th Decade Vol 1 # 2---------------------http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48679#relPageId=13&tab=page=http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48679#relPageId=14&tab=page=http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48679#relPageId=15&tab=page=http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48679#relPageId=16&tab=page=http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48679#relPageId=17&tab=page=http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48679#relPageId=18&tab=page=http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48679#relPageId=19&tab=page##########################################################################Nicolet Hotel Barber Shop story ------------------------------------------------ 4th Decade, Vol. 3 #3======================================================== http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48692#relPageId=32&tab=page= http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48692#relPageId=33&tab=page= http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48692#relPageId=34&tab=page=http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48692#relPageId=35&tab=page= http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48692#relPageId=36&tab=page=http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48692#relPageId=37&tab=page= http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=48692#relPageId=38&tab=page Edited June 5, 2015 by Steven Gaal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Josephs Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 I see you lurking there Parker.... we all do. Can you count or not? There are 180 days in a school year - we've had that discussion The record shows 109 + 15 + half days days from March 23 to end of the semester... with a 17 day stay at Youth House... How dat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Tracy Parnell Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 A couple of new additions to my site. First, Armstrong is caught misrepresenting witnesses again: http://wtracyparnell.com/myrtle-julian-and-clem/ And a surprising statement by Jim Hargrove from an old Dellarosa forum post: http://wtracyparnell.com/so-what/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) A couple of new additions to my site. First, Armstrong is caught misrepresenting witnesses again: http://wtracyparnell...ulian-and-clem/ // PARNELL ============================================= SHERT ?? Tujague (board member Friends Of Democratic Cuba and former employer LHO) is connected to Clem Shert (Oswald family attorney) and Ernest Carrere former Navy intelligence officer. David Ferrie's first CAP base part of a NAVY airport and post assassination Ferrie connected to transport NAVY personnel. Posted 20 April 2013 - 11:23 PM Confirming PD SCOTT=========================PD Scott in Dallas Conspiracy quoted Stephen Birmingham that Empire Trust maintained ,"something like a private CIA around the world to protect their investments.."(Our Crowd,Harper and Row ,1967,p.378). However there was no documentation in said book. John Crichton Army Reserve intelligence officer was part of Empire Trust. Crichton's claim to fame was hiring Ilya Mamantov to mistranslate Marina in an incriminating fashion her husband. I did find a second intelligence officer connected to Empire Trust.At the National American Bank in New Orleans was director Leon Tujague (who gave LHO first job and LHO also had problematic Social Security number at age 15/half),director Clem A. Shert (Oswald family attorney) and later President of said bank, director Seymour Weiss a Lansky associate and director Ernest Carrere former Navy intelligence officer.* Carrere was director of Louisiana Land and Exploration Co. which was owned by Empire Trust. Carrere was also John Mecoms Jr. attorney. John Mecom SR & JR (mob) were friends with DeMohrenschildt.John Mecom Sr was part of the CIA connected San Jacinto Foundation which was one of the first groups to ask JFK to come to Dallas. That Carrere was Naval intelligence and connected to Empire Trust bolsters Birmingham's claim that Empire Trust had its own private CIA. Empire Trust whose leading shareholders were the inter-related familes of Kuhn,Loeb,Lehman and Bronfman. The Kuhn, Loeb-Morgan alliance, maintain close relationships with the House of Rothschild, said Rothschild's conxxxxxed the First National Bank Of Houston,which gave in 1971 the chairmanship of the First National Bank of Houston to one GHWB.^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Carrere was president of a retired ONI officers association (worked for Empire Trust connected company) Crichton and Lewis McNaughton (employer Bouhe and Declan Ford) were both EMPIRE TRUST Edited July 2, 2015 by Steven Gaal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Tracy Parnell Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Steve, I am having a little trouble following your post, but it seems you are saying Sehrt is in on the plot. But from my reading of H&L Armstrong is not saying that at all. So are you breaking ranks here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Laverick Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 A couple of new additions to my site. First, Armstrong is caught misrepresenting witnesses again: http://wtracyparnell...ulian-and-clem/ // PARNELL ============================================= SHERT ?? Tujague (board member Friends Of Democratic Cuba and former employer LHO) is connected to Clem Shert (Oswald family attorney) and Ernest Carrere former Navy intelligence officer. David Ferrie's first CAP base part of a NAVY airport and post assassination Ferrie connected to transport NAVY personnel. Posted 20 April 2013 - 11:23 PM Confirming PD SCOTT ========================= PD Scott in Dallas Conspiracy quoted Stephen Birmingham that Empire Trust maintained ,"something like a private CIA around the world to protect their investments.."(Our Crowd,Harper and Row ,1967,p.378). However there was no documentation in said book. John Crichton Army Reserve intelligence officer was part of Empire Trust. Crichton's claim to fame was hiring Ilya Mamantov to mistranslate Marina in an incriminating fashion her husband. I did find a second intelligence officer connected to Empire Trust. At the National American Bank in New Orleans was director Leon Tujague (who gave LHO first job and LHO also had problematic Social Security number at age 15/half),director Clem A. Shert (Oswald family attorney) and later President of said bank, director Seymour Weiss a Lansky associate and director Ernest Carrere former Navy intelligence officer.* Carrere was director of Louisiana Land and Exploration Co. which was owned by Empire Trust. Carrere was also John Mecoms Jr. attorney. John Mecom SR & JR (mob) were friends with DeMohrenschildt. John Mecom Sr was part of the CIA connected San Jacinto Foundation which was one of the first groups to ask JFK to come to Dallas. That Carrere was Naval intelligence and connected to Empire Trust bolsters Birmingham's claim that Empire Trust had its own private CIA. Empire Trust whose leading shareholders were the inter-related familes of Kuhn,Loeb,Lehman and Bronfman. The Kuhn, Loeb-Morgan alliance, maintain close relationships with the House of Rothschild, said Rothschild's controlled the First National Bank Of Houston,which gave in 1971 the chairmanship of the First National Bank of Houston to one GHWB. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Carrere was president of a retired ONI officers association (worked for Empire Trust controlled company) Crichton and Lewis McNaughton (employer Bouhe and Declan Ford) were both EMPIRE TRUST So this refers to Armstrong's blatant and seedy misrepresentation of witnesses in what way? Did you actually read Tracy's links? Best response would be to dump some meaningless drivel and hopefully we'll all go away. It's a long shot, but what other option do you have left? It's not a good time to be a H&L supporter at the moment is it Steven? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 (edited) Steve, I am having a little trouble following your post, but it seems you are saying Sehrt is in on the plot. But from my reading of H&L Armstrong is not saying that at all. So are you breaking ranks here? I didn't know Armstrong had a "Shert" position. gaal ============================================= Marguerite per Parnell = But what Armstrong leaves out in the Myrtle Evans testimony is revealing. Right after Myrtle says, “that couldn’t be Margie” she adds: …but of course it was, (emphasis added) (BECAUSE EVERYONE WAS SAYING SO ?,GAAL) but if you had known Margie before all this happened, you would see what I mean. She was beautiful. She had beautiful wavy hair. = Julian Evans, in his Warren Commission testimony, said: She has really aged. She looked like a charwoman, compared to what she used to look like. She used to be a fashion plate. She dressed beautifully, but when we saw her on television just recently, after all this happened, she looked awful. There’s no way to describe it, the change that has come over her. You wouldn’t have recognized her if they hadn’t told you who she was (BECAUSE EVERYONE WAS SAYING SO ?,GAAL) ; she looked that different. Where her hair used to be black, now it’s entirely gray, and she really looks old… Edited June 6, 2015 by Steven Gaal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Laverick Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Steve, I am having a little trouble following your post, but it seems you are saying Sehrt is in on the plot. But from my reading of H&L Armstrong is not saying that at all. So are you breaking ranks here? I didn't know Armstrong had a "Shert" position. gaal ============================================= Marguerite per Parnell = But what Armstrong leaves out in the Myrtle Evans testimony is revealing. Right after Myrtle says, “that couldn’t be Margie” she adds: …but of course it was, (emphasis added) (BECAUSE EVERYONE WAS SAYING SO ?,GAAL) but if you had known Margie before all this happened, you would see what I mean. She was beautiful. She had beautiful wavy hair. = Julian Evans, in his Warren Commission testimony, said: She has really aged. She looked like a charwoman, compared to what she used to look like. She used to be a fashion plate. She dressed beautifully, but when we saw her on television just recently, after all this happened, she looked awful. There’s no way to describe it, the change that has come over her. You wouldn’t have recognized her if they hadn’t told you who she was (BECAUSE EVERYONE WAS SAYING SO ?,GAAL) ; she looked that different. Where her hair used to be black, now it’s entirely gray, and she really looks old… So why did Armstrong leave out the but of course it was bit? You have to assume that the only reason she could say "but of course it was" was due to everyone else saying so. But that's just your pure GUESSWORK borne from desperation. Myrtle Evans knew her better than "everyone else saying so" and she concluded "but of course it was". Armstrong missed that last bit out. Why? Had he left it in you would have a NON STORY. These are the shabby bricks that the whole H&L charade is built with. But just like all those notorious American tourists who have been 'sold' Big Ben over the years...they still keep buying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 (edited) Stick to the evidence Parker and deal with IT, All I'm doing here is posting it and watching you and your brigade stumble over yourselves trying and debunk it with nothing but the air in your lungs... Just count the days Parker... you can do that, unless math is also different down under fitting 125+ days into less than a single semester is almost as good as the SBT... Did you ever stop and wonder how it is that you, Armstrong and the rest of the klan are the only ones who can see the problem... er... "problem"? Have a think about that, David and get back to me about how brilliant you are for reading a full school year into a single semester. Edited June 6, 2015 by Greg Parker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Josephs Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Stick to the evidence Parker and deal with IT, All I'm doing here is posting it and watching you and your brigade stumble over yourselves trying and debunk it with nothing but the air in your lungs... Just count the days Parker... you can do that, unless math is also different down under fitting 125+ days into less than a single semester is almost as good as the SBT... Did you ever stop and wonder how it is that you, Armstrong and the rest of the klan are the only ones who can see the problem... er... "problem"? Have a think about that, David and get back to me about how brilliant you are for reading a full school year into a single semester. Wow... you really are this bad. March 23, 1953 to May 30, 1953... is to you a full school year? The Fall semester and Jan/Feb do not count. Yet if you look only a few lines above http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19762&page=29#entry304931 It shows Sept '52 and that semester's (defined as the first half of a school year in the english language) attendance (15 3/2 attend 47 3/2 missed) until he skips and does not go to any school for over 2 months. There are at least 40 school days in the 2 missed months... so 40 + 15 + 47 + 109 + 15 = the total # of days in this boy's record's school year. 180 days in a school year Greg... this adds to 226 and Youth House is still not counted. I'm exceedingly brilliant Greg... just getting back to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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