Paul Trejo Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 (edited) That is a rather lengthy rebuttle, and I don't deny that there are several factors that can influence a photograph. However, I was talking about simple perspective shifts based on head orientation relation to camera lens being able to explain ear movement outside of "puberty" as Mr. Mitchem so eloquently put it. Below is a quick and dirty rendering of the exact same head in a 3d modeling program. The head on the right has a very slight shift downward in relation to the viewing angle. Amazingly, we see an upward shift in the ears relation to the "viewing lens" of this image. I don't really know how simpler to explain it, but that is what I was attempting to point out regarding the issue with ear height variation from photo to photo. Please let me know if you disagree. Well, Michael, where I disagree is this: somebody is presuming that these are two ORDINARY photographs. What Jack White proposed in 1991 is that they are BOTH RETOUCHED. The first one was created by taking the left-half of Oswald's face, and pasting over the right-half. The second one was probably created by the reverse procedure. So, head measurements for these two PHOTOS at this point would be irrelevant. How Jack White could come up with the "H&L" theory based on photos like this remains bizarre to me. Jack White was brilliant to discover Roscoe White's body in Lee Harvey Oswald's BACKYARD PHOTOGRAPHS, but Jack was far from brilliant in his "H&L" theory. Regards, --Paul Trejo Edited July 16, 2015 by Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 (edited) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwUsZ8RjIqg John Armstrong - Myra DaRouse Larue Interview Part 1 RE VOEBEL ============================================== some one commented licozythree 2 years ago Myra got one thing right - any photo she may have been shown was not of the boy she claims to remember. The boy she has been convinced by Armstrong was Harvey, was in fact a little kid named Bobby Newman who hung out with Oswald's friend Ed Veobel. see article on this at reopenkennedycase website ========================= ha ha !! licozythree = CIA's LICOZY3 (the CIA man on the motorcycle in Mexico city) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ WHO IS licozythree (GREG PARKER ????) ,gaal ========= Could you give us a list of the "Harvey & Lee Hit Squad"? why licozythree Barking mad...! WHO IS (GREG PARKER????) He's an entity Steven. A COINTELPRO op and he's under your bed! He's in your wardrobe and he's in your shed. We all are. Watching you. Making sure you don't tell the world about the secrets that only you and the CIA know. The future of corporate America is totally dependent on making sure Steven Gaal is silenced. This is us trying to do that. But... You've rumbled us! Not for the first time we all have to ask Steven Gaal...What on earth are you talking about? This cult, note that its main proponents are religious fanatics, will go to any lengths to divert and slither away from anyone who challenges their guru. Btw, in the five years these interviews have been on You Tube none have had more than 2,000 hits, (that's about one a day!). Jeez, even my crappy songs are more popular than that! Can we just let this silliness go now and start addressing the real issue? Steve does apparently have some health issues which exempt him from having to keep within "the rules". Steve has by now, whined to the moderators btw, complaining about you stating the obvious -- that he is barking mad. Unlike the real world, being factual is no defense around here. Whats the issue for licozythree is that it appears to be a made up name that is similar to the Code name of a CIA operative . Lcozythree made an anti-ANTI H & L comment. There seems almost zero internet activity for said licozythree except the anti H & L comment.. ,gaal Edited July 16, 2015 by Steven Gaal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Morrow Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 My personal opinion is that these are clearly the same man, taken at different points in his life. Lighting, head tilt, pursing of the lips in the marine photo (edit: I mean photo on the right, I mistook that for a photo of Oswald in the marines) can easily account for many of the subtle differences between photos. I think there is some interesting evidence suggesting there were sightings of "Oswald" in more than one place at once, but this set of photos doesn't convince me we are looking at two different men. When did his ears drop? Puberty? His head is clearly tilted more downward in the right photo, which would make his ears appear higher. If you don't understand how perspective works, I'm afraid there is no helping you. Mr Morrow, you berate Ray here about perspective and you claim authority while measuring a 3d dimension on a 2d image by drawing some line... there is something called photogrammetry which is a complex method for measuring objects on a 2d space which results in 3d analysis. What you did can best be called "eye-balling" it... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photogrammetry Photogrammetry is the science of making measurements from photographs, especially for recovering the exact positions of surface points. What you've actually done above, frankly, is a joke in relation to the comparison of two different images... personal opinions aside, this work doesn't prove your opinion, it only proves how little you know about measuring distance in photographs... Knowing something about perspective you'd also know your comment about why the ears appear "higher" is complete gibberish. (your pick line even proves the opposite of what your opinion is - it shows these people's faces are NOT the same at all... why exactly do you ignore the results of this work in the first place? You basically prove the images do not match at all, and then state the opposite as an opinion... and then get on Ray related to perspective which you completely fubar. http://commonsensephotography.com/what_is_camera_perspective/index.php Below are examples of a 24mm lens and a 200mm lens taken from the same position. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perspective_distortion_(photography) gives you a walkthru example of different focal lengths and photographer distances to the same object... You'd also know you'd need to know much more about the taking of these images to be able to compare them at all.... How far from each camera were these images taken? With what lens do you think each was taken - 35mm, 50mm, zoomed or not - the same for each or not? What is the scale of each image to the original negative? If the two images were taken with different settings or distances of any kind it is impossible to use lines, pixels or anything else for that matter to compare or measure what is seen on the images. Maybe read up alittle about measuring distance on a 2d representation of 3d space... It's nice you think it is so easy as to just draw a few lines... sadly, that's not at all how it works. By sizing and lining up the right ear we can at least see how the two images work with each other... no measurements, just starting with a feature that is sized to match each other which SHOULD result in the faces matching each other... What we also find is that no matter what we do we cannot get LEE's dropped shoulders to match Harvey's more straight shoulders But if there is something you can do to make them match... let's see what you got. There is that fact as well that the 1959 Passport image and the image of Harvey from a week or so later do not appear too similar David, Two simple questions for you. 1) Do you think it was me that created the "doppleganger" image above with the lines drawn on it? You comment seems to be suggesting I created it, which I did not 2) What do you assume my position is regarding the work in the doppleganger image? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 The ears appear smaller (less lobe) in the "CATHY" photo than the Santa Anna passport photo., gaal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwUsZ8RjIqg John Armstrong - Myra DaRouse Larue Interview Part 1 RE VOEBEL ============================================== some one commented licozythree 2 years ago Myra got one thing right - any photo she may have been shown was not of the boy she claims to remember. The boy she has been convinced by Armstrong was Harvey, was in fact a little kid named Bobby Newman who hung out with Oswald's friend Ed Veobel. see article on this at reopenkennedycase website ========================= ha ha !! licozythree = CIA's LICOZY3 (the CIA man on the motorcycle in Mexico city) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ WHO IS licozythree (GREG PARKER ????) ,gaal ========= Could you give us a list of the "Harvey & Lee Hit Squad"? why licozythree Barking mad...! WHO IS (GREG PARKER????) He's an entity Steven. A COINTELPRO op and he's under your bed! He's in your wardrobe and he's in your shed. We all are. Watching you. Making sure you don't tell the world about the secrets that only you and the CIA know. The future of corporate America is totally dependent on making sure Steven Gaal is silenced. This is us trying to do that. But... You've rumbled us! Not for the first time we all have to ask Steven Gaal...What on earth are you talking about? This cult, note that its main proponents are religious fanatics, will go to any lengths to divert and slither away from anyone who challenges their guru. Btw, in the five years these interviews have been on You Tube none have had more than 2,000 hits, (that's about one a day!). Jeez, even my crappy songs are more popular than that! Can we just let this silliness go now and start addressing the real issue? Steve does apparently have some health issues which exempt him from having to keep within "the rules". Steve has by now, whined to the moderators btw, complaining about you stating the obvious -- that he is barking mad. Unlike the real world, being factual is no defense around here. Whats the issue for licozythree is that it appears to be a made up name that is similar to the Code name of a CIA operative . Lcozythree made an anti-ANTI H & L comment. There seems almost zero internet activity for said licozythree except the anti H & L comment.. ,gaal As your link shows, it is a youtube username. Spooky! Or just you drawing your own deranged conclusions based on your own delusions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 The ears appear smaller (less lobe) in the "CATHY" photo than the Santa Anna passport photo., gaal I'm guessing that this is not your correct head size? The lobotomy scars appear smaller than I imagined they would.. I am willing to stand corrected, however... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 Be careful Greg......... Gaal prolly will complain again On what grounds, Bart? I have used the same analytic technique employed by the cult. Input through the eyeballs. Output through the ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwUsZ8RjIqg John Armstrong - Myra DaRouse Larue Interview Part 1 RE VOEBEL ============================================== some one commented licozythree 2 years ago Myra got one thing right - any photo she may have been shown was not of the boy she claims to remember. The boy she has been convinced by Armstrong was Harvey, was in fact a little kid named Bobby Newman who hung out with Oswald's friend Ed Veobel. see article on this at reopenkennedycase website ========================= ha ha !! licozythree = CIA's LICOZY3 (the CIA man on the motorcycle in Mexico city) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ WHO IS licozythree (GREG PARKER ????) ,gaal ========= Could you give us a list of the "Harvey & Lee Hit Squad"? why licozythree Barking mad...! WHO IS (GREG PARKER????) He's an entity Steven. A COINTELPRO op and he's under your bed! He's in your wardrobe and he's in your shed. We all are. Watching you. Making sure you don't tell the world about the secrets that only you and the CIA know. The future of corporate America is totally dependent on making sure Steven Gaal is silenced. This is us trying to do that. But... You've rumbled us! Not for the first time we all have to ask Steven Gaal...What on earth are you talking about? This cult, note that its main proponents are religious fanatics, will go to any lengths to divert and slither away from anyone who challenges their guru. Btw, in the five years these interviews have been on You Tube none have had more than 2,000 hits, (that's about one a day!). Jeez, even my crappy songs are more popular than that! Can we just let this silliness go now and start addressing the real issue? Steve does apparently have some health issues which exempt him from having to keep within "the rules". Steve has by now, whined to the moderators btw, complaining about you stating the obvious -- that he is barking mad. Unlike the real world, being factual is no defense around here. Whats the issue for licozythree is that it appears to be a made up name that is similar to the Code name of a CIA operative . Lcozythree made an anti-ANTI H & L comment. There seems almost zero internet activity for said licozythree except the anti H & L comment.. ,gaal As your link shows, it is a youtube username. Spooky! Or just you drawing your own deranged conclusions based on your own delusions. see re youtube usernames , gaal Dispelling Internet Disinformation Tactics – Debunking the DebunkersJanuary 22, 2014 ---------------------------------- https://rebelsiren.wordpress.com/2014/01/22/dispelling-internet-disinformation-tactics-debunking-the-debunkers/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 (edited) see re youtube usernames , gaal Dispelling Internet Disinformation Tactics – Debunking the Debunkers January 22, 2014 ---------------------------------- https://rebelsiren.w...-the-debunkers/ This stands as a testament to your thought processes whereby you use someone using a username to "debunk" anyone using a username on youtube. It also demonstrates yet again that you are exempt from playing by the rules here. edit: sorry... forgot to add the p.s. go and root your boot. Edited July 17, 2015 by Greg Parker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Josephs Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 (edited) The ears appear smaller (less lobe) in the "CATHY" photo than the Santa Anna passport photo., gaal I'm guessing that this is not your correct head size? The lobotomy scars appear smaller than I imagined they would.. I am willing to stand corrected, however... So says the man using an image from 35 years ago... Something about stones and glass houses Parker... did you have a nice little break? Doesn't seem to have helped much though as you are right back to insults... lobotomy scars? what are you, 5 years old? Edited July 17, 2015 by David Josephs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 The ears appear smaller (less lobe) in the "CATHY" photo than the Santa Anna passport photo., gaal I'm guessing that this is not your correct head size? The lobotomy scars appear smaller than I imagined they would.. I am willing to stand corrected, however... So says the man using an image from 35 years ago... Something about stones and glass houses Parker... did you have a nice little break? Doesn't seem to have helped much though as you are right back to insults... lobotomy scars? what are you, 5 years old? 35 years ago? Ha. Thanks. It was about 3 years old when I first starting posting here in 2004 and was the only pic I had on my computer at the time. What am I? What are you? David, may all your chooks turn into emus and kick your dunny down. My analysis of Steve's head photo is every bit as scientific and worthwhile as your analysis of LHO photos. Thanks, much love etc, grEg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Josephs Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 David, Two simple questions for you. 1) Do you think it was me that created the "doppleganger" image above with the lines drawn on it? You comment seems to be suggesting I created it, which I did not 2) What do you assume my position is regarding the work in the doppleganger image? 1) you answered your own question Michael... "I did not" 2) If you write what you mean then isn't this your position? "My personal opinion is that these are clearly the same man, taken at different points in his life. Lighting, head tilt, pursing of the lips in the marine photo (edit: I mean photo on the right, I mistook that for a photo of Oswald in the marines) can easily account for many of the subtle differences between photos. I think there is some interesting evidence suggesting there were sightings of "Oswald" in more than one place at once, but this set of photos doesn't convince me we are looking at two different men" So these two are the same man, to you. The evidence which I've been discussing which Tracy nor anyone else cannot refute other than the reality of the situation "will never be known".. what an amazing cop out this is... we know EXACTLY what the WCR and DoD says about the situation - THEY provided the evidence. thing is I'm asking him or you to explain the DoD conflicts with the Marines who were with the man in Taiwan while his records claim he is in Japan being treated for a STD... How can he both never go, and be there at the same time? (The Unit Diaries which show his leaving and returning are NOT in the WCR or exhibits... wonder why) Forget for a second what you see... what does the evidence the WCR offers say about the records of this man other than it is in conflict with those who were with one versus the other man? Stick to the evidence offered... CE1961 conflicts with CE1962 and the Folsom/Donabedian Exhibits... and then the DoD lies about it... How can Lee Oswald be in both Ping Tung and Atsugi at the same time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Hargrove Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 How can Lee Oswald be in both Ping Tung and Atsugi at the same time? I know.... I know .... Lee was ONLY at Atsugi... despite ALL the EVIDENCE that he was at Ping Tung (and en route). Good Golly, DJ, must have been some other feller at Ping Tung! Don't know who.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Hargrove Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 And now for something completely different.... Harvey can't drive… ==================== QUOTE ON =================== Ruth Paine leaves for the east coast Ruth Paine left Irving, Texas on July 27, 1963 and supposedly drove to the east coast to visit her family. She was not seen again until September 20 when she arrived at the Oswald's apartment in New Orleans. She stayed with the Oswalds for three days and then drove Marina and June to Irving and arrived on September 24th. NOTE: Mrs. Paine was supposed to have driven her light blue two-tone 1955 Chevrolet station wagon (Texas license NK 4041) to the east coast but, according to the Murrets, she drove a brown station wagon to New Orleans in May, 1963, accompanied by Ma- rina and June Oswald. Michael Paine, from whom Ruth had been separated since the fall of 1962, moved into an apartment in Arlington, Texas and later to an apartment in Grand Prai- rie, Texas. The Paine's house should have been vacant from July 27 thru September 24th, 1963 and Mrs. Paine's light blue two-tone 1955 Chevrolet station wagon should have been with her on the east coast, but there are indications the blue station wagon remained in Irving. Irving barber and city councilman Cliff Shasteen told the Warren Commission that Lee Oswald drove Ruth Paine's car to his shop in the late summer of 1963 on sev- eral occasions. The owner of an Esso-Humble service station in New Orleans, Mr. Will, said that Oswald filled up a 1955 two-tone station wagon with gas at his station on sev- eral occasions, the last time about September 10, 1963. The last time Mr. A.R. Will saw Oswald he did not have enough money to pay his bill, which was slightly more than $11. Mr. Will gave Oswald a tank of gas on credit and Oswald signed the bill "L.H. Oswald, 4905 Magazine Street." When Mr. Will asked Oswald for identification, he produced a photo identification card. Harvey Oswald had no driver's license and could not drive. In the latter part of July, 1963 US Postal carrier J.G. Davis began carrying mail for the route serving 2515 W. 5th in Irving, Texas. Davis told postal inspectors I.L. Niewoehner and R.L. McCoy that he left mail addressed to the Oswalds in the mail box at 2515 W. 5th, without realizing there was a forwarding order to have the mail sent to 4907 Magazine Street in New Orleans (This forwarding order has never surfaced and probably never existed). Davis recalled the box was emptied every few days by someone who he assumed had authority to withdraw mail from the box --from Harvey and Lee, p. 558 ================== QUOTE OFF ====================== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Hargrove Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 Wait... wait... Don't tell me!!! I'm going to make a wild guess.... Lee Oswald never went to Ping Tung, Taiwan. Harvey Oswald did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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