The Von Möhrenshildt family

[Chuck Schwartz]

de Mohrenshildt was one of the many people associated with the JFKA that died an unnatural death.  He committed suicide, supposedly.

[Denny Zartman]

In one of the very first conversations I ever had about the JFK assassination someone pointed out that guys like George de Mohrenshildt don't just "make friends" with guys like Oswald.

Setting aside the fact that the two only met at the behest of CIA's J. Walton Moore, try to imagine how realistic it would be to believe that the alleged psychotic rifle-polishing ill-tempered Marxist loner actually became best friends with an aristocratic White Russian. Best friends? According to the W.C., de Mohrenshildt might have been Oswald's only friend.

[Paul Brancato]

Great thread - thank you for starting it.

I speculated a while back that George DeMohrenschildt was secretly part of the Skorzeny network, along with a few other Dallas residents. George played up his liberalism in the US, but his past definitely points in the opposite direction. And as Denny points out, his friendship with Oswald makes no sense in any other context than spy work. 
jean Paul - if you uncover any info on Skorzeny in this context please post them. 
also want to add that I followed Mae Brussell when she was alive and broadcasting. Last I heard her daughter was trying to find a home for her voluminous materials. Mae wrote an essay on the N-A-Z-I connection - have you seen it? 

Edited July 29, 2022 by Paul Brancato

[Guest]

22 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

Great thread - thank you for starting it.

I speculated a while back that George DeMohrenschildt was secretly part of the Skorzeny network, along with a few other Dallas residents. George played up his liberalism in the US, but his past definitely points in the opposite direction. And as Denny points out, his friendship with Oswald makes no sense in any other context than spy work. 
jean Paul - if you uncover any info on Skorzeny in this context please post them. 
also want to add that I followed Mae Brussell when she was alive and broadcasting. Last I heard her daughter was trying to find a home for her voluminous materials. Mae wrote an essay on the N-A-Z-I connection - have you seen it? 

I didn't really look into details on Skorzeny, but he is indeed a big player.

To me, this thread was partly in trying to find something on when DM was recruited.

Often you see these spies in the import-export business, giving them a reason to travel....

George was in the "Sigurd Co." in Antwerp, in his WC test. he said he was in that business with his girlfriend and travelled all over europe etc for that compny (other sources say he was in that Company with 2 Jews ?).  I don't know what it is, but there is "something" with this Sigurd Company, haven't figured it out yet. I have the adress etc but there is no information on his business partners

Amazing guy, running an international business that requires travelling a lot, while succesfully getting a college degree, I'm not buying... (just edited this, copied txt and lost a part in the process...) 

PS : I did see her essay, very interesting

Edited July 30, 2022 by Jean Paul Ceulemans

[Guest]

1) My current problem is... too many possible connections..  Was tracking some "known" n a z i 's and where they went in the USA (just to find any connections to George dM).  An example : looking at Walter Dornberger (W. von Braun's collegue, the V-1 etc  you know) and noticed from 1950's up to 1965 Dornberger worked for BELL.  Is there a chance he was a collegue of Michael Paine ? I knew about Bell Helicopters but remembered Chuck Yeager testing the Bell X-1 (at that moment my brain started working again...).

Was this the same plant Michael worked or elsewhere ???  Now, I am not accusing here, just wondering if I bumped on the same company perhaps... probably just a small world....

2) about Gehlen : looking at the period he was active (and resp. for Eastern Europe) he defenitively would be the guy to get someone in or out of Russia (or keep an eye on the other countries under Russian influence (eg Yugoslavia......).  I do not have a direct connection the GdM but I guess Maydell must have had connections to Gehlen one way or another

 

 

 

  

[Guest]

An interesting article from Probe Barbare LaMonica on the possible connections between W.A. Hyde and G.dM (first about the insurance business in New York in 1938 , next on ICA in the 1950's).  

This is all fairly new to me, so this is probably old news to most of you...

I do not know if there where any further investigations after this ?

I have yet to read a few books on this, so I might be on some old track...

https://ratical.org/ratville/JFK/FalseMystery/WmAveryHyde-B.LaMonica.pdf

There are sooooooooooooo many connections...  I guess the only hard evidence has to be in the CIA files for all I know...

[Guest]

An old fox needs not to be taught new tricks I suppose...

 

Edited August 25, 2022 by Jean Paul Ceulemans
Pict.removed to save attachm. space

[Guest]

Now I'll be...  I do not have this book yet ("Three Barons"), but was able to read some excerpts with Google Books...  So I have learned today to first do my homework before anything else...  auch... Excerpt from Three Barons below. Now..., I do not agree on what is being written in this book (for beginners I would have to read it completely), BUT it is clear some things were never mentioned by the WC. GdM was being tracking closely (his mail, etc) for at least 5 years after the JFKA (see his FBI files on MF).  Others... nope... because... well... it was inconvenient ?

 

Edited September 1, 2022 by Jean Paul Ceulemans

[Chuck Schwartz]

Jean Paul,  Joan Mellen wrote an interesting book on George DeMohrenshildt called " Our Man in Haiti".

[Paul Brancato]

18 hours ago, Jean Paul Ceulemans said:

Now I'll be...  I do not have this book yet ("Three Barons"), but was able to read some excerpts with Google Books...  So I have learned today to first do my homework before anything else...  auch... Excerpt from Three Barons below. Now..., I do not agree on what is being written in this book (for beginners I would have to read it completely), BUT it is clear some things were never mentioned by the WC. GdM was being tracking closely (his mail, etc) for at least 5 years after the JFKA (see his FBI files on MF).  Others... nope... because... well... it was inconvenient ?

I’ve never seen this. Sounds speculative, probably based on Mae Brussell. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Chuck Schwartz said:

Jean Paul,  Joan Mellen wrote an interesting book on George DeMohrenshildt called " Our Man in Haiti".

That's also on my list, thanks

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Paul Brancato said:

I’ve never seen this. Sounds speculative, probably based on Mae Brussell. 

While reading some of the pages I found there is some "new" (to me) information, I will get the book anyhow

[Guest]

I'm still working on the Belgian connection, it's not just about the colleges/institutes he attended (both were well known upper-class colleges).

There is the Texan Farenthold family, originating from Germany, a part moved to Belgium and George Farenthold was the Belgian that moved to Texas/Dallas and were all the known Farenthold descent from.

To make an impression on some lady George said he was a cousin to the Farenthold's, he was not a direct cousin (to my knowledge) but he did know the family, possibly from his time in Belgium, or perhaps they had a joint interest in something.  

The Belgian Farenthold's were in the industry (late 19th/early 20th century) , one was know for it's production of oil-lamps in Brussels.  

https://www.texasmonthly.com/news-politics/the-blood-of-the-farentholds/

 

 

[Pete Mellor]

23 hours ago, Jean Paul Ceulemans said:

Now I'll be...  I do not have this book yet ("Three Barons"), but was able to read some excerpts with Google Books...  So I have learned today to first do my homework before anything else...  auch... Excerpt from Three Barons below. Now..., I do not agree on what is being written in this book (for beginners I would have to read it completely), BUT it is clear some things were never mentioned by the WC. GdM was being tracking closely (his mail, etc) for at least 5 years after the JFKA (see his FBI files on MF).  Others... nope... because... well... it was inconvenient ?

Just to note:- The strange party where the Oswalds 'met' Ruth Paine came about because in February 1963 de Mohrenschildt, who met Oswald, as we know, on the advice of J. Walton Moore (employed by Dulles' friend Tracy Barnes in the mysterious CIA Domestic Operations Division) introduced Oswald to Volkmar Schmidt.  In Germany several years earlier Schmidt lived with and studied under a professor at the University of Heidelberg who had been involved in the plot to assassinate Hitler.  After meeting Oswald, Schmidt particularly wanted him to meet Michael Paine.

Volkmar Schmidt had come to Dallas from Germany in the fall of 1961 to do geological research for Magnolia Laboratories in Duncanville, Texas.  Schmidt's teacher and housemate in Germany had been  Dr. Wilhelm Kuetemeyer, professor of psychosomatic medicine and religious philosophy at the University of Heidelberg.  His work involved conducting experiments on a group of schizophrenics until Kuetemeyer became involved in the 20th of July plot against Hitler and had to go into hiding-like Gisevius.  When Schmidt first met Oswald he brought up the subject of General Walker and Hitler, as Schmidt recounted to Edward Epstein.  Schmidt's two housemates, geologist Richard Pierce and chemist Everett Glover also worked at Magnolia.  It was Glover who arranged the February 22nd party at which the Oswalds met Ruth Paine.  Two other guests at the party, Pierce's girlfriend Betty McDonald and geologist Norman Fredricksen were also Magnolia employees.

Reference has been made in posts above to Joan Mellen's 'Our Man in Haiti'.  I found it interesting in that text that de Mohrenschildt met with a Middle Eastern 'spook' by the name of Mohamed Al Fayed, who at that time was having dealings with 'Papa Doc' and looking to develop an oil refinery.  As is known, Al Fayed's son Dodi was killed in the assassination in Paris in 1997 of Diana Spencer.

[Guest]

INFO ON THE early FARENTHOLD family :

 

Farenthold family BELGIUM :

Charles Frédéric Farenthold  was registered in 1871 in Belgium as a  foreign travelling merchant, he was born in Berlin in 1846.  In 1871 he already had a relation of some sort with Jeanne Philomène Mathy, she was born in Werchter in 1856, a small town in Belgium. They only got married in 1880

This Charles Frédéric Farenthold had invented  a process to improve the popular kerosene/oil- lamps.  He starts a factory in Brussels that soon also produces domestic heaters  and  large industrial-types of lighting (all based on the usage of kerosene) .  Products are being advertised well into the 1920’s.  Products are sold under the Farenthold name, but also under names like Fortune (yep...) and others.  

He had at least 2 sons : 1) Carl Wilhem Farenthold (born 1883 Brussels) married  in 1904 Anne Marie Leemans (born 1883, Heverlee, Belgium), they divorced in 1908, next married in 1912 Julie Sophie Sidonie Morelle (born 1877 Cassel, France).  2) Fritz Farenthold (born circa 1882 Brussels ) married 1925 Jeanne Bekkers

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NOTE : in 1910 one of the Brussels Farenthold family is mentioned as a breeder of Belgian Shepherd dogs (especially of the Malinois type). With some  partners he’s breeding them to be used as a medic-aid and police dogs.  PS : Belgian Malinois were  often used in the military as message carriers, ambulance dogs, and to pull machine guns in WWI.  This Farenthold was in 1910 the secretary of the Belgian Shepherd Club.

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Farenthold family U.S.A.

George Edward Fahrenthold (born dec 6, 1915 Brussels –died 2000 Corpus Christi), was the great-grandson of Charles Frédéric Farenthold (see above, Belgium)

George Edward Farenthold (the great-grandson that is) received his U.S. citizenship in 1940 and subsequently became a decorated Air Force captain.   Married 1) Annie Blake Morgan and 2) Mary Frances Tarlton "Sissy" Farenthold.

This is the one George de Möhrenschildt had some contact with (or at least tried to).  He probably heard he was from Belgium and used that to make a connection, George said he was his cousin but that was not correct, perhaps somewhere way up the family trees there is a connection, haven't found anything that suggests that.  Farenthold always denied he was related to GdM.

 

From : https://www.texasmonthly.com/news-politics/the-blood-of-the-farentholds/

“George F. was a man accustomed to high living, which included making a home in what is now the official residence of the president of Algeria, getting his education in a Swiss academy, and enjoying the company of a manservant wherever he traveled. His first marriage to a Texas woman had been a bust, ending in 1948, but not before George had availed himself of his wealthy father-in-law’s business knowledge and capitalized on a few lucrative opportunities. Thus he came to the Bluntzer-Dougherty-Tarlton family, bringing with him an internationalist’s savoir-vivre, a good head for the oil business, a ten-year-old son named Randolph by his previous marriage, and the rich bloodlines of Belgian aristocracy”*

 

Note :*about this “Belgian aristocracy” and his “Baron” title : I do not know where that came from, as Farenthold is not Belgian artistocracy. But it could have been German aristocracy.  Other possibilities : one of them married into aristocracy or one of them got the titel Baron by merit (industrial/cultural/...) and not by heritage, but so far I have found nothing to substantiate that

 

 

 

Edited August 8, 2022 by Jean Paul Ceulemans