Derek Thibeault Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 3 minutes ago, Derek Thibeault said: It was on Ancestry.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Thibeault Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 Just now, Derek Thibeault said: Not sure if this is the right one. There is more info if you have a subscription. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Thibeault Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 3 hours ago, Joseph McBride said: Acquilla Clemmons (as I spell her name, although it sometimes is spelled Clemons; her unusual first name derives from "Eagle," which befits her courage and patriotism) was never seen again after doing the interview with Mark Lane at her home in North Oak Cliff on March 23, 1966, for RUSH TO JUDGMENT. I found the unedited transcript of that interview in the papers of the film's director, the radical documentarian Emile de Antonio. I and other researchers have tried to find Mrs. Clemmons. I found some indications that she may have moved to Philadelphia. But given her age at the time of the assassination and the murder of Officer Tippit (she told Lane she was about 55 and had lived in Dallas since she was 15), she would be around 111 if she survives. It is disturbing that she disappeared, let's hope not violently but perhaps having to flee the white supremacist atmosphere of Dallas and the threats against her from the DPD. De Antonio said in an interview with him and Lane for Film Comment's Winter 1966-67 issue that when they went to Dallas to film RUSH TO JUDGMENT, all the tension was around the Tippit murder, not the events in Dealey Plaza. Mrs. Clemmons was a brave woman to keep speaking out about two men she saw as involved in the Tippit murder. She was one of the people to whom I dedicated INTO THE NIGHTMARE. The true heroes of this case are the courageous, honest civilian witnesses who have spoken out in contradiction of the official myth, as well as some insiders such as Roger Craig and the medical personnel in Dallas and Bethesda. Thank you sir. You are right! The name spelling could be an issue. I hope she lived out her life in peace. BTW - John Ford and The Searcher is my favorite film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Bulman Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 30 minutes ago, Derek Thibeault said: Thank you sir. You are right! The name spelling could be an issue. I hope she lived out her life in peace. BTW - John Ford and The Searcher is my favorite film. Not to go off topic, but Derek do you know The Searchers is loosely based on a true story, the recapture of Cynthia Ann Parker? She died of heartbreak, in white captivity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Von Pein Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Derek Thibeault said: Derek, The info you've got above is, indeed, very likely our 10th Street Acquilla Clemons. It's the middle name (Elizabeth) that might be the key there (plus all the rest of the spelling). I note that Dale Myers, in this 2020 blog article, has made six separate references to "Acquilla E. Clemons" (with one M). See image below as well. BTW .... I've noticed over the course of the last several years, Dale Myers has been very careful about the spelling of Clemons' last name. He has actually changed his mind about the way her last name is really spelled, because I've noticed he has her name spelled Clemmons (with two Ms) all throughout the original 1998 edition of his book "With Malice", but in Dale's more recent blog posts (such as that one from 2020 I linked above), he always now spells her name Clemons (with just one M). And since Dale has done more research on the Tippit murder and its associated witnesses than any other human on Earth, I have no qualms about accepting Dale's current version of Acquilla's last name. (Although given Dale's very fastidious attention to detail and accuracy, it does make me wonder why Mr. Myers didn't have Acquilla's name spelled with just the one M in the 1998 version of his book? Dale obviously thought he had it right in his '98 volume, but then later apparently learned the correct spelling. It probably drives him nuts to know that her name is misspelled many times throughout the '98 book. I know if it were my book, something unfixable like that would drive me batty.) Edited August 17, 2022 by David Von Pein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph McBride Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 (edited) De Antonio had quite a lot of government opposition to his documentary UNDERGROUND, about the Weather Underground, which he filmed secretly. Many Hollywood people came out in his support. I covered the controversy for Daily Variety. He called me and asked me to conduct a live interview with him on an LA TV station that ran (as I recall) 90 minutes. He said Variety had always been the fairest publication toward him and his work, and when I expressed surprise, he explained it was because Variety had to report factually on what a film contained, because exhibitors and others needed to know. So the paper couldn't afford to distort things as other media do. Unfortunately, that all changed after the Silverman family sold the paper to a British conglomerate and they got rid of our editor on Daily Variety, Tom Pryor, a feisty man with great integrity, and replaced him with the dubious Peter Bart. A representative of the new ownership candidly told Tom that they brought in Bart to increase advertising revenues (Bart would make deals with advertisers to kill or alter stories and so forth). After the PATRIOT GAMES/Paramount controversy between me and Bart, Premiere magazine sarcastically chose us as "Showbiz Couple of the Year." After resigning from Variety with a settlement due to Bart's misbehavior, I went to Dallas to do further research for INTO THE NIGHTMARE. Edited August 17, 2022 by Joseph McBride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Doudna Posted August 17, 2022 Share Posted August 17, 2022 2 hours ago, Derek Thibeault said: It was on Ancestry.com Yes Derek you are right! Forget the North Carolina one, not right. Here is what I found on Ancestry.com (I went in for the trial membership to have a look). Her name is definitely spelled "Clemons", Acquilla Elizabeth Clemons, married 1955 to Robert Eugene LAGWAY (not "Legway"--a typo on the Ancestry.com listing you show! I looked at the marriage document and it clearly has Robert's name typed "LAGWAY" not "Legway"!) Robert Eugene Lagway was born 12/23/05 and died 9/29/94 in either Sherman, or Denison, Texas. But "Acquilla Clemons" is completely a deadend in records, latest record under that name shows her living in Dallas in a 1962 city directory (plus Joseph McBride cites she had lived in Dallas a long time). Therefore I wondered if Acquilla Clemons may have gone by her middle name Elizabeth. I found an "Elizabeth Clemons" died 10/19/94 in Dallas, no birthdate given. I thought of all the stories of aged spouses dying soon after the other spouse dies, at about the same time. This would be Sept. 29 and Oct 19 of the same year, 1994, if that Elizabeth Clemons was Acquilla who married Robert Lagway. I would like to think, for this sympathetic and underappreciated witness, Acquilla Clemons, that she lived a peaceful life, escaped notoriety by the expedient of going by Elizabeth instead of Acquilla, and lived out her days peacefully with family members in her home city, Dallas. I can however find no newspaper obituary for either her or Robert Eugene Lagway. If Acquilla's husband Robert Lagway was born in 1905 and married Acquilla in 1955 when he was 50, there is a good chance Acquilla was not his first wife, and that there could be children of Robert Lagway from a previous marriage, who may survive today in the Dallas area, or grandchildren, who could possibly know and tell the story of "what became of Acquilla Clemons". There are many Robert Lagways in documents which could be sorted through for matching to Robert Eugene Lagway m. Acquilla Clemons, to find possible descendants in Dallas today. So Derek this is what I found from your "tip"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Thibeault Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 7 hours ago, Ron Bulman said: Not to go off topic, but Derek do you know The Searchers is loosely based on a true story, the recapture of Cynthia Ann Parker? She died of heartbreak, in white captivity. at some point - I think I heard that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Thibeault Posted August 17, 2022 Author Share Posted August 17, 2022 5 hours ago, Greg Doudna said: Yes Derek you are right! Forget the North Carolina one, not right. Here is what I found on Ancestry.com (I went in for the trial membership to have a look). Her name is definitely spelled "Clemons", Acquilla Elizabeth Clemons, married 1955 to Robert Eugene LAGWAY (not "Legway"--a typo on the Ancestry.com listing you show! I looked at the marriage document and it clearly has Robert's name typed "LAGWAY" not "Legway"!) Robert Eugene Lagway was born 12/23/05 and died 9/29/94 in either Sherman, or Denison, Texas. But "Acquilla Clemons" is completely a deadend in records, latest record under that name shows her living in Dallas in a 1962 city directory (plus Joseph McBride cites she had lived in Dallas a long time). Therefore I wondered if Acquilla Clemons may have gone by her middle name Elizabeth. I found an "Elizabeth Clemons" died 10/19/94 in Dallas, no birthdate given. I thought of all the stories of aged spouses dying soon after the other spouse dies, at about the same time. This would be Sept. 29 and Oct 19 of the same year, 1994, if that Elizabeth Clemons was Acquilla who married Robert Lagway. I would like to think, for this sympathetic and underappreciated witness, Acquilla Clemons, that she lived a peaceful life, escaped notoriety by the expedient of going by Elizabeth instead of Acquilla, and lived out her days peacefully with family members in her home city, Dallas. I can however find no newspaper obituary for either her or Robert Eugene Lagway. If Acquilla's husband Robert Lagway was born in 1905 and married Acquilla in 1955 when he was 50, there is a good chance Acquilla was not his first wife, and that there could be children of Robert Lagway from a previous marriage, who may survive today in the Dallas area, or grandchildren, who could possibly know and tell the story of "what became of Acquilla Clemons". There are many Robert Lagways in documents which could be sorted through for matching to Robert Eugene Lagway m. Acquilla Clemons, to find possible descendants in Dallas today. So Derek this is what I found from your "tip"! Nice work! I am sure Elizabeth was an easier name to go by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Thomas Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 (edited) This was given to me by a friend. John Kelin was the original source for unearthing this. Shirley Martin interviewed Acquilla Clemmons in August, 1964: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1wGFs59hXjeYFoZLuFff9U69d_5DS8cEd/view?usp=sharing I have no idea what the references to Oswald's wife being there are supposed to mean. Steve Thomas Edited August 18, 2022 by Steve Thomas Giving credit where it is due. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Thibeault Posted August 18, 2022 Author Share Posted August 18, 2022 9 minutes ago, Steve Thomas said: This was given to me by a friend. Shirley Martin interviewed Acquilla Clemmons in August, 1964: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1wGFs59hXjeYFoZLuFff9U69d_5DS8cEd/view?usp=sharing I have no idea what the references to Oswald's wife being there are supposed to mean. Steve Thomas The Mrs Oswald part interesting - she is very scared here. Who was she working for? That has to be in some record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bauer Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 (edited) Regards the interview posted above via the link; Has Joseph McBride ever mentioned this interview? If he has seen the transcript, did he not think it was of any value? Does he dismiss it for any reason? Edited August 18, 2022 by Joe Bauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph McBride Posted August 18, 2022 Share Posted August 18, 2022 (edited) See quotes from that interview in my 2013 book INTO THE NIGHTMARE. Edited August 19, 2022 by Joseph McBride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Thibeault Posted August 19, 2022 Author Share Posted August 19, 2022 The more I think about this, and I read the blog article by Dale Myers, I strongly suspect that Lane and Martin's questioning would not have been acceptable in a court of law. They throw too many leading questions at her. Now I believe she saw something and I believe she was scared, either of losing her job or of harm. I'm assuming she was poor, so losing a job is a big deal. No clue what family she had. Maybe the 1960 census when that comes out in 9 years may be able to shed some light. It's hard when an event happens, which witness saw which part and who was looking at what? I don't understand why everyone in that neighborhood does not have a police interview on file of what they saw on the day of the shooting. The Warren Commission also should have done that. The job of investigators that day is derelict in their duty to truly uncover what happened. If Oswald ever went on trial for this, not sure they could convict him if people delivered honest testimony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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