The REAL reason why Oswald went to Irving on 11.21.63

[Joe Bauer]

I've viewed interviews of Wesley Frazier 200 times.

One quote that he repeated in what seemed like half of these was his immediate question to Lee as they were getting into Frazier's car the morning of 11,22,1963:

"What's in the bag Lee?"

How many Mondays did Buell Frazier take Oswald to work in his car?

6?

It appears that Lee throwing his brown paper wrapped item on the back seat was not what Frazier remembers him doing with his lunch bag the other 5 previous times.

That suggest to me that what Oswald threw onto the back seat was not his lunch. At least not in the form Frazier ever witnessed in his 5 or 6 morning commutes to work with Lee.

 

 

Edited June 20, 2023 by Joe Bauer

[Matt Allison]

The only witness to LHO having a rifle in New Orleans at all would be Marina, correct?

So yeah, we can take that for what it's worth.

The rifle would have had to have been packed and unpacked several times; the original trip to New Orleans in Spring of '63, and then once again upon return to Texas in September of '63.

Do we assume it was taken apart and transported in pieces? If so, what were the pieces carried in?

And what is the evidence of such?

[Cory Santos]

3 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

He, like many other witnesses, was simply incorrect about this. He was fooled by the acoustics that existed in Dealey Plaza.

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2010/09/dealey-plaza-earwitnesses.html

 

Then he could be incorrect about other things too then.   Certainly, you agree with that right?

[David Von Pein]

4 hours ago, Cory Santos said:

Then he [Buell Frazier] could be incorrect about other things too then. Certainly, you agree with that right?

Well, yeah, I guess you're right. Perhaps the words that Buell Frazier said that Oswald uttered to him on the morning of Nov. 22 ("I'm going to buy my lunch today") could have become completely distorted by the acoustics of the nearby carport or by some other freak occurrence, which made Oswald's actual comment ("I've got my cheese and apple lunch in this huge paper bag, Wesley") only falsely sound like "I'm gonna buy my lunch" to Buell Wesley Frazier's ears.

Not a very likely error for Buell to make. But, hey, anything's possible, right? 😃

 

Edited June 21, 2023 by David Von Pein

[Cory Santos]

1 hour ago, David Von Pein said:

Well, yeah, I guess you're right. Perhaps the words that Buell Frazier said that Oswald uttered to him on the morning of Nov. 22 ("I'm going to buy my lunch today") could have become completely distorted by the acoustics of the nearby carport or by some other freak occurrence, which made Oswald's actual comment ("I've got my cheese and apple lunch in this huge paper bag, Buell") only falsely sound like "I'm gonna buy my lunch" to Buell Wesley Frazier's ears.

Not a very likely error for Buell to make. But, hey, anything's possible, right? 😃

 

So is it your opinion Oswald did not eat lunch prior to 12:30 on 11-22?

[Ron Bulman]

9 minutes ago, Cory Santos said:

So is it your opinion Oswald did not eat lunch prior to 12:30 on 11-22?

No cheese sandwich before going "out front with Shelly"?

[David Von Pein]

17 minutes ago, Cory Santos said:

So is it your opinion Oswald did not eat lunch prior to 12:30 on 11-22?

Yes.

 

[Cory Santos]

3 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

Yes.

 

Based on what?

[David Von Pein]

16 minutes ago, Cory Santos said:

Based on what?

You're kidding, right?

You're just playing around with me now, aren't you?

 

[Matt Allison]

David- I am genuinely curious to how you would answer the questions I posed above:

"The rifle would have had to have been packed and unpacked several times; the original trip to New Orleans in Spring of '63, and then once again upon return to Texas in September of '63.

Do we assume it was taken apart and transported in pieces? If so, what were the pieces carried in?

And what is the evidence of such?"

[David Von Pein]

15 minutes ago, Matt Allison said:

David- I am genuinely curious to how you would answer the questions I posed above:

"The rifle would have had to have been packed and unpacked several times; the original trip to New Orleans in Spring of '63, and then once again upon return to Texas in September of '63.

Do we assume it was taken apart and transported in pieces? If so, what were the pieces carried in? And what is the evidence of such?"

I don't see any reason to assume the rifle was "in pieces" when it was transported to and from New Orleans in the spring and summer of 1963.

Why would anyone assume such a thing?

I don't know how the rifle was specifically packed for transit. Nobody does. But I can reasonably infer that Oswald's C2766 Carcano rifle WAS transported (in some manner) to and from New Orleans in 1963.

 

Edited June 21, 2023 by David Von Pein

[Matt Allison]

3 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

I don't see any reason to assume the rifle was "in pieces" when it was transported to and from New Orleans in the spring and summer of 1963.

Then wouldn't it have been noticed by Ruth Paine upon both departure and arrival in both instances?

[David Von Pein]

5 minutes ago, Matt Allison said:

Then wouldn't it have been noticed by Ruth Paine upon both departure and arrival in both instances?

Not if it was packed in some kind of external container (e.g., bag, blanket, box, etc.).

Bottom Line:

Nobody knows just how the rifle was packed for transit.

 

Edited June 21, 2023 by David Von Pein

[Bill Brown]

17 hours ago, Michael Griffith said:

You don't know that Oswald carried the bag tucked under his armpit. You are taking Frazier's word for this and are rejecting Dougherty's clear, adamant recollection that Oswald had nothing in his hands when he entered the TSBD. 

And if the paper bag in evidence is the one Oswald carried, and if Oswald carried the disassembled Carcano in that bag, why was there not one speck of oil in/on the bag? 

 

"You don't know that Oswald carried the bag tucked under his armpit. You are taking Frazier's word for this and are rejecting Dougherty's clear, adamant recollection that Oswald had nothing in his hands when he entered the TSBD."

 

Dougherty has absolutely nothing to do with how Oswald may have been carrying the package from Frazier's car to the back entrance on the loading dock.

 

 

"And if the paper bag in evidence is the one Oswald carried, and if Oswald carried the disassembled Carcano in that bag, why was there not one speck of oil in/on the bag?"

 

Nonsense.

 

Why would oil be expected to be in or on the bag just because a rifle was carried inside it?

 

[Bill Brown]

 

Now cue the tired argument that the testimonial record states that the inner workings of the rifle was well-oiled and this somehow means that oil should have been all over the bag.