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Posner Interview with Hindsight History


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48 minutes ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

@Joe Bauer two bullet fragments were found in the front of the limo

Thanks.

So, those fragments from the JFK head shot bullet traveled another 5 feet and with total loss of velocity simply dropped down on the front seat floor?

JFK's head was pulled down slightly by Jackie when it was hit and was on a lower level plane than both Kellerman's and Greer's heads 5 feet in front of them.

So, obviously those fragments didn't hop over Kellerman's and Greer's heads and then drop down.

They either went right between their bodies before dropping down ...or, again they were part of a larger fragment or another bullet that hit the upper windshield frame.

That's my "elementary dear Watson" laws of physics deduction guess anyway.

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21 hours ago, Jonathan Cohen said:

No... he said that only a portion of the limousine's interior was cleaned, as opposed to the entire car.

Once Kennedy was at Parkland, preserving that crime scene should have been paramount. It should have been towed away and not driven away. Not refitted and reused until freaking Nixon!!! Ghouls.

Edited by George Govus
I really should read page one before I read page 2.
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The fragments probably came from the chrome molding strip near the windshield.

 

Dennis David said that he held a vile of 4 fragments.The total size of the fragments was bigger than one bullet & less than two.

Edited by Michael Crane
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On 7/6/2023 at 1:23 PM, Gerry Down said:

During a recent interview with Hindsight History, Gerald Posner brought up three interesting points:

  1. 57 Minutes to 1 Hour 1 Minute: Posner demonstrates that the story of the limo being washed at Parkland hospital is a myth and in fact only the drivers seat was washed in order to enable the limo to be driven back to Love Field to be flown back to Washington.
  2. 1 Hour 13 Minutes: Tippit possibly did not believe Oswald was a suspect when he stopped Oswald because the protocol when stopping a suspect was to radio it in to inform DPD HQ that you were stopping a suspect. Tippit did not do this. This opens the possibility that Oswald was simply doing something odd that caused Tippit to stop him rather than believing he was a suspect in the JFK assassination. 
  3. 1 Hour 24 minutes: Posner points out that Texas had a law in 1963 called "Murder without malice" which had a 5 year max sentence. One motivation in Ruby killing Oswald may have been that Ruby might have thought he would simply get 5 years max for the murder but have the rest of his life to be a hero for the feat. This would also explain why his lawyer might have encouraged him to say he killed Oswald for Mrs Kennedys sake. This would make it look like Ruby had been overcome with emotion and so there had been no planning to the murder. 

Here is the interview:

 

Posner is full of it, as usual. No one said they saw the SS clean up the driver's seat. Here is what they said...

  • An 11-22-63 UPI article, most likely reflecting the words of UPI’s man-on-the-scene Merriman Smith, reported on this clean-up, stating: “Outside the hospital, blood was cleaned from the limousine.”

  • An 11-23-63 New York Times story by Tom Wicker similarly reported, “A bucket of water stood by the car, suggesting that the back seat had been scrubbed out.” (In the 1965 anthology John Fitzgerald Kennedy...As We Remember Him, and then again in his 1978 book On Press, Wicker explained just why this bucket suggested as much and specified that it wasn't just a bucket of water, but “a bucket of bloody water.”)

  • An article on the assassination by Hugh Sidey in the 12-20-63 issue of Time Magazine confirmed these accounts, and claimed he'd witnessed: “A young man, I assume he was a Secret Service man, with a sponge and a bucket of red water, and he was trying to wipe up the blood and what looked like flakes of flesh and brains in the back seat.” (Sidey repeated this allegation in an 11-28-88 Time article. He wrote: "The presidential limousine rested at Parkland Hospital. A grim young man was washing away the blood and flesh that had splattered the leather upholstery...The young man in his neat dark suit, sleeves pushed up, swabbed the seats. They glistened in their miserable wetness. Beside the car was a bucket with brownish red water. If any doubt remained about this calamity, it was swept away in one glance at that bucket. So simple. so hideous." )

  • And as if that weren't enough, Newsweek’s Charles Roberts also confirmed these accounts. In his 1967 defense of the Warren Report, modestly entitled The Truth About The Assassination, Roberts said simply that on 11-22-63 he saw two Secret Service men "starting to put the fabric top" on the President's limo, and thought "Why now?" Now that was vague, but Roberts would later expand on this. In an interview conducted for Robert MacNeil's 1988 book The Way we Were, Roberts admitted that he'd actually seen these agents “mop up the back seat” before putting on the fabric top, and that he'd thought it “ironic” that one of the Secret Service agents waved him aside and told him “you can’t look,” when "this wall of protection...of course could do no good."

  • And then, for good measure, there's Sid Davis, a reporter for Westinghouse Radio. On 11-9-13, in a taped interview with The Newseum, Davis shared that when he arrived at Parkland Hospital ”'I could see the Secret Service agents cleaning up the back of the limousine. I went to take a look and a friend of mine, Hugh Sidey of Time Magazine, said 'Don’t look, it’s too horrible.'"

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8 hours ago, Michael Crane said:

Dennis David said that he held a vile of 4 fragments. The total size of the fragments was bigger than one bullet & less than two.

Really? Wow!

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9 hours ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

@Joe Bauer some believe the fragments from the head shot "hit the windshield" and dropped to the floor of the limo.

Very possible.

Whatever hit the windshield had a much reduced velocity and mass, hence just cracking it and not going through and through.

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51 minutes ago, Joe Bauer said:

Very possible.

Whatever hit the windshield had a much reduced velocity and mass, hence just cracking it and not going through and through.

A few witness's said that the bullet hole was through & through.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 7/6/2023 at 9:23 PM, Gerry Down said:

1 Hour 13 Minutes: Tippit possibly did not believe Oswald was a suspect when he stopped Oswald because the protocol when stopping a suspect was to radio it in to inform DPD HQ that you were stopping a suspect. Tippit did not do this. This opens the possibility that Oswald was simply doing something odd that caused Tippit to stop him rather than believing he was a suspect in the JFK assassination. 

 

I wonder if Posner has got this wrong. It was protocol to radio it in whenever you were getting out of your patrol car and then to radio it back in again when you got back into your patrol car. Therefore Tippit should have radioed it in that he was getting out of his patrol car to talk to Oswald regardless of the reason he was talking to Oswald, in other words completely independent of whether he thought LHO was a suspect in the JFK assassination.

Have i got this wrong? Was it protocol to radio it in that you had a suspect and to actually announce it over the radio that you "had a suspect"?

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The reason you had to radio it in is because in 1963 the DPD did not have walkie-talkies to carry around with them. The only radio they had was in the car. Therefore you had to radio it in whenever you were getting out of the car in case anything happened to you whilst outside the car. If you radioed it in that you were getting out of the patrol car but did not radio it back in, in say 5 minutes, that you had got back in to your patrol car, they could send out a patrol car to your last known location to "rescue" you. 

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