FINALLY, PROOF: Charles Tracy Barnes was the CIA Chief of Domestic Operations Division, Support!

[Robert Montenegro]

I really hope this thread doesn't stray too off course.

It's about the significance of new documents. 

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Leslie Sharp]

31 minutes ago, Robert Montenegro said:

I really hope this thread doesn't stray too off course.

It's about the significance of new documents. 

 

Agree, but the new documents only confirm what was already known. The concern is why the fact was ignored for so long. Was it buried, overlooked, ignored, deliberately or otherwise?

 

Staying with "T" as Barnes in the Lafitte records, we now have the DOD chief in specific context of the actual plans as they evolved in 1963 for the assassination of his commander in chief.  That should be of interest and focus on any Tracy Barnes thread. Otherwise, we're only reinforcing the "if only we had had access to ALLL the government documents ALL these years, the case would have been solved."  

If I could make the point and Alan K. agreed, both Hank and I argued that nothing in the Barnes-related government documents say anything about Barnes' role in the Dallas assassination, nothing. Yes, his role in PBSuccess established precedent, but not proof necessarily; one has to connect the dots and make significant leaps to make a case that would hold up in court.  The Lafitte datebook on the other hand ... 

Edited July 9, 2023 by Leslie Sharp

[Pat Speer]

23 hours ago, Robert Montenegro said:

 

• https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/2023/104-10119-10100.pdf

 

For well over thirty years now, researchers have been diligently trying to verify bonafides, in regards to claims made in Robert D. Morrow's controversial book, "First Hand Knowledge: How I Participated in the CIA-Mafia Murder of President Kennedy."

 

One of the most controversial, was the claim that Charles Tracy Barnes, formerly Deputy Director of the Psychological Strategy Board during the Korean War and CIA Special Assistant for Paramilitary & Psychological Operations during the Guatemalan coup d'état (cryptonym PBSUCCESS) was, by 1962, commander of a highly illegal branch of CIA called Domestic Operations Division, which was tasked with supporting the Directorate of Plans in covert operations that were active within the continental United States (sometimes under the designation OOA or "...Other Operational Activities..." in support of DDP).

 

Well, now we have the documented proof:

 

 

The above document states the following:

 

QUOTE—

"...REF: Memo 11/15/62 from D/Sec to C/DODS in Subj file On above date Joseph Murphy, Security Officer, DODS, advised that subject is considering filing an appeal from the security disapproval date of 11/15/62 for his wife to accept employment with (Spanish Embassy) Mr. Murphy requested advice as to procedure in filing an appeal. I suggested the, if subject had any justification not previously submitted to Security, a second request would be considered by this Branch, but that, if subject was filing an appeal with no additional justification, the appeal should be submitted thru Chief, DODS, and should reflect the views of Tracy Barnes. Subject has discussed his request with Mr. Barnes and may want to contact someone in Security above the Branch level..."

—END QUOTE

 

So, when Chief, Reports & Publications, Domestic Operations Division, Support, Directorate of Plans, (C/R&P/DODS/DD/P), Everette Howard Hunt Jr. was whining and moaning to CIA Office of Security about his wife not being able to get a job with CIA in the Madrid, Spain US Embassy, this hand-written memo was generated, giving us the first documented evidence anywhere, that Charles Tracy Barnes' official job title in 1962 was, "...Chief, Domestic Operations Division, Support..."

 

And if CIA officialdom was behind the murder of President Kennedy, now we have a prime candidate for project manager, so to speak...

 

...perhaps Tracy Barnes really is Milice française, Organisation secrète d'action révolutionnaire nationale terrorist Jean-Pierre Lafitte's "...well connected T..."

 

 

I looked into this almost 20 years ago, and was able to document both Barnes' working as head of the D.O.D. and that Hunt worked under him. I was also able to document what the D.O.D. did. I supplied this info to Larry Hancock and as I recall he included it in an update to his book Someone Would Have Talked. 

The most interesting aspect to this, as I recall, is that the D.O.D. could not spy on U.S. citizens living in the U.S. but COULD spy on (and try to double) foreign nationals living in the United States. Well this led me to wonder if they were spying on and trying to double the Cuban Ambassador to the U.N., whose mistress just so happened to be Oswald's contact in Mexico City, Sylvia Duran. If so--if Oswald  went to Mexico City as part of an operation designed to entangle the Cuban ambassador to the U.N.--well that could explain a lot, perhaps even his supposedly partying with Duran and his supposedly writing a Dear Mr Hunt letter. 

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by Pat Speer

[Gerry Down]

15 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

I looked into this almost 20 years ago, and was able to document both Barnes' working as head of the D.O.D. and that Hunt worked under him. I was also able to document what the D.O.D. did. I supplied this info to Larry Hancock and as I recall he included it in an update to his book Someone Would Have Talked. 

The most interesting aspect to this, as I recall, is that the D.O.D. could not spy on U.S. citizens living in the U.S. but COULD spy on (and try to double) foreign nationals living in the United States. Well this led me to wonder if they were spying on and trying to double the Cuban Ambassador to the U.N., whose mistress just so happened to be Oswald's contact in Mexico City, Sylvia Duran. If so--if Oswald  went to Mexico City as part of an operation designed to entangle the Cuban ambassador to the U.N.--well that could explain a lot, perhaps even his supposedly partying with Duran and his supposedly writing a Dear Mr Hunt letter. 

 

As LHO was not a foreign national, it seems hard to see how LHO could have been at any stage the target of DOD operations. Sounds like DOD would have been more interested in Cubans, for example, coming in to the country.

[Robert Montenegro]

32 minutes ago, Gerry Down said:

As LHO was not a foreign national, it seems hard to see how LHO could have been at any stage the target of DOD operations.

 

Plus, it has already been documented that Mr. Oswald was of interest to a COL. Harold Muddy Frindell, who was commander of 112th Military Intelligence Group, Region II command, 4th US Army Operations Group, Counterintelligence, US Army, Assistant Chief of Staff for Intelligence.

 

COL. Frindell even had military intelligence operatives in New Orleans, spying on Mr. Oswald:

 

• CMDR David C. Reid (commander, Naval Criminal Investigative Service, 8th Naval District, Office of Naval Intelligence, New Orleans, Louisiana/ liaison, 112th Military Intelligence Group)

 

• John J. D'Angelo (Special Agent, US Air Force Office of Special Investigations, 9th District, New Orleans, Louisiana/ liaison, 112th Military Intelligence Group)

 

•  Harry G. Maynor (FBI, Special Agent In Charge, New Orleans, Louisiana/ liaison, 112th Military Intelligence Group)

 

And of course, Edward John Coyle (Head of Security Section, 112th Military Intelligence Group) was in the Sexton Building (AKA Texas School Book Depository), just minutes after the murder of President Kennedy, for still, to this day, unknown reasons...

 

Edited July 10, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Larry Hancock]

As Pat said, this has been discussed for some time and I think it brings into play the fact that Domestic Operations had a fairly broad remit (legal or not) at the time.  Ostensibly it did not "spy" on foreign agents - the CIA was to hand that off to the FBI and we have concrete examples of that, one being "Tumbleweed". 

Domestic operations did a good deal of work establishing domestic "covers" for foreign operations - which was actually one of Barnes' long time specialties and possibly the reason he was given the assignment. It also identified and maintained contacts with American's with international contacts or those traveling abroad who could be used as sources or assets. 

Which is why De Morenschildt was cultivated as a source for Domestic Operations.  I've always been curious as to what Divisions actually used Clay Shaw.  The same would be said for Meheu and his operations against foreign diplomats.  That may even be revealed in more current documents; I admit to never going back to take a look at either Shaw or Meheu in that respect.

And of course J Walton Moores files remain largely a mystery - they would give us a very interesting insight into Domestic Operations activities.

 

 

[Joseph Backes]

Context helps.  You have to read and know a lot about this case to know when there's something good in the document releases.  

 

[Gerry Down]

So DOD and Domestic Contacts are one and the same? Domestic Contacts Division were some branch of DOD with Barnes ultimately at the top? Barnes was Walton Moores boss?

[Joseph Backes]

4 minutes ago, Robert Montenegro said:

 

Plus, it has already been documented that Mr. Oswald was of interest to a COL. Harold Muddy Frindell, who was commander of 112th Military Intelligence Group, Region II command, 4th US Army Operations Group, Counterintelligence, US Army, Assistant Chief of Staff for Intelligence.

 

COL. Frindell even had military intelligence operatives in New Orleans, spying on Mr. Oswald:

 

• CMDR David C. Reid (commander, Naval Criminal Investigative Service, 8th Naval District, Office of Naval Intelligence, New Orleans, Louisiana/ liaison, 112th Military Intelligence Group)

 

• John J. D'Angelo (Special Agent, US Air Force Office of Special Investigations, 9th District, New Orleans, Louisiana/ liaison, 112th Military Intelligence Group)

 

•  Harry G. Maynor (FBI, Special Agent In Charge, New Orleans, Louisiana/ liaison, 112th Military Intelligence Group)

 

And of course, Edward John Coyle (Head of Security Section, 112th Military Intelligence Group) was in the Sexton Building (AKA Texas School Book Depository), just minutes after the murder of President Kennedy, for still, to this day, unknown reasons...

 

Could you supply RIFs or book citations to back this info up? It's very interesting.

[Robert Montenegro]

21 minutes ago, Joseph Backes said:

Could you supply RIFs or book citations to back this info up? It's very interesting.

 

Here, knock yourself out:

https://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/review-board/barger-files.html

[Robert Montenegro]

36 minutes ago, Larry Hancock said:

Domestic operations did a good deal of work establishing domestic "covers" for foreign operations - which was actually one of Barnes' long time specialties and possibly the reason he was given the assignment.

 

Like covers for foreign mechanics, like, I don't know, maybe, Capt. Jean-René Marie Souètre, or  SS-Obersturmbannführer Otto Skorzeny, or perhaps stateless goons like Jean-Pierre Lafitte.

 

This is fun, roundabout logic and inference, woo-hoo! 

 

Edited July 10, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Joseph Backes]

17 minutes ago, Robert Montenegro said:

 

Here, knock yourself out:

https://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/review-board/barger-files.html

Did you go to Archives II and go through this material there yourself?  

[Tom Gram]

25 minutes ago, Joseph Backes said:

Could you supply RIFs or book citations to back this info up? It's very interesting.

I second this request. Here’s a 1962 112th report on a “Federal Agency” attempting to recruit Cuban Exiles in New Orleans for guerrilla activities, including Arnesto Rodriguez and Carlos Bringuier. 

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=232057#relPageId=3

The source said the agents were posing as National Guard members and took the exiles to an “Army camp” near the Industrial Canal. 

This report was forwarded to the FBI, and sent up the chain of command. The direct result of this report was the CIA getting the Justice Department to shut down any further FBI investigation of the CRC in New Orleans a few months later in July. 

Oswald of course met with Rodriguez and Bringuier and asked about training Cuban exiles. 

If you have any documents suggesting that Oswald was of interest to the 112th, or that they actually surveilled him, please share. 

I must admit I’m pretty skeptical. 

[Leslie Sharp]

37 minutes ago, Robert Montenegro said:

 

Like covers for foreign mechanics, like, I don't know, maybe, Capt. Jean-René Marie Souètre, or  SS-Obersturmbannführer Otto Skorzeny, or perhaps stateless goons like Jean-Pierre Lafitte.

 

This is fun, roundabout logic and inference, woo-hoo! 

 

@Robert Montenegro @Pat Speer @Larry Hancock In context of the details found in Hank's primary source for Coup in Dallas — the Lafitte datebook — to be crystal clear, Otto Skorzeny and Pierre Lafitte were not mechanics in the literal sense.

There is no evidence whatsoever that Otto Skorzeny was in Dallas in the lead up to or on the day of the assassination. Neither has it been established that his "arms and legs" Ilse Skorzeny was in Dallas on the day; we only know that she met with Reich banker Hjalmar Schacht and "T" at the Old Warsaw on November 7.

The prime candidate for "T" remains Tracey Barnes. We also know that Schacht had significant dealings with Dallas businessmen including Leo Corrigan (Ruby's landlord) and oilman Clint Murchison in the Bahamas.  We know that Ilse had met with General Charles Willoughby in NYC when the topic of Ella Rometsch was considered.

Lafitte (and possibly his wife Rene) checked into the Stoneleigh Hotel on or before November 20, as did La Cagoule sociopaths Alice Lamy, Jean Filiol and Gerhard Litt. We know that Jean Souetre, former OAS captain, was in Dallas on November 19 "to go overt with Jack C" and we know from Lafitte's November 23 entry, Jean's gone out) with the noteSilverthorne - Mex written above.  The Stoneleigh was/is a stone's throw from Ilse's Dallas cover office, Previews Inc. on Rawlins St. and the Old Warsaw in the Maple area of Oak Lawn. We have no evidence Lafitte appeared in Dealey on Friday, although a photo sleuth is in process of searching the possibility. 


It is for these reasons, and a number of other significant indications in Lafitte's records, we concluded that Lancelot Project did not fall within the formal military or intelligence structure being discussed here, nor did it require the elaborate machinations being posited.

Edited July 10, 2023 by Leslie Sharp

[Pat Speer]

1 hour ago, Gerry Down said:

As LHO was not a foreign national, it seems hard to see how LHO could have been at any stage the target of DOD operations. Sounds like DOD would have been more interested in Cubans, for example, coming in to the country.

No, the point is that he may have been working for the D.O.D. Not that they would have been spying on him.