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Craig Roberts: Kill Zone


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Besides duty as a Marine Vietnam sniper, Craig Roberts was a sniper and helicopter pilot

for the Tulsa police department SWAT team until retirement, and now teaches snipers.

I'd say that is pretty current expertise.

You fail to mention what is commonly called "buck fever", which Roberts discusses in

detail. Before Oswald fired his shots, HOW MANY HUMAN BEINGS HAD HE PREVIOUSLY

KILLED? Firing at paper targets is easy compared to having a person's head in the

crosshairs.

Jack

In his Army service, none

During his defection to the USSR, none

In New Orleans, None

In Dallas (in the space of 1 - 2 hours ALLEGEDLY) Two

Chris

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Guest Stephen Turner

We could as well ask the question, in a much more violent life than Oswalds, prior to murdering him, how many people did Jack Ruby kill?

As a numbers runner, none.

As a Union fixer/goon, none

As a gun runner to Cuba, none

As a Dallas night club owner, none

Plenty of pistol whippings, and fist fights granted, but no murders. Until that fatefull moment he decided to save Jackie from having to return to Dallas for Oswalds trial.

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Charlie & Chuck I agree.

IMO the alleged shooting feat is the key. I'm of the opinion that it was impossible.

In 43 years no test has come close to matching the alleged shooting feat.

I have read through most of Toms reply's on this subject and I still don't know what his opinion is on a lone shooter.

I have discussed the STB with Dave VP via 'E' mail I don't agree with his conclusions, however he explained his position to me clearly and I respect his opinion.

Tom any chance of a simple yes or no answer with regard to the lone gunman position?

Chris Brown.

YES!

It has been posted multiple times on this forum as well as elswhere.

1. There was only a LONE SHOOTER!

2. All shots originated from the sixth foor window of the TSDB!

3. All shots were fired from the 6.5mm Carcano rifle found on the sixth floor of the TSDB.

4. The WC is a lie/intentional misrepresenatation of the facts as relates to the shooting/shot sequencing.

5. The Z312/313 head shot, is/was/and will always remain the second shot in the shooting sequence.

6. LHO absolutely had the shooting ability to accomplish the shots.

7. The only "difficult" shot was the last shot, which was in fact a "snap-shot" which was fired virtually as rapiidly as the rifle can be operated. Call the hit luck, or just that the back of the target was almost flat, thus virtually insuring a hit somewhere, it was nevertheless a quick and good shot.

8. Of course, when one verifies the shooting ability of LHO, that will find that he consistently (from the beginning day of shooting) fired in the upper ranges of EXPERT when firing from the fixed/supported position.

And during the 200-yard rapid fire exercise as well as the 300-yard rapid fire exercise, his shooting abilility placed him as high as in the 98th percentile ranking, and in the average of the 95th percentile ranking.

And, this capability was demonstrated throughout his pre-qualification rangefire.

Lastly, anyone who has read the statements of Marina Oswald would recognize that she knows little about weapons, however she knew that LHO sat on the porch and practiced bolt operation of the rifle in his possession.

And in that regard, one does not practice rapid fire with a bolt action rifle unless they are under the assumption that it is, or will be a necessity.

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Charlie & Chuck I agree.

IMO the alleged shooting feat is the key. I'm of the opinion that it was impossible.

In 43 years no test has come close to matching the alleged shooting feat.

I have read through most of Toms reply's on this subject and I still don't know what his opinion is on a lone shooter.

I have discussed the STB with Dave VP via 'E' mail I don't agree with his conclusions, however he explained his position to me clearly and I respect his opinion.

Tom any chance of a simple yes or no answer with regard to the lone gunman position?

Chris Brown.

YES!

It has been posted multiple times on this forum as well as elswhere.

1. There was only a LONE SHOOTER!

2. All shots originated from the sixth foor window of the TSDB!

3. All shots were fired from the 6.5mm Carcano rifle found on the sixth floor of the TSDB.

4. The WC is a lie/intentional misrepresenatation of the facts as relates to the shooting/shot sequencing.

5. The Z312/313 head shot, is/was/and will always remain the second shot in the shooting sequence.

6. LHO absolutely had the shooting ability to accomplish the shots.

7. The only "difficult" shot was the last shot, which was in fact a "snap-shot" which was fired virtually as rapiidly as the rifle can be operated. Call the hit luck, or just that the back of the target was almost flat, thus virtually insuring a hit somewhere, it was nevertheless a quick and good shot.

8. Of course, when one verifies the shooting ability of LHO, that will find that he consistently (from the beginning day of shooting) fired in the upper ranges of EXPERT when firing from the fixed/supported position.

And during the 200-yard rapid fire exercise as well as the 300-yard rapid fire exercise, his shooting abilility placed him as high as in the 98th percentile ranking, and in the average of the 95th percentile ranking.

And, this capability was demonstrated throughout his pre-qualification rangefire.

Lastly, anyone who has read the statements of Marina Oswald would recognize that she knows little about weapons, however she knew that LHO sat on the porch and practiced bolt operation of the rifle in his possession.

And in that regard, one does not practice rapid fire with a bolt action rifle unless they are under the assumption that it is, or will be a necessity.

Thanks Tom,

A relatively short and to the point answer.

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Tom

You should be ashamed of yourself with that last post...at least on THIS forum !

Nearly everyone on this forum knows of the absolutely preposterous string of lies which Marina told and are now acknowledged to be "lies" even by herself.

Yet you expect everyone to believe "HER REAL TRUTH" that Lee sat on the front porch and practiced with

the bolt operation which made him an acknowleged

"MASTER OF THE CARCANO" !

It is getting higher and deeper. A shovel wont get you out of this.....you will need a "John Deere" !

AS I spent a great deal of time in both New Orleans and Dallas in the 1960's, don't launch one of your dissertations regarding "customs in the "Old South" in which nearly every true Confederate made a practice of operating the bolt action of a military rifle in a city neighborhood. It ain't so!

I was also born and bred in the "Old South"......

and this "just ain't so" !

As I certainly can't afford to purchase a John Deere at the moment, I am going to have to depart this thread before I drown in your posts.

Charlie Black

Charlie black

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Though this is a "Double Post", I am intentionally not erasing it. I want Tom to read it "twice" !

You should be ashamed of yourself with that last post...at least on THIS forum !

Nearly everyone on this forum knows of the absolutely preposterous string of lies which Marina told and are now acknowledged to be "lies" even by herself.

Yet you expect everyone to believe "HER REAL TRUTH" that Lee sat on the front porch and practiced with

the bolt operation which made him an acknowleged

"MASTER OF THE CARCANO" !

It is getting higher and deeper. A shovel wont get you out of this.....you will need a "John Deere" !

AS I spent a great deal of time in both New Orleans and Dallas in the 1960's, don't launch one of your dissertations regarding "customs in the "Old South" in which nearly every true Confederate made a practice of operating the bolt action of a military rifle in a city neighborhood. It ain't so!

I was also born and bred in the "Old South"......

and this "just ain't so" !

As I certainly can't afford to purchase a John Deere at the moment, I am going to have to depart this thread before I drown in your posts.

Charlie Black

Charlie black

Edited by Charles Black
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Though this is a "Double Post", I am intentionally not erasing it. I want Tom to read it "twice" !

You should be ashamed of yourself with that last post...at least on THIS forum !

Nearly everyone on this forum knows of the absolutely preposterous string of lies which Marina told and are now acknowledged to be "lies" even by herself.

Yet you expect everyone to believe "HER REAL TRUTH" that Lee sat on the front porch and practiced with

the bolt operation which made him an acknowleged

"MASTER OF THE CARCANO" !

It is getting higher and deeper. A shovel wont get you out of this.....you will need a "John Deere" !

AS I spent a great deal of time in both New Orleans and Dallas in the 1960's, don't launch one of your dissertations regarding "customs in the "Old South" in which nearly every true Confederate made a practice of operating the bolt action of a military rifle in a city neighborhood. It ain't so!

I was also born and bred in the "Old South"......

and this "just ain't so" !

As I certainly can't afford to purchase a John Deere at the moment, I am going to have to depart this thread before I drown in your posts.

Charlie Black

Charlie black

In your absence, might I recommend a visit to the "fact zone".

So, let me again repeat:

Failure to understand the facts has no bearing on the validity of the facts.

It merely means that one does not understand the facts!

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Tom,

Okay, cool- you've answered some of my questions. Now, please, in brief but clear language, explain how Oswald was the lone assassin, shooting from where the Warren Commission said he did, with the ridiculous weapon they claim he used, yet the Warren Report was a lie? From what I can determine so far, your main contention with the Warren Report is their insistence that the head shot was the third shot. I really don't understand how being wrong about that, but right about the obvious lone assassin fairy tale, makes their report a fraud. Please tell us what the government has been bothering to coverup, if all the shots were fired by Oswald?

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Tom,

Okay, cool- you've answered some of my questions. Now, please, in brief but clear language, explain how Oswald was the lone assassin, shooting from where the Warren Commission said he did, with the ridiculous weapon they claim he used, yet the Warren Report was a lie? From what I can determine so far, your main contention with the Warren Report is their insistence that the head shot was the third shot. I really don't understand how being wrong about that, but right about the obvious lone assassin fairy tale, makes their report a fraud. Please tell us what the government has been bothering to coverup, if all the shots were fired by Oswald?

_____________________________

Don,

Excellent question! Hopefully Tom will answer soon in an equally well-written and understandable way.

--Thomas

____________________________

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Tom,

Okay, cool- you've answered some of my questions. Now, please, in brief but clear language, explain how Oswald was the lone assassin, shooting from where the Warren Commission said he did, with the ridiculous weapon they claim he used, yet the Warren Report was a lie? From what I can determine so far, your main contention with the Warren Report is their insistence that the head shot was the third shot. I really don't understand how being wrong about that, but right about the obvious lone assassin fairy tale, makes their report a fraud. Please tell us what the government has been bothering to coverup, if all the shots were fired by Oswald?

_____________________________

Don,

Excellent question! Hopefully Tom will answer soon in an equally well-written and understandable way.

--Thomas

____________________________

The primary reason has been stated here numerous times.

However, in event that one can not figure out my simple little word games, then they stand little or no chance of resolving the WC's masterful labyrinth.

Besides that!

with the ridiculous weapon they claim he used

When one clearly demonstrates that they know so little that they make such statements such as the above, there is little use in attempting to explain or even point them into the direction where they may actually find some facts.

Have a nice 40-more years!

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Tom

Another very ugly bail out. I thought you were "all the way" !

I have never seen anyone that could post so many words with so little meaning.

You keep making reference that the forum must be retarded if we think that what you call "word games" is just beyond our comprehension.

Have you ever considered that most here are not in search of word games and inner meanings. It takes time to read some of your voluminous posts, that at the end of which, we are required to guess at your meaning......if in fact there is any meaning.

If you don't have anything to say that the majority

of forum members can comprehend, perhaps you should find a forum that requires membership of only the intelligentsia.

Perhaps you just love to type and missed your life's calling !

Charlie Black

Perhaps you should be in the Guiness record for the most recorded "bail outs". Or you might consider another hobby, before you get a "streamer"!

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Tom

Another very ugly bail out. I thought you were "all the way" !

I have never seen anyone that could post so many words with so little meaning.

You keep making reference that the forum must be retarded if we think that what you call "word games" is just beyond our comprehension.

Have you ever considered that most here are not in search of word games and inner meanings. It takes time to read some of your voluminous posts, that at the end of which, we are required to guess at your meaning......if in fact there is any meaning.

If you don't have anything to say that the majority

of forum members can comprehend, perhaps you should find a forum that requires membership of only the intelligentsia.

Perhaps you just love to type and missed your life's calling !

Charlie Black

Perhaps you should be in the Guiness record for the most recorded "bail outs". Or you might consider another hobby, before you get a "streamer"!

Or perhaps I just tire of informing of something and yet those who apparantly have no understanding of the answer either refuse to accept it or do not comprehend it.

you should find a forum that requires membership of only the intelligentsia.

I was lead to believe that this forum was "above" the non-factual level of discussions and compehensions which has permeated and contaminated the other forums.

That it utilized such terms as "Educational", mislead me to believe that most here would have done their homework prior to coming to class, and would have thus been far and above the level of discussion of items which were long ago either resolved, or easily resolved through sufficient and adequate research on one's on.

You keep making reference that the forum must be retarded if we think that what you call "word games" is just beyond our comprehension.

Nope! Just certain individuals!

There are certainly individuals here who know and are applying the proper methods of research for problem resolution, and although no doubt "contaminated" in mind due to some association, I have no doubt that they have the capabilities to overcome even the contamination in the progress of their research.

Others, I fully expect to remain "lost" for another 40 years.

Please be my guest to "not read"!

Considering the level of learning you appear to have achieved to date, any further effort would appear to be a waste of time on your part as well as mine.

"Stupid is as stupid does"

(Forest Gump)

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Hello Tom

I appreciate your comment which invites me to "not read your posts". I, even with my intellectual shortcomings, somehow managed to figure this out for myself, years ago on another forum.

However, since we unfortunately are both interested it seems, in very similar forum topics, I have chosen not to do this, as I am interested in what is usually some very good input of other forum members. I cannot engage in these threads and simply disregard "your" input, because of the number of posts which you seem to try to force into each thread, which usually are meant to either challenge a response, or by lack of such challenge seem, thru passivity, to accept your ramblings as fact. This in itself isn't particularly bad within itself, but it gives members who are not as conversant with this subject, as are many of the others on this forum, an implication that the more informed members are "in agreement" with some of your decoded "word game" theories, when in fact they not only are not, but are really unsure of what you are attempting to put forth.

So Tom....it appears that I am as stuck to you as flypaper !

Charlie Black

Edited by Charles Black
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Guest Stephen Turner
Hello Tom

I appreciate your comment which invites me to "not read your posts". I, even with my intellectual shortcomings, somehow managed to figure this out for myself, years ago on another forum.

However, since we unfortunately are both interested it seems, in very similar forum topics, I have chosen not to do this, as I am interested in what is usually some very good input of other forum members. I cannot engage in these threads and simply disregard "your" input, because of the number of posts which you seem to try to force into each thread, which usually are meant to either challenge a response, or by lack of such challenge seem, thru passivity, to accept your ramblings as fact. This in itself isn't particularly bad within itself, but it gives members who are not as conversant with this subject, as are many of the others on this forum, an implication that the more informed members are "in agreement" with some of your decoded "word game" theories, when in fact they not only are not, but are really unsure of what you are attempting to put forth.

So Tom....it appears that I am as stuck to you as flypaper !

Charlie Black

Over two thousand, three hundred posts, in well under two years, and all on this one subject, enough material to fill several books, and yet still we await the final report, and are expected to wade knee deep through "little word games" For gawds sake man come to the point. If indeed you have one...Steve.

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Cousin Jethro is an enigma. He claims to believe in the LHO LONE GUNMAN myth, yet

he believes the WC was a coverup and the Zfilm is altered. He believes he is the sole

owner of certain "evidence". He believes he is the sole authority on anything related

to guns and ballistics. He seems to spend an inordinate amout of time on the internet

but is not in the mold of the obvious provocateurs. His writings ramble and are

repititious, repeating the exact same things endlessly. I usually read none of his

messages, because I know I have heard it all before. Strange.

Jack

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