David Josephs

On ‎1‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 11:24 AM, Jeff Carter said:

While yes the Chicago Secret Service write that the alleged Hidell money order was found in Kansas City, they are mistaken and seem to have associated the confirmation a money order had been located with their knowledge the search for the money order was taking place in Kansas City. The alleged money order was instead found in Washington. But the Chicago report does confirm that most everyone thought it would be located in Kansas City. John Armstrong was right to point that out.

Here is the report by the Secret Service in Washington, which covers that side of the story. 
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10490#relPageId=118&tab=page

Curiously, Holmes is not mentioned. The liaison in Texas, who supplied the money order information and requested the search, is said to be Postal Inspector Stevens from the Fort Worth Postal Inspection Service. Was Holmes' “boss” the inspector in Fort Worth, not in Washington?

Holmes was not involved at all with the PMO... his story of the finding of the stub has never been challenged or corroborated by anyone or anything.

I took the report Jeff links to - as well as all the other source material - and compiled a timeline of the FBI/SS/USPS reports

Since I have been so close to it for so long, please feel free to identify any conflicts within this timeline...   I disagree with you Jeff about the mentioning of it in Kansas being a mistake...

I color coded things to try and keep them straight...

DJ

11 minutes ago, Rick McTague said:

I'm curious just how LHO could have used his pistol to shoot Officer Tippet since the pistol wouldn't fire in the theater - it had a defective firing pin.

Good point... 

or the fact Markham says 1:07

or that he came from the EAST and not the WEST

or that it's more than 10 minutes from N Beckley to 10th and Patton

or the pistol has two different chains of possession and custody

or the Seaport documentation is pure BS

or that REA has no records of the shipment, the pick-up or collection of the shipping amount...

or that witnesses see another police car and 2 more policemen watching the shooting (there were 2 policemen in the car E. Roberts remembers honking its horn)

or that there is no way to connect a bullet to its hull

or that HILL and one other claim the weapon was a .38 automatic

or that Oswald never bought ammo

and that the pistol in evidence is the same type used by most everyone at the Dallas Police Dept. as is the ammo...

But he was shot from the front Chris....

And there were people between your shooter and JFK... if you're talking just past the pole.

??  

On ‎1‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 10:40 AM, Steve Thomas said:

Three in the magical mystery cigarette package, and two found by the Davis sisters? Three of one brand and two of another? Speculation was that one shot missed.

It seems that THREE is only mentioned that one time by HILL...  except... Rose shows 4 shots entering the body... Shot #5 hit a button and was found in the ambulance if I remember correctly.

  "There are four entrance types of wounds.  No. 1 is 4 3/4  inches from the top of the head and 3 3/4 inches to the right  of the midline.  This measures 3/ x 1/4 inch and is surrounded by a contusion ring.  No powder tattooing is noted at the margins.

"Wound No. 2 is 17 inches from the top of the head on the right chest.  It is 4 inches to the right of the midline, above and slightly medial to the right nipple.  It measures 3/8 x 1/4 of an inch, surrounded by bruising.  There is also a contusion ring.

 "Wound No. 3 is 21 inches from the top of the head, along the anterior lateral side of the right chest and is 6 inches to the right of the midline.  This measures 5/16 x 1/4 of an inch and is surrounded by a contusion ring.

   "Wound No. 4 on the left chest is 20-1/2 inches from the top of the head, 1-1/4 inches to the left of the midline.  The wound measures 3/4 x 3/8 of an inch, is transverse and surrounding this is a 1/4 x 3/4 inch abrasion.

So a couple things about this CSSS....

Testimony shows all those who handled the pistol after supposedly taken from Oswald at the Theater, say it was fully loaded.  This says there were only 4 of the 6 chambers filled.

Mr. HILL. Then I broke the gun open to see how many shells it contained and how many live rounds it had in it. 
Mr. BELIN. How many did you find? 
Mr. HILL. There were six in the chambers of the gun.

While 2 days earlier BARNES gives KELLEY 2 more live .38 rounds yet there is no other notation as to how they are connected and the 11-28 report does not state where the other 2 live .38 shells went...  

Why would KELLEY get 2 then Drain get the other 4 2 days later??

---

The "4 Hulls" relate to the "at the scene" shells supposedly found.... does indeed miss one Steve  There should have been 5 shells...

Mr. BELIN - How many shots did you hear all told?
Mr. BENAVIDES - I heard three shots.

Mr. BELIN. How many shots did you hear?
Mr. SCOGGINS. Three or four, in the neighborhood. They was fast.
Mr. BELIN. They were fast shots?
Mr. SCOGGINS. Yes; they were fast.

ELBERT AUSTIN, 8317 Fourth Avenue, Dallas, advised that on the afternoon of November 22, 1963, he was working on a construction job at the intersection of Tenth and Denver Street, Dallas, Texas. He advised he was a brick mason's helper and was assisting in the construction of an apartment house. Me stated sometime after 1:00 PM he was on a scaffold in front of the aforementioned apartment house when he heard approximately two or three shots

JIMMY EARL BURT, General Delivery stated that on November 22, 1963 he was living at 505 E. 10th Street, Dallas, Texas which is the residence of his father—in—law, DAVID SHAEFER. He and a friend WILLIAM SMITH were sitting in his brother, BILLY BURT's house located at the corner of 9th and Denver Streets, Dallas. It was some time after lunch when they heard two gunshots. He and SMITH immediately ran from the house toward his car, a 1952 two—tone blue Ford which was parked facing south on Denver Street. As they ran from the house they heard four more shots making a total of six.

Mr. BALL. What did you hear at that time?
Mr. CALLAWAY. I heard what sounded to me like five pistol shots.
Mr. BALL. Five pistol shots?
Mr. CALLAWAY. Five shots, yes, sir.

FRANK CIMINO, 403 East Tenth Street, Apartment 7, Dallas, Texas, advised that on November 22, 1963, he was residing in an apartment at 405 East Tenth Street. He Stated that at around 1 p.m. he was at his apartment listening to the radio. He heard four loud noises which sounded like shots and then he heard a women scream

The officer was lying on his side with his head in front of the left front head light of his car. His gun was out of the holster and lying by his side 

Mr. DULLES. Plural? How many did you hear?
Mrs. DAVIS. Just two, they were pretty close together. (both sisters say the same thing)

Mr. BALL. How many?
Mr. GUINYARD. I heard three.

FRANCIS KINNETH, 1425 Caidwell, Dallas, Texas, advised he was employed on a construction job at the intersection of Denver and Tenth Street, Dallas, on the afternoon of November 22, 1963. He advised at approximately 1:00 PM he had heard approximately two or three shots 

L. J. LEWIS, 7616 Hums, Pleasant Grove, Texas, advised he is presently self-employed as a wholesale car dealer. LEWIS advised that on the afternoon of November 22, 1963, he was on the used car lot of Johnny Reynolds Used Cars together with HAROLD RUSSELL and PAT PATTERSON, during which time they heard approximately three or four gun shots coming from the vicinity of Tenth and Patton Avenue, Dallas, Texas 

Mr. LIEBELER. How many shots did you hear?
Mr.REYNOLDS. I really have no idea, to be honest with you. I would say four or five or six. I just would have no idea.

Mr. JACK RAY TATUM :  I heard three shots in rapid (illegible)I went right through the intersection, stopped my car and turned to look back. I then saw the officer lying on the street and saw this young white man standing near the front of the squad car. Next. this man with a gun in his hand ran toward the back of the squad car, but instead of running away he stepped into the street and shot the police officer who was lying in the street.

Thanks Jeff...

My confidence level of the "evidence" from that weekend related to Zfilm statements and affidavits is extremely low. 

The 48fps point is simply to illustrate a process that did not require matte work...  just the removal and re-filming of the pieced together final film which allows for the edge printing between sprocket holes to work just fine.

This is where I place the changeover to 48fps:   Frame #1 shows the expected light bleed...  Frame #133 should be similar or at least not look exactly like #135 2 frames later.

I see that the wide turn onto Elm and the switchover to 48fps was accomplished for very specific reasons.  I've posted this composite image a number of times...

Position A is accepted as a location the limo drove thru on its way to z133...  it took over 80 frames from the motorcycle cop - in the bottom image - to make that wide turn.

We see him disappear to the left of Elm looking up the street and then emerges in the exact same position as the limo in Position A.

How does the limo and motorcade get from the turn onto Elm, thru Position A and then to Z133 ?

Mr. SHANEYFELT. Station C is on a line drawn along the west curb line of Houston Street in a direct line, and station C is at a point along that line that is in line with where the car would have turned coming around that corner. It is on a line which is an extension of the west curb line of Houston Street.
Mr. DULLES. Where is position A on that chart?
Mr. SHANEYFELT. Position A is here.
Mr. McCLOY. That is before you get to the tree?
Mr. SHANEYFELT. Yes; he isn't under the tree yet.
Mr. SPECTER. And what occupant, if any, in the car is position A sighted on for measuring purposes?
Mr. SHANEYFELT. All of the photographs made through the rifle sight that are shown on the exhibit in the lower left-hand corner were sighted on the spot that was simulating the spot where the President was wounded in the neck. The chalk mark is on the back of the coat.
Mr. SPECTER. When you say that position A is the first position at which President Kennedy was in view of the marksman from the southeast window on the sixth floor of the School Book Depository Building, you mean by that the first position where the marksman saw the rear of the President's stand-in?
Mr. SHANEYFELT. That is correct.

Now, of course that is an absurd and incorrect statement.  Roll the limo back a foot and the mark is still easily seen...  Worse yet, Shaneyfelt's testimony reinforces that all the measurements are to the STAND-IN and not to where JFK would have been

Mr. SPECTER. Will you now read the statistical data from that exhibit?
Mr. SHANEYFELT. Yes. Distance from the chalk mark on the back of the stand-in for the President to the station C is 136.6
Distance to rifle in the window is 174.9 feet. The angle to the rifle in the window based on the horizontal is 21b050. The distance to the overpass is 350.9 feet, and the angle to the overpass is 0b012'.  This is on frame 207, Commission Exhibit No. 892.

CE884 - the final evidence...  Frame 207 for JFK has the same info as the stand-in...   174.9' from Rifle to chalkmark.

Mr. SHANEYFELT. That is frame 210 and has been marked as Commission Exhibit No. 893 and represents the 10-inch adjustment for the difference in the height of the car as compared with frame 207.

and here he gives it all away....  the rise/run on Elm is 1'/18.3'.   A 10" drop in vertical height equates to 10"/12" = x/18.3'.   x = 18.3' * .833333 = 15.25'

For Shaneyfelt to make the correct adjustments for the stand-in and the height of the re-creation limo everything must move down Elm 15 feet.  Of course that change makes everything related to frame numbers and distances completely worthless....

Again... it is my theory that the film which Max Phillips sent to Chief Rowley was the in camera original, making its way to Hawkeyeworks on Saturday prior to the 10pm delivery to Dino at the NPIC.  The film was further cleansed for Homer on Sunday...  

The underlying contention here is that the DPD replaced the evidence related to Tippit with the correct pistol and shells...  a modified .38 used by the majority of policemen in the US at the time.

The excess shells attributed to Oswald - and supposedly found hours later in his pockets - carry the tell-tale signs of having been stored in a gun belt...

Something Oswald did not have along with a box of ammo, any evidence he ever purchased ammo or there was ever a pistol and ammo in his possession.

Benavides adds another tidbit which point away from our man Ozzie

On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 9:03 PM, Jeff Carter said:

If the Zapruder camera was shifted from RUN to SLOW MOTION during the assassination sequence, the transition from 16fps to 48fps would not have been immediate but ramped (gradual). 

As I understood it Jeff...  the switch is immediate...  and if you add up the time and amount of film... there would have been no need to run off 19' of film to end the roll, at 48fps over 1274 frames of side B would have been used.  divide by 48/18.3 = 2.623 and you get 486 frames.  

12 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

Is he maybe lying somewhere in this?

ya think?

This subject - like so many - ought to be put to rest...  The man never had CE-139 in his possession.  C2766 cannot be proven to have ever been removed from Harborside Storage.  Worse yet... Feldsott tells us the shipment with C2766 was in June 1962...  The evidence shows the first retrieval of rifles from THAT order which included C2766 was not until August 1962...

The FBI reports mention 2 other orders with rifles with serial numbers that are close June 18 '62 and March 27 '63... yet there is no record of those order ever coming to Kleins.

The famous TS to FC rifle order change comes in April 62 yet is not delivered until Feb 63? 

So where is the documentation for these two orders?  (btw, Century Arms sends a "2766" to Vermont in June 1962....

Rupp is the only person in this story who sends “Crescent-to-Klein’s” order info to Feldsott in NYC after shipment.  For Feldsott to have order info for a June 18, 1962 shipment, Rupp or some other rifle dealer needs to have completed an order and sent it to Klein’s.  Rupp offers no such evidence while the Century Arms to Empire Wholesale Sporting goods order of June 29, 1962 had a “2766” Carcano in the shipment.  Amazingly none of the 1300 rifles sent from Canada have the letter prefix – whether this is “C”2766 cannot be known.

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=11277&search=&tab=page#relPageId=2&tab=page

Mr. JENNER - Does your recollection serve you that anybody standing in the courtyard and dry-sighting a rifle would be visible to people who just happened by, or who would be looking out a window on the south side of Magazine Street, or in the home or in the dwelling house to the east of the courtyard?
Mrs. PAINE - He would have been very visible. Would have collected a clutch of small boys.
Mr. JENNER - This was a neighborhood, then, in which there were small children?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes.

And as you mention about the suggestive testimonies:

Mr. PAINE - And that is why I think they asked me, it may have been as early as that, whether it was a rifle, "Do you think it could have been a rifle?" I don't remember how it was posed, but I probably answered when it was suggested, it was a rifle, and there they suggested it was a rifle, because they had already learned from Marina that he had had a rifle, and it had been, perhaps, had learned it had been in that blanket.

Mr. PAINE - My impression was that they asked me if I knew what was in this blanket, or he asked me, and then he asked me if it could be a rifle, and I probably responded, yes. It didn't take long once the rifle was suggested as the object to fit this puzzle together, this puzzle of the pieces that 1 had been trying to assemble in the package.

How many times does Ruth say "No"  ?

Mr. JENNER - It was in the open so you could see what went into your car?
Mrs. PAINE - I think so. I certainly then repacked it to go to New Orleans.
Mr. JENNER - Well, I want to stick with this occasion, please.
Mrs. PAINE - All right.
Mr. JENNER - Was there a rifle packed in the back of the car?
Mrs. PAINE - No.
Mr. JENNER - You didn't see any kind of weapon?
Mrs. PAINE - No.
Mr. JENNER - Firearm, rifle, pistol, or otherwise?
Mrs. PAINE - No; I saw nothing of that nature.
Mr. JENNER - Did you drive them to your home?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes.
Mr. JENNER - Were the materials and things in your station wagon unpacked and placed in your home?
Mrs. PAINE - Yes; immediately.
Mr. JENNER - Did you see that being done, were you present?
Mrs. PAINE - I helped do it; yes.
Mr. JENNER - Did you see any weapon on that occasion?
Mrs. PAINE - No.
Mr. JENNER - Whether a rifle, pistol or--
Mrs. PAINE - No.
Mr. JENNER - Or any covering, any package, that looked as though it might have a weapon, pistol, or firearm?
Mrs. PAINE - No.

Mr. JENNER - Yes, I am interested, and I would like to stick with the duffel-bags for a moment. Was there any appearance as to either duffelbag, which, to you, would indicate some long, slim, hard----
Mrs. PAINE - I assume them to be both full of clothes, very rounded.
Mr. JENNER - I 'don't wish to be persistent, but was there anything that you saw about the duffelbags that lead you at that time to even think for an instant that there was anything long, slim and hard like a pole?
Mrs. PAINE - No.
Mr. JENNER - Or a gun, a rifle?
Mrs. PAINE - No.

Representative BOGGS - Did you see the rifle that he had in the room in your home?
Mrs. PAINE - In the garage, no.
Representative BOGGS - In the garage, you never saw one?
Mrs. PAINE - I never saw that rifle at all until the police showed it to me in the station on the 22d of November.

==============   How about Mikey?  (The man supposedly has photos taken holding the rifle and pistol yet declines to share his little toy with anyone?  If those photos were really taken in March with a copy given to George... is it realistic to accept that no one where the rifle was stored would even be aware it exists?

Mr. LIEBELER - Did you ever observe or hear prior to the assassination that Lee Oswald had been practicing with a rifle?
Mr. PAINE - No, I didn't know prior to the assassination, we didn't know he had a rifle. I had supposed from my conversation with him back on Neely Street that he would like to have a rifle but I didn't gather that he did.
Mr. LIEBELER - Aside from whether or not you knew that he had a rifle, did you ever hear or observe him practicing with a rifle?
Mr. PAINE - No, I did not.

12 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

I know this is outlandish speculation but it is possible that Reid, Baker and Truly were "coached" regarding the official story that had (been) developed.  The evidence indicates that the official story was incorrect.

Kinda like Bledsoe and the bus trip

Not outlandish at all...    Bledsoe could never tell us about Oswald's ARREST shirt (with the torn buttons and torn elbow) before he had gone home and changed.
I don't see that Oswald was on that bus (McWatters even denies it was Oswald) but he had to be for the scenario to work...

Bledsoe, like so many other witnesses if you read thru the testimony, was led into the directions needed.  As were Truly and Baker regarding the lunchroom encounter.

=====

{sigh}

This is not like any other case... the Evidence IS the Conspiracy, not indicative of the initial crime...

Besides...  let's look at what it would take for Oswald to have been in that window at the right time with a rifle ready to fire:  https://kennedysandking.com/john-f-kennedy-articles/oswald-on-november-22-1963

Cheers

DJ

On ‎12‎/‎13‎/‎2017 at 1:34 PM, James DiEugenio said:

Since Baker was confused about this point all the way to September, and I don't think Truly mentioned it in his testimony, when was the first appearance of the Coke Oswald allegedly was drinking on the second floor?

Did it come from the Fritz notes?

(edit) Sorry... you're right about the Coke being in Fritz's notes... but when exactly where they written?

"Claims 2nd floor Coke when
off came in"

=================

Truly, Baker and Reid testify to the WC on the same day, one after the other... March 25th.

The first appearance seems to be Mrs. Reid's testimony.... and then Baker's recant from Sept

Mr. DULLES. Did he have a coke? 
Mr. TRULY. No, sir. 
Mr. DULLES. No drink? 
Mr. TRULY. No drink at all. Just standing there. 

Mr. BELIN - All right. I see a coke machine off on the left. When you saw Oswald after you got to this doorway inside the lunchroom, had he gone as far as the coke machine?
Mr. BAKER - I didn't notice the coke machine or any item in the room there All I was looking at was the man, and he seemed to be approximately 20 feet down there from me.

When Baker rewrites his statement the day before the WCR is delivered, the man in the lunchroom was already drinking a coke...  Baker can't even get his rewrite correct... and must change what he wrote to jive with the story.

Mrs. REID. Well, I kept walking and I looked up and Oswald was coming in the back door of the office. I met him by the time I passed my desk several feet and I told him, I said, "Oh, the President has been shot, but maybe they didn't hit him." 
He mumbled something to me, I kept walking, he did, too. I didn't pay any attention to what he said because I had no thoughts of anything of him having any connection with it at all because he was very calm. He had gotten a coke and was holding it in his hands and I guess the reason it impressed me seeing him in there I thought it was a little strange that one of -the warehouse boys would be up in the office at the time, not that he had done anything wrong. The only time I had seen him in the office was to come and get change and he already had his coke in his hand so he didn't come for change and I dismissed him. I didn't think anything else. 

On ‎1‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 8:41 AM, James DiEugenio said:

David:

That's something I was not aware of: Holmes never brought the stub or the booklet to his interviews?  

And the WC never asked him for either?

Was it not Belin who was in charge of this aspect?

Like the Baker Affidavit... it was simply ignored.   And once the PMO was in their possession - real or not; authentic or not didn't matter....

Holmes is performing all this SATURDAY MORNING...  yet the information relayed to SAIC Gaiglein who is with Harold Marks and other "employees" of the Facility to retrieve the PMO.

It's not until 8:30 PM that the process of finding the original - or a copy - even begins...  yet by noon that morning, Holmes claims he located the STUB still attached to the BOOK by using the TOTAL AMOUNT of the PMO as determined by Homes' bad addition...(Note: shipping was $1.50 for a total of $19.95 + $1.50 = $21.45... Holmes is even offering the wrong shipping amount yet still arrives at the correct total?)

Between noon and 10pm... nothing appears to have been happening related to the PMO...  or was it?  supposedly, it was ultimately produced at a Postal Center in VA

"Further Chicago investigation shows that the money
order involved has been recovered by Postal Inspec-
tos in Kansas City and forwarded the Assistant
Chief's Office of this Service"  (2nd paragraph Synposis)

"Holmes' notes from 11-22"  

“Now you thumb through those,” I said, “and when you come to Klein’s Sporting Goods, let’s see what it looks like.”     
It wasn’t but a couple of minutes that one of the girls hollered, “Here it is!” So I looked at it and down at the bottom of the ad it said that that particular rifle was such and such amount. But if it could not be carried on a person, such as a pistol, like a shotgun or a rifle, then it was $1.25 or $1.37 extra. Shipping charges were also added, so I added those together, took that figure and called around to all the different stations and the main office where these crews were checking stubs.         
It wasn’t ten minutes that they hollered, “Eureka!” They had the stub!        (this would have been the far right stub with the # , $amount , and date stamp.)
I called it in immediately to the chief on the open line to Washington and said, “I’ve got the money order number that Oswald used to buy this gun, and according to the records up there, they had shipped it to this box that he had rented at the main office in Dallas at that time, which he later closed and opened another at the Terminal Annex because it was closer to the School Book Depository.”

WCR Testimony:
Mr. HOLMES. So in about an hour Postal Inspector McGee of Chicago called back then and said that the correct amount was $21.95---$21.45 excuse me, and that the shipping---they had received this money order on March the 13th, whereas I had been looking for March 20.
So then I passed the information to the men who were looking for this money order stub to show which would designate, which would show the number of the money order, and that is the only way you could find one.
I relayed this information to them and told them to start on the 13th because he could have bought it that morning and that he could have gotten it by airmail that afternoon, so they began to search and within 10 minutes they called back and said they had a money order in that amount issued on, I don't know that I show, but it was that money order in an amount issued at the main post office, which is the same place as this post office box was at that time, box 2915 and the money order had been issued early on the morning of March the 12th, 1963.

Mr. BELIN. All right. Now, you found this postal money order and then what did you do?

Mr. HOLMES. I gave that information to my boss by telephone. He called Washington immediately. Of course this information included the money order number

Mr. BELIN. Anything else now about this money order? Do you have a record of the number of the money order?
Mr. HOLMES. No; I don't.

A mockup. Yes

What Bugs and others dislike is when more evidence which should corroborate, should authentic... Proves the original evidence is as they say in france, merde.  

... Self-corroborating circular evidence which conflicts with standard procedures needs close examination... Whenever evidence is minimized by the likes

Of Bugs et al...  You know they prefer you not look behind the curtain....   Oz must remain elusive.  The rifle evidence is fraught with problems

Just ask Michael Scibor...

23 minutes ago, Michael Walton said:

Questions:

I read Oswald was a pack rat and kept everything. Was the purchaser's stub (I'm assuming that would have been given to him) ever found in his possessions (Paine garage, etc)?

Also because of his alleged pack rat status, was the cardboard box that the rifle was shipped in ever found in his possessions?

No on both accounts.

There was no money order or rifle order prior to 11.22.  I cover it all at K&K

On ‎1‎/‎20‎/‎2018 at 8:28 PM, Ron Bulman said:

Oswald Didn't Order A Rifle.  That's why no one in the Post Office said he picked it up over the counter with the notice in his post office box, Because the Rifle Wouldn't Fit In The Box.  It didn't happen.  It's been argued to death previously here and elsewhere.  The Warren Omission story of it has fallen apart.  David is putting further nails in the coffin of this unproven lone nut Theory. 

The evidence shows the postal money order being found 4 different times in 3 different places....

Holmes' story is pure fantasy...   The found the stub in the money order book... But no stub or book is offered....

Before tearing it should have looked like this.... The stub at the right, in the book of other money orders is proof... Holmes claims are not authentic

17 hours ago, Steve Thomas said:

David,

 

Does anybody know if Kleins shipped their rifles disassembled or not? If it was broken down, it might not have been 5' long, but surely the package would have been clearly marked, wouldn't it?

 

Steve Thomas

Mr. WALDMAN. Our catalog No. C20-T750, which was the number indicated on the coupon prepared by A. Hidell, designates a rifle with scope attached. And we would have so shipped it unless the customer specifically specified that he did not wish to have it attached. There is nothing in our records to indicate that there was any request made by the customer, and therefore we would have every reason to believe that it was shipped as a rifle with scope-mounted. 
Mr. BELIN. Do you know whether or not the rifle would have been broken down in shipment or whether or not it would have been shipped fully assembled? 

Mr. WALDMAN. It was customary for us to ship these rifles with scopes attached in a corrugated cardboard carton made for us by the Rudd Container Corporation of Chicago. 
Mr. BELIN. About how long would that carton be in size, if you know? 
Mr. WALDMAN. Approximately 60 inches. 
Mr. BELIN. Did you ever furnish any samples of this carton or any wrapping paper or tape to the FBI? 
Mr. WALDMAN. Yes; we did furnish a sample of the carton together with the type of sealing tape that was generally used and such craft paper that may have been used for inner cushioning packing.

Really great work there Steve....

I'm trying to make the point that the FBI had informants telling them about Oswald's postal situations

CI NO T-1 is giving us info in July '63 about where he lives, where he gets his mail and subsequently in this same report it talks of mail and its contents to and from the FPCC...

And here not 3 weeks after supposedly receiving said rifle we are told again of mail to and from FPCC.  As we can see, Confidential Informants were talking about Oswald not long after returning from Russia in June 1962.

There are no reports of a rifle prior to Nov 22 since there was no rifle ordered or sent to Oswald prior to Nov 22 or ever.

#43 is dated Aug 1962   #44 is dated March 25th and talks about what he receives in the mail.  #45 is dated August 9 and is related to his arrest in New Orleans

First - it's hard to believe that there was nothing between Aug 16, '62 and March 25 '63 and then again until Aug 9 '63.
Second - by March 25 or a few days after GPO Dallas receives the rifle, supposedly puts a postcard into Oswald's box (doesn't exist) for him to pick up the package (not remembered by anyone).  

Just now, David Von Pein said:

But it must be a much bigger bitch for you CTers, seeing as how you guys have absolutely no physical evidence of any conspiracy whatsoever. That must really suck. (God bless you.)

 

Seems you've missed you meds again today Dave....

The Evidence only shows a conspiracy... that's where your house of cards blows away. 

Everything you cite as supporting evidence standing all by itself is rendered moot once you try and Authenticate the evidence... (look it up)

Without Authentication, what you and the WCR offer is worthless.  WITH authentication we find the evidence only illuminates the conspiracy to kill JFK and pin the blame on a patsy.

Kinda simple if you're not blind

No worries Ron....  lol

5 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

Life's a real bitch sometimes, ain't it?

 

Only for you LNers out there.... 

1 minute ago, David Von Pein said:

Read the first line of my previous post again, David....

"I think you (like many CTers) expect way too much efficiency from Government employees."

It was a 5 foot carton from Kleins addressed to the wrong person's PO Box.   They knew he was getting the WORKER just not a rifle from Kleins which required a variety of steps to pick up.

Not once from April 1 thru Nov 22 did a single government source declare that Oswald had a rifle...  even after the Walker shooting.
 

Yet the man accused of being his CIA handler and his wife are the sources - again, after the fact - that Oswald had a rifle that no one else sees... ever.

And your reply about the efficiency of FBI informants, when mountains of info that YOU use comes from these assets regarding virtually every aspect of Oswald's life... just not the receipt of a scoped rifle... rings hollow Dave.  

The FBI and its assets were efficient enough on so many other fronts....  these informants - if you've read thru their reports - provide detailed info on so much minutia and inconsequential things...    less than 2 weeks before the Walker shooting Oswald supposedly buys and receives a scoped rifle - yet not a single FBI asset is aware of this.

Kinda like the 25 FBI informants in Mexico also not being able to find any evidence of Oswald in Mexico....

uh, you're not listening Dave....  everything you offer above comes AFTER 11/22. 

We certainly agree that Oswald was being watched, his mail was being opened, his whereabouts determined by change of address forms and mail delivery as informed by Postal assets.

Please provide any proof the FBI was aware that Oswald was sent a rifle from Kleins prior to Nov 22, 1963 - since you claim a 5' carton arrived at the Dallas GPO addressed to HIDELL with the Oswald PO Box.   How did the FBI and its network of informants miss that one?

We all know about the BS the FBI produced after the fact.... what I want to know from the most devout LNer is how did Oswald receiving this rifle NOT get reported upon until after Nov 22 given all the Postal assets they had in New Orleans, Chicago, Ft Worth and Dallas? 

All thru 1963 Oswald's mail was being monitored and reported upon by numerous USPS informants

Dallas T-1, for example was Dorothy Xxxxxx, Info. clerk U.S. Post Office, Forth Worth, Tex.
New Orleans T-1 Joseph J. Xxxxx Postal Inspector New Orleans, La.

David,

How is it that the FBI is not made aware of the delivery of not only a 5' carton from Klein's with a rifle in it, but a REA package from Seaport with a pistol in it? 

Are we saying that the Dallas Postal-related informants simply missed the largest package ever sent to the man, as well as him picking it up.  Same problem with REA.

Why doesn't a single report prior to 11/22 show the FBI is aware of what Oswald received in the mail?

On ‎1‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 9:32 PM, Gene Kelly said:

David:

I don't buy that FBI was simply doing their job.  Why on earth would the FBI want Oswald's 9th grade records on the morning after the assassination?   Frank Kudlaty, the assistant principle at Stripling Junior HS in Fort Worth, stated that he remembered Lee Oswald attending because he was called by the Principle to head to the school Saturday morning (the 23rd) and hand over records on Oswald to the FBI agents.  Lee Oswald was only at Stripling for about six weeks in the fall of 1954. But there are four family statements that he attended Stripling in Fort Worth; three by Robert, and one by Marguerite.  Fellow students also recall him as a classmate.  Yet the Warren Commission never published these records or information, and the FBI denied knowledge of them (or lost them), yet they appear to have placed an urgent priority in obtaining them.  The records vanished from the evidentiary record.  It's not my intent to debate Oswald's matriculation at Stripling; it’s the FBI that puzzles me.  What do Oswald's 9th grade school records have to do with a murder investigation?

However, if one buys into the idea that the family was constantly (and oddly) on the move from 1947-1959 -- making it difficult to trace the whereabouts of “Lee Harvey Oswald,” once he had defected -- then the significance of 2220 Thomas Place (opposite Stripling) takes on a new significance.  Perhaps it was a home base (or “safe house”) for the so-called Oswald Project ... one that FBI needed to erase. Now the urgent collection of a just a few weeks’ worth of junior high school records takes on new meaning. Layer in the fact that WC attorney John Ely's notes are notably missing from the National Achieves, and the subsequent exposition of the Jenner memo stating:      

"Our depositions and examination of records disclose that there are details in Mr. Ely's memoranda which will require material alteration and, in some cases, omission".

There’s something fishy going on here, and it’s the FBI that seems out of character.

Gene  

 

Agreed - which was my point about the other 2 "accused killers" - the interest in every aspect of Oswald's pre-adult life is unique to the JFK case.

Look at it this way Gene... the "published" record comprised the histories of 2 men combined into one which is why anything and everything related to the natural born LEE Oswald caused such confusion among those doing his bio.  Whole scores of Marines who knew one Oswald yet never knew the other...  the 1952 - 1956 years are come of the most interesting and protected data in the case.... 

Gene - If you'd like, I compiled a large side by side excel sheet comparing the two lives chronologically...  PM me your email and I'll send it to you in either pdf or excel - depending on what works for you...

it’s the FBI that puzzles me.  What do Oswald's 9th grade school records have to do with a murder investigation? 

Maybe ask ourselves:  How would the FBI know to go to Stripling and by default Kudlaty in the first place?

Let me add this tangent Gene... on the afternoon of the assassination, Mexican "presidential staff" arrived at the 4 different bus lines in Mexico (Anahuac, Norte, Frontera & Flecha Rojas) and took ONLY the data related to Sept 27 thru Oct 3rd and began the process of creating a bus trip with the help of a highly placed FBI asset in the Immigration section of the Gobernacion...  yet as they settled on a story - time and the reality of the situation requires them to drop the initial conclusions despite evidence offered of Oswald's bus travel

The idea that the FBI would do such odd and clandestine things with evidence and testimony is supported by Swearingen's book https://www.amazon.com/FBI-Secrets-M-Wesley-Swearingen/dp/0896085015.  Despite him also writing a book about the JFK assassination - the thrust is his POV on how the FBI catered to Hoover's needs and falsified a great many things...

John Simkin

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We should remember also that a great man CIA were FBI and vice versa...loyalties within these agencies becomes very muddled. 

10 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

David, forgive my antiquated technological ignorance (again) but are you inferring some of that newer photo shopping stuff might have been used here? 

Nope...  Just pointing out a theory which is not based in reality