Thomas Graves

Bill, I like your theories, and I must say that you do a good job of supporting them with pertinent documentary evidence. I particularly like the idea that although Oswald might have been sent to Russia by US intelligence, he may have gone to Russia on his own. I'm toying with the idea that he wanted to become a double or triple agent, and went there with a little advice and help from his "friends". Regardless of his motives for going to Russia, it makes sense that Oswald was closely monitored by both the KGB and the CIA while he was there. It also stands to reason that he was used by the CIA as a U-2 info-based "dangle," and in conjunction with "defector" Robert Webster, a man whom he facially resembled (at least from certain angles) and whose biometrics were apparently assigned to Oswald to create "marked cards" for The Mole Hunt. It's fascinating and ironic that a probable result of this was the DPD's being unintentionally supplied with Webster's height and weight and approximate age on 11/22/63, which the DPD then broadcast to its officers to help them in their "search" for JFK's killer. One minor point I'd like to make, and it's obviously no criticism of you, is the interesting fact that the following document says that no derogatory information about Oswald was found in his Marine Corps files right after he defected in 1959. It makes no mention of the fact that he was court martialed twice while stationed in Japan. But maybe they were just looking for more serious, "national security" type behaviors or offenses. http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=117797&relPageId=260 So, I'm with you and support you, especially on what you've said about Goodpastures' creating the fraudulent Mystery Man = Oswald situation and, with the help of Egerter, creating and disseminating Oswald "marked cards" in an attempt to determine who, as evidenced by the impersonation of Oswald and Duran on September 28, 1963 in Mexico City, had penetrated LIENVOY,. I suppose the biggest compliment I can give you is that what you've written helps to me to understand the implications of Newman's Oswald and the CIA. --Tommy PS I'm still reading Chapter 3 and I just noticed an obvious typo: "Besides being the only officer to know Oswald’s background, [Bill] Bright appears to be the only officer at the Mexico City station who knew that Soviet consul Kostikov was the CIA’s case officer for the double agent known to the CIA as AEBURBLE and to the FBI as TUMBLEWEED, a case which had caused discussion between Jim Angleton and J. Edgar Hoover." Typo aside, what you've pointed out about this Bill Bright guy sure makes him look like a "person of interest." Sorry, I tried to edit it and mistakenly double-posted.

Richard, I've read in either Truly's or Shelley's WC testimony that the order fillers like Oswald rarely had occasion to go up to the sixth floor to fill an order. Anyway, what does it really matter which shirt Prayer Man was wearing? Would the "tan" "light brown" "brown" button-down collar one be better at covering Oswald's tee shirt? Is that why he has to be wearing that one? Do you think it's impossible that Oswald lied about changing his clothes? He was known to have prevaricated from time to time, wasn't he? if you had gone home just to get your revolver and some ammunition, would you admit it to the interrogators? Do you think Oswald really went home just to change his dirty clothes and grabbed his gun as an afterthought? Or do you think that gun was planted on him at the Texas Theater? --Tommy

Bill, I like your theories, and I must say that you do a good job of supporting them with pertinent documentary evidence. I like the idea that although Oswald might have been sent to Russia by US intelligence, he may have gone to Russia on his own (I'm thinking that he wanted to be a double or triple agent). Regardless of his motives, it makes sense that Oswald was closely monitored by both the KGB and the CIA while he was there. It also stands to reason that he was used by the CIA as a U-2 info-based "dangle," and in conjunction with "defector" Robert Webster, a man whom he facially resembled (at least from certain angles) and whose biometrics were apparently assigned to Oswald to create "marked cards" for the Mole Hunt. It's fascinating that a probable result of this was the DPD's being unintentionally supplied with Webster's approximate height and weight and age on 11/22/63, which the DPD then broadcast to its officers to help them in their ostensible search for JFK's killer. One minor point I'd like to make, and it's obviously no criticism of you, is the interesting fact that the following document says that no derogatory information about Oswald was found in his Marine Corps files right after he defected in 1959. It makes no mention of the fact that he was court martialed twice while stationed in Japan. But maybe they were just looking for more serious, "national security" type behaviors or offenses. http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=117797&relPageId=260 So, I'm with you and support you. What you've said elsewhere about Goodpastures' creating the fraudulent Mystery Man = Oswald situation and creating and disseminating different Oswald "marked cards" in her attempt to determine who had penetrated LIENVOY (as evidenced by the impersonation of Oswald and Duran on September 28, 1963) makes sense, too. I suppose the biggest compliment I can give you is that what you've written helps to me to understand the implications of Newman's Oswald and the CIA. --Tommy Here's an excellent article on Webster and Oswald by Gary Hill in The Fourth Decade: http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=48688&relPageId=49

Bill, I agree with you. Oswald didn't have enough time to change his clothes, and it's hard to imagine them getting dirty in order-filling his job, anyway, unless he was moving boxes around. I think he told the investigators that he changed his britches and shirt because it sounded better than going home just to grab his revolver and some ammo (and maybe a jacket). Even if it is true that, as Oswald said, "I took my gun to the theater with me because boys just like to take their gun with them." Supporting the idea that Oswald lied about changing his clothes is the fact that Marina said in her WC testimony that she thought that he had worn the same shirt to work that he was arrested in [Exhibit 150]. I've seen the long-sleeved, button-down collared, (supposedly) "dirty" shirt [Exhibit 151] that Sean believes Oswald wore to work that day described in the official documents on this thread as being "tan," "light brown," and "brown." Tan and light brown are light colors, but Marina described the shirt Lee wore to work that morning as being "dark." Regardless of which shirt Oswald wore that day, I'm still bothered by the fact that we can't see any part of his white tee shirt in the Prayer Man footage, although it does appear that we can see Prayer Man's bare neck. Also, it doesn't make sense that Prayer Man would have his shirt buttoned all the way up if his sleeves were rolled up. Maybe he was hot from working hard so had his sleeves rolled up, but had buttoned his shirt all the way up so as not to offend Jackie with his grubby-looking tee shirt? LOL --Tommy

If Oswald was a Lone Nut, how would 10 or 10,000,000 wiretaps have helped uncover "the plan"? Chris, I agree. It would make more sense if Nixon was talking about a plan for Oswald, not by Oswald. --Tommy

So far I've seen that shirt described as "light brown," "brown," and "tan." None of those colors are "reddish." --Tommy

Sean and Richard, Maybe someone could ask Marina or B.W.F. if this "brown" or "light brown" shirt is the one Oswald wore to work that day, or if he wore the "maroon-and-gray" one, instead. The maroon-and-grey one would make a certain amount of sense because maroon is, after all, a "reddish" color. But it's Interesting that the "reddish" maroon-and-gray one was in the "clean" list, and the "brown" one wasn't, so evidently the brown one was considered to be a piece of "dirty laundry." --Tommy Too bad there's no list of dirty laundry found in Oswald's room. Or is there?

Chris, I've read that some clandestine photos of Oswald (not those taken of the infamous Mexico City Mystery Man or Mystery Men) were taken outside of one of the embassies. I'm going from memory here, but I think I read that one of the photos showed Oswald's face in profile. The photos I'm talking about never made it into the public domain, and they are obviously not the same ones that the article is referring to. --Tommy

Larry, I agree with you on this and I'm even starting to think that Oswald may have gone to Russia on his own I-Wanna-Be-a-Spy initiative, with the help and encouragement of certain "friends" (Ferrie? , Hemming? , faceless CIA / ONI rogue agents or officers, or even James Jesus Angleton (vest pocket)). ---Tommy

Robert... can you please source this statement for me? When/Where was this said and to whom? Thanks DJ It appears to be an oral statement made by Baker, "many years" after the assassination. I found it in a long article about the acoustical evidence by a "John C. Bowles." http://www.jfk-online.com/bowles6.html Here's the pertinent but undated "statement," with appropriate introduction: CHAPTER SIX REFLECTIONS Probably the most informed and the most ignored authorities on what happened and in what order in Dealey Plaza are the motorcade motor jockeys. They have been interviewed uncounted times by many people, ranging from official investigators to insufferable quacks. Again, they are referred to in this text by a "letter" name, hopeful that it will discourage further contacts, however well-intentioned. While their recollections are presented in the first person, their comments should not be taken as unalterable quotes. Too many years have passed for them to remember with unimpeachable certainty what they might have said earlier and what they say now. Accordingly, what they say here should be considered for the meaning rather than exactness. [emphasis added by T. Graves] [...] OFFICER "E" [obviously Marion Baker] It had been a long escort. We had a lot of people all the way. There were no problems, just a heavy crowd and a lot of yelling and cheering, and the motors were getting hot. When you follow the lead, you do a lot of starting and stopping, trying to hold an interval. I was glad it was almost over. The crowd was real heavy down on the end of the downtown area, but just past Dealey Plaza it would open up and we would be on the freeway and just a few minutes from the Trade Mart. The front of the motorcade started blocking up in the crowd in those last turns coming off Main and turning onto Elm. Back on Houston, where we were, we were just about stopped and moving real slow when we could move. A little past half way down Houston (between Main and Elm), I heard the first shot. I could tell it came from somewhere in front of me, and high. As I looked up I noticed all the pigeons flushed off the top of the building on the corner ahead of me. And in the same period I heard the second shot, and then the third one. I couldn't see just where the shots came from but I knew they were from a high-powered rifle. I hunt a lot, and had just got back from hunting. There was no mistaking that; there were three shots, that's for sure. Though I didn't see exactly where the shots came from, I knew in my own mind they probably came from the corner building as the sound was right and because of the pigeons. So I headed there, got off my motor and entered the building (the Texas School Book Depository). It took a while because of the crowd; they had started moving in every direction. The man who said he was the building superintendent was outside and met me at the door and went in with me. Shortly after I entered the building I confronted Oswald. The man who identified himself as the superintendent said that Oswald was all right, that he was employed there. We left Oswald there, and the supervisor showed me the way upstairs. We couldn't get anyone to send the freight elevator down. In giving the place a quick check, I found nothing that seemed out of the ordinary, so I started back to see what had happened. Not knowing for sure what had happened, I was limited in what I could legally do. The investigator from Washington contacted me for my recollection of what happened, but I guess they weren't interested in what I said. _________________________________________________ What's interesting to me is the fact that the sentences in bold tend to substantiate Sean Murphy's theory. Simply put, Baker suggests here that he and Truly realized that the elevators were stuck on the fifth floor only after they had encountered Oswald. From the Warren Report, we already know that Truly and Baker were on the first floor when they tried to get one of the freight elevators to come down, but couldn't, so went up the stairs instead. http://books.google.com/books?id=TpzGMAmH2LEC&pg=PA153&lpg=PA153&dq=truly+baker+%22first+floor%22+elevator&source=bl&ots=ijwVDtVD1A&sig=TxFR8rL7BKAO1oeBGOgb5LFnv7I&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RpZpUp_mDYzyigKz0YDQBA&ved=0CDcQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=truly%20baker%20%22first%20floor%22%20elevator&f=false --Tommy Bowles is not to be relied upon. There's a reason he interviewed real people and then failed to identify them by name. He changed some of their words. Pat, Yes, he could have changed their words. But this Bowles guy is a Lone Nutter, so why would he "change Baker's words" so it would appear that Baker had encountered Oswald on the first floor? That would exonerate Oswald, wouldn't it? Sincerely, --Tommy

From the Just Wondering Department: If Prayer Man is Oswald, shouldn't we be able to see some of his white T-shirt? Yes, I realize that Prayer Man was standing in the shadows, but still.....? --Tommy Tommy, Prayer Man's shirt appears to be buttoned up fairly high. Fritz's transcription of Bookhout's interrogation notes indicates that Oswald told Fritz he changed shirts back at his rooming house--the shirt he was wearing when arrested was not the shirt he went to work in--that was a "reddish" shirt. A "maroon and grey cotton" shirt was found among Oswald's effects at N. Beckley Ave.: what I wouldn't give to see a photo of it. [emphasis added by T. Graves] Sean, Me, too! Maybe it was a maroon and grey turtleneck. LOL --Tommy

Douglas, Do you think Oswald killed Kennedy? --Tommy

Yup. He is still there in the corner of the porch, Sean. As the 50th approaches, the visible interest in Prayer Man still appears to be limited to a few Internet Forums. Hopefully, he will receive some long overdue exposure in the conferences taking place next month. From the Just Wondering Department: If Prayer Man is Oswald, shouldn't we be able to see some of his white T-shirt? Yes, I realize that Prayer Man was standing in the shadows, but still.....? --Tommy

Zack, The guy in the middle in the back looks kinda familiar. Any idea when the photo was taken? --Tommy

Robert... can you please source this statement for me? When/Where was this said and to whom? Thanks DJ Joseph, It appears to be an oral statement made by Baker, "many years" after the assassination. I found it in a long article about the acoustical evidence by a "John C. Bowles." http://www.jfk-online.com/bowles6.html Here's the pertinent but undated "statement," with appropriate introduction: CHAPTER SIX REFLECTIONS Probably the most informed and the most ignored authorities on what happened and in what order in Dealey Plaza are the motorcade motor jockeys. They have been interviewed uncounted times by many people, ranging from official investigators to insufferable quacks. Again, they are referred to in this text by a "letter" name, hopeful that it will discourage further contacts, however well-intentioned. While their recollections are presented in the first person, their comments should not be taken as unalterable quotes. Too many years have passed for them to remember with unimpeachable certainty what they might have said earlier and what they say now. Accordingly, what they say here should be considered for the meaning rather than exactness. [emphasis added by T. Graves] [...] OFFICER "E" [obviously Marion Baker] -- It had been a long escort. We had a lot of people all the way. There were no problems, just a heavy crowd and a lot of yelling and cheering, and the motors were getting hot. When you follow the lead, you do a lot of starting and stopping, trying to hold an interval. I was glad it was almost over. The crowd was real heavy down on the end of the downtown area, but just past Dealey Plaza it would open up and we would be on the freeway and just a few minutes from the Trade Mart. The front of the motorcade started blocking up in the crowd in those last turns coming off Main and turning onto Elm. Back on Houston, where we were, we were just about stopped and moving real slow when we could move. A little past half way down Houston (between Main and Elm), I heard the first shot. I could tell it came from somewhere in front of me, and high. As I looked up I noticed all the pigeons flushed off the top of the building on the corner ahead of me. And in the same period I heard the second shot, and then the third one. I couldn't see just where the shots came from but I knew they were from a high-powered rifle. I hunt a lot, and had just got back from hunting. There was no mistaking that; there were three shots, that's for sure. Though I didn't see exactly where the shots came from, I knew in my own mind they probably came from the corner building as the sound was right and because of the pigeons. So I headed there, got off my motor and entered the building (the Texas School Book Depository). It took a while because of the crowd; they had started moving in every direction. The man who said he was the building superintendent was outside and met me at the door and went in with me. Shortly after I entered the building I confronted Oswald. The man who identified himself as the superintendent said that Oswald was all right, that he was employed there. We left Oswald there, and the supervisor showed me the way upstairs. We couldn't get anyone to send the freight elevator down. In giving the place a quick check, I found nothing that seemed out of the ordinary, so I started back to see what had happened. Not knowing for sure what had happened, I was limited in what I could legally do. The investigator from Washington contacted me for my recollection of what happened, but I guess they weren't interested in what I said. _________________________________________________ What's interesting to me is that the above sentences in bold tend to substantiate Sean Murphy's theory. Simply put, Baker suggests above that he and Truly realized only after they had encountered Oswald that the elevators were stuck on the fifth floor. From the Warren Report, we already know that Truly and Baker were on the first floor when they tried to get one of the freight elevators to come down, but couldn't, and went up the stairs instead. Therefore, Baker and Truly must have encountered Oswald on the first floor. http://books.google.com/books?id=TpzGMAmH2LEC&pg=PA153&lpg=PA153&dq=truly+baker+%22first+floor%22+elevator&source=bl&ots=ijwVDtVD1A&sig=TxFR8rL7BKAO1oeBGOgb5LFnv7I&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RpZpUp_mDYzyigKz0YDQBA&ved=0CDcQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=truly%20baker%20%22first%20floor%22%20elevator&f=false --Tommy bumped in an attempt to get this thread back on topic Bill, The only problem I have with Baker's "statement" is that John C. Bowles didn't actually say that Baker had uttered or written it (remember, according to Bowles an Officer "E" made it), it's undated, and it's unspecified as to whom "Officer E" made or gave the statement. For all I know, John C. Bowles could have creatively "interpreted" what Baker said a long time ago and then put it in his own words, with his own spin. What argues against this, though, is the fact that Bowles appears to be a LNer, and his article is on another LNer's website (David Reitzes). It would make no sense for Bowles to make up a statement that supports a CTer point of view, and even less sense for Reitzes to present it for the whole world to see. Could it be that Bowles just slipped up? He was, after all, concentrating on rebutting the HSCA's "open mike" accoustical findings, not on trying to determine where in the TSBD Baker and Truly had encountered Oswald. But I rather doubt it. --Tommy PS You're right of course to point out the significance of Baker's saying that a Federal investigator had contacted him and (evidently) taken a statement, and that the Feds did nothing with it. If this is true, could it be because they realized that Baker's statement to them implied (or outright stated) that he had encountered Oswald on the first floor? The fact that neither Bowles nor Reitzes edited out this part of Baker's statement could argue either way for its authenticity, I suppose. I suppose it could also argue for Bowles' and Reitzes' carelessness or, conversely, their sense of fair play and honest reporting.

Robert... can you please source this statement for me? When/Where was this said and to whom? Thanks DJ Joseph, It appears to be an oral statement made by Baker, "many years" after the assassination. I found it in a long article about the acoustical evidence by a "John C. Bowles." http://www.jfk-online.com/bowles6.html Here's the pertinent but undated "statement," with appropriate introduction: CHAPTER SIX REFLECTIONS Probably the most informed and the most ignored authorities on what happened and in what order in Dealey Plaza are the motorcade motor jockeys. They have been interviewed uncounted times by many people, ranging from official investigators to insufferable quacks. Again, they are referred to in this text by a "letter" name, hopeful that it will discourage further contacts, however well-intentioned. While their recollections are presented in the first person, their comments should not be taken as unalterable quotes. Too many years have passed for them to remember with unimpeachable certainty what they might have said earlier and what they say now. Accordingly, what they say here should be considered for the meaning rather than exactness. [emphasis added by T. Graves] [...] OFFICER "E" [obviously Marion Baker] -- It had been a long escort. We had a lot of people all the way. There were no problems, just a heavy crowd and a lot of yelling and cheering, and the motors were getting hot. When you follow the lead, you do a lot of starting and stopping, trying to hold an interval. I was glad it was almost over. The crowd was real heavy down on the end of the downtown area, but just past Dealey Plaza it would open up and we would be on the freeway and just a few minutes from the Trade Mart. The front of the motorcade started blocking up in the crowd in those last turns coming off Main and turning onto Elm. Back on Houston, where we were, we were just about stopped and moving real slow when we could move. A little past half way down Houston (between Main and Elm), I heard the first shot. I could tell it came from somewhere in front of me, and high. As I looked up I noticed all the pigeons flushed off the top of the building on the corner ahead of me. And in the same period I heard the second shot, and then the third one. I couldn't see just where the shots came from but I knew they were from a high-powered rifle. I hunt a lot, and had just got back from hunting. There was no mistaking that; there were three shots, that's for sure. Though I didn't see exactly where the shots came from, I knew in my own mind they probably came from the corner building as the sound was right and because of the pigeons. So I headed there, got off my motor and entered the building (the Texas School Book Depository). It took a while because of the crowd; they had started moving in every direction. The man who said he was the building superintendent was outside and met me at the door and went in with me. Shortly after I entered the building I confronted Oswald. The man who identified himself as the superintendent said that Oswald was all right, that he was employed there. We left Oswald there, and the supervisor showed me the way upstairs. We couldn't get anyone to send the freight elevator down. In giving the place a quick check, I found nothing that seemed out of the ordinary, so I started back to see what had happened. Not knowing for sure what had happened, I was limited in what I could legally do. The investigator from Washington contacted me for my recollection of what happened, but I guess they weren't interested in what I said. _________________________________________________ What's interesting to me is that the above sentences in bold tend to substantiate Sean Murphy's theory as it is developed on this thread. Simply put, Baker suggests above that he and Truly realized only after they had encountered Oswald that the elevators were stuck on the fifth floor, and would not come down to them. From the Warren Report, we already know that Truly and Baker were on the first floor when they tried to get one of the freight elevators to come down, but couldn't, and went up the stairs instead. http://books.google.com/books?id=TpzGMAmH2LEC&pg=PA153&lpg=PA153&dq=truly+baker+%22first+floor%22+elevator&source=bl&ots=ijwVDtVD1A&sig=TxFR8rL7BKAO1oeBGOgb5LFnv7I&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RpZpUp_mDYzyigKz0YDQBA&ved=0CDcQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=truly%20baker%20%22first%20floor%22%20elevator&f=false --Tommy bumped in an attempt to get this thread back on topic

Joseph, I'm not particularly "into" the Harvey and Lee scenario, nor do I really want to go down that rabbit hole. But I do have a question. What time were the three tramps paraded through Dealy Plaza? Around 2:30? So if the Harvey and Lee Theory is correct, that would make it "Harvey" talking to the policeman-type in the background of that Three Tramps photo, right? Here's the photo from jfkassassination[.]net. The person we're talking about is in the background on the far right. http://jfkassassination.net/russ/infojfk/jfk6/6figIV51p267.jpg --Tommy PS I hope this thread doesn't devolve into a Harvey and Lee debate.

Robert... can you please source this statement for me? When/Where was this said and to whom? Thanks DJ It appears to be an oral statement made by Baker, "many years" after the assassination. I found it in a long article about the acoustical evidence by a "John C. Bowles." http://www.jfk-online.com/bowles6.html Here's the pertinent but undated "statement," with appropriate introduction: CHAPTER SIX REFLECTIONS Probably the most informed and the most ignored authorities on what happened and in what order in Dealey Plaza are the motorcade motor jockeys. They have been interviewed uncounted times by many people, ranging from official investigators to insufferable quacks. Again, they are referred to in this text by a "letter" name, hopeful that it will discourage further contacts, however well-intentioned. While their recollections are presented in the first person, their comments should not be taken as unalterable quotes. Too many years have passed for them to remember with unimpeachable certainty what they might have said earlier and what they say now. Accordingly, what they say here should be considered for the meaning rather than exactness. [emphasis added by T. Graves] [...] OFFICER "E" [obviously Marion Baker] It had been a long escort. We had a lot of people all the way. There were no problems, just a heavy crowd and a lot of yelling and cheering, and the motors were getting hot. When you follow the lead, you do a lot of starting and stopping, trying to hold an interval. I was glad it was almost over. The crowd was real heavy down on the end of the downtown area, but just past Dealey Plaza it would open up and we would be on the freeway and just a few minutes from the Trade Mart. The front of the motorcade started blocking up in the crowd in those last turns coming off Main and turning onto Elm. Back on Houston, where we were, we were just about stopped and moving real slow when we could move. A little past half way down Houston (between Main and Elm), I heard the first shot. I could tell it came from somewhere in front of me, and high. As I looked up I noticed all the pigeons flushed off the top of the building on the corner ahead of me. And in the same period I heard the second shot, and then the third one. I couldn't see just where the shots came from but I knew they were from a high-powered rifle. I hunt a lot, and had just got back from hunting. There was no mistaking that; there were three shots, that's for sure. Though I didn't see exactly where the shots came from, I knew in my own mind they probably came from the corner building as the sound was right and because of the pigeons. So I headed there, got off my motor and entered the building (the Texas School Book Depository). It took a while because of the crowd; they had started moving in every direction. The man who said he was the building superintendent was outside and met me at the door and went in with me. Shortly after I entered the building I confronted Oswald. The man who identified himself as the superintendent said that Oswald was all right, that he was employed there. We left Oswald there, and the supervisor showed me the way upstairs. We couldn't get anyone to send the freight elevator down. In giving the place a quick check, I found nothing that seemed out of the ordinary, so I started back to see what had happened. Not knowing for sure what had happened, I was limited in what I could legally do. The investigator from Washington contacted me for my recollection of what happened, but I guess they weren't interested in what I said. _________________________________________________ What's interesting to me is the fact that the sentences in bold tend to substantiate Sean Murphy's theory. Simply put, Baker suggests here that he and Truly realized that the elevators were stuck on the fifth floor only after they had encountered Oswald. From the Warren Report, we already know that Truly and Baker were on the first floor when they tried to get one of the freight elevators to come down, but couldn't, so went up the stairs instead. http://books.google.com/books?id=TpzGMAmH2LEC&pg=PA153&lpg=PA153&dq=truly+baker+%22first+floor%22+elevator&source=bl&ots=ijwVDtVD1A&sig=TxFR8rL7BKAO1oeBGOgb5LFnv7I&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RpZpUp_mDYzyigKz0YDQBA&ved=0CDcQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=truly%20baker%20%22first%20floor%22%20elevator&f=false --Tommy

As for the source of that entrance wound, although he didn't know the autopsy doctors had missed it, the young mortician who pieced JFK's head back together after the autopsy said that there was a small, thin pencil sized wound above JFK's right eye just above the hair line. If they would have shaved JFK's hair, as they would have done in a proper autopsy, that wound would have been immediately recognized, but because they didn't look for it they didn't record it. I don't think this is accurate, Bill. A lot of stuff has been added on to Tom Robinson's actual statements over the years, and I suspect you've been exposed to some of it. Robinson, to my recollection, said he saw a tiny wound on Kennedy which he thought was created either by bullet shrapnel from the outside, or a small bullet or bone fragment coming from the inside. This divot was not as large as a pencil, and was not a through and through hole through the skull, as one would expect from a bullet wound. Robinson was, in fact, quite dismissive of it, and thought he put a bit of wax in it, if anything. Is that the wound Robinson is referring to, in the "notched" hairline area above and a little to the left of JFK's anatomical right eye? --Tommy Pat Speer Replied: No, I don't think so. He said it was at the temple. [...] Pat, Although not exactly "at the temple," the wound in the photograph looks pretty darn close to it. Where would you say the wound is? (I'm still talking about the small dark circle in the "notched" part of JFK's hairline.) In the "forehead?" In a specific part of the skull with a Latin name that a mortician wouldn't necessarily know? Or, perhaps, in the general "temple" area? Sincerely, --Tommy

As for the source of that entrance wound, although he didn't know the autopsy doctors had missed it, the young mortician who pieced JFK's head back together after the autopsy said that there was a small, thin pencil sized wound above JFK's right eye just above the hair line. If they would have shaved JFK's hair, as they would have done in a proper autopsy, that wound would have been immediately recognized, but because they didn't look for it they didn't record it. I don't think this is accurate, Bill. A lot of stuff has been added on to Tom Robinson's actual statements over the years, and I suspect you've been exposed to some of it. Robinson, to my recollection, said he saw a tiny wound on Kennedy which he thought was created either by bullet shrapnel from the outside, or a small bullet or bone fragment coming from the inside. This divot was not as large as a pencil, and was not a through and through hole through the skull, as one would expect from a bullet wound. Robinson was, in fact, quite dismissive of it, and thought he put a bit of wax in it, if anything. Is that the wound Robinson is referring to, in the "notched" hairline area above and a little to the left of JFK's anatomical right eye? --Tommy

Relax, David.

I'm having a hard time reconciling Dr. McClelland's statements. Is he suggesting that the grassy knoll shooter "blew out the right side" of JFK's head and caused "a massive wound in the back of Kennedy's head" with the same shot? Is it possible to do that with one shot? --Tommy

Sean, Good post! Please freshen my memory-- on what real or imaginary grounds did the bad guys base their belief that Oswald had left the building from the front door? Oswald's Alibi-Per-Fritz: "Second Floor Coke When Officer Came In To First Floor Had lunch Out with Bill Shelley In Front" Mrs. Reid: Saw Oswald on the second floor about two minutes after the assassination, walking in the general direction of the front stairs. Anything else? Thanks, --Tommy

Thanks for sharing that, Ray. Gary's right. All of the assassination witnesses should be allowed to attend. (Except, perhaps, Danny Garcia Arce. He's the guy who said he was on the Grassy Knoll but couldn't see the limo!) --Tommy

rephrased and bumped: "Gary, could you please arrange a ticket for James Tague?" Thank you, --Tommy