Evan Marshall

Neither of these guys were ever on my Christmas Card list, but there needs to be documentation not just a need to believe. Casey was pretty shrewd-I would be amazed if such sentiments were ever put on paper.

Just for the record, and to clear up the misinformation posted here by White, I was not "banned" from JFKResearch for abusive behavior, DellaRosa "banned" me because he claimed I was cross posting, which was false. White is also incorrect in his statement that I offered no research to JFKRESEARCH. He knows full well that debunked quite a few of his fradulant claims with solid emperical evidence. He also knows I played a big part in the research that was posted at JFKRESEARCH that trashed his claim of Moorman in the street. Of course Jack making these false claims is a personal attack.... having written three books on wound ballistics that have generated alot of angry and often vicious attacks I've always wondered why people can't just disagree without being disagreeable. civility is an often ignored subject around the breakfast table-our 7 kids were taught better and it astounds me when people have to be so obnoxious, demeaning, and insulting in their feeble attempts to "prove" a point. My web page (www.stoppingpower.net) has discussion forums and our rules are clearly posted and I enforce them ruthlessly-unfortunately, it seems the only way to ensure sociable discussion. most of us can agree that we have not been told the truth re:the politcal assassinations of the 60's and other events-I'm sure I would diagree significantly re: 9/11 with most people here because I had (have) a TS clearance and was aware of much of what was going on that day in federal circles, BUT we can discuss it without rancor or intellecually lazy attacks on people character and motives. Because I think the death of certain individuals such as Che', etc, were a good thing it does not make me a contract employee of anyone. maturity can be acquired at any age.

finally got a copy to replace the one I loaned to a female author along with some tapes of Mark Lane interviews that are not commonly seen. Unfortunately, the person in question could never quite remember to return my property-ever. it's being published by Mary Ferrell's organization and if you haven't read it you should.

sort of off-topic but its fascinating how the newspaper photogs take such good photos and the autopsy photog can't seem to get most of them in focus.

an even bigger problem is that we don't know near as much about ballistics as we often think we know. I've seen any number large caliber handguns glance of the skull and ride around the outside under the skin. evan marshall www.stoppingpower.net www.marshallsshootingcenter.com

Really. Personally, I couldn't care less why people arrive at the conclusions they do. I think this is a venue of fact based argument, so such personal speculation appears counter-productive. You have a strange manner of introducing these ideas. Always with the sleazy insinuations. Since you put it that way, we have the basis for a discussion. JFK came into Parkland with a good part of his brains blown out. If the staff at Parkland had been prepped to finish the dude off, why did they nick the right side of the trachea, bruise the tip of the lung, and produce a tiny fracture of the T1 transverse process? I mean, the guy is laying there with his brains out and they "finished him off" with a nick and a bruise and a hairline fracture? No, the throat wound tells a different story. Small caliber. Did not exit. Left a field of metallic debris at its point of deepest penetration. JFK acted paralyzed in the limo -- simplest explanation -- because he WAS paralyzed. All consistent with a Mitch WerBell adaptation of Charles Senseney's blood soluble paralytic technology. http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/church/r..._6_Senseney.pdf http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKwerbell.htm And that is why the plotters felt confident they'd get the job done in Dealey. while eye and ear witnesses can be problimatical I learned as a Detroit Cop that professionals observations are uniformly valid-the emrgency room personnel at Parkland saw gunshot wounds on a daily basis and unlike the autopsy docs had extensive experience with same. the poor quality photos has always troubled me-these were professional photographers and I can't believe this was represenative of their work-would like to see the pics from other autopsies they shot-I can't believe the quality was that poor. always thought some amatuer photog shot the photos we have now.

EM, Have you read Peter Lance's Tripple Cross or know about Ali Mohamad? BK no to the 1st and that's a fairly common name left the Fed's and opened a gunshop and indoor range-approx the same hrs (80-90 a week) but atleast I get to sleep in my own bed and the dog's quit growling at me when I show up. sorry for the delay in responding. Actually had alot more contact with the FBI during my Detroit years than the time I spent in Arkansas and New Mexico. The Bureau is like any other large organizations-there are some sharp people, some real dunces, and the majority are in the middle. When assigned to Homicide I found their profiling work was generally quite good. like any large organization, promotion and positive recognition is not always connected to doing a good job-I found while assigned to Homicide that the only thing worse than being wrong was being right when it went against the Bosses wishes or agenda. the longer I spend as a published writer-hundred's of article and column segments in the law enforcement& firearms press and three controversial books on wound ballistics-the more skeptical I become of the written word. Trying to plow thru two books on the JFK assassination currently and its hard because of the authors ability to write-I think they're both on to something but they drag terribly. I can't go into details re: 911 because my TS Clearance is still active and will be until late 2008 when it expires, but we were set to run several missions that day and had several in progress. Everything I saw and some of it was at very high levels was shock and surpise-I worked with these folks on an almost daily basis and their responses we're genuine. Saw nothing to indicate govt complicity. the problem with intell work is similar to doing criminal investigations-the people with intimate knowledge of criminal activity are not going to be a Scoutmaster or Mormon Missionary-you are forced to deal with the realy nasty people. I used to say that a reliable informant was somebody I had in the back of a van with a submachine gun pointed at their head. I'm not a big, broad conspiracy believer-were JFK, RFK, MLK assassinationed by conspiracies-yes-obvioulsy, but people who keep seeing folks like Morales behind every tree have to understand that I know some of his contemporaries and no one with a direct connect to the Agency would have put themselves in a postion to get grabbed by some over eager cop or caught up in some other bad, dumb luck event. Hi EM, Thanks for the comeback, and I agree with your assessment of Feds, with a certain percentage of each category, just like JFK reseachers, some good, some bad, some jerks, but none responsible for our personal and national security, which the Feds are. While Bill Turner is a hero of mine, and I believe John O'Neill tried to work his way thorugh the compromised beaurcracy of the FBI, there is incompetency on the one hand, neglegance on the other, and criminal neglegance when it comes to the intentional and deliberate actions of certain investigating officers and officials. I think James Hosty was neglegant for not recognizing LHO as a more significant case than he did, while FBI SA John Zent was criminally neglegant as the "case officer" of Ali Mohamid, who told the RCMP to let him go at the boarder, and failed to report on Ali Mohamid's admission that he was working for al Qaeda in its war against the USA. Looking at Zent's career and his distracting stand up testimony in a triple homicide in which the perpetrator arranged the alibi of having dinner with Zent while the murders were taking place, makes me believe he was just an imbicile. And I'm sure there's a few of those in the FBI. You can't say the same for others. Like James Fogel and Tommy Corrigan and those in the FBI Special Ops Group who "Got Gotti," who got a tip that PLO terrorists were threatening to blow up casinos in Atlantic City and from July 2 - July 23, 1989, followed, observed and photographed the al Qaeda cell Ali Mohamid trained at Calverton Shooting Range near Brookhaven, on the North Shore of Long Island, New York. While they weren't PLO and didn't try to take out AC, they were invovled in the assassination of Rabbi Kahane and the first WTC bombing. As one FBI agent put it, "Understand what this means. You have an al Qaeda spy who's now a US citizen on active duty in the US Army, and he brings along a video paid for by the US government to train Green Beret officers and he's ussing it to help train Islamic terrorists so they can turn their guns on us..." A year later, after one of those trained by Ali Mohamid at Calverton, assassinated Kahane, the FBI and NYPD searched Nosair the assassin's New Jersey apartment and discovered two associates, US Army Special Ops Training Manuals and videos from Fort Bragg that should have led to Ali Mohamid, and 47 boxes of additional evidence. Among the additional evidence was a Federal Firearms License that led to brothers Daniel B. and Ray Murteza, Waterbury, Connecticut gun dealers. Ray, a former Waterbury police officer and Albanian Muslim, at first denied but later conceeded he sold the .357 mag used to kill Kahane, and practiced firing with Nosair at the High Rock firing range in Naugatuck, Connecticut. This led to the realization that there was a "much broader papperon of paramilitary training by Islamics,...but afer the NYPD declared the Kahane murder a 'lone-gunman' shooting, the FBI apparently terminated the investigation." Then there was the bad FBI supervisor, Lindley DeVeccio, who helped arrange for mob murders so his confidential informant could be made boss of Columbo mob family, and is now under indictment for four homicides, and could have been brought down back in 1976 for illigally selling handguns in Pennsylvania. DeVeccio wasn't charged by then NY DA Rudy Giuliani because, "the guy was a cop." Somewhere along the line, these investigations nail the bad guys, then let them off the hook so they can assassinate a Rabbi, blow up the WTC garage and set up 9/11, as if they all took us by surprise. As a former big city police officer, official trainer and operator of a target range, do you think these guys are suspicious? And how do we characterize the investigators, who failed to not only connect the dots, but as Peter Lance says, "disconnected them" after the fact. BK We're in the middle of some delicte business negotiations here at the moment so I can only give this a superifical pass, but remember all of us are human and and capable of short sightness and preconceived notions. I was and am troubled by missed clues in the Oke City Affair and the rush to execute Timmy McVay. The whole Waco things sits badly too. What's going on now is prep time for another 9/11 and we're going to lose people-alot I'm afraid. One of the assignments I had was to review the Al Quada Training Tapes one of our guys had liberated while serving with Delta in Tora Bora. LE and Govt need to rethink their approach and I'm afraid we'll be confronted by situations where we have to choose between casualities and MASSIVE CASUALTIES. Hope I'm wrong but too many buds on the black side of Spec Ops are telling me they're hearing the same thing. Columbine should have taught that containment is no longer a valid tactic and the Beslan School should have been a case of an rapid breach, and arrest or killing of those holding innocent children. There is also the fact that some people cannot deal with the horrible reality of Terrorist Behavior and want to not have to think of such horrors. We need alot more accountability AND we have a continued need for tough guys who will stand on the sharp end of the stick and protect us. There are some folks who are beyond redemption and just need to be killed, and yes I spend every Sunday at the local Mormon Church. I see no conflict in loving God and directly confronting evil.

I disagree. The perfect murder is where the authorities do not realise that a murder has been committed. I have posted the solution to my murder mystery. Do you think, given the evidence available, that you would have thought that Wallace was murdered? http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=8869 you're welcome to disagree, but if its not closed as a Homicide, there's always the potential for re-examination. A closed case is a whole other matter-haven't read it since real murders are rarely as tidy as those scenarios we imagine or create

I got assigned a number of homicides where very highly eudcated folks thought they committed the perfect murder-most are in a MI prison for life, no parole. The perfect murder would be one that the wrong person was convinced of and it was smugly considered closed.

EM, Have you read Peter Lance's Tripple Cross or know about Ali Mohamad? BK no to the 1st and that's a fairly common name left the Fed's and opened a gunshop and indoor range-approx the same hrs (80-90 a week) but atleast I get to sleep in my own bed and the dog's quit growling at me when I show up. Well EM, I live near Ft. Dix in Jersey and can hear the reservists on the range on the other side of the lake. My dad was Det Sgt./ Lt. PD Camden - (No. 1 Most Dangerous City in USA - 2 years in a row), worse than Detroit. Dix also has training pods for urban warfare and local Pineys are hired to play arabs. Anyway, as PDS notes in his Dallas COPA talk - edited transcript to be posted shortly - Lance details the double-tripple agent career of Ali Mohamad - whose Egyptian Army unit was involved in the assassnation of Sadat. Ali Mo was trained at Ft. Bragg, returned to Egypt and was recruited by al Qaeda to come to USA as infiltrator and spy. He married Calf. women he met on flight over, enlisted in Army, became Sgt. and assigned to Special Ops training at Ft. Bragg. On leave he traveled to Brooklyn NY where he trained first al Qaeda cell in USA out of Blind Sheik's mosque in rifle, pistol and AK47, practicing in an open field on Long Island, as filmed by FBI. One of Ali Mohamad's rifle range students assassinated Jewish rabbi Kahane, and when police went to his apartment in Jersey, they found USA Special Ops manuals that were traced to Ali Mo, who went on to scout Kenya embassy bombing sites and relocated OBL from Sudan to Afghanistan. He was an al Qaeda agent provatour and trainer while having an inept FBI "handler" and CIA guardians. PDS compares him with similar attributes of LHO. Like the fate of most serial killers, if standard police investigative techniques were followed and the Special Ops manuals found in the assassin's apartment were traced to Ali Mo at Ft. Bragg, the terrorist cell reponsible for the first WTC attack and 9/11 could have been exposed years earlier. And they would have been by honest cops not interfered with by inept FBI agents and CIA case officers who gave Ali Mo a pass. While both Ali Mo and the Blind Sheik are in custody, their damage is done; both nurtured by US intelligence (Blind Sheik on CIA Passport), and not by OBM. As a law enforcement officer who has worked with the feds, are the FBI just inept or are they part of the program? Thanks. BK sorry for the delay in responding. Actually had alot more contact with the FBI during my Detroit years than the time I spent in Arkansas and New Mexico. The Bureau is like any other large organizations-there are some sharp people, some real dunces, and the majority are in the middle. When assigned to Homicide I found their profiling work was generally quite good. like any large organization, promotion and positive recognition is not always connected to doing a good job-I found while assigned to Homicide that the only thing worse than being wrong was being right when it went against the Bosses wishes or agenda. the longer I spend as a published writer-hundred's of article and column segments in the law enforcement& firearms press and three controversial books on wound ballistics-the more skeptical I become of the written word. Trying to plow thru two books on the JFK assassination currently and its hard because of the authors ability to write-I think they're both on to something but they drag terribly. I can't go into details re: 911 because my TS Clearance is still active and will be until late 2008 when it expires, but we were set to run several missions that day and had several in progress. Everything I saw and some of it was at very high levels was shock and surpise-I worked with these folks on an almost daily basis and their responses we're genuine. Saw nothing to indicate govt complicity. the problem with intell work is similar to doing criminal investigations-the people with intimate knowledge of criminal activity are not going to be a Scoutmaster or Mormon Missionary-you are forced to deal with the realy nasty people. I used to say that a reliable informant was somebody I had in the back of a van with a submachine gun pointed at their head. I'm not a big, broad conspiracy believer-were JFK, RFK, MLK assassinationed by conspiracies-yes-obvioulsy, but people who keep seeing folks like Morales behind every tree have to understand that I know some of his contemporaries and no one with a direct connect to the Agency would have put themselves in a postion to get grabbed by some over eager cop or caught up in some other bad, dumb luck event.

I spent the last 5 yrs as a contract instructor for a Fed Agency with direct counter terrorist responsibilities. We will be hit again and it will be massive and at multiple locations. They really don't need another reason to hate us. EM, Have you read Peter Lance's Tripple Cross or know about Ali Mohamad? BK no to the 1st and that's a fairly common name left the Fed's and opened a gunshop and indoor range-approx the same hrs (80-90 a week) but atleast I get to sleep in my own bed and the dog's quit growling at me when I show up.

I spent the last 5 yrs as a contract instructor for a Fed Agency with direct counter terrorist responsibilities. We will be hit again and it will be massive and at multiple locations. They really don't need another reason to hate us.

I spent the last 5 yrs as a contract instructor for a Fed Agency with direct counter terrorist responsibilities. We will be hit again and it will be massive and at multiple locations. They really don't need another reason to hate us.

While I believe both Morales and Phillipa where involved along with Mitch Webell, Jack Cannon, and some others-I can't believe that anyone with direct ties to the Agency would have participated in such a way to tie themselves directly to the event. If some one picked up Oswald they were a cut-out and probablly didn't know who they were really working for.

pretty easy to insult and defame the dead-Carlos Hathcock was not only a superb sniper but a good guy and implying that he was too stupid understand the situation is intellecually dishonest and morally lazy You are absolutely right concerning the amount of time requird to for the "first shot".....this shot was both the closest and allowed the most time for a strike ..... however the WC concluded that this shot missed....I don't agree with that either. Nope! The WC "talked in tongues"/spoke in circles, etc as regards THE SHOT THAT MISSED. They never out and out claimed exactly which shot it was, they merely claimed that Z313 was most likely/probably the last shot. It was Posner who added to the fairy tale that it was the first shot, and supported this with the tree limb strike/glance/lost bullet, etc. Despite what Tague had to say about when he received his scratch on the face, as well as all of the eyewitness accounts as to JFK reacting to the first shot. Before you expain it to me again, I am familiar with your shooting theory, but I just don't buy it. It was not offered for "sale". Body Kidnappings and multiple assassin theories are for sale. Truth & facts are free for those who know how to evaluate them. P.S. Exactly why do you think the WC knew that they could get away with this/their version. I feel that "hit" #1 was to the throat and fired from the front.....hit #2 was to the back...followed in quick succession by a hit to the head, a hit to Connally, and most likely another hit to the head. Interspersed were misses from possibly both directions along with probably another Connally strike. I feel that there most likely four separate hits to JFK, 2 hits to Connally and at least two misses. Personally, I "feel" quite old, and have little time for those who evaluate factual evidence by what they "feel". Hope that you have another 40+ or so years in which to continue to be lost in this subject. My "guess" as to shooters locations is TSBD, Dal Tex, North knoll and South knoll. I feel that the shots fired from the TSBD were primarily diversionary, but that one of these may have struck and "partially penetrated" JFK's back My "guess" would be that you have done little if any research into the subject matter, and therefore are attempting to pass a factual test with "guess"ing. I don't believe that LHO "touched" a rifle on that date. I believe that the MC in question was purchased from Oswald by a conspirator, well in advance of 11/22. As I stated earlier, you need not re-explain to me Your theory. I am familiar with it, but am simply not in agreement ! Then you most assuredly are not "one" of those few here who recognize factual evidence and thereafter understand the principals of verification of same. P.S. Why not take a look at the evidence from Parkland which initially stated that JFK had a "fragment" wound of the anterior neck. Or even better yet, call Dr. Perry and have him explain the mistake/error to you. Or, just continue to "guess".

I'm always amused when people who've never been a sniper talk about how easy the shot was-shooting at a paper target is one thing-shooting at another human is another matter-I've done it and its neither easy or without a cost. www.stoppingpower.net I'm always amused when people who've never been a sniper talk about how easy the shot was- I'm always amused when people claim that "Sniper" training is required in order to hit an extremely slow moving target at a range of 68 yards (204 feet) or less. Most 12 to 13 year old's down here in S. Mississippi can accomplish that, and do, each time that dear season opens. P.S. It cost LHO his life! P.P.S. Shortest distance which LHO qualilfied at in the USMC was 200 yards, of which he shot in the UPPER EXPERT range of qualification. shooting at a known distance at a stationary target is nothing like shooting at a target that's moving away from you-there's no indication Oswald had ever shot a rifle at a human target in the past-how come Carlos Hathcock couldn't do it? How come every body talks about how easy it is-talk is easy-being on the rifle when its for real isn't.

I'm always amused when people who've never been a sniper talk about how easy the shot was-shooting at a paper target is one thing-shooting at another human is another matter-I've done it and its neither easy or without a cost. www.stoppingpower.net

let's not make it unworkable-there is not a need to have 40 SS agents compromised. Let's remember none of them had been fired on before and unfortunately assignments were often granted by senority and a younger man behind the wheel might have made all the difference. do I believe there was some SS complicity-yes, but it only required one or two not a legion. I've worked a number of protective details and done alot of executive protection training-it would take a very few members of a protective detail to lose a principal.

I'm not reading it right now because I have contractual agreements for books and articles that I have to get written very soon. Certainly Larry's 1st version was a superb book and one of a handful I found of value. Too many conspiracry books want to use a shotgun approach to find the "real killers". Others are impossible to finish-I've been a published writer since the mid 70's and too many books make better sleeping potions.

Close up of Altens photo. when I was the training sgt for the SWAT Team we were involved in the Papal Detail when he visited Detroit-it would only a very small number of the protective detail to slow down or be out of position for the Principal to die.

Of course, it is necessary to do deals in order to get elected. The point is, how far do you go? Those of us living in a parliamentary democracy, accustomed to "minority" governments, are perhaps more familiar than our US cousins with how legislation is fashioned by consensus and compromise when a government lacks a clear majority to pursue its agenda. The point is not just what deals are done to get elected, but how one gets deals done after being elected without a clear mandate. You also have to consider the consequences if you have no intention of keeping these promises. For example, JFK had meetings with Richard Bissell and Allen Dulles before he was elected. And when asked whether he'd shown either candidate favouritism in his briefings regarding the forthcoming Bay of Pigs plans, Dulles replied that each candidate had been given the same information. However, this was wholly disingenuous since Nixon didn't need any information, as he'd been a prime architect of the plans. How likely is it that Kennedy would have taken so hawkish a position against Nixon in the debates were he in possession of all the facts, only to then be faced with carrying out a program about which he had so many misgivings? It is clear that somebody's recollection is faulty. When faced with two divergent recitations of events, we are forced to choose between CIA's version and that offered by the Kennedy White House insiders. Given that the former is a suspect in murdering the latter, I am uncomfortable accepting uncritically what CIA personnel have to say. Those who disagree are free to do so. JFK promised to take a hard-line on Cuba. In fact, during the presidential election, he attacked the Eisenhower and Nixon for being soft on communism in regards to Cuba. In return, JFK was told about the plans to arrange for anti-Castro exiles to invade Cuba. I suspect he was also told about the plans to assassinate Castro just before the invasion. Even though the CIA have always denied this was part of the plan, it does not make much sense without combining the two actions. If JFK was unprepared to authorize US military participation in the invasion, do you really think he'd risk the potentially embarrassing blowback of it becoming publicly revealed his government had tried to kill Castro as part of the invasion? I have little doubt CIA planned to kill Castro, and that this was the "something" which Dulles publicly admitted they had counted on to happen which didn't transpire. Whether Kennedy knew about it is another matter entirely. JFK also did deals with the Texas oil industry, promising to leave their “oil depletion allowance” alone. And it was left alone, despite discussions to the contrary having been conducted during his tenure. JFK also sent RFK down to the Deep South to promise no legislation on civil rights. And, to his eternal discredit, he would have been as good as his word had various previously unforseen events not forced his hand. Maybe, his father even made promises on his behalf to the Mafia. The problem about making promises is that if you break them you will be punished, either by the electorate or by the pressure groups you have let down. One also has to look at the record of the JFK administration. JFK did go along with the Bay of Pigs invasion. And thereafter complained bitterly that he'd been sold a pig in a poke, as subsequent forensic investigations demonstrably proved was true. Nor did he make principled decisions about civil rights. As RFK explained, JFK sacked Harris Wofford, chairman of the Subcabinet Group on Civil Rights (1960-1962), because he was too passionate about the subject of civil rights legislation. Thank you, for this illustrates precisely what I stated above. Most importantly, JFK and RFK put Martin Luther King under a lot of pressure to call of his civil rights demonstrations. The same tactic was used against the leaders of the Congress on Racial Equality (CORE) who were causing bad publicity for the Democratic Party in the Deep South with their Freedom Rides. Thank goodness they took no notice of JFK. The truth is that the main reason black civil rights were achieved was because of the actions of people like Martin Luther King, James Farmer and Bayard Rustin and not because of the views of so-called liberal white politicians. Whatever private sympathies the Kennedys may have had for the civil rights movement, they only became public when King, et al, forced the Kennedys' hand. For me, this is the most damning condemnation of the Kennedy administration, a fact I trust will be borne in mind the next time somebody wishes to accuse me of trying to whitewash JFK's legacy. As the people of Iraq are currently finding out, you have to fight to get freedom and democracy. It is not something that you can have imposed on you. Which is precisely what the Kennedys discovered the hard way when troops were called out - as they had been in the Eisenhower administration - to preserve public order in the face of race-based insurrection. bought the book and trying to plow thru it, but find it a dificult read-having a story to tell does not guarantee you'll do it well.

Welcome to the Forum. When I read what you posted, I smiled. My initial post back in 2005 had to do with the police in Dallas. Here is what someone named Jerry Lawson posted on the Dallas Historical Society Forum page back in September. It had to do with something called, Shotgun Squads in Dallas in the 1960's: "In the late 60's I was managing the Pizza Inn on West Davis. The manager of the store on South Lancaster got sick one night and I went to cover his shift. When I got there he called me to tell me about the shotgun squad and fill me in on their procedure. Two of them would arrive just after dark and set up behind a piece of plywood in the back dining room with a clear view of the cash register. If someone was robbing me, I was to take two steps back from the register, raise my hands in the air, and loudly say "do you want the change too?". That was the signal for them to fire. Sure enough, right after dark two Dallas police officers walked in the door with shotguns. They were arguing (in jest) about who would get the first shot that night. One of them said "well, you go ahead and take the first shot. You're going to miss anyway and I'll still have to bring him down". The night was uneventful until my district supervisor walked in the door. He stopped at the cash register, leaned over the counter and started a conversation with me about how I liked working that restaurant. I always thought my superviser was a jerk and a pain in the ass. I thought for just a few seconds about taking two steps back, raising my hands in the air, and asking him if he wanted the change too. Of course I didn't, but he'll never know just how close he came." Steve Thomas when I was assigned to the Tac Unit in the early 70's we worked some stakeouts-in Motown atleast, it was SOP for holdup men to shoot the clerk whether they resisted or not, so it was not unusual for shoot outs to occur-cops like to live too.

having spent two tours in Detroit Homicde, I'm afraid Denis is far from the mark-I worked CSI in the early 70's and honesty and presentation of undoctored evidence was the rule of the day. I know most people hate cops, but I was involved in several keys cases in Detroit and honesty was always the rule of the day. cops are people who generally relfect the values of the community they work in-if people are concerned about racist, crooked cops they need to look inward as they rarely brought in from Eastern Europe to patrol the streets of your community.

And that's it? - lee Velma is getting pretty brave in her old age. my experiences with the polygraph were always less than satisfactory-you're at the mercy of the operator and what he or she decides is deception.