Kathleen Collins

Shore worked for Reprise Records in Los Angeles. I think Tonahill most likely misremembered which city the person was from, or maybe Shore was temporarily in San Fran at the time.

I don't know if this has any bearing here, but wasn't Sinatra the owner of Reprise Records?

Kathy C

As far as the rock and roll angle, it was already in America in the 1950's...and I daresay, the "British Invasion" led by The Beatles, was a juggernaut that was coming whether JFK was dead or alive.

It just goes to show that if you were sitting on the sidelines waiting for the JFK assassination to bring about the era of "sex, drugs, and rock and roll," the "revolution" had already started without you.

I've read this theory too. Supposedly 4 British young men were programmed with musical talent and sent over here after Kennedy died. This was a big distraction to America -- the Beatles and everything that came with them, such as fashion, etc.

It's a crock of s----. But the timing of the assassination and the Beatles' arrival will always stick in people's minds. What was that?

Kathy C

Greg,

I guess the question begs here, was the motorcade running on time at this point?

The other interesting aspect here is that I also remember reading that at about 12:20, the motorcade stopped on Ervay Street for a brief time. Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't the U.S. Post Office located on Ervay, where Oswald rented P.O. Box 2915?

James

James,

yes, I did think about whether the motorcade was running on time. I do know that it was announced over the radio that it was running 5 minutes late (Mrs Reid was phoned by her husband with the news). Don't know if that would have been reported in California - or exactly what time it was reported even in Dallas. It is possible the information could have been relayed, but I don't find it all that likely that it was.

Let's assume for a minute that the lady did not know it was running late. If on time, at 12:30, it was due at the Trade Mart. There is little doubt that a sniper could have made the hit at that location. What this might suggest is that the woman knew the hit was on, but not all the details about where along the route it might be made.

I think the Oxnard report is one of the more compelling documents there is supporting foreknowledge. This due to how quickly the call was reported, and the seeming good character of those doing the reporting -- along with no known reason for making it up.

Greg, I am very interested in the Oxnard Call. I read your work sometime last week, I think, about radionics. I cannot locate this info. Could you give me a link?

Kathy C

Thanks to the generousity of Duncan MacRae i now have a new home for

my image galleries.

This has been a long time in coming and is an on going " Work in progress "

http://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/gallery

Fantastic work Robin. I look forward to checking back every now and again. Really a terrific start.

I hope I can contribute....

- lee

Hi Lee.

Great to hear from you again.

Lee you already have contributed.

The book you sent me in the mail " Trasks Pictures of the pain " provided some of the best Scans in the Image gallery.

And no one could forget that " CLASSIC " Cancellare image you obtained from Ebay, and generously shared with the forums.

Keep in touch Lee.

My Email:

quaneeri2@yahoo.com

Robin, I like your site very much. I uploaded here one of the scariest pictures I've ever seen. It's of the front section of the limo, racing to Parkland and beyond a man is on a rooftop with a rifle. He really wasn't going to get out of there alive.

Kathy C

The same producer is doing the upcoming Discovery Channel program focusing on the JFK limousine.

And we know that will be a bunch of lies.

Kathy C

Thank you Pat. They're still working to give us the big lie that Oswald did it. The worst offender, imo, is Robert Oswald. I don't believe he and Harvey were brothers. If LHO enjoyed the limelight his capture brought him, why did he keep denying he did it?

Kathy C

One night last week, I watched this Kennedy documentary that had Oswald as the lone assassin. They put together a computer animated simulation of the assassination to prove Oswald shot Kennedy and both Kennedy and Connelly were hit by the same bullet because of the way both reacted in the limo. They began to talk about the "pristine" bullet, which I've seen in various books. There was hardly a dent on it. I think they found it on Connelly's stretcher.

On this show, they mocked the pristine bullet theory by showing a bullet that looked crushed like a bottle cap run over by a train. It definitely was not pristine. So, in effect, could they have switched bullets and called the used bullet they showed the magic bullet? Did anyone else notice this trickery? I forget what channel it was on -- the History Channel, Discovery, The Learning Channel, etc.

There is a site about the pristine bullet. I wonder what you think of it -- Were we shown only one side to the bullet as this guy mainlains? I love the last line about what children should never do again. Is this a joke?

http://karwas.gso.uni-edu/JFK/issues_and_e...ine_bullet.html

Kathy C

It isn't Kennedy's vocabularly that should be questioned about Hersh's Dark Side of Camelot, but some of the details.

For instance, Hersh claims that Skinny D'Amato paid off the West Virginia Sheriffs to help throw the pivitol West Virginia primary election to JFK. D'Amato was owner of the 500 Club in Atlantic City, pal of Frank Sinatra, and manager of the Cal/Neva casino when it was owned by Sinatra and Sam Giancana. D'Amato, according to Hersh, was the bagman in delivering the money to the Sheriffs, who he knew from them visiting his club while attending the national sheriff's convention in Atlantic City.

Hersh also claims that Joe Kennedy had a piece of the Cal/Neva and that was one of the key associations between the Kennedys and Giancana, besides Judith Cambell Extner.

I'm not disputing any of this, but its certainly more titillating then calling a spade a spade.

BK

I should have known. The book claimed matter-of-factly that Oswald did it alone.

They had a documentary on the History Channel last night about the Kennedy Assassination. Oswald did it and his nauseating brother and other people who "knew" Oswald, like Priscilla MacMilliam, said Oswald wanted fame; he wanted the spotlight; he wanted to be in the History books. If that's the case, then why was he denying that he shot anybody?

Kathy C

In the context of growing up in that era, I can imagine that JFK might have said what was alleged in Hersh's book. But I still think it shows that he was ahead of the curve, as compared to the area where I grew up, as he might've used "the n-word," but didn't. Remember, in 1963 Martin Luther King still had a "dream" that had yet to be realized...and which is only fully coming to life here in 2008. And you're trying to look at this thru the prizm of 2008, when it needs to be examined in the light of 1961, when it allegedly occurred. But I can imagine that the only reason that Hersh included that alleged quote was to add to the unsavory picture he was painting of JFK. While JFK certainly wasn't a saint, neither was he as bigoted as most of America still was in the early 1960's, IMHO.

Robert Kennedy gives us some interesting insights into the brothers attitude towards race in the Oral History Project interviews. He admitted that before JFK was elected in 1960 the Kennedy team had given little thought about civil rights. As he points out, the family knew very little about the experiences of the black race. It was a question of empathy. In fact, RFK admitted that he had travelled to the Deep South to see Democrat leaders to give assurances that if elected, JFK would not push too hard for civil rights reform. RFK admits that he applied pressure on MLK to back-down with his campaign. RFK urged JFK to sack Harris Wofford, the presidential adviser on race because he was too committed to the cause. Advice that JFK acted upon. He also tried to stop the Freedom Riders from their campaign against segregation on buses. They refused so he sent one of his close friends to monitor their actions. He ended up being badly beaten up himself. It was this incident that changed RFK and JFK's attitude towards race. Before this it was a political issue. Now it changed to a moral issue. This is the main point that has to be grasped about JFK. In 1960 JFK was a conservative. In 1963 he was a genuine liberal. That is why he was so dangerous and had to be taken out.

I've read more in that book, and I've lost interest in it. It's a hatchet job. That's how it started out; no fairness. I don't believe Kennedy used that phrase. And that creep, George Smathers, is quoted throughout.

Kathy C

My first response is that I'd have to see the quote from a second source other than that book.

Not saying it didn't happen but Hersh's book got into hot watter for going overboard on some of the badly sourced allegations aout Kennedy. That says a lot, given the Kennedy bashing nature of the media at the time that the book appeared.

Hersh said a former Senate aide and lawyer told him. He did not want to be identified. Convenient. If true, the lawyer used the term boogie republic, ascribing it to Kennedy. Maybe Kennedy said it, but even way back when, I don't think Kennedy would be so politically stupid. I'm going to look for other sources.

Kathy C

Now don't anyone go into convulsions, hallucinate, hit, yell or send a nuclear weapon -- I have gossip. I just would like feedback.

After my writer's workshop last night, I bought The Dark Side of Camelot by Seymour M. Hersh at a book sale. Reading it I learned a Democrat named Charles Engelhard, diamond merchant in S. Africa and an extremely wealthy man, was trying to get evidence of sexual liasons involving Jack Kennedy during Kennedy's early campaign. A former Senate aide of Kennedy's was told of this plan by a staunch Kennedy Democrat, whom Engelhard had approached. Kennedy became President. Certain Dems wanted Engelhard to be named an Ambassador to a high profile embassy.

Here's Kennedy's answer:

"I'm going to f---- him...I'm going to send him to one of those boogie republics in Central Africa."

(He named Engelhard the American Representative to the Independence Day ceremonies in Gabon and Zambia.)

Now the active word here is "boogie" republics. Was Kennedy referring to black people as "boogies"? Where I come from (across the river from NY), "boogie" meant a black peorson. It also meant snot. So it doesn't have a great connotation. I've heard Spanish people use it to describe black people too. Could we call John F. Kennedy a racist? I have to admit I was a little shocked, but I don't hold it against him. In those days those were their common words. It was handed down more or less; not something you would say publicly.

I would like to know others' opinions.

Kathy C

This may be a bit convoluted, but what isn't when it comes to JFK/Dallas.

A good friend of mine from NYC who has been in the projection/editing biz since the early '60's recently advised me that he has a copy of the Zap film that he's had since '67 or so...buried in his warehouse....you can imagine my interest...so naturally, I asked him how he got it....he said to the best of his recollection, he got it from R.Greenberg, a NYC editing firm of some repute...a quick google on R.Greenberg brought up a 2-D graphics firm that works in the motion picture biz...but only since '77.....hmmmmm, eh?....

3 questions, if you will...

1. anyone heard of this company?

2. why would they have a Zap copy?

3. is it worth my time to go through what amounts to a medium size warehouse of tape stock to find it?

my friend doesn't really care about all the assassination stuff....he's just a tapehound with lots of cool tape and film, mostly rock-n-roll boots from the '60's and early '70's...

basically told me if I can find it, I can have it.

any one that can comment or add some info before I spend what could amount to days going through boxes of tape?

thanks, t.

By all means search for that film. Is the warehouse in NY?

Kathy C

"Robert Kennedy felt that unless the women caller heard by the telephone supervisors was clairvoyant, there was sufficient reason to suspect she might have knowledge of the assassination plot. It bothered him to no end."

An interesting story. Did the FBI ever follow-up on this? Though I guess even it they wanted to [sic] they likely couldn't have done much as she was untraceable. What 'suspected' persons involved lived in that area?

Some people suspect that the murder of Karen Kupcent had something to do with the Oxnard call.

Karen's father was from the same Chicago neighborhood as Jack Ruby and Ruby claimed to know him.

BK

Karyn Kupcinet had no foreknowledge of the Kennedy Assassination. But she died because of the Assassination and Jack Ruby killing Oswald. There was a lot of heat about the Chicago Mob being behind the Assassination. When Ruby shot Oswald, Irv Kupcinet, the columnist and talk show host, sought out Paul Dorfman, who knew Ruby. He got a call put through to him at Palm Springs where Dorfman was "vacationing." Also in Palm Springs that weekend was Karyn Kupcinet, whom Chicagoans knew well. It is my theory that Dorfman was trying to think of something that would shock the populace of Chicago and make them forget about Ruby and the Chicago Mob for awhile. With Irv on the phone and Karyn being spotted (possibly), it might have dawned on Dorfman that were she murdered in Hollywood, Chicago would be shocked and for a time their attention would swayed to the murder, which has never been solved.

Kathy C

I heard a story once that one of the Tramps had killed his parents. I thought it was Sturgis. It turned out to be Charles Frederick Rogers, who was wanted in Austin, TX. He is also called "Frenchy." Some people believe he is the first Tramp.

As for myself, I don't know who is the first Tramp. I believe Charles Harrelson is the second and E. Howard Hunt is the third.

It is mentioned here, but there are no details, about Charles Rogers killing his parents. I will continue to look for more.

www.assassinationscience.com/Verb.html

Kathy C

I looked into one of the tramps having killed his own parents. I found a mention of it at:

www.assassinationscience.com/Verb.html

It's believed that Charles Rogers was wanted in Austin, TX for killing his parents. He is also being called "Frenchy," the first tramp, over which some people disagree.

Kathy C

I am not a photographer and I don't know too much about computer software for photographs.

I've never heard anyone mention this -- although someone could have -- but does this photo below look "photoshopped" to anyone? Kennedy is "lit" differently from the others and there's a white splotch where his hand should be.

Kathy Collins

I am trying to find out who saw E. Howard Hunt and Frank Sturgis at Chappaquiddick.

I heard a weird story once, and I'm trying to learn if anyone else ever did: Did Frank Sturgis kill his parents and chop them up? Somebody told me this and I'm trying to find out about it.

My thoughts are with Ted.

Kathy Collins

I found this sports and gambling page and they were talking about the dead Kennedys and Ted. Anyway it brought me to a one-hour-and-a-half video which I have not seen yet, about the murder of John Kennedy Jr. Let me say that I tried the search engine here and I couldn't find one thread on John Jr., though I know they exist.

To the best of my recollection, I have not seen the video. I will watch it later as I have to go out. This is the site:

http://peswiki.com/index.php/Video: Who_killed_JFK_Jr_(George_W._Bush_did)

Kathy C

I WILL say this: all the postings I read (especially about the Odio incident and the back of the head issues) are compelling...Vince Bugliosi's book just truly floored me. Perhaps I need to keep my self-professed open mind even more open than it already is.

I also have to say: yes, i do have an ego...but it's mostly online; in person, you would say to yourself, "Gee, Vince, you don't seem at all like the egotistical bastard you are on the net" LOL. Always remember this; often, a so-called ego masks insecurities... The net is a free and fun way to advertise yourself (as Nixon said, history belongs to those who write it for themselves, or something like that); guess I get carried away sometimes...

Vince Palamara

Vince, I get out of control too with repurcussions. You're not alone there.

But what I want to ask you is what one thing did Bugliosi write that convinced you 100% that it was Lee Harvey Oswald, shooting from the 6th Floor window, who managed to shoot and kill President Kennedy? Please don't say there were too many things. Please narrow it down.

Kathy C

My own choices for best opening lines?

"Here come old blacktop/ He come cruisin' up slowly..."

This brought a lawsuit. Chuck Berry sued John Lennon ("Come Together").

Or:

"I read the news today, oh boy..."

"A Day in the Life" -- Beatles

Kathy C

Cigdem,

That would be from an obscure band out of Liverpool, England and the song title is the same as the first line. Off of the album The Beatles, also known as "The White Album" (1968); possibly one of Mr. Lennon's experiments in "free association" with Ms. Ono.

Take care,

Dan

Why Don't We Do It in the Road? was Paul McCarntey's entirely.

Kathy C

Why don't we do it in the road?

Dan,

It would be good if you could add the artist and the song title to your post.

It sounds a bit intriguing....

Jesus! Are you that young?

Kathy C

I am an only child and until I married I had no other family except my parents so I was an avaricious reader. I don't know about "changing" my life but the books that had the most affect on me were in order of reading age: Little Women, Anya Seton's "Katherine" which turned me on to history, Lady Chatterly's Lover, Zola's Nana, Jane Eyre, Wuthering Heights, Pride and Prejudice, Clockwork Orange, 1984, Animal Farm, Wild Swans. Not sure what that makes me - a romantic socialist perhaps?

You mentioned Anya Seton. Her book, Green Darkness, was the best novel I ever read. It was total escapism. The occult, historical and romantic novel about a girl who falls in love with a monk -- I read its 800 pages 3 times, different years. Seton wrote it in mostly Old English. (I took a course in Old English in college.) I have never read Katherine but will in the future. You should see how backlogged my reading is. My house looks like a library.

I still have the first printing of Green Darkness, but the illustration on the front cover has been ripped off. I loved that drawing, but they later put the book out as a paperback and used an inferior cover. Someday, I'll buy the original with cover on the Internet.

There were other books that amazed me: Marilyn by Norman Mailer (a bad word around here). Currently, everyone is putting the book down. Mailer didn't do enough research on it. The Publisher asked Mailer for 10,000 words on Monroe, but he greatly exceeded that number. I loved the book and the first time I read it, I cried at the end.

Lolita by Vladimir Nabokov was another book I couldn't put down. Nabokov spoke English as a second language. It was so well-written.

I loved Rosemary's Baby. Short and succinct. The movie followed it exactly (except for one scene.) Ira Levin told a simple story about a pregnant woman, living in the Dakota, hounded by witches and no one believes her.

I also loved Play It as It Lays by Joan Didion. Quite a writing style. I read it twice to fully understand it. And went on to read her Book of Common Prayer.

And the poet I loved the best: Sylvia Plath.

Reasons why the backyard photographs are faked.

(1) Same Lee Harvey Oswald face on 3 bodies.

(2) Chin is square, not pointed.

(3) Fingers are chopped off.

(4) Shadows are wrong.

(5) Left arm is too short.

(6) Rifle is wrong length

(7) Body is out of balance.

(8) Newspapers are wrong size.

(9) Rifle swivels are in the wrong place.

Jack, I believe the backyard photos are fake. It seems fairly obvious. Now, your friend John Armstrong wrote of 2 Oswalds -- Harvey, whom Ruby killed and Lee, who helped frame Harvey for the Assassination of President Kennedy.

If there was in fact a Lee Oswald, why couldn't the conspirators use his face for the Backyard Photos? He was a bit taller than Harvey, so they probably couldn't use his body in the pictures. But what about Lee's visage?

Kathy C

Here you go: Kathy.....

B....

Dear Bernice -- thank you for that picture, but there's another one. I will try to find it and post it from the Internet instead of my computer.

Kathy