Jonathan Cohen

Not to derail this thread, but the above is one of John Butler's favorite talking points. I challenged him to explain how this evidence could have been faked in an earlier thread where he claimed Altgens 6 has been heavily altered, but neither he nor anyone else can do it. Why? Because the film and photo record in this case is self-authenticating.

Kudos to Robert. This is one of many perfectly logical ways to explain the Stripling confusion.

Why on earth would whoever was running this imaginary double Oswald project allow the "Marguerite Oswald" imposter to give interviews to local journalists??

False. None of the Parkland doctors determined the extent of this flap because Mrs. Kennedy had essentially pushed it back together while holding JFK's head during the ride to the hospital. Upon arrival at the ER, the doctors were completely focused on the wound in the back of the head but even then did not know its true shape and extent.

You're kidding, right? Jeremy has absolutely destroyed the key point of this entire ridiculous theory. but HE is the one with an illogical line of reasoning? As always, if you need me, I'll be having cocktails with the "short, dumpy" Marguerite Oswald. Or, wait. Maybe it's the "tall, attractive, well-dressed" Marguerite. I'll let you know.

There is absolutely nothing fraudulent about that photo.

No "supporting data" will ever satisfy H&L adherents that they're actually talking about the same person - not two distinct individuals who magically look exactly alike. All the supporting data anyone would ever need comes from the exhumation, which proves there was one and only one Lee Harvey Oswald. Was Oswald impersonated at various points throughout the assassination? I believe he was, in an attempt to strengthen the eventual case against him. But that certainly does not require subscribing to the preposterous and throughly debunked notion that he was part of a CIA doppelganger project.

Chris - are you suggesting that the "same" alterations made to the Zapruder film were made to every other motion picture taken in Dealey Plaza?

There is no "Harvey." Paperwork anomalies notwithstanding, every single photo being discussed here is of the same person - the one and only historical Lee Harvey Oswald.

Hallelujah, Mark. H&L adherents seem incapable of giving equal weight to anything that might challenge their beliefs. As Ron Ecker points out in the next post, "FAILED" could mean any number of things OTHER THAN "failed prothesis," and as such certainly cannot be used to support the notion that the corpse is at odds with the extant dental records.

Precisely. I do not believe it is possible to do with the assassination images what Wilson claimed he could.

Joseph: I'm honored you think my postings rise to the level of paid disinformation specialist. Now I've really hit the big time! In reality, none of my comments here have EVER been pro-Warren Commission. I am as staunch a disbeliever in their findings and conclusions as you will find on this forum. Rather, my comments are in objection to JFK conspiracy theories that are at best implausible and unsupported by any hard evidence (ie, nearly every film and photo shot in Dealey Plaza was altered) and at worst simply preposterous (two distinct Lee Harvey Oswalds running around the United States independent of one another for a decade, "fake" Marguerite Oswalds, etc.). We all owe Tracy Parnell a debt of gratitude for his exhaustive debunking of the "Harvey and Lee" concept.

The fact that books have been written ABOUT Armstrong's book proves nothing more than that people people are very gullible. As with everything, there is a very simple, logical explanation about the "missing" tooth: that Voebel was mistaken. If you need me, I'll be having coffee with the "real" Marguerite. Or... wait. maybe the "fake" one. I'll compare her eyebrows.

Rob, I'm as suspicious of the backyard photos as anyone. But we are talking here about the Dealey Plaza photo record, which began when you proposed that Altgens 6 was altered before it went out over the AP wire within a few minutes of the assassination.

Oh brother. THIS again? It has all been completely debunked time and again, but I'm resurfacing this link to a 1998 David Lifton newsgroup post as further evidence that the man in the grave was the ONE and ONLY historical Oswald.

What I meant was, how would the "forgers" have been able to ensure their forgeries and alterations would not one day be contradicted and exposed by films/photos unknown to them at the time? The fact of the matter is that the assassination photo record is self-authenticating, as demonstrated repeatedly by folks such as Josiah Thompson.

Simple. It's not him.

>> IMO, alterations do occur in the films and photos that make up the Dealey Plaza record of the assassination. John, if you alter one film or photo taken during the assassination, don't you necessarily have to alter them all, so that they match? How on earth could this gargantuan feat ever have been accomplished? Some of the photographic record wasn't even known to the world until YEARS after the assassination. Were those images then retroactively altered to align with all the previous alterations?

Soo.. was Altgens in on the plot to add a "face mask" to "Oswald" in a photo he just happened to have captured in the midst of the assassination? Where did the "face mask" come from? Was it just conveniently waiting for the plotters at the AP office in Dallas?

How could Altgens 6 have been altered when it was transmitted over the AP wire 25 minutes after the assassination?

Andrej - in your opinion, how can work of this type be accurately done on photos that are not the originals? How do you account for degradation of the image? If I'm not mistaken, Wilson performed some of his analysis on copies of assassination photos he sourced out of books.

As has been discussed on numerous prior threads here, the photo enhancements Wilson claims to have been able to produce have never been peer-reviewed and are outlandish beyond belief.

Altgens 6 was transmitted over the wires 25 minutes after the assassination. That alone should disprove any speculation that it was somehow altered to include such things as "face masks" ...

It's heartening to know there are consequences for what Mr. Pozner so accurately describes as "the pain and terror" Fetzer "purposefully inflicted" on him and other Sandy Hook families.

Jack White may have been the nicest guy on planet earth, but his theories have been authoritatively proven wrong time after time, be it on the "Moorman in the street" issue, the moon landing "hoax" or his support for the preposterous and insulting claim that no actual airplanes hit the World Trade Center on 9/11. This is someone in whom you expect us to trust?