Bill Brown

Brownlow is a proven L-I-A-R and anyone relying on anything he says is playing the fool.

I'm perfectly aware of all that. The Commission document does NOT include the text noting the Holan house. That was added later by the clueless. Point being, you're flat out wrong to imply that the Warren Commission itself ever stated that Holan lived in that house. I'm growing tired of correcting your elementary-level errors and having to explain to you, each time more than once, how you're wrong because you can't accept it the first time. This is just like the time you kept insisting you knew the exact location of Hardy's Shoes and I had to tell you about four times that you were wrong before you finally agreed. It's okay to be ill-informed. But to antagonize while ill-informed is foolish.

"The purported shortcut across the front yard of the Davis residence and exit through the shrubbery is not a foregone conclusion. Many saw the killer proceed to the corner of Patton & 10th, turn left at this corner, and leave the area via the alley." Nonsense. No one saw the killer leave the area via the alley.

"It seems from this thread some of us may have been misled by a Warren Commission Exhibit. Imagine that. The Ariel Photograph of the scene of the Tippit shooting shows Doris Holan on 10th St., straight across from Tippit's car and the Driveway it blocked." Good grief, man. In the "Aerial View Of Tippit Killing Site" image you posted, the Warren Commission did not place Holan in the house on Tenth Street. That was done by the clueless person/website you took the image from. You were "misled" by someone, for sure; but it wasn't the Warren Commission. Imagine that.

"There is Doris Holan in position to see and told what she saw (to Brownlow and Pulte); Guinyard who said he saw a patrol car in the same location as Doris Holan's line of sight out her front window (Brownlow);" Care to guess where the story of Guinyard seeing a police car in the alley came from? I'll give you a hint, his name rhymes with Schmownlow. Guinyard didn't mention any patrol car in the alley in 1963 or 1964. Yet, you believe he all of a sudden remembers the patrol car when Talking to Brownlow. Boy, Brownlow sure had a talent for drawing information out of witnesses. (Yeah right) Greg, you're so hopeful that someone other than Oswald gunned down Tippit that you'll throw your common sense and logic aside and believe almost anything which points away from Oswald.

"And you're changing Mrs. Holan telling of a car making backing movements in a "driveway" to her saying nothing at all, in order to fit your narrative, which is a conspiracy theory which has no evidence for it and debatable whether is has much plausibility either." You really feel that what I am doing (outright dismissing Brownlow's story based on the known evidence) with what you are doing (changing "driveway" to "alley" in order to get it to fit your narrative) are the same thing? No Sir. Brownlow is nothing more than a L-I-A-R. Period. I know this to be a fact. Apparently you do not.

I've already made my point. You're changing "driveway" to "alley" in order to get it to fit your narrative... And none of the REAL witnesses who were outdoors at the time and saw Tippit talking to his killer ever mention a police car in any driveway.

"You mean in the alley? No. I don't mean in the alley. If I meant alley, then I would have said alley. I said (and meant) driveway, since you said this (below): "It may not actually be totally impossible that Doris Holan could have seen a "driveway" (differing from the alley) in the vicinity of 404 and 410 E 10th from her vantage point from her window facing Patton, if she saw a car in the back of a house (not the front of the house toward 10th), backing out into the alley."

Greg Doudna, of the witnesses who were outdoors and saw the patrol car stop alongside a man walking and/or saw Tippit before he was shot, people like Burt, Smith, Benavides, Markham and Scoggins, please list which of these REAL witnesses stated that there was a police car doing such a thing as going back and forth in ANY driveway of ANY of the houses along Tenth Street.

Neither Brownlow nor Pulte are credible. Having said that, their claim is that a police car was seen in the DRIVEWAY between the houses of 404 E. 10th and 410 E. 10th. You guys are then, for some unknown reason, switching DRIVEWAY to ALLEY. Nope.

"In her testimony to the WC she says "1:15" Right. So in the interest of accuracy, maybe stop putting quotes at "around quarter past". By the way, when she gave the time of 1:15, it was in response to the question asked by Ball about what time she gets her bus (a strange way to ask a question). Therefore, we don't really know if Markham is telling us she gets to her bus stop at 1:15 or if she gets on the bus at 1:15. Since a bus stopped there at 1:12 and again at 1:22, I'm going with the notion that she gets to her bus stop regularly at 1:15 in order to catch the 1:22 bus. Like I said before, one does not normally plan on getting to the bus stop three minutes after the bus was due. One would miss the bus over half the time (if not more). "Benavides says that after the shooter leaves he waits a further 2 minutes, then moves to attend to Tippit, and then moves to try the radio." If you really believe Benavides was cowering down in his truck for two minutes after the shooting, then you have Benavides hiding inside his truck, a mere fifteen feet from Tippit's body, while Helen Markham, Frank Cimino and others are already beginning to mill around the body. Did you think this through? No way is this the scenario which occurred. Secondly, and more importantly, Benavides tells Eddie Barker (The Warren Report, part 3, CBS, 1967) that he watched the killer go around the corner and then sat in his truck "for a second or two" before getting out. It's most likely that Benavides was out of his truck and on the patrol car radio about sixty seconds after the shooting. We can hear Benavides begin to key the mic at 1:16. "Bowley arrives around that time, checks his watch and it's 1:10. He moves to Tippit, and attempts to help him before taking over the radio from Benavides, he gets the radio wokring and makes a call to dispatch the time of that call is 1:16." Bowley tells us that he pulled up to the scene, got out of his car, walked over to the body, saw right away that there was nothing he could do for Tippit, then immediately went over to the driver's side door and grabbed the mic from Benavides. How long do you think something like that would take? Sixty seconds? Ninety seconds? No way does Bowley pull up at 1:10 and then take roughly seven minutes (1:17, per Dale Myers) before making the report on the squad car radio. I refuse to believe Bowley's 1960 era windup wristwatch was more accurate than the clocks in the dispatch room (which place Bowley's call at 1:16). Bowles, the dispatch supervisor, tells us that those clocks could be off by a minute or so (he's simply allowing room for error, smart man) but there is no reason to believe they were off that day. I also refuse to believe Bowley was on the scene for six or seven minutes, standing there looking at the body, before getting on the squad car radio.

Steve, apparently there's a conspiracy at every turn; including the one at Lankster & 8th.

"Out of interest what was the 1:22 bus? I've seen the schedule for the Number 55 bus, but that ran hourly (or, more accurately, every 58 minutes for some reason...). The "15" Bus would have arrived around 1:36 and the "30" would as I understand it, (happy to be corected on this) have required her to move to a different stop. What was the bus that ran 10 minutes after the 1:12pm "55" at the same stop? From what I can see from the schedule, the next bus would have arrived at around 2:10pm, meaning she would have been stepping off the bus about 5 minutes after her shift started. I'll pop a link to the schedule up when I'm on my proper computer, this notebook is struggling to do one thing at once, let alone multi-task." In March of '64, Agent Bob Barrett (of the FBI) determined with the Dallas Transit System that a bus stopped at that bus stop (Jefferson and Patton) at "about 1:12 and every ten minutes thereafter".

"She didn't say the bus arrived at 1:15. She said that she would leave her house just after one, and walk to the bus which would arrive around quarter past." First, where did she say such a thing? You keep using the phrase "around quarter past" with quotes. What makes you say this?

"I'm fairly sure it was the 1:12 since she described the one she always caught as arriving around quarter past after leaving the house at just after 1.00pm, and it being her daily schedule to arrive in time for a bus that in her brain arrived in under 15 minutes after she left." I'm fairly sure Markham would quite often miss the 1:12 bus if she regularly got to the bus stop at 1:15. This tells me that she usually got to the bus stop at 1:15 and caught the 1:22 bus. The bottom line is that 1:15 is the only time she gives, regarding catching the bus. You cannot claim as a fact that Markham regularly caught the 1:12 bus. Be sure of it if you like, but it's not a fact.

"The Warren Report did itself no favours by asserting the time of the shooting as being at 1:16PM. Helen Markham would have long been at her bus stop by that time, following her daily routine of setting off slightly after 1PM to meet a bus that arrrived at 1:12PM, though she said it was some time around 1:15... Regardless of the possibility of the bus' delayed arrival that day, she would have been there by 1:12PM and nowhere near the scene." Since Markham never mentions the 1:12 bus, it's equally as possible that she intended to catch the bus at 1:22. You don't get to automatically assume that she was intending to catch the 1:12 bus. Regarding the bus, the only time Markham gives is 1:15. People don't regularly get to the bus stop three minutes after the bus was due to stop by.

Scoggins said he was crouched behind the cab. Gil Jesus (mistakenly) said Scoggins was lying face down in the street. As for the killer looking back over his shoulder, Benavides said the killer did this, not Scoggins. The relevance is that you stated that Gil Jesus seems to have "a damn good grasp on the Tippit witness situation". I'm here to tell you that this is not so.

I'm curious... Do you believe that William Scoggins was lying face down in the street as the fleeing gunman approached the cab moments after shooting Tippit?

J.L. Angell https://www.legacy.com/funeral-homes/obituaries/name/jl-angell-obituary?pid=184395600&v=batesville&view=guestbook https://www.parker-ashworthfuneralhome.com/obituaries/6087733 His patrol car (#20) is captured on film in Dealey Plaza after the assassination.

Some of you need to read this and learn something... https://www.cbsnews.com/texas/news/welcome-to-texas-unusual-pronunciation/ "And we recently visited Lancaster to find out why it's pronounced "Lang-k's-ter" instead of "LAN-caster," as many people assume."

"It is all confusing, and impossible to know much of anything for sure. I went back and re read a bit in Nightmare. I'd forgotten about the Top Ten records stop. Drenas article is very good, it's referenced in Nightmare. But I have to take it with a grain of salt when in the second paragraph he gives special thanks to Dave Perry for his advice." You critique Dave Perry (a very fine researcher, no doubt) while "forgetting" about the Top Ten scenario. Hilarious. Point being, if you're so ignorant on the goings on in Oak Cliff, then who are you to critique anyone, especially someone like Perry?

Herb Sawyer from Howard Brennan. I never rely on Brennan and I don't see how it is possible to accurately give a height/weight description of a man in the window from Brennan's position, though this is what happened.

You know what? All ya gotta do is listen to the tapes for yourself. The "ster" is most definitely there.

BUMP

This whole thing is plain silly. First, Tippit says he's at Lancaster and 8th. He simply pronounced Lancaster and 8th like "Lankster & 8th". All Tippit did was shorten Lancaster from three syllables to two. Second, Lancaster and 8th is only two measly blocks from Lansing and 8th. Am I to understand that whatever conspiratorial nonsense a moving patrol car could be involved in at Lansing & 8th could not happen just two simple blocks away at Lancaster and 8th? Did you really think this through?