real evidence (for a change) – what is it with these pictures of Oswald leafletting?

[Tom Neal]

Yes, that's definitely Bill Shelley.

In case you didn't know, Shelley was photographically "captured" that afternoon

(wearing tie but sans coat), drinking coffee just

inside the TSBD front doors (with some guys who look like reporters).

Tommy,

Thanks for the confirmation. I have not seen this photo of a coat-less Shelley. Any idea where I might find?

Assuming I found the right guy, your 1925 birth date is very close:

William Hoyt Shelley

b. 12 APR 1926

d. 6 SEPT 1996

Maggie Marie Shelley (Wife)

b. 1927

(alive as of 2012)

Tom

Edited November 7, 2015 by Tom Neal

[Brian Schmidt]

I've always thought the man in the Oswald leaflet photos looked a lot like Bill Shelley too. I keep going back and looking, like Tommy, to see if the guy in the photo looks younger than late 30's...sometimes I think he does, sometimes he could pass for late 30's--kinda looks like Sean Penn.

To Stephen's point, it is always highly speculative to make conclusions based on blurry old photos, and often times the observer is bias in that he wants to find a CIA agent on Daley Plaza, for instance. Such a find would have the ability to 'leap-frog' through decades of research and prove that there was almost undoubtedly a conspiracy. I still remain somewhat hopeful that facial recognition software might someday give us definitive answers. The problem might still be that the photos are too poor quality, though. For example, a while back I tried to use Facebook's facial recognition software (which is quite good) to see if it found a match between the man on the corner of Elm & Houston and known pictures of Rip Robertson. The problem was--presumably because part of his face was blocked and it was so low resolution--is that it didn't recognize the man at the corner of Elm & Houston's face as a face at all.

[Chris Newton]

For example, a while back I tried to use Facebook's facial recognition software (which is quite good) to see if it found a match between the man on the corner of Elm & Houston and known pictures of Rip Robertson.

That's actually a great idea. I've wondered much about using Apple's iPhone fingerprint software to compare the unknown TSBD print with Mac Wallace's. I had seen a fingerprint hack out in the wild somewhere

[Thomas Graves]

Tom,

It was very, very easy. Just googled, in quotation marks, "bill shelley" and then clicked on IMAGES and scrolled down a bit.

And wah law, this is what I just now came up with -- a great, new (to me) website called Prayer Man.

Enjoy!

http://www.prayer-man.com/tsbd/bill-shelley/

--Tommy

[Tom Neal]

Tom,

It was very, very easy. Just googled, in quotation marks, "bill shelley" and then clicked on IMAGES and scrolled down a bit.

And wah law, this is what I just now came up with -- a great, new (to me) website called Prayer Man.

Enjoy!

http://www.prayer-man.com/tsbd/bill-shelley/

--Tommy

Thanks Tommy,

I actually had this one already, but the PM site is new to me, also.

Are the dates for Shelly that I posted correct?

Tom

[Thomas Graves]

Tom,

It was very, very easy. Just googled, in quotation marks, "bill shelley" and then clicked on IMAGES and scrolled down a bit.

And wah law, this is what I just now came up with -- a great, new (to me) website called Prayer Man.

Enjoy!

http://www.prayer-man.com/tsbd/bill-shelley/

--Tommy

Thanks Tommy,

I actually had this one already, but the PM site is new to me, also.

Are the dates for Shelly that I posted correct?

Tom

Tom,

I wouldn't know. That's why I had to read his WC testimony and then, based on his self-described work history and the fact that he said his education consisted of just high school, guess at his age.

I'm afraid I'm not much of a researcher. Too lazy I guess. LOL.

--Tommy

Edited November 8, 2015 by Thomas Graves

[Jon G. Tidd]

I wouldn't recognize Bill Shelley if I tripped over him. I do recognize "photo-man's" haircut, however. It was popular among young men in the early 1960s.

[Paul Trejo]

The Warren Commission interviewed William H. Shelley more than once. On 14 May 1964 in Dallas, Attorney Joseph A. Ball asked Shelley about other weapons he had seen at the TSDB during the week of the JFK assassination:

--------------- BEGIN EXTRACT OF BILL SHELLEY'S WC TESTIMONY 14 MAY 1964 ------------

Mr. BALL. Do you recall seeing a couple of guns in the TSBD Building on the 20th of November 1963?
Mr. SHELLEY. Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL. Where?
Mr. SHELLEY. Just outside Mr. Truly's office on the will-call counter.
Mr. BALL. And how did they get there?
Mr. SHELLEY. Mr. Warren Caster had just purchased them and brought them in and stopped by to see us.
Mr. BALL. Did you handle the guns?
Mr. SHELLEY. I held the .22.
Mr. BALL. And was there another make of gun too -- there was, wasn't there?
Mr. SHELLEY. Yes; I believe there was a .30-06 Mauser that had been converted. It was a foreign make converted to a .30-06.
Mr. BALL. ...And did you ever see them again?
Mr. SHELLEY. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. Had you ever seen any guns in that building before that date?
Mr. SHELLEY. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. Did you ever see any guns in that building between that date and the time the President was shot?
Mr. SHELLEY. No, sir.

--------------- END EXTRACT OF BILL SHELLEY'S WC TESTIMONY 14 MAY 1964 ------------

What's interesting about this testimony is the sighting of a .30.06 Mauser in the TSBD that week. That wasn't the only reported sighting. In a DPD report, on the day of the JFK assassination, the DPD reported it found a .30.06 Mauser on the 6th floor of the TSBD building.

Later, as we know, that entry was scratched out and changed to 6.5 Mannlicher-Carcano. (According to A.J. Weberman, the 6.5 Mannlicher-Carcano rifle was supplied to the DPD by an underground friend of Gerry Patrick Hemming.)

All this suggests that the DPD was inside on the JFK assassination.

Anyway -- getting back to Bill Shelley in New Orleans, watching LHO passing out Fake FPCC leaflets for his Fake FPCC operation out of 544 Camp Street -- we have a very strange scenario developing.

Somebody -- if it wasn't Ruth Paine -- was trying to arrange for LHO to be working at the TSBD building by the time JFK rode through Dallas. General Walker was tracking LHO all year (as we surmise from the Jack Martin Home Movie and from Walker's personal papers).

It would fit perfectly if we could link Bill Shelley with the "Friends of Walker" in Dallas, and with Guy Banister in New Orleans, as well as with the husband of Linnie Mae Randle, who was the person who mentioned the TSBD job to Ruth Paine.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited November 8, 2015 by Paul Trejo

[Thomas Graves]

[...]

What's interesting about this [shelley's] testimony is the sighting of a .30.06 Mauser in the TSBD that week. That wasn't the only reported sighting. In a DPD report, on the day of the JFK assassination, the DPD reported it found a .30.06 Mauser on the 6th floor of the TSBD building. Later, as we know, that entry was scratched out and changed to 6.5 Mannlicher-Carcano.

[...]

Well, Peculiarly Pedantic Paul,

We already know that, don't we.

Do you enjoy lecturing?

--Tommy

Edited November 8, 2015 by Thomas Graves

[Paul Trejo]

Well, it's just interesting that Bill Shelley was also aware of a .30.06 Mauser inside the TSBD during the week JFK was killed.

Now, if Bill Shelley was also in New Orleans watching LHO pass out Fake FPCC leaflets -- then I want to know a lot more about Bill Shelley.

What was his religion? How did he vote? Did he ever serve in the US Army? Did he belong to the JBS? Did he belong to the Minutemen? Did he belong to the "Friends of Walker?"

I want to know. I'm seeking information.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

[Thomas Graves]

Well, it's just interesting that Bill Shelley was also aware of a .30.06 Mauser inside the TSBD during the week JFK was killed.

Now, if Bill Shelley was also in New Orleans watching LHO pass out Fake FPCC leaflets -- then I want to know a lot more about Bill Shelley.

What was his religion? How did he vote? Did he ever serve in the US Army? Did he belong to the JBS? Did he belong to the Minutemen? Did he belong to the "Friends of Walker?"

I want to know. I'm seeking information.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Dear Paul,

Why don't you start your own thread on Bill Shelley?

Inquiring minds want to know.

--Tommy

PS Do you really think that the baby-faced guy at 3:19 in the Black Op Radio video is 38-year-old Bill Shelley?

[Chris Davidson]

Paul,

I believe the frames Martin supplied are from this clip.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwrExtVD005OVm9jMWRSNmJhMU0/view?usp=sharing

chris

[Martin Blank]

I wouldn't recognize Bill Shelley if I tripped over him. I do recognize "photo-man's" haircut, however. It was popular among young men in the early 1960s.

tan jacket man's hair cut was called a new yorker. flat top combined with long sides. when did we get into the fashion business?

[David Andrews]

It's a damned good likeness of Bill Shelley, down to the wardrobe style. Great find, Martin.

If Shelley's in front of the N. O. Trade Mart, what question does that beg about the TSBD management?

To address more recent issues: What does that say about Ruth Paine's and her neighbors' claims to getting Oswald his job at the TSBD? Cover story?

But we all know Ruth Paine wouldn't prevaricate.

Edited November 8, 2015 by David Andrews

[Thomas Graves]

It's a damned good likeness of Bill Shelley, down to the wardrobe style. Great find, Martin.

[...]

LOL Great find my ...

Anyone here besides me old enough to remember Ed "Kookie" Byrnes of the immensely popular TV series 77 Sunset Strip? "Kookie" influenced thousands (if not millions) of us male teenagers and young men to style our hair like his.

"Kookie, Kookie, Lend Me Your Comb" from 1959!!!

--Tommy

Edited November 8, 2015 by Thomas Graves