Scott Kaiser Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 (edited) David, Paul, and the rest of the Dulles haters of this world. I never, ever said Dulles was the "mastermind" or "CEO" and now "pointman." Those words came from ya'll. That's how we say it here in Texas. Edited January 27, 2016 by Scott Kaiser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Schmidt Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 I don't have the book yet, and have a couple of questions. Since the CIA works for the president (ha ha ha ha), how much if at all was Eisenhower involved in the coups in Guatemala and Iran? (What a favor they did for us by helping overthrow a democratically elected government in Iran.) I remember as a youngster the joke about the Eisenhower Doll. "You wind it up and it doesn't do anything for eight years." Some joke, eh? Does the book have much to say about Allen's brother John Foster? All I really remember about him was Carol Burnett's song on the Ed Sullivan Show, "I'm in Love with John Foster Dulles." In fact I think it may have made her career. At least we owe him that. The book covers Eisenhower quite a bit, from how John Foster and Allen got into their seats in the administration and how Ike's perception of them changed over time. He basically deferred how to deal with unfriendly governments to Dulles and didn't have much operational knowledge of the coups, except being impressed by how they were handled. The book discusses how Eisenhower was greatly influenced by John Foster's worldview and basically was silently complicit in these change of governments. In the case of Lumumba, he actually said "get rid of him." Talbot asserts that Eisenhower never fully trusted Allen Dulles and grew to regret keeping him as DCI for as long as he did and felt he was betrayed during the U2 fiasco. As far as how much the book covers John Foster: It's definitely a book centered around Allen, but John Foster is an integral part so it discusses him quite a bit. It goes over their different personalities and complex relationship and gives a broad sense of what John was up to over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ecker Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Brian, thanks. I recall reading somewhere in recent years that John Foster and Allen were both involved with United Fruit (as attorneys?), which would explain their wanting to protect it from the Guatemalan government. Which makes it a textbook case of conflict of interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Schmidt Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 They were, along with a bunch of other officials in the Eisenhower administration. Ike himself had significant investments in United Fruit and I want to say his secretary's husband was on the board of directors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ecker Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 What a bunch of thugs. I remember my family, and most of the country, I guess, were really big on Ike for president. My folks wouldn't dream of voting for Adlai Stevenson because he was a Unitarian, which meant he might as well be an atheist. We needed a good God-fearing man like Ike, who of course would have good God-fearing men in his administration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Kaiser Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 (edited) I believe, to better understand President Eisenhower's motives towards DCI Allen Dulles, one must look at the life of Mr. Eisenhower and how he was desperately wanting to change the way of life for all Americans. President Eisenhower was a five-star general in the United States Army during World War II and served as Supreme Commander of the Allied Forces in Europe. He was responsible for planning and supervising the invasion of North Africa in Operation Torch in 1942-43 and the successful invasion of France and Germany in 1944-45 from the Western Front. Mr. Eisenhower was after all, a five star general who has been apart of some of the most fiercest battles while seen some of the greatest action of war any general had seen, after all, Mr. Eisenhower was not a pencil pushing desk jockey general when he himself was at the forefront of it all. As president of the United States that person takes on another role, to uphold our constitution and persevere freedom and the democratic right to live in a free society, that freedom comes with a cost. President Ronald Reagan said it best, in order to preserve the right to live free we must have the strongest American military second to none. Something to that manner, you get the logistics. Mr. Dulles never had that experience of being president of the United States, in-fact, his position would come as close to any working directly for, and reporting only to the president. What is most important about this story is the fact that Dulles, Truman, Eisenhower and Kennedy have seen a number of wars. There's Pearl Harbor that set into motion WWII, Vietnam, Cambodia, Korea and the cold war. Dulles' job forced him in a position collecting intelligence overtime, not because of these wars, but because America was fighting the one single largest war this world had ever seen at [that] time, communism. We were responsible for the U-2 planes and spying on the Russians while the Russians were doing the same thing to us. We would usher out propaganda regarding communism, and the communist would usher out propaganda regarding democracy. Those days were completely different to have lived in that many of us here, unless we lived in those days we may never fully explain how difficult those days were, we may never really grasp the allegory. What did president Eisenhower do as Commander in Chief up to his last days in office? He warned not only the new and upcoming president about the Military Industrial Complex, but he also at the same time had warned America. Now, when I think of the complex, I don't necessary regard it to one man, and blame Dulles for everything. His position as DCI at times forced him to make the decision he made as what all good CEO's of any company would do. The CEO I'm speaking of would undoubtedly be the president of the United States, and as Chief Executive Officer one has to allow the other officers [to make that call]. Many of you will not understand what I'm saying for lack of a better debate, and that's okay. But, when you begin to understand that our [job positions] is what forces us to make the decisions we make daily, then and only then will you begin to understand. I said it before, and I'll say it again, Allen Dulles, although he has been at the forefront of some of the fiercest battles against America, while undermining communism with sheer propaganda. I wholeheartedly believe that Dulles' only single role in Kennedy's assassination is to do what he knew best, cover it up. Have a good day gentlemen, Scott Kaiser Edited January 27, 2016 by Scott Kaiser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Kaiser Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 ^Edited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James DiEugenio Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 (edited) The best book on Eisenhower is The Declassified Eisenhower by Blanche W. Cook. Talk about an eye opener. While running Columbia after the war, Ike got taken to school by the CFR crowd. Which was right in the neighborhood. This is why when Truman wanted him to run as a Democrat, he refused and ran as a Republican. And this is why he chose the Dulles Brothers to run his foreign policy. Edited January 27, 2016 by James DiEugenio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Andrews Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 (edited) Delete, please. Edited January 27, 2016 by David Andrews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Kaiser Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 (edited) Delete, please. I'm reminded of a kid at a candy store whose parents say no! You are not going to eat your candy before dinner and spoil your appetite. But, I am also reminded of a little kid who didn't get the christmas gift he's been bugging his parents about, now son, pay attention, because I'm only going to say this for the last time. Dulles' only role in Kennedy's assassination was to cover it up. Scott Kaiser Edited January 27, 2016 by Scott Kaiser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Brancato Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 And your source is a son of CIA's Bissell. What are his bonafides? What would you expect his father to say? Why would you or he think his father was telling the truth, or just the truth as he saw it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Brancato Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 I know I've been leaning on you a bit about this. But it seems to me that the source for your opinion, or knowledge, is a poor one on its face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Kaiser Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 (edited) And your source is a son of CIA's Bissell. What are his bonafides? What would you expect his father to say? Why would you or he think his father was telling the truth, or just the truth as he saw it? I always welcome an intelligent debate vs having to censor, edit or delete a topic to fit someone's agenda so that different views are always welcomed, as there is not one side or the other, but rather an open debate of the said topic. Paul, you say, "And your source is a son of CIA's Bissell. What are his bonafides? What would you expect his father to say? Why would you or he think his father was telling the truth, or just the truth as he saw it?" Can you tell me what the difference is between a son of a CIA man and a conspiracy theorist? Edited January 27, 2016 by Scott Kaiser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Kaiser Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 ^Edited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Kaiser Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 I know I've been leaning on you a bit about this. But it seems to me that the source for your opinion, or knowledge, is a poor one on its face. That's okay, we all other then me make mistakes... Apologize accepted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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