WHEN does Oswald crystallize into the patsy?

[Paul Trejo]

On ‎8‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 5:13 PM, Jason Ward said:

Harry Dean, thank you very very much.   In my what you have to say is more valuable than any of us who came later and are mere students or commentators.   Is it  your belief that Oswald has no CIA connection until the fall of 63?

kind regards

Jason Ward

Jason,

The following is my opinion.

After speaking with Harry Dean at length over the years, I will venture a response from his Radical Right CT.

During the Fall of 1963, when Harry Dean first heard the name of Lee Harvey Oswald, he heard it in the context of the Radical Right in SoCal in mid-September, 1963, and Harry believed what he heard, namely, that Lee Harvey Oswald was an officer of the FPCC.

It did not occur to Harry Dean at that time that this was a Fake FPCC.

The claim was serious to Harry Dean, because in 1961-1962 Harry Dean himself was actually a member of the FPCC, and in fact was a Secretary of the FPCC in Chicago.

When Harry Dean heard Ex-General Walker name this New Orleans "officer of the FPCC" as the Patsy of this JFK plot, he cheered and warned everybody about Oswald, because he knew from experience that FPCC officers could be armed and dangerous.

At the same time, Harry told me, he had heard so much baloney talk amongst the SoCal Minutemen and JBS members, about how to kill JFK, that he really didn't take it seriously.  He really thought people were just blowing off more steam.  Harry believed that the real purpose of the JBS was to shift the USA further to the Right Wing, so that the mood of the USA would elect a Republican for President.  Harry really didn't believe that there would be a real attempt on JFK.

When JFK really was killed -- Harry Dean was shocked.  But when Lee Harvey Oswald was named as the killer -- Harry Dean was speechless.  He himself had been part of the plot.

From what Harry Dean told me, the CIA was never part of the JFK plot.  It was entirely a Radical Right Conspiracy from the start.   So, if CIA rogues were involved, then they were taking orders from the Radical Right -- some of whom had substantial military and paramilitary experience.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

[Harry J.Dean]

Jason

My (later observation) re; Oswald's connections was

 

In the south central U.S.

Was a Federal spy

Lee Oswald, by name

In the same job as I.

 

[Jason Ward]

4 hours ago, Harry J.Dean said:

Jason

My (later observation) re; Oswald's connections was

 

In the south central U.S.

Was a Federal spy

Lee Oswald, by name

In the same job as I.

 

Harry,

Many thanks for talking with me.   Is there anyone else you feel we should look at?  Someone who is still a little hidden after all these years?

Jason

[Harry J.Dean]

Jason

cannot offer any person or item other than those covered in 1990 Ms/book CROSSTRAILS  and or 

exposed by assassination researchers.

[Michael Clark]

9 hours ago, Harry J.Dean said:

In the south central U.S.

Was a Federal spy

Lee Oswald, by name

In the same job as I.

 

Love that Harry.

Cogent and brief

Accept my apologies 

If my words caused you grief.

 

Cheers,

Michael

[Chuck Schwartz]

Per Antonio Veciano, LHO met DAP in late Sept. 1963, in Dallas.  I believe the purpose of that meeting was to inform LHO he would be handled by DAP and that at that meeting, DAP had decided to make LHO the fall guy for the JFK hit. (DAP did not tell LHO this)

[Paul Trejo]

On 8/28/2017 at 8:05 AM, Chuck Schwartz said:

Per Antonio Veciano, LHO met DAP in late Sept. 1963, in Dallas.  I believe the purpose of that meeting was to inform LHO he would be handled by DAP and that at that meeting, DAP had decided to make LHO the fall guy for the JFK hit. (DAP did not tell LHO this)

Chuck,

That is the common CIA-did-it opinion.  It is based on facts mingled with speculation.

If you go by DAP's novel manuscript, "The AMLASH Legacy," he says that he was using LHO to try to kill Fidel Castro, but somebody hijacked him to kill JFK.

The Radical Right has their fingers all over LHO during 1963, starting with the New Orleans period. 

Fifty years of CIA-did-it CT literature is merely repetitive.  It's time to dig deeper into the Radical Right CT of the JFK assassination.

That's my opinion, and it seems to be the growing opinion.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited August 30, 2017 by Paul Trejo
typos

[Chuck Schwartz]

The "radical right" is a subset of the CIA.

[Paul Brancato]

1 hour ago, Chuck Schwartz said:

The "radical right" is a subset of the CIA.

Trejo doesn't get that. I've tried many times to argue this with him. Who could argue for instance that Walker was such, but not LeMay and Lemnitzer? Or Hoover, whose agents heavily infiltrated CPUSA but not JBS? 

As for CIA, Angleton has obvious fascist connections in Italy. And Dulles was the point man in the OSS who protected Nazis from prosecution, and his law firm Sullivan and Cromwell were pro Nazi before and during WW2. I could go on. 

Its sad that Trejo, whose prime sentence taken alone most of us would agree with - that it was the radical right - is so myopic when it comes to defining them, and so bent on defending the CIA and FBI that he has on many occasions here called Hoover and Dulles American heroes. What a disconnect, big enough to fly a Starfleet cruiser through.

[Paul Trejo]

6 hours ago, Chuck Schwartz said:

The "radical right" is a subset of the CIA.

Chuck,

The following is my opinion.

The Radical Right is the racist wing in US politics.  In 1963 its main issue was Earl Warren's Brown Decision to racially integrate US public schools.

The CIA has no interest of any kind in white supremacy or racism.   So, you're entirely mistaken.   So is Paul Brancato on this topic.

It's sad when somebody can't tell the difference between the Confederate Flag and the CIA.   

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 4, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Jason Ward]

6 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

Trejo doesn't get that. I've tried many times to argue this with him. Who could argue for instance that Walker was such, but not LeMay and Lemnitzer? Or Hoover, whose agents heavily infiltrated CPUSA but not JBS? 

As for CIA, Angleton has obvious fascist connections in Italy. And Dulles was the point man in the OSS who protected Nazis from prosecution, and his law firm Sullivan and Cromwell were pro Nazi before and during WW2. I could go on. 

Its sad that Trejo, whose prime sentence taken alone most of us would agree with - that it was the radical right - is so myopic when it comes to defining them, and so bent on defending the CIA and FBI that he has on many occasions here called Hoover and Dulles American heroes. What a disconnect, big enough to fly a Starfleet cruiser through.

What benefit is gained by the CIA in assassinating JFK?

 

Jason

[George Sawtelle]

Jason

No bennies. The CIA did not kill Kennedy. Neither did LBJ, General Walker, H L Hunt,  military industrial complex.

There was only one man who could marshall the forces necessary to pull off the assassination and cover it up. Allen Dulles ordered the hit and as Warren Commission member covered it up.

[Jason Ward]

20 hours ago, George Sawtelle said:

Jason

No bennies. The CIA did not kill Kennedy. Neither did LBJ, General Walker, H L Hunt,  military industrial complex.

There was only one man who could marshall the forces necessary to pull off the assassination and cover it up. Allen Dulles ordered the hit and as Warren Commission member covered it up.

Well I can see your point that there is no benefit for the CIA in killing Kennedy.  A lot of people spend a lot of time trying to prove the CIA did it even though it wasn't beneficial for them to do so...anyway, what is the benefit to Allen Dulles of killing Kennedy?

 

Jason

[Paul Trejo]

20 hours ago, George Sawtelle said:

Jason

No bennies. The CIA did not kill Kennedy. Neither did LBJ, General Walker, H L Hunt,  military industrial complex.

There was only one man who could marshall the forces necessary to pull off the assassination and cover it up. Allen Dulles ordered the hit and as Warren Commission member covered it up.

George,

The following is my opinion.

Without the full cooperation of the US Government, at all levels, there could never, ever have been any JFK Cover-up at all.

The JFK assassination was covered-up by the Full US Government.  This is proved by the fact that US Supreme Court Justice Earl Warren censored thousands of pages of JFK evidence from public viewing for up to 75 years.

However -- just because the US Government engineered the JFK Cover-up, does not mean that the US Government killed JFK.  On the contrary, the  Radical Right (centered in the South) killed JFK.  

But in 1963, as today in 2017, the USA has no will to go after its Radical Right wing.  It reminds us too much of the Civil War -- something we never want to repeat again.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited September 5, 2017 by Paul Trejo

[Jason Ward]

29 minutes ago, Paul Trejo said:

....  On the contrary, the  Radical Right (centered in the South) killed JFK.  

....

 

Paul,

I've come across a few points to run by you.

1. IIRC, James Early Ray is a Bircher and his brother shows up at a Bannister-connected attorney asking for advice when Ray is arrested.   It seems to me the assassination era of political violence in the US was in service of one side only.   

2. Meanwhile, as I'm ploughing through the document dumps for the MFF, it's clear that the CIA is totally obsessed with dislodging Castro in 63, and little else.   They are ostentatiously hiring every Cuban they can find who says they are against Castro, which is just about all the Cubans once they hear about the CIA gravy train.   Nowhere is their hostility towards Kennedy in the records I see - from management nor hired operators.  

3.  Also, the anti-Castro aspect of the anti-Castro Cubans is clearly more about getting a CIA handout than it is about any desire to risk life and limb in a counter-revolution.  The Cubans talk a big game but deliver nothing, while constantly asking for money.  They take a lot of CIA cash but manage only comical theatrics and schoolboy adventures - for 8-10 years.  In my view the alleged "passion" against Castro is no passion at all, and highly confined to a few ex-Batista cronies.  It's much the same with the Vietnamese, Iraqis, Afghanis, Syrians, and all the others who show up yelling about freedom and democracy when Uncle Sam opens up his big fat wallet - but in reality these types neither care nor can they deliver anything they promise.  

None of these so-called anti-Castro Cubans actually want to go back to Cuba after they taste America - regardless of their rhetoric.  Miami presents more opportunity for Cubans before, during, and after all the Castro nonsense - they are anti-Castro mainly because the US pays them to be anti-Castro.

4. The FBI is growing more and more intense in their study of the Birchers, Hargis, Milteer, the Christian Crusade, etc. in the early 60s.  Someone above said these groups weren't penetrated - but that is very far from the case.  Hoover sent more and more agents and paid informants to infiltrate these groups from Little Rock on; the cable traffic reveals a serious fear in Hoover's mind.  The Ole Miss episode and aftermath saw a massive FBI domestic intelligence operation.

5. But for me to fully buy your Walker-did-it-CT, I'd need to see some clear evidence that Walker's on the top and giving orders.  Otherwise, for now it seems a justifiable conclusion is that the Right is the prime mover, but Walker as indisputable leader is not so obvious.   I can imagine that Walker may be a public and operational leader, but my sense is that hidden men like Hunt-Murchison give him the fuel to "succeed."

 

Jason

 

 

Edited September 5, 2017 by Jason Ward