The inevitable end result of our last 56 years

[Guest]

Been saying this a while, impending food crisis. Something like 1/3 of the world's grain comes from that region. 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61171529

 

[Douglas Caddy]

[Paul Brancato]

General question, but directed at Kirk’s criticism of Ben’s suggestion that a no fly zone might be appropriate.
what’s the difference between arming Ukraine and protecting Ukraine? Is it just putting Americans in harms way? How does a no fly zone invite Russian escalation? I’ve been against it from the beginning, but I’m starting to question the logic behind the opposition to a no fly zone.

 

[Guest]

30 minutes ago, Paul Brancato said:

General question, but directed at Kirk’s criticism of Ben’s suggestion that a no fly zone might be appropriate.
what’s the difference between arming Ukraine and protecting Ukraine? Is it just putting Americans in harms way? How does a no fly zone invite Russian escalation? I’ve been against it from the beginning, but I’m starting to question the logic behind the opposition to a no fly zone.

 

It’s a very good question. 
 

The question I have is; do we know what is going on in the skies right now? I see images in western media of downed Russian planes. I have not as yet seen a Ukrainian planes downed but, I may be guilty of not looking hard enough. They do have a much smaller air force (Ukraine) but, are they getting assistance with hardware? 
 

By having a no fly zone, who does it benefit the most? What is the objective of those directing the conflict, on either side?! 
 

We obviously want to stop the loss of life and destruction. Sometimes actions dressed as well intended, sometimes have the opposite effect. 

[Benjamin Cole]

4 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

General question, but directed at Kirk’s criticism of Ben’s suggestion that a no fly zone might be appropriate.
what’s the difference between arming Ukraine and protecting Ukraine? Is it just putting Americans in harms way? How does a no fly zone invite Russian escalation? I’ve been against it from the beginning, but I’m starting to question the logic behind the opposition to a no fly zone.

 

Paul-

My guess (and everything is a guess given the fog of war, and M$M) is that the Russians are using more missiles than bombers, and the NFZ is a good idea, but maybe not critical. Still, the NFZ sends a signal. 

That said, it is painful to watch missiles being launched into civilian populations. In addition the photos of Mariupol are undeniable. 

My guess is that diplomatic efforts will fail to end this war, and this appears to be a war perpetrated by an aggressor, that being Putin. No one was planning to invade Russia, and no country armed with nukes has ever been invaded. The "self-defense" argument posited by some Russia supporters does not hold water. 

With a great deal of reluctance, I think a kinetic interdiction is warranted. 

As stated, surely European nations should take the lead. Nevertheless, Biden has been feeble, inert, adrift. 

Biden's pre-invasion stance all but invited a thug like Putin into Ukraine, and after that he offered Zelensky refuge---a clear signal the West was willing to partition Kyiv to Putin. 

The globalist view of the world is that what is best for multinationals is what counts. They can do business with Putin, and were doing business with Putin, and would do business with him in Ukraine. Biden is a lifer DC-denizen, ergo a globalist, ala Cheney, ala Bush, ala Hillary.

What is spooky is how deep into bed with the Beijing-CCP the globalists are. Xi just crushed free speech in Hong Kong and put a million fellow humans into concentration camps in western China. 

Not a peep from Apple, Disney, BlackRock, Tesla, Goldman Sachs, WalMart, GM et al. Or the craven hypocrites at the NBA. 

The US operates a global guard service for multinationals, at a cost of $ 1 trillion a year. Nothing has changed under Biden. 

 

 

 

Edited April 22, 2022 by Benjamin Cole

[Douglas Caddy]

Proud Boy threatens FBI Agent.

Proud Boys member under investigation made threatening call to FBI agent | The Hill

 

[Benjamin Cole]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/04/21/desantis-war-on-disney-gop-future/

 

What a story. 

Interesting take: Corporate give-aways, and even self-governance (!) are good, if Disney is the corporation. 

"It will also point to a potential future Republican Party that envisions an expanded use of state power to fight the culture wars in a much broader and more pernicious sense."---WaPo

There is some truth in this. But is not the reverse also true? When the Donks fight culture wars through state-corporate powers---that is clean and wonderful?

Does anyone in the public realm in America today dare say, "Due to my religion, I have reservations about, and cannot support, the gay lifestyle?" 

What were happen to any faulty member at any university who said this? 

And who benefits from these silly, petty culture wars that the WaPo and NYT and Fox highlight and magnify daily? 

 

 

[Ron Bulman]

4 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

General question, but directed at Kirk’s criticism of Ben’s suggestion that a no fly zone might be appropriate.
what’s the difference between arming Ukraine and protecting Ukraine? Is it just putting Americans in harms way? How does a no fly zone invite Russian escalation? I’ve been against it from the beginning, but I’m starting to question the logic behind the opposition to a no fly zone.

 

I think it's still the nuclear threat.  Is putin unhinged, desparate?  If We/Nato enforce a no fly zone by shooting down a Russian aircraft how will he respond?  With nuclear weapons? A situation that could easily escalate

Edited April 22, 2022 by Ron Bulman

[Benjamin Cole]

"Former President Obama placed blame on tech companies for failing to address the disinformation problem he said the industry has amplified during a speech Thursday at Stanford University."--The Hill

---

Obama calls for more regulatory oversight of social media giants.--NYT

Tech companies’ power has “turbocharged” political division and requires government scrutiny, former President Barack Obama said at Stanford.

---30---

Ooof. 

The Donks want to end free speech on social media? Or just incorrect speech? As defined by who? 

No concerns about corporate-state sanctioned speech only? 

So, the "Wuhan lab leak" story get banned....and everyone is cool with that? 

Should social media resemble, say, the kind of speech tolerated on an Ivy League campus? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Benjamin Cole]

Obama Slams Misinformation on Social Media: 'People Are Dying'---C/NET

If the premise is that "misinformation" is killing people, then the next step is that speech must be regulated. 

And from there....

[Kirk Gallaway]

As Ron says, that's the danger of escalation.  When Ben was first calling for a no fly zone. . Russia didn't have air superiority and 2 months in, still doesn't. I'm not sure if they've tried and don't want to push it. There are things we don't understand. But there's no problem  getting  our tactical weapons inside Ukraine up to now..But Russia's threatening to stop that. Everything on one level seems so measured. Ben talks about Poland being our proxy army, but I haven't read where they are at willing to do that. They've only offered to give us their Soviet era Mig 29 flying jets  for us to use if we replenish them.. Which apparently surprised us. Now Slovakia is offering some Mig 29's, and are scheduled to  upgrade to our  F-16's in 2024. So they don't expect that they might need to use them for themselves in the meantime?

As I was saying a month ago,, nothing can stop Russia from just lobbing bombs into East Ukraine, and that's what's going on. Is it now just a matter of Putin accepting the hollowest victory? You have to wonder if the largely pro Russian Ukrainians in the East can really approve of being bombed out of their homes and livelihoods?

Maybe that can curiously offer a road to a peaceful settlement. Obviously Ukraine's going to have to give up Crimea, but maybe that 20% corridor could be established as  an independent region? Of course, I'm not sure how that would really work.

To hear us tell it, it's been a huge Russian disaster. As far as having high hopes to rush in and overtake the country and install a regime change. I do tend to think that was a hope. So in that limited sense, it's a failure. But I don't necessarily accept the west's claims that Putin is as desperate as we portray him.

Then there's always that gambit possibility.  Could the attempted, then failed invasion of Kiev just end up being a plan B ploy to give the west some victory to save face?, while Putin's hoping to get an Eastern corridor out of it? Could he be that clever? It may not be likely but.....Whoa!

[Benjamin Cole]

for comic relief...

[Douglas Caddy]

 

 

Putin is seen gripping a table amid cancer battle rumours as he meets 'slurring' defence minister | Daily Mail Online

 

[Ron Bulman]

"I'm not getting in that car."

Jan. 6 revelations will 'blow the roof off the House,' Rep. Jamie Raskin says (msn.com)

[David Andrews]

15 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

 Obviously Ukraine's going to have to give up Crimea, but maybe that 20% corridor could be established as  an independent region?

Look for a partition deal floated that gives Russia the eastern region of Donbas, up to Donetsk, plus northern border provinces east and west for "democratic security."  The Don River valley is historically Russian-dominated, and could be a moneymaker for Russia long-term. 

"Quiet flows the Don" - until redevelopment.  It could become a version of the Pearl River valley in industrialized China.

Edited April 22, 2022 by David Andrews