Backyard photos

[Pete Mellor]

10 minutes ago, Richard Booth said:

I am skeptical of this because they took so damn long to come forward, over 20 years.

It reminds me a lot of the bogus story given by Gordon Arnold.

I believe that the conspirators, if they were making phony pictures, would have developed them themselves and not taken them to a non-secure commercial developer like the Hesters. 

Yeah Richard another weird account, in a case of so many weird ones!   They were supposedly developing assassination photos for DPD & FBI.  At that time on the 22nd a BYP with no figure wouldn't be so profound.  But I agree, I take a lot of these with more than a pinch of salt.

[Richard Booth]

1 minute ago, Pete Mellor said:

Yeah Richard another weird account, in a case of so many weird ones!   They were supposedly developing assassination photos for DPD & FBI.  At that time on the 22nd a BYP with no figure wouldn't be so profound.  But I agree, I take a lot of these with more than a pinch of salt.

I look at it this way:

If I were involved in a conspiracy, and I'm framing this guy, and I'm taking phony pictures, what would I do?  Would I go take photos and have them developed and violate basic principles of operational security? No way. I'd develop those pictures myself. 

DPD and FBI were fully able to develop pictures themselves, having entire departments devoted to this. If we believe that DPD was involved in forging pictures, Roscoe White could have developed them himself. And he would have. 

So the Hesters' story not only doesn't make much sense, it also came about many years after the fact which is a further dent in it's credibility. 

While I believe firmly there was a conspiracy, I do tend to be skeptical of some things when it makes sense be skeptical. 

[Chris Bristow]

On 9/5/2020 at 10:48 PM, Richard Booth said:

I agree

It's no coincidence that almost all of the incriminating evidence was found at Mrs. Paine's home, that Oswald got his TSBD job through Ruth Paine, that Paine got Marine to come live with her for the express purpose, I think, of being the method by which evidence would be funneled to the DPD post assassination.

Paine's CIA connections are very obvious: Her dad via USAID, sister as a psychologist, as you said.

Then we have Paine working in Nicaragua in the 1980s where she's asking "deeply personal" questions of aid workers which caused them to believe that she worked for the CIA.

Ya I remember the day I learned about all her CIA connections I just kept shaking my head.

[Richard Booth]

1 hour ago, Chris Bristow said:

Ya I remember the day I learned about all her CIA connections I just kept shaking my head.

It was quite obvious, I take the Salandria position that so much of this case is in-your-face obvious and apparent.

It was only later mostly confirmed when the Nicaragua stuff and USAID stuff came to light.

This is from Kennedy Assassination Chronicles, 1998, by Steve Jones:

http://jfklancer.com/pdf/Paine.pdf

Then there is the stuff about the Paines having 3x4 file-card cabinets in their garage which had the names and personal details of left wing sympathizers in it. They were clearly collecting intelligence there very much like ole' Guy Bannister did. 

She was also clearly used as a conduit for tampered-with or phony evidence, all that stuff found at her house.

I have some major issues understanding Marina Oswald (given all the lies she told, given that she concealed how well she spoke English) but she even immediately severed contact with Ruth Paine and said it was because of Paine's connection to the CIA.

In my ever evolving theory on Marina, that was merely a calculated move: Paine never was really her friend, and now that the "job" is done they didn't need to associate. In this theory Marina is some kind of asset, to my mind. The fact she spoke fluent English at 17 years old in Russia and made contact with both American defectors Webster and Oswald speaks to how she had to have been a KGB asset in Russia. She was a honey trap. The fact she freely moved around from Leningrad to Minsk, something ordinary Soviet citizens were not free to do, is also suspect. I theorize that Marina was a compromised KGB honeytrap that we might have flipped, and the Soviets discovered this. Normally they would have liquidated her, but I see perhaps some special arrangement where they let her leave the country with Oswald instead of being killed. She has no choice in the matter, die or go with Oswald and both leave. So she lands in the USA with Oswald as a person beholden to the CIA: her marriage and escape from Russia could well be viewed as an ex-filtration. In this theory, all of the bogus incriminating things she said about Oswald begin to make sense. 

What doesn't make sense is her flipping and saying that it was a conspiracy and Lee Oswald was innocent. There could be lots of variables we don't know which explain that. 

Her marriage to Porter doesn't make any sense either. So much about all this that is obscured and difficult to reach a conclusion you have confidence in.  

[Joe Bauer]

I have never researched Marina's husband Porter outside of general reading about them both.

From that I am wondering what the attraction was on Marina's part?

Did Porter sweep Marina off her feet? If so, how?

Was he more a father figure which Marina never had outside of her uncle?

Marina was still a very beautiful ( and even sexy ) young woman with mesmerizing blue eyes when she met and married him. 

I assumed Marina was pursued by countless men after she got through the worst trauma time after 11,22,1963.

Just from that first nationally broadcast interview of Marina ( "Marina, what do you do all day?") I was smitten with her myself like millions of other men I am sure.

Marina could have had her pick of so many men, good looking, wealthy, exciting lives.

Again, knowing so little about Porter I am just guessing but he seemed like kind of a dud socially and I didn't see the physical attraction chemistry which I always assumed was a big deal with Marina.

From the WC testimony of Jeane De Mohrenschildts Marina frequently complained to her that Oswald didn't meet her sexual needs. Maybe Porter was quite the stud in this department?

Just an aside, didn't everywhere news coverage Dallas super reporter Hugh Aynesworth claim he once bedded Marina himself?

Marina was always an enigma. A very attractive and intriguing one.

If she had looked like the typical Cold War propaganda Russian plow pushing woman with thick arms and ankles and weathered face there wouldn't have been the massive interest in her that there always has been.

 

Edited September 9, 2020 by Joe Bauer

[Richard Booth]

5 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

I have never researched Marina's husband Porter outside of general reading about them both.

From that I am wondering what the attraction was on Marina's part?

Did Porter sweep Marina off her feet? If so, how?

Was he more a father figure which Marina never had outside of her uncle?

Marina was still a very beautiful ( and even sexy ) young woman with mesmerizing blue eyes when she met and married him. 

I assumed Marina was pursued by countless men after she got through the worst trauma time after 11,22,1963.

Just from that first nationally broadcast interview of Marina ( "Marina, what do you do all day?") I was smitten with her myself like millions of other men I am sure.

Marina could have had her pick with so many men, good looking, wealthy, exciting lives.

Again, knowing so little about Porter I am just guessing but he seemed like kind of a dud socially and I didn't see the physical attraction chemistry which I always assumed was a big deal with Marina.

From all the WC testimony of Jeane De Mohrenschildts Marina frequently complained to her that Oswald didn't meet her sexual needs. Maybe Porter was quite the stud in this department?

Just an aside, didn't everywhere news coverage Dallas super reporter Hugh Aynesworth claim he once bedded Marina himself?

Marina was always an enigma. A very attractive and intriguing one.

If she had looked like the typical Cold War propaganda Russian plow pushing woman with thick arms and ankles and weathered face there wouldn't have been the massive interest in her that there always has been.

 

I've seen photographs of them from around '68 and the guy looks like a handsome person. However my understanding is that this man worked for a CIA contractor. Collins Radio, same place as Carl Mather. 

Now that's not terribly impossible but at this point when do the "happenstances" end? 

If Aynesworth said that I wouldn't at all be surprised, the slimebucket that he is.

These days Marina looks like a man wearing a wig:

 

Edited September 8, 2020 by Richard Booth

[Joe Bauer]

1 hour ago, Richard Booth said:

I've seen photographs of them from around '68 and the guy looks like a handsome person. However my understanding is that this man worked for a CIA contractor. Collins Radio, same place as Carl Mather. 

Now that's not terribly impossible but at this point when do the "happenstances" end? 

If Aynesworth said that I wouldn't at all be surprised, the slimebucket that he is.

These days Marina looks like a man wearing a wig:

 

Stunning youthful and middle age female beauty is a cruel gift upon it's departing.

Have you seen current pictures of Brigitte Bardot, Ursulla Andrus, Goldie Hawn, Kathleen Turner and countless others?

Still, it's a beautiful sight to behold in it's full bloom as it was for Marina Oswald in her day.

Did Marina ever discuss in any interview or book, what it was about Porter that made her choose him in the ultimate intimacy union over anyone else?

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 8, 2020 by Joe Bauer

[Richard Booth]

14 minutes ago, Joe Bauer said:

Did Marina ever discuss in any interview or book, what it was about Porter that made her choose him in the ultimate intimacy union over anyone else?

I don't think so. It is something I've been curious about for some time. 

Here are some photos, then and now:

It's quite the mystery. 

A recent article...from a tabloid...is interesting:

Close friend and documentary film maker Keya Morgan, said Mrs Porter now believes her first husband was set up to take the fall for conspirators in the CIA and Mafia.

The grandmother is said to be convinced her phones are still tapped by the Secret Service and lives in fear of being targeted and killed by spooks herself.

I think there are things which she could say which would cause people to forever look at this case differently, and I think the same thing can be said about Buell Frazier.

What I would like to know is where she was taught to speak English, and who taught her. I'm also interested in knowing how she came to meet Mr. Porter and what he did for a living when they met.

 

 

Edited September 8, 2020 by Richard Booth

[Joe Bauer]

51 minutes ago, Richard Booth said:

I don't think so. It is something I've been curious about for some time. 

Here are some photos, then and now:

 

 

It's quite the mystery. 

A recent article...from a tabloid...is interesting:

Close friend and documentary film maker Keya Morgan, said Mrs Porter now believes her first husband was set up to take the fall for conspirators in the CIA and Mafia.

The grandmother is said to be convinced her phones are still tapped by the Secret Service and lives in fear of being targeted and killed by spooks herself.

I think there are things which she could say which would cause people to forever look at this case differently, and I think the same thing can be said about Buell Frazier.

What I would like to know is where she was taught to speak English, and who taught her. I'm also interested in knowing how she came to meet Mr. Porter and what he did for a living when they met.

 

 

Marina is Movie Star stunning in the picture above - seriously.

Those eyes!  Big, beautiful, blue and sexy. 

On the other hand I don't see Porter as handsome.

And in this picture he seems dour. Thought Marina had enough of dour with Lee Oswald.

Quite a mis-match if you ask me.

Doug Caddy has spoken to Marina. I think she may have revealed something to him personally that she hasn't to others.

Marina was so manipulated up to and beyond the Warren Commission hearings.

Just in that first televised interview ( when she was what...just 22 years old?), she gave an answer to the question of whether she thought Lee was guilty of shooting the president by replying with this ...

"I no want to believe Lee was guilty, but I have too many facts...and facts tell me Lee did shoot the president."

Oh please!

That is one of the most contrived and obviously scripted lines that stood out like a huge herpes lip sore as not being something from Marina's own mind and mouth, imo.

 

Edited September 8, 2020 by Joe Bauer

[Richard Booth]

1 hour ago, Joe Bauer said:

Marina is Movie Star stunning in the picture above - seriously.

Those eyes!  Big, beautiful, blue and sexy. 

On the other hand I don't see Porter as handsome.

And in this picture he seems dour. Thought Marina had enough of dour with Lee Oswald.

Quite a mis-match if you ask me.

Doug Caddy has spoken to Marina. I think she may have revealed something to him personally that she hasn't to others.

Marina was so manipulated up to and beyond the Warren Commission hearings.

Just in that first televised interview ( when she was what...just 22 years old?), she gave an answer to the question of whether she thought Lee was guilty of shooting the president by replying with this ...

"I no want to believe Lee was guilty, but I have too many facts...and facts tell me Lee did shoot the president."

Oh please!

That is one of the most contrived and obviously scripted lines that stood out like a huge herpes lip sore as not being something from Marina's own mind and mouth, imo.

 

I suppose I should qualify my description. I would not describe the guy as handsome, my statement was more to say he wasn't ugly. He just looks like a generic guy. Just some guy, if you saw him at the 7/11 you wouldn't really remember him. He's average. 

It wouldn't be the first time you see an average guy with an above average girlfriend or wife. Honestly, in my experience, the better looking a woman is the lower her confidence level. And in this case, Marina's confidence had to be destroyed: she was married to the man everyone told her had killed the President. I think that would have destroyed her confidence. 

The most interesting thing to me is the man's job, and how the two of them met. From what I have read this guy worked for a CIA subsidiary and that to me is incredibly suspicious. For a CIA contractor, would it not cause you to lose your job or be considered a security risk if you married a woman from Russia who had been married to the man who killed the President?

So I'm curious what this guy did for a living, and if he continued to be employed by Collins radio.

I agree with you that Marina's words sound false. We have to remember that she lied so much to the HSCA that they prepared a report about all of her lies. She was lucky she wasn't indicted for perjury given that an article of indictment was prepared for David Phillips and Ann Goodpasture. Marina should have been indicted. She lied constantly.

Her lies, her speaking English when she's a 17 year old Soviet citizen, these things tell me there is more to Marina than we have ever considered. 

I think she was a honey trap in the USSR and either she came over here with Oswald as a KGB asset, or her coming here was a part of an agreement where the USSR allowed a disloyal traitor to leave the country. In the latter scenario, Marina is working for the Americans and somehow her cover is blown, and the KGB agrees to let her just leave rather than arrest and kill which is what normally would happen. The latter scenario is also unlikely given the Soviets' typical behavior towards traitors was to immediately call them into the office or arrest them and then to torture a confession out of them, while they are told "the only chance you have is to tell us everything" and as soon as they do--boom. Marina, however, is the only example I have ever seen of a female agent and perhaps the Soviets would have handled a female honeytrap's exposure differently. With more mercy. Just let her leave with that loser Oswald, and clean their hands of her. 

The second scenario I mention above is unlikely, as we'd expect the Soviets to kill her if she were a traitor. However, it gives me no comfort to consider the first scenario: where she's a witting KGB or GRU asset who comes here to work for them. 

The most important thing about her is that she spoke English and that she had relationships with two American defectors, Robert Webster and LHO. This tells me she absolutely had to have been an asset. 

Remember that she lied about her English language ability and so did Priscilla MacMillan. When MacMillan tells the absurd story about Oswald claiming he wanted Marina to help him hijack an airplane, MacMillan is sure to remind the audience that Marina couldn't have done that "because she doesn't speak English" -- MacMillan and Marina both there are concealing her language ability. 

She spoke fluent English to Robert Webster and LHO in Russia, and she spoke English in 1963/64 for a contract negotiation. That English language ability is a key indicator. 

Edited September 8, 2020 by Richard Booth

[Ty Carpenter]

The guy looks like JD Tippett.

[Richard Booth]

12 minutes ago, Ty Carpenter said:

The guy looks like JD Tippett.

I see the resemblance. 

People have said Tippit looked like JFK which I disagree with. I see what you mean though. 

[Mark Stevens]

I have an article with someone knowledgeable of Marina, I believe it is an author and I want to say McMillan (I can't see her saying this though) in which the person is asked something regarding "the one thing Marina wishes people knew" or something along those lines. The comment attributed to Marina is "when the police came the afternoon JFK was shot Lee's rifle was in the garage." I cannot find the reference at the moment but I will continue to look.

Is anyone familiar with this statement from Marina?

[Richard Booth]

2 hours ago, Mark Stevens said:

I have an article with someone knowledgeable of Marina, I believe it is an author and I want to say McMillan (I can't see her saying this though) in which the person is asked something regarding "the one thing Marina wishes people knew" or something along those lines. The comment attributed to Marina is "when the police came the afternoon JFK was shot Lee's rifle was in the garage." I cannot find the reference at the moment but I will continue to look.

Is anyone familiar with this statement from Marina?

First I have heard of that.  I doubt McMillan would ever say that in any way, she does make lots of things up but it's always slanted in one way. 

Interested in hearing what that is when you find it.

[Joe Bauer]

3 hours ago, Ty Carpenter said:

 

Gosh ...you're right Ty!

And Marina in her old age picture above resembles Caitlyn Jenner imo.