W. Niederhut Posted March 21, 2023 Share Posted March 21, 2023 3 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said: Excellent commentary---for the Trump thread. Ben, I don't want to beat a dead horse about forum administration and the 56 Years thread, but you weren't even around when Joseph McBride started that thread. The same thing was true about our 2020 "Journal of the Plague Year" thread. A number of us specifically asked the administrators to allow those threads on the JFKA forum-- and we had a lot of interesting, informative discussions there, before you later joined the conversation and started redundantly posting your MAGA/Fox/Greenwald talking points-- "Patriot Purge," "Russia hoax," etc. Now you're pretending to be the voice of reason and proper censorship of non-JFKA related discussions here? Anyway, what is done is done, but I'm not happy about the way that you and Mathew Koch undermined those forum discussions with your MAGA spam and misguided indignation about accurate analyses of Trumpism and current political conflicts in the U.S. External criticism of this forum hasn't focused on our fact-based critique of Trumpism. It has focused on criticism of the fact-free MAGA spam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted March 21, 2023 Share Posted March 21, 2023 4 hours ago, W. Niederhut said: Ben, I don't want to beat a dead horse about forum administration and the 56 Years thread, but you weren't even around when Joseph McBride started that thread. The same thing was true about our 2020 "Journal of the Plague Year" thread. A number of us specifically asked the administrators to allow those threads on the JFKA forum-- and we had a lot of interesting, informative discussions there, before you later joined the conversation and started redundantly posting your MAGA/Fox/Greenwald talking points-- "Patriot Purge," "Russia hoax," etc. Now you're pretending to be the voice of reason and proper censorship of non-JFKA related discussions here? Anyway, what is done is done, but I'm not happy about the way that you and Mathew Koch undermined those forum discussions with your MAGA spam and misguided indignation about accurate analyses of Trumpism and current political conflicts in the U.S. External criticism of this forum hasn't focused on our fact-based critique of Trumpism. It has focused on criticism of the fact-free MAGA spam. I encourage you to continue post your worthy views in those sections of the EF-JFKA set aside for current political discussions, or general expounding on general political perspectives. A JFKA Forum is not the proper venue for anti-Biden or anti-Trump commentary. As an aside, I think the JFK research community needs a "big tent" attitude, and participants from across the political spectrum should feel welcome when reading the EF-JFKA. You may not agree with this sentiment, but if so, I think you need to have a discussion with the moderators. Indeed, this thread likely needs to be moved into one of the new sections devoted to current affairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leslie Sharp Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 (edited) @Benjamin ColeA JFKA Forum is not the proper venue for anti-Biden or anti-Trump commentary. Have you been considering the assassination in a vacuum all these years? Biden likely won the 2020 election as result of the severe reaction to Donald Trump. Credentialed historians have of late been drawing lines from Trump's rise - to Dallas - to the Cold War - to the rise of Hitler and his mentor Mussolini. Carlson and likeminded propagandists are attempting to reverse the history leading to 11.22.63 Dallas. The JFKA forum is precisely where Trump and his cult should be studied. From my perspective, your attempts to drag Biden into the equation are falling flat. Edited March 22, 2023 by Leslie Sharp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 (edited) 54 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said: I encourage you to continue post your worthy views in those sections of the EF-JFKA set aside for current political discussions, or general expounding on general political perspectives. A JFKA Forum is not the proper venue for anti-Biden or anti-Trump commentary. And when did you become the arbiter of these decisions, Ben? You're a relative newbie here. If you go back and re-read the comment that I posted for you, (above) you will, hopefully, realize that a number of long-term Education Forum members requested that Joseph McBride's 56 Years thread be allowed on the board. You weren't even around in those days. And it was an interesting, informative community thread before you and Mathew started mucking it up with MAGA spam. Nor was it, "anti-Trump," as you say-- except in the context of accurate, informed discussions about American history and politics. Trump was merely one topic among many that we all discussed before you showed up and started posting incessant Tucker Carlson/Glenn Greenwald propaganda tropes. Edited March 22, 2023 by W. Niederhut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 5 minutes ago, Leslie Sharp said: @Benjamin ColeA JFKA Forum is not the proper venue for anti-Biden or anti-Trump commentary. Have you been considering the assassination in a vacuum all these years? Biden likely won the 2020 election as a reaction to Donald Trump. Esteemed historians have been drawing straight lines from Trump's rise - to Dallas - to the Cold War - to the rise of Hitler and his mentor Mussolini. The JFKA forum is precisely where Trump and his cult should be studied. Agreed, Leslie. And Trump's white supremacist cult is also rooted, historically, in the culture of the Confederacy, the Know Nothing Party, and the Dixiecrat reaction to the Civil Rights movement-- Nixon's Southern strategy, GHWB's Willie Horton ads, anti-Obamism, etc. But now closet Trumpster Ben Cole is, apparently, in charge of what Education Forum members are allowed to talk about. Lucky us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 8 minutes ago, Leslie Sharp said: @Benjamin ColeA JFKA Forum is not the proper venue for anti-Biden or anti-Trump commentary. Have you been considering the assassination in a vacuum all these years? Biden likely won the 2020 election as a reaction to Donald Trump. Esteemed historians have been drawing straight lines from Trump's rise - to Dallas - to the Cold War - to the rise of Hitler and his mentor Mussolini. The JFKA forum is precisely where Trump and his cult should be studied. LS- I also have theories, which are worlds apart from your theories, on the evolution of US politics, the capture of both parties by the intel state, and the deposing of four postwar presidents. My views on the JFKA might be worth presenting in the EF-JFKA. My other theories likely are not, and if I ever get around to writing them up, I will post them in the designated space, or over at KennedysandKings (if Jame D. accepts them). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 (edited) 11 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said: Agreed, Leslie. And Trump's white supremacist cult is also rooted, historically, in the culture of the Confederacy, the Know Nothing Party, and the Dixiecrat reaction to the Civil Rights movement-- Nixon's Southern strategy, GHWB's Willie Horton ads, anti-Obamism, etc. But now closet Trumpster Ben Cole is, apparently, in charge of what Education Forum members are allowed to talk about. Lucky us. Your political theories on Trump have nothing to do with the JFKA, but do serve to dissuade potential participants from visiting this forum. It is not civil conversation to accuse other participants of being closeted anythings or racist, Nezis and fascists. I am not a moderator, but I will ask moderators to move this thread to a more-proper location. Edited March 22, 2023 by Benjamin Cole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leslie Sharp Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said: LS- I also have theories, which are worlds apart from your theories, on the evolution of US politics, the capture of both parties by the intel state, and the deposing of four postwar presidents. My views on the JFKA might be worth presenting in the EF-JFKA. My other theories likely are not, and if I ever get around to writing them up, I will post them in the designated space, or over at KennedysandKings (if Jame D. accepts them). You skip the salient issue ... Kennedy's assassination did not occur in a vacuum, and instead allege that Trump was "deposed". How does one have a meaningful, robust debate with those who duck 'n dive? Edited March 22, 2023 by Leslie Sharp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Bulman Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 20 minutes ago, Leslie Sharp said: @Benjamin ColeA JFKA Forum is not the proper venue for anti-Biden or anti-Trump commentary. Have you been considering the assassination in a vacuum all these years? Biden likely won the 2020 election as result of the severe reaction to Donald Trump. Credentialed historians have of late been drawing lines from Trump's rise - to Dallas - to the Cold War - to the rise of Hitler and his mentor Mussolini. Carlson and likeminded propagandists are attempting to reverse the history leading to 11.22.63 Dallas. The JFKA forum is precisely where Trump and his cult should be studied. From my perspective, your attempts to drag Biden into the equation are falling flat. Yes, what She said. (I've advocated for a like icon here before) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leslie Sharp Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 @Benjamin Cole but do serve to dissuade potential participants from visiting this forum. Ben, I'm curious how you know that potential participants are dissuaded from visiting the forum? Are you in touch with individuals who express an interest but opt out because they are Trump supporters and feel he is being unfairly maligned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 2 minutes ago, Leslie Sharp said: You skip the salient issue ... Kennedy's assassination did not occur in a vacuum. and allege that Trump was "deposed". How does one have a meaningful, robust debate with those who duck 'n dive? We have a robust---and hopefully civil---debate over in the water cooler or Biden and Trump thread sections. Where such a debate belongs, per the moderators. My theories on the deposing of Nixon, Carter and Trump have a lot of cred...but do not belong here. Side note: Maybe the Nixon story could squeak in here. As noted by Larry S., a lot of the actors in the Nixon drama...lead back to the same cast of suspects in the JFKA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 2 minutes ago, Ron Bulman said: Yes, what She said. (I've advocated for a like icon here before) If your explanation of the JFKA results in Trump being defined as a Nezi...then it probably belongs in one of the sections devoted to political discussions, not in the EF-JFKA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leslie Sharp Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 (edited) @Benjamin Cole Can you please expand on why you think this thread isn't an appropriate venue to discuss Trump when he is the instigator of false, dangerous rhetoric? Odd JFKA Reference By Right Wing Radio Pundit?"this entire criminal cabal that came about as a result of the murder of John F. Kennedy, the people that perpetrated the murder of John F. Kennedy, rise up to that..." Edited March 22, 2023 by Leslie Sharp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 1 minute ago, Benjamin Cole said: Your political theories on Trump have nothing to do with the JFKA, but do serve to dissuade potential participants from visiting this forum. It is not civil conversation to accuse other participants of being closeted anythings or racist, Nezis and fascists. I am not a moderator, but I will ask us moderators to move this thread to a more-proper location. Dead wrong, Ben. Trump and his white supremacist party are very much a part of American history, and Deep State history, during the past 60+ years. That's what our 56 Years thread was about. Trump was elected in 2016 by the machinations of Deep State actors-- including James Comey, Charles McGonigal, and mass media moguls like Sulzberger. Meanwhile, I've already explained to you, at least three or four times now, that there is nothing "uncivil" about disagreeing with people's false claims about history on this forum. Nor do criticisms of false claims constitute ad hominem arguments per se. Stop playing the victim. As for your other erroneous comments, I have never called anyone on this forum a "N-a-z-i" or a "fascist." I do believe that Trump's cult has some fascist characteristics-- authoritarianism, militant nationalism, scapegoating of ethnic minority groups, etc. Obviously, you are very interested in censoring honest discussions here about Trump and his place in American history. And it sounds like you, and others, having been hounding the mods about suppressing references to Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Cole Posted March 22, 2023 Share Posted March 22, 2023 4 minutes ago, Leslie Sharp said: @Benjamin Cole but do serve to dissuade potential participants from visiting this forum. Ben, I'm curious how you know that potential participants are dissuaded from visiting the forum? Are you in touch with individuals who express an interest but opt out because they are Trump supporters and feel he is being unfairly maligned? Only one. The circle of JFKA buffs...in the larger world is rather small. He did not think Trump was being unfairly maligned--like many, he has more nuanced views. There may not be white hats and black hats in DC. He contended the anti-Trump posters had befouled the space not only with their rather opinionated and imbalanced observations---not only of Trump but others who held different viewpoints. He went back to comfortably reading JFKA books. I doubt even a civil Trump supporter would be treated civilly in the EF-JFKA. Which is why the moderators have carved out spaces for political discussions. Go to the designated threads and post with a full-throated roar! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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