Sandy Larsen Posted May 2 Author Share Posted May 2 On 4/30/2024 at 7:00 PM, W. Niederhut said: Obama would have handled the situation much better, IMO, because he understood Netanyahu's militant bigotry. Obama and Clinton defend Biden’s support for Israel’s war in Gaza Former presidents spoke at Democrat fundraiser in New York that was disrupted by protesters. Financial Times March 28, 2024 Barack Obama and Bill Clinton, the former US presidents, sought to bolster Democratic support for Joe Biden on his handling of Israel’s war in Gaza — an area of angst and division within the party — ahead of the coming presidential election against Donald Trump. At a star-studded fundraiser held at New York City’s Radio City Music Hall on Thursday, Obama and Clinton backed Biden’s leadership on the Middle East conflict, as protesters interrupted the event to criticise US support for Israel. The turmoil in the Middle East was “one of the most important reasons to elect President Biden”, said Clinton, who repeatedly sought to broker peace in the region during his time in office between 1993 and 2001. “He genuinely cares about preserving the existence of Israel, which Hamas doesn’t. And he genuinely cares about giving the Palestinians a decent state of self governance and the support they need for self determination,” Clinton added. Obama said Biden had shown “moral conviction and clarity”, adding that “he’s also willing to acknowledge that the world is complicated and that he’s willing to listen to all sides in this debate”. The support from Clinton and Obama comes with Biden facing a wave of criticism from the left of the Democratic party — including Arab-American communities in key swing states, particularly Michigan — that has threatened to harm his re-election chances in November. Biden has been increasingly critical of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s conduct of the war recently, saying he was not doing enough to prevent civilian casualties in Gaza and ensure access to humanitarian aid in the enclave. Israel launched its war against Hamas after the group killed 1,200 Israelis in an October 7 raid on the country last year. Israel’s retaliatory offensive has so far killed more than 32,000 people in Gaza, according to Palestinian authorities, as well as displaced 1.7mn of its 2.3mn inhabitants and fuelled a humanitarian catastrophe in the enclave. US officials have warned that Israel risked losing international support if it continued with its offensive without adequate plans to protect civilians. But Biden has still not endorsed a permanent ceasefire or the conditioning of US military aid to Israel, as some Democrats have been calling for. “There are too many innocent victims, Israeli and Palestinian. We’ve got to get more food and medicine, supplies into the Palestinians. But we can’t forget, Israel is in a position where its very existence as at stake,” Biden said during the fundraiser. Obama’s support for Biden’s stance on Israel is particularly significant because he had a more tense relationship with Netanyahu while in office between 2009 and 2017, and some of the former Obama administration had been warning that the Israeli prime minister had a history of ignoring US advice. Biden’s strategy at the beginning of the conflict had been to embrace Netanyahu publicly, while privately urging him to scale down the military operation in Gaza, but Israel has often defied US recommendations. Biden has also been calling for Israel to accept a “two-state solution” at the end of the conflict, which Netanyahu has rejected, though the US president said it was still possible. “I‘ve been working with the Saudis and with all the other Arab countries, including Egypt and Jordan and Qatar. They’re prepared to fully recognise Israel,” Biden said on Thursday. “But there has to be a post-Gaza plan, and there has to be a train to a two-state solution. It doesn’t have to occur today, but there has to be a progression, and I think we can do that.” [End] On 4/30/2024 at 7:00 PM, W. Niederhut said: Biden should have been much more forceful in opposing the massacre of women and children in Gaza, and the massive bombing of schools, hospitals, and residential buildings. From the above article: Obama’s support for Biden’s stance on Israel is particularly significant because he had a more tense relationship with Netanyahu while in office between 2009 and 2017, and some of the former Obama administration had been warning that the Israeli prime minister had a history of ignoring US advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted May 2 Author Share Posted May 2 On 4/30/2024 at 7:00 PM, W. Niederhut said: [Biden] should have withheld bombs and military equipment, and supported UN ceasefire resolutions. Biden got Netanyahu's ear by commiserating with him over the Oct. 7 attack. Because of that, he was able to get Netanyahu to notify Gazans of imminent attacks so they could move out of harm's way. From the article I quoted in my prior post: Biden’s strategy at the beginning of the conflict had been to embrace Netanyahu publicly, while privately urging him to scale down the military operation in Gaza, but Israel has often defied US recommendations. In contrast, you would have threatened Netanyahu to hopefully achieve the same goal. Has it not occurred to you that your plan could backfire by angering Netanyahu into ignoring you and doing as he pleased with the Gazans? From the article I quoted in my prior post: ...some of the former Obama administration had been warning that the Israeli prime minister had a history of ignoring US advice. I don't see how your approach could have done any better than Biden's approach. At least Biden's approach has had some demonstrable success. I think Biden has played it masterfully. It hasn't worked out as well as we all hoped only because of Netanyahu's stubbornness, not Biden's mishandling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted May 2 Author Share Posted May 2 13 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said: I think Biden has played it masterfully. It hasn't worked out as well as we all hoped only because of Netanyahu's stubbornness, not Biden's mishandling. My take is this... 1. Biden has a strategic plan that he's been working to minimize civilian casualties. 2. Biden's critics have no idea that Biden has a strategy. What they want to see is anti-Netanyahu rhetoric coming from Biden's mouth and anti-Netanyahu actions taken at the UN. Regardless of the outcome. (Sure, they want a good outcome... but their focus is on having Biden come across as being anti-Netanyahu... period.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Thomas Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 - Donald Trump - "Friend, in 24 hours, the hearing on my GAG ORDER will begin. I COULD BE THROWN IN JAIL AT THAT VERY MOMENT! This is what the Hate-America Deep State has always dreamed of. STAND WITH TRUMP I won’t be able to campaign. I will be muzzled and silent. And Democrats will have free rein to destroy our country." You'd better give me money now. At any moment I could be laying in a pile of rotting garbage, covered in my own feces. It's looking very grim. Give me money. Steve Thomas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 (edited) 4 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said: My take is this... 1. Biden has a strategic plan that he's been working to minimize civilian casualties. 2. Biden's critics have no idea that Biden has a strategy. What they want to see is anti-Netanyahu rhetoric coming from Biden's mouth and anti-Netanyahu actions taken at the UN. Regardless of the outcome. (Sure, they want a good outcome... but their focus is on having Biden come across as being anti-Netanyahu... period.) Sandy, Obama and Clinton are trying to help Biden get re-elected, fortunately. They are, certainly, not going to bash him for his disastrous blunders in Gaza. But the truth is that Biden's response to Netanyahu's Gaza genocide will go down as an historic foreign policy debacle-- an abomination. He shipped bombs to Bibi, and vetoed UN ceasefire resolutions. Think about it. First, Biden unabashedly shipped bombs and military hardware to Netanyahu to completely demolish Gaza-- apartment buildings, schools, hospitals, and mosques, etc.-- and massacre 35,000 non-combatant civilians, including 15,000 children. Then he later tries to organize relief efforts for the displaced, starving population of Gaza. We have met the enemy, and he is us. Edited May 2 by W. Niederhut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted May 2 Author Share Posted May 2 59 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said: Sandy, Obama and Clinton are trying to help Biden get re-elected, fortunately. They are, certainly, not going to bash him for his disastrous blunders in Gaza. But the truth is that Biden's response to Netanyahu's Gaza genocide will go down as an historic foreign policy debacle-- an abomination. He shipped bombs to Bibi, and vetoed UN ceasefire resolutions. Think about it. First, Biden unabashedly shipped bombs and military hardware to Netanyahu to completely demolish Gaza-- apartment buildings, schools, hospitals, and mosques, etc.-- and massacre 35,000 non-combatant civilians, including 15,000 children. Then he later tries to organize relief efforts for the displaced, starving population of Gaza. We have met the enemy, and he is us. Netanyahu would have bombed the hell out of Gaza regardless of what Biden did. But had it not been for Biden, the number of civilian deaths would have been much greater. And right now Israel would be bombing Rafah while the millions of Gazans sheltering there die of starvation and sickness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said: Netanyahu would have bombed the hell out of Gaza regardless of what Biden did. But had it not been for Biden, the number of civilian deaths would have been much greater. And right now Israel would be bombing Rafah while the millions of Gazans sheltering there die of starvation and sickness. Good point about Rafah. But, at the very least, Biden should have halted the shipment of American bombs to Israel. And what would have happened if Biden had supported UN ceasefire resolutions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted May 2 Author Share Posted May 2 21 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said: But, at the very least, Biden should have halted the shipment of American bombs to Israel. And what would have happened if Biden had supported UN ceasefire resolutions? Netanyahu was actually doing some of the things Biden asked him to do to minimize civilian casualties. I don't know every one of Biden's calculations, but I suspect he feared that Netanyahu would quit listening to him if he had voted for a UN resolution or halted arms shipments. The one thing Biden did do was stipulate what arms couldn't be used in Gaza. And of course, now he has signaled that he will change policy toward Israel if Netanyahu invades Rafah without providing refuge for the Gazans living there. Or if Netanyahu doesn't allow humanitarian aid in. I believe that Biden was saving his big guns (threatening to end military and other aid) for when the largest number civilian lives were at stake. That time has arrived. Progressives should be happy with that. But now my conservative friends are bitching that Biden is turning his back on Israel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 (edited) 4 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said: Netanyahu was actually doing some of the things Biden asked him to do to minimize civilian casualties. I don't know every one of Biden's calculations, but I suspect he feared that Netanyahu would quit listening to him if he had voted for a UN resolution or halted arms shipments. The one thing Biden did do was stipulate what arms couldn't be used in Gaza. And of course, now he has signaled that he will change policy toward Israel if Netanyahu invades Rafah without providing refuge for the Gazans living there. Or if Netanyahu doesn't allow humanitarian aid in. I believe that Biden was saving his big guns (threatening to end military and other aid) for when the largest number civilian lives were at stake. That time has arrived. Progressives should be happy with that. But now my conservative friends are bitching that Biden is turning his back on Israel. Sandy, Biden's collusion in Netanyahu's Gaza Genocide will be remembered as an historic abomination. 35,000 massacred women, children, and non-combatant civilians, and the obliteration of schools, hospitals, universities, mosques and residential buildings-- with American bombs! It dwarfs the Srebenica Massacre, which was official declared a genocide at the Hague in 2004, and by the International Court of Justice, in 2007. Edited May 2 by W. Niederhut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Thomas Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 Former President Donald Trump emerged from the latest day of his criminal hush money trial in Manhattan to tell reporters that he probably wouldn't be testifying — because he wasn't allowed to. "I'm not allowed to testify because of the unconstitutional gag order, we're appealing the gag order and let's see what happens," he said. The man's inventive. I'll give him that. Steve Thomas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 Close to 300 ex-Obama-Biden staffers call to suspend military assistance to Israel May 2, 2024 Philip Martin, a former Obama-Biden administration staffer, says he feels betrayed by President Joe Biden’s “unconditional support” for Israel as it continues its attack in Gaza, almost seven months after the terrorist group Hamas killed 1,200 people in Israel and took 250 hostages. Martin, a former director in the U.S. Department of Education, told USA TODAY he’d joined the Obama campaign in 2008 because he was furious that the Bush administration had “hijacked" the country's pain to justify kill civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan. But now, he says Biden is having a similar effect with his Israel foreign policy. “Seeing the Biden administration provide unconditional support to the Israeli war machine that is killing, displacing, starving, and otherwise terrorizing Palestinian civilians makes me just as furious and feels like a betrayal,” he said. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/05/02/ex-obama-biden-staffers-suspend-aid-to-israel/73539778007/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted May 3 Share Posted May 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted May 3 Share Posted May 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Thomas Posted May 3 Share Posted May 3 Noem dog shooting sparks Congressional Dog Lovers Caucus https://www.politico.com/news/2024/05/02/noem-dog-caucus-congress-00155721 "Call them the Paw-cus. A bipartisan group of lawmakers launched the Congressional Dog Lovers Caucus on Thursday — less than a week after South Dakota Gov. Kristi Noem’s killing of her dog disgusted Democrats and Republicans alike. “Dogs are the only thing on earth that loves you more than they love themselves. Their joy to live brings together Americans from all walks of life and can help nourish bipartisanship in Congress,” Rep. Jared Moskowitz (D-Fla.) said in a statement." "Five days before the caucus launched, Moskowitz — a freshman Democrat notorious for his online trolling — posted an infomercial-style video mocking Noem with the caption: “For just $.10 a day you can help us save a puppy from Kristi Noem.”" Steve Thomas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted May 3 Share Posted May 3 Trump Media auditor charged with massive fraud. Trump Media: SEC charges auditor BF Borgers with fraud (cnbc.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now