RFK Jr discusses his candidacy, and talks about Operation Northwoods

[Kirk Gallaway]

Jim quotes Paul:

15 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Kirk - you never miss a chance to go after Jim D. I find it annoying and pathetic.

Why did you feel you needed to include this from Paul, Jim? Is just another indirect non reply?

Here you make an  attack on Matt, and don't explain yourself. I hold you to task, Paul overlooks your attack, immediately assumes you're a victim,(annoying and pathetic, Paul?) and now you make a plaintive cry that you're a victim for simply being asked direct questions?

 

Ok, but this is your answer to what's going on in Ukraine. I guess we'll be hearing from you more often now that you are confident the Russians are now winning and you can verify it's from the CIA?  OK, we'll see..  But regarding the geopolitical aspect, This is now the standard answer seized upon since Putin had the great meeting with Xi. The world's going to splinter against the West but it's a long way from that. Who ultimately offers Xi more? An oil burning kleptocracy? Xi's entire empire was  first built on American consumers.

 

 I can  fully understand that a person, whose not a self proclaimed pacifist who would want an immediate negotiation over a year ago. But hardly someone like you and Oliver Stone, Jim, who thought they knew all the facts and were so incensed when Yanukovych was ousted that you approved of Putin seizing Crimea. You were in favor escalation when Putin profited from it, and now de escalation when Putin profits from it. And then when Putin launches his bloody invasion, Stone says "we (the U.S.) made them do it."

Sorry, doesn't get it!

 

But I'm sure Stone will lunge at that idea that the U.S. siding with the Ukraine resistance drove Putin and Xi into each other's arms  and say he told you so, after he came out of his 10 hour interview with Putin so completely goo goo gaga over Putin that he was driven to probably spend  millions of his own money making a film to the West that Putin could eventually use as a justification for his bloody invasion of Ukraine. I'm sure it was unintentional. But you don't think he's desperately looking  for some excuse to make him look right after he saw the Ukrainian Fascist tale he told  would give pretext to an even greater bloody Fascist invasion of a sovereign country?         Oops!

 

Oh, but I know it's not my place as a commoner to dare utter that  here among so many free thinking individuals here who "defy the herd". People like John,Jim Di,  Chris  and of course  Kierkegaard to whom the truth is not more "repugnant than death". Right John?

 

heh heh heh    ho ho ho! ohhh

 

 

you notice my use of "irony" there? heh heh

 

[Kirk Gallaway]

Jim:The new documents prove that MacGregor and Ritter were and are correct.

Then predictably Chris:

Chris:A few of us said most of this in real time. And a belligerent majority here preferred to believe illusions from MSM.

 

Oh yeah? Scott Ritter proclaimed "Putin will not invade Ukraine". After the invasion, Ritter said Ukraine would fall "in a week maximum." Then  in a link, Chris provided shortly after the invasion, Ritter, with a snicker confidently predicted that NATO was so weak, and broken, and they would provide no real assistance to Ukraine. He was wrong on that account too. And now this war has gone on another year, with literally the whole time Ritter was telling us a Russian victory was around the corner.

Will you admit  his first 14 months of prediction have been a disaster?-----------

I didn't think so.     heh heh heh

 

 

As far as Ritter ultimately being wrong about Nato. I was a Ritter fan when he first asked the questions about WMD, back in the Iraq War. I myself have wondered about the usefulness of Nato.

But I don't anymore. To those of us who talk about the U.S. Perpetual War policy, and want to curb U.S. Defense spending. Do you realize what a terrible blow was dealt to that hope when Putin invaded Ukraine? You can forget it for quite a while now, even apart from any escalation from China.on Taiwan. And whose fault is that? Who did "the unspeakable" that none of you predicted?

 

 

It looks like Ritter was convicted by a sex sting with a 15 year old, and did some time. I know some will just dismiss it as the work of the "deep state"!  But it's not a charge to be ignored either.

 

******

Re: Ritter: He was once highly respected and helped with decommissioning Iraq's WMD programs from 1991–1998. However, since 2011 he has twice been convicted of attempted sexual assault of a minor and gone to prison for it. Since his release he has been a regular contributer for RT (Russia Today). Now I don't have any proof he's being paid by the Russian government but at least here in the United States because of his convictions, and especially the type of offense, he would find it very hard to find employment. So make of that what you will..

 

Ex-U.N. official Ritter convicted in underage Internet sex sting

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-sex-ritter/ex-u-n-official-ritter-convicted-in-underage-internet-sex-sting-idUSTRE73E0EK20110415

 

And this is about the accuracy of Ritter's opinions up to now. Hey there's no doubt this thread is completely partisan.

 

https://www.quora.com/How-accurate-and-trustworthy-is-Scott-Ritter-former-US-military-analyst-and-his-professional-opinions-about-the-Ukrainian-crisis

 

O

 

 

[Kirk Gallaway]

Jim:The new documents prove that MacGregor and Ritter were and are correct.

 

"Were?" Ok, Now let’s look at some quotes from Mac Gregor. One is in an interview with Tucker Carlson.

 

 

.The battle in eastern Ukraine is really almost over, all of the Ukrainian troops there have been largely surrounded and cut off. You have a concentration down in the Southeast of 30 or 40,000 of them, and if they don't surrender in the next 24 hours, I suspect Russia will ultimately annihilate them.

- Douglas MacGregor, February 2022

The Siege of Maruipol

would last almost three months beyond that 24 hour prediction.

The first five days Russian forces I think frankly were too gentle. They've now corrected that. So, I would say another 10 days this should be completely over.
- Douglas MacGregor, March 4 2022

10 days after that was March 14, 2022. It is now March 22 2023. It’s not over yet.

The war is really over for the Ukrainians. They have been grounded to bits. There's no question about that despite what we report on our mainstream media. So the real question for us at this stage is, if there is an agreement, Tucker, are we going to live with the Russian people and their government? Or are we going to continue to pursue this sort of regime change dressed up as Ukrainian war?
- Douglas MacGregor, March 17, 2022!

 

Again over a year ago.

That was just the first month of the war. Let’s see if he managed to make better predictions later in the war.The war, with the exception of Kharkiv and Odessa, as far as the Russians are concerned is largely over. There is no intention to do anything else
- Douglas MacGregor, July 08, 2022

It’s now March 2023. Nowhere near over and the Russians are further from Kharkiv and Odesa than they were then.this war may be over soon.: …“Right now things are going very, very badly, [for Ukraine]
- Douglas MacGregor, early September 2022

Lest anyone forget September 2022 was the month of the Kharkiv offensive

 

MacGregor was talking when the Ukranians had kicked the Russians back across the border by Kharkiv and back to the Oskil River. They would go on to advance far further later in the month.

Douglas MacGregor has been consistently and thoroughly wrong throughout the war as well as being a consistent pro-Putin voice. He might get a prediction right eventually on the “a stopped clock is right twice a day” principle, but his track record ranks significantly below either a mystic 8-ball or a coin flip.

Siegfried Sassoon: MacGregor is an anti-American fabulist who has sold anti-semitism and racism to anyone who is willing to pay. Instead of accepting his service when he was forced out as a colonel, unable to advance in rank, he grew angry at the US Army and anyone of General rank.

 

You sure can pickem' Jim!

 

 

Sorry for spamming, but it's so much fun!

 

Edited April 24, 2023 by Kirk Gallaway

[Guest]

@Kirk Gallaway isn’t it interesting how a little comment can get right inside someone else's head. It is said that the truth hurts. 
 

Your retorts amount to ‘haarspalterei’, they do not change the direction of the tide. 🙂 

[Leslie Sharp]

3 hours ago, Michael Griffith said:

We need to understand that fascism and communism are merely two sides of the same totalitarian coin. Both believe in total government power. Both believe the government has the right to own or seize any business or property that it desires, that the government should exercise total control over the news media, that the government should exercise total control over churches/religions, that the government should exercise total over control over education, etc.

The Koch brothers and the JBS have opposed these authoritarian ideas and have advocated the opposite view of government power and authority.

Once again we see a manifestation of the unfortunate fact that this forum is dominated by ultra-liberals who insist on describing anyone who disagrees with them as fascists, extremists, neo-N-azis, etc. 

I, for one, am very glad to see that RFK Jr. is open to working with people who represent a wide range of political views. The fact that he would speak at Hillsdale College says volumes about his tolerance and inclusion and willingness to work with people with whom he disagrees on a number of issues but with whom he agrees on issues that are important to him. That's true tolerance and inclusion, and open-mindedness.

It could be argued that Koch Sr. had no particular political loyalties other than corporate profit, building Stalin's petroleum infrastructure and then strengthening Hitler's Reich machine. Is that not the economic model of ill-informed Libertarians? The market drives everything at any and all costs (pun intended)?
 

Koch's political ideology becomes more defined when he co-founds the JBS. You're not suggesting that fundamentally the Birch Society was anything other than a far right movement with the intent to erode government oversight to the benefit of corporate profit and influence?

And I'm curious how you would define Koch funded ALEC if not the quintessential corporate/government symbiosis— the very definition of fascism.  Elaborating here: a corporate bill mill. It is not just a lobby or a front group; it is much more powerful than that. Through ALEC, corporations hand state legislators their wishlists to benefit their bottom line. Corporations fund almost all of ALEC's operations. They pay for a seat on ALEC task forces where corporate lobbyists and special interest reps vote with elected officials to approve “model” bills. 

Edited April 24, 2023 by Leslie Sharp

[Leslie Sharp]

8 hours ago, Chris Barnard said:

Read the book. It’ll make more sense to you.  

The end game here is to further marginalize RFK Jr. 

https://www.rawstory.com/steve-bannon-rfk-vice-president/

Edited April 24, 2023 by Leslie Sharp

[Leslie Sharp]

If RFK Jr.'s grasp of his uncle's assassination in Dallas stops at "Operation Northwoods," can he fully appreciate the implications of finding common ground with far right policies of the Birch Society and similar movements funded by Koch et al?

A portentous January 1968 affidavit sworn by Aginter Press assassin and Jean Rene Souetre associate Jacques Godard reveals the group’s relationship with certain American persons and organizations: “In the course of our services we had relations with certain persons and organizations like, for example, President Tshombe and with Biafra. We likewise were in charge of relations with the John Birch Society, which was an American political group financed especially by Texas oil producers whose activity is absolutely anti-communist. Everywhere where there is a struggle, either open or covert, with communists, the John Birch Society lends its financial aid to the people who are struggling against international communism.”
 

The OAS and the Aginter Press

Before being air dropped into Vietnam again in 1954, Lucien Conien spends a few weeks at Otto Skorzeny’s training camp outside of Madrid. It is the same camp where multiple French ultraright guerre révolutionnaire tacticians who would meld into the OAS are going through intensive warfare training before being dispatched to Vietnam. By 1957, they had become bitterly opposed to Senator John Kennedy from Massachusetts when he advocated for Algerian independence. The training is rigorous, even brutal at times. Skorzeny’s chief trainers at the camp, Jean Rene Souetre, mentioned in the mysterious correspondence of Frenchman Paul Gluc, and fellow Frenchman Yves Guiliou who widely used the alias Ralf Guerin-Serac, are relentless in their objective to shape their trainees into thoroughly trained professional soldiers. Conien meets every several days with the former SS officer for drinks, dinner, and an occasional choice cigar. 

Not surprisingly, and especially germane to one of this investigation’s central characters, is that Lucian Conien knew Otto Skorzeny quite well. His initial links to Skorzeny can be found in the La Cagoule, the French Resistance, and the long-standing, mysterious and Portugal-based Aginter Press. Ostensibly a press or media agency, Aginter Press fronted for what CIA officials privately called “assassination central.” Often wrongly cited as being founded in 1966, Aginter Press was first organized in 1962 by Skorzeny’s prized trainer, Guérin-Serac, as a “counterinsurgency, counter-guerrilla center with support of the CIA, of the paramilitary Portuguese Legion, and especially of PIDE, the feared Portuguese secret police, which supposedly financed Aginter Press at the tune of two million escudos per month. Aginter Press was a sizable operation. Between 1962 and 1965, it organized and established an important network of informers linked, through PIDE, to the CIA and to the security services of such countries as West Germany, Spain, Greece, and South Africa,” as well as numerous Latin American and several other European countries. 

[Michael Griffith]

Wow, this is interesting: So now, according to some, RFK Jr. might not be sufficiently liberal because he's willing to cooperate on some issues with conservatives. People with such a rabidly ideological mindset are a huge part of the problem with our politics today. That mindset is poisoning out political debate and making it impossible for non-extremist Democrats to find common ground and reach compromises with non-extremist Republicans, and vice versa. 

[Leslie Sharp]

1 hour ago, Michael Griffith said:

Wow, this is interesting: So now, according to some, RFK Jr. might not be sufficiently liberal because he's willing to cooperate on some issues with conservatives. People with such a rabidly ideological mindset are a huge part of the problem with our politics today. That mindset is poisoning out political debate and making it impossible for non-extremist Democrats to find common ground and reach compromises with non-extremist Republicans, and vice versa. 

For RFK to win the Democratic nomination, he will need to appeal to moderates. The slightest appearance of appeasing the alt-right — the very ideology that fueled the assassinations of his uncle , his father, and Martin Luther King Jr.  — will eliminate him as a viable candidate if it hasn't already.  Appeasement is not the same as finding common ground.

 

Edited April 25, 2023 by Leslie Sharp

[Benjamin Cole]

Reminder---people said Jimmy Carter had no shot. People said Trump had no shot. 

RFK Jr. has a shot. 

And alone among Donks, he would open up the JFKA records. 

Seems like a natural choice to me. 

[Ron Bulman]

8 hours ago, Douglas Caddy said:

David Talbott speaks:

My Thoughts About RFK Jr. — Blog (thedavidtalbotshow.com)

Thank you for sharing this.  Davids comments are always welcome for me.  This is great.

[Leslie Sharp]

4 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Reminder---people said Jimmy Carter had no shot. People said Trump had no shot. 

RFK Jr. has a shot. 

And alone among Donks, he would open up the JFKA records. 

Seems like a natural choice to me. 

I'm curious how those who disparage Democratic policies could get on board with RFK Jr.  He is a Kennedy Democrat — pro strong federal government, compassionate immigration policies, healthcare for all Americans, social programs that lift all boats, corporate taxation in line with the toll corporations take on our infrastructure and environment, civil rights that guarantee life liberty and pursuit of happiness for ALL, "international" democracy and the responsibility of the US to those who struggle for it ... not exactly a libertarian ideology. 

[Benjamin Cole]

8 minutes ago, Leslie Sharp said:

I'm curious how those who disparage Democratic policies could get on board with RFK Jr.  He is a Kennedy Democrat — pro strong federal government, compassionate immigration policies, healthcare for all Americans, social programs that lift all boats, corporate taxation in line with the toll corporations take on our infrastructure and environment, civil rights that guarantee life liberty and pursuit of happiness for ALL, "international" democracy and the responsibility of the US to those who struggle for it ... not exactly a libertarian ideology. 

Who disparages Donk policies...perhaps people skeptical of both parties, and the rampant institutionalized corruption that defines the two parties. 

Corporate America, Wall Street, the defense industry, Silicon Valley and the globalists are backing the Donks to the hilt. 

What does that tell you?

The intel state wanted HRC and then Biden as President, and not Trump. 

The picture is very polluted. 

OK, I will take a shot on RFK Jr.. You have a better option?

Biden, the man who did a snuff job on the JFK Records Act?  That does not strike me as a better choice. 

 

 

[Leslie Sharp]

1 minute ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Who disparages Donk policies...perhaps people skeptical of both parties, and the rampant institutionalized corruption that defines the two parties. 

Corporate America, Wall Street, the defense industry, Silicon Valley and the globalists are backing the Donks to the hilt. 

What does that tell you?

The intel state wanted HRC and then Biden as President, and not Trump. 

The picture is very polluted. 

OK, I will take a shot on RFK Jr.. You have a better option?

Biden, the man who did a snuff job on the JFK Records Act?  That does not strike me as a better choice. 

 

 

So, you're on board with this platform as well?  pro strong federal government, compassionate immigration policies, healthcare for all Americans, social programs that lift all boats, corporate taxation in line with the toll corporations take on our infrastructure and environment, civil rights that guarantee life liberty and pursuit of happiness for ALL, "international" democracy and the responsibility of the US to those who struggle for it.

Clinton ran on the these political fundamentals, as did Biden.  Trump did not, and in fact his philosophy is the antithesis democracy.  

If RFK Jr. can convince moderate Dems that in the process of polishing the edges of the alt-right elements within the GOP  he will not sacrifice these principles, he could take the nomination.  

[Benjamin Cole]

6 minutes ago, Leslie Sharp said:

So, you're on board with this platform as well?  pro strong federal government, compassionate immigration policies, healthcare for all Americans, social programs that lift all boats, corporate taxation in line with the toll corporations take on our infrastructure and environment, civil rights that guarantee life liberty and pursuit of happiness for ALL, "international" democracy and the responsibility of the US to those who struggle for it.

Clinton ran on the these political fundamentals, as did Biden.  Trump did not, and in fact his philosophy is the antithesis democracy.  

If RFK Jr. can convince moderate Dems that in the process of polishing the edges of the alt-right elements within the GOP  he will not sacrifice these principles, he could take the nomination.  

You have cited a lot of platitudes, with which I generally agree. 

But only RFK Jr will open the JFK Records. 

Biden did a snuff job on the JFK Records. 

There you have it.